How good can this team be this year?

[NorthHawk]

When I replied to the Jamal Adams thread it got me thinking about the team as a whole.
Just how good can it be this year?

The positives are much more talent on the DL and a proven Defensive HC with varying schemes depending on the personnel.
On Offense we have an OC that has been described by one former player as a mad scientist with his plays. It's a much more creative approach to the game than the old 'line up and play without consideration for what the Defense is doing' that we had under Carroll. It will be interesting to see how it evolves.

The negatives are with the new schemes there will be an adjustment period for the players and the coaches will also be identifying those players that don't fit what they want to do. There will probably be some players who unexpectedly excel and others that unexpectedly don't do as well as previous years or if younger as well as expected.

My guess is we lose some games early as the team finds itself, but end up having around the same record of 9-8 or 8-9. With another draft and players that don't fit weeded out next year, we should end up with a better record.

[River_Dog]

When I replied to the Jamal Adams thread it got me thinking about the team as a whole.
Just how good can it be this year?

The positives are much more talent on the DL and a proven Defensive HC with varying schemes depending on the personnel.
On Offense we have an OC that has been described by one former player as a mad scientist with his plays. It's a much more creative approach to the game than the old 'line up and play without consideration for what the Defense is doing' that we had under Carroll. It will be interesting to see how it evolves.

The negatives are with the new schemes there will be an adjustment period for the players and the coaches will also be identifying those players that don't fit what they want to do. There will probably be some players who unexpectedly excel and others that unexpectedly don't do as well as previous years or if younger as well as expected.

My guess is we lose some games early as the team finds itself, but end up having around the same record of 9-8 or 8-9. With another draft and players that don't fit weeded out next year, we should end up with a better record.

I'm a little more optimistic. We finished at 9-8 last season so all we need to do is flip the outcome of 3 games and we're at 12 wins. Looking at our 2024 opponents, I'll pencil in the following games as wins:

Cards X2
Split with the Rams
Giants
Broncos
Bears
Patriots
Jets
Falcons

That's nine wins right there, plus throw in a few possibilities like splitting with the Niners, a home win over either the Packers, Fins, Bills, and/or Vikings, and suddenly, we're looking at 11-12 wins and in the hunt for the SB.

This defense could look radically different from the past few years. If Nwosu can return from his injury and play like he did in 2022, Jones play like he did in 2022, and if Murphy turns out to be the real deal, we could be looking at an awesome front 4. Plus, guys like Mafe. Wollen, and Hall are young enough that they could be coached up by a more competent staff, and suddenly we have top 5 defense.

I'm not predicting a 12-win season, but I think that it's a reasonable expectation. We could have a SB competitive team in a much shorter time frame than any of us could guess.

[NorthHawk]

Depending on when we get each team, I'm not sure we split with the Cards and Rams. Both of them have played us tough in the past even if we did win a lot against AZ but like us they will be on a new path forward and they had a real good draft IMO.
The Rams are always a tough out for us. Maybe it's just Pete who's number McVay had, but they're much further along with their development than we are at this point even after losing Donald.
Jets? If Rodgers is playing, then they will always be tough with their Defense.
Finally the Bears. I just don't know what to make of them. Maybe Williams will have trouble with complicated defenses, but maybe he will adjust quickly. Either way, they have a lot of young talent on that team. In a way I hope they start to do well and become contenders in their division - except against us.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

For all the problems they had, they weren't out of the running. My hope is McDonald changes the team mindset similar to what Pete did so many years ago. Get them hungry and get them focused. No more dumb penalties. No more terrible tackling. Too many games turned on those things.

ETA: Manage the GD clock properly.

[Oly]

When I replied to the Jamal Adams thread it got me thinking about the team as a whole.
Just how good can it be this year?

The positives are much more talent on the DL and a proven Defensive HC with varying schemes depending on the personnel.
On Offense we have an OC that has been described by one former player as a mad scientist with his plays. It's a much more creative approach to the game than the old 'line up and play without consideration for what the Defense is doing' that we had under Carroll. It will be interesting to see how it evolves.

The negatives are with the new schemes there will be an adjustment period for the players and the coaches will also be identifying those players that don't fit what they want to do. There will probably be some players who unexpectedly excel and others that unexpectedly don't do as well as previous years or if younger as well as expected.

My guess is we lose some games early as the team finds itself, but end up having around the same record of 9-8 or 8-9. With another draft and players that don't fit weeded out next year, we should end up with a better record.

I agree with all of this. It would be a pleasant surprise to make the playoffs. My too-early prediction is 8-9.

A lot depends on who makes the team. Pete's first year saw a ton of young guys beat out mediocre vets. If Macdonald has the same clean-slate approach, then I can see a worse record. If that's the case, then I might even predict 6-11.

To be specific, let's look at CB. Here are the current CBs: Devon Witherspoon, Tariq Woolen, Mike Jackson, Tre Brown, Coby Bryant, Artie Burns, Nehemiah Pritchett, DJ James, Andrew Whitaker. They usually keep five or six. Spoon and Woolen are locks. That leaves the following fighting for three or four spots:

Brown
Jackson
Bryant (who might be going to S?)
Burns
Pritchett
James
Whitaker

If they keep Jackson and Burns, it tells me that Macdonald is playing for now rather than the future, and that attitude is more likely to put the Hawks around .500. But if Pritchett and/or James make the roster over Jackson and Burns, it suggests Macdonald is playing for the future. If he does that, I'd expect a worse record this season but a more promising future.

[4XPIPS]

Excellent opening topic.

Considering how historically bad our defense was last year and we still had a winning record... I would presume we should advance slightly forward from where we were. I can seriously see us getting to 10 wins, because I am have always been on the Mcdonald hype train well before Pete was even thought of being canned.

I do believe the Cards will take a step forward, but I do think the Rams minus Aaron Donald are going to be more below average then projected. I am willing to bet we have a better record than the Rams. McVay had PC figured out every game, and out coached him every game.

There are quite a bit of NFC teams that have new head coaches like ourselves, as well new QBs along with 1st year starter(potential), 2nd year starter, and of course just the 2nd year with their new team. So I would presume some of the teams below will take a step back as some should improve, but there is still quite of bit unknown. We all saw how much Geno scaled back his 2nd year under center as a full time starter, but hopefully he can bounce back.

*New Head Coach

Bears C Williams
*Commanders J Daniels
Vikings J McCarthy
*Falcons Cousin(first year)/Possibly Penix
*Panthers B Young (2nd year)
Saints D Carr (2nd year start)
Packers J Love (2nd year start)
Bucs B Mayfield (2nd year start)

[Aseahawkfan]

I have no expectations for next year other than I want to see a very improved defense.

[jshawaii22]

I'm just trying to be realistic when I counter some of the thread.
All new coaching staff with ZERO HC experience and ZERO pro signal calling experience, and some of you are talking 10 wins and playoffs?
We have a new inside OLine and most of the DLine and Linebackers. We don't know if we're playing a 3-4 where we don't have a NT or go back to a more standard 4-3.
Woolen needs to play back to his rookie year. He was not good last year. We lost our #2 TE (and my fav) and both starting safeties although Love is good.
I realistically see us at 6 - 8 wins, if Geno plays at last years level. Does anyone think he's going to improve at this point?
For games, AZ is improved, Rams and 49ers are both better than us already, so maybe 1 of 6 in division. The other games? Who knows, but I know many other teams below us improved through FA's and the draft and this year some got their QB's of the future and we have.... Geno... for 1 -2 more years. Not exactly a SB scenario IMHO.

[4XPIPS]

I'm just trying to be realistic when I counter some of the thread.
All new coaching staff with ZERO HC experience and ZERO pro signal calling experience, and some of you are talking 10 wins and playoffs?
We have a new inside OLine and most of the DLine and Linebackers. We don't know if we're playing a 3-4 where we don't have a NT or go back to a more standard 4-3.
Woolen needs to play back to his rookie year. He was not good last year. We lost our #2 TE (and my fav) and both starting safeties although Love is good.
I realistically see us at 6 - 8 wins, if Geno plays at last years level. Does anyone think he's going to improve at this point?
For games, AZ is improved, Rams and 49ers are both better than us already, so maybe 1 of 6 in division. The other games? Who knows, but I know many other teams below us improved through FA's and the draft and this year some got their QB's of the future and we have.... Geno... for 1 -2 more years. Not exactly a SB scenario IMHO.

I can see 10 wins, and if that is enough for playoffs then so be it. I don't think it unrealistic to see rookie head coaches coming out of the gates and having a winning season. Of course many have failed in their first season as well, but it's not like we are running an rookie QB out there to develop. I think with our offense is pretty much intact, we still have Geno, we still have same RBs in K9 and ZC, and we have 3 solid WRS, and yes we lost talent at TE(not that we used them a whole bunch last season) but our offensive line got better and if healthier is going to be better with the depth and players we have there. So all in all I believe our offense is probably as good as last year, and our biggest weakness was clearly the defense, and if that improves to the middle of the pack... I could see us having a 10 win season. No where do I see us SB bound, but it's likely we can pick up 10 wins with this team and the players we have shed and the talent we have gained.

About Geno improving. I think he can. We already saw what he did his first year as a full time starter, so we know where the ceiling maybe but if he can get back to that I think he can improve. Is he the QBOTF? No.

[jshawaii22]

We haven't had 10 wins in 4 years and the last time was with Russell Wilson at QB, but I won't stop cheering for the team. I'm just being realistic.

[Spohawk5092]

low expectations for this season.....

[Rambo2014]

You are 500 team, get over it...8-9 or 9-8 being generous


Rams 13-4
Niners 10-7
Sea 9-8
Arz 7-10

[River_Dog]

We haven't had 10 wins in 4 years and the last time was with Russell Wilson at QB, but I won't stop cheering for the team. I'm just being realistic.

It's odd that I've become the optimist in our group. I used to get accused of being a Debbie Downer. I wonder what Obi would say.

I wouldn't say that I'm "expecting" a 10-12 win season in that I'd be disappointed if we didn't get that many wins, rather that I would not be at all surprised if we did end up at 12-5 and win the division.

For the first time in years, I can truly say that I'm excited about our upcoming season.

[4XPIPS]

We haven't had 10 wins in 4 years and the last time was with Russell Wilson at QB, but I won't stop cheering for the team. I'm just being realistic.

You are correct again, but our defense has stunk in the last 4 years, and never got better through draft picks, trades, FA signings, or even player development. If I was a betting man I would not bank that we get 10 wins, but I wouldn't be surprised nor would I be quite disappointed if we don't get 10 wins. All I am saying is I realistic path to getting 10 wins as the NFC is getting a massive make up over the last two years between new QBs and new HCs. If we get let's say 4 wins, and really plummet from last year then I would be quite shocked.

[4XPIPS]

You are 500 team, get over it...8-9 or 9-8 being generous


Rams 13-4
Niners 10-7
Sea 9-8
Arz 7-10

Get over it , I am optimistic that we can get 10 wins, and you delusion to getting 13 wins? With no Aaron Donald anymore. I see rams 8-9 this year at best.

[Old but Slow]

There still is not a long time starter at QB, and the offensive line is going through a reorganization, which makes getting the O-line working as a unified group a question mark. We do not know if Oluwatimi is going to work out, as well as Bradford, and Abe Lucas is the best of the group, but is he healthy? Haynes is a rookie and seems like the real deal, but again, he is now playing with different guys on each side.

My plan, and it is loose, is to start Howell at QB and see what happens. If we get lightning in a bottle, great, but if not then maybe we will be bad enough to get a high draft pick next year when there seems to be a good harvest at QB.

I do not think that this team is ready to make a serious run at the Superb Bowl, so I hope it is a poor year. That does not mean tanking the season, I still want to see good football, but this is a time to test your depth, give lots of snaps to the young players rather than sticking to more experienced vets.

Prediction? Ten win. Darn it.

[Oly]

There still is not a long time starter at QB, and the offensive line is going through a reorganization, which makes getting the O-line working as a unified group a question mark. We do not know if Oluwatimi is going to work out, as well as Bradford, and Abe Lucas is the best of the group, but is he healthy? Haynes is a rookie and seems like the real deal, but again, he is now playing with different guys on each side.

My plan, and it is loose, is to start Howell at QB and see what happens. If we get lightning in a bottle, great, but if not then maybe we will be bad enough to get a high draft pick next year when there seems to be a good harvest at QB.

I do not think that this team is ready to make a serious run at the Superb Bowl, so I hope it is a poor year. That does not mean tanking the season, I still want to see good football, but this is a time to test your depth, give lots of snaps to the young players rather than sticking to more experienced vets.

Prediction? Ten win. Darn it.

I'd be interested in starting Howell to see what we have, but I don't see that happening. I think Macdonald is going to want to show his team that the best player in camp wins the job. If we wanted a fresh start, it's the GM's job to fill the roster with the right players. But if Geno is there, he has to get the job if he's the best QB on the roster. And I'm pretty sure he is.

But I'm with you on the need to give the young'uns plenty of snaps.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

There still is not a long time starter at QB, and the offensive line is going through a reorganization, which makes getting the O-line working as a unified group a question mark. We do not know if Oluwatimi is going to work out, as well as Bradford, and Abe Lucas is the best of the group, but is he healthy? Haynes is a rookie and seems like the real deal, but again, he is now playing with different guys on each side.

A known issue that wasn' t going be fixed in this draft. They weren't moving up and no one worth it was going to fall. The oline is definitely young; at least they are all playing the positions they did in college. Hopefully the team can absorb the lumps they have to take.

My plan, and it is loose, is to start Howell at QB and see what happens. If we get lightning in a bottle, great, but if not then maybe we will be bad enough to get a high draft pick next year when there seems to be a good harvest at QB.

Unless he blows Geno out, I doubt we'll see this happen. It would be cool if he makes some noise though. It's interesting that's he's younger than two of those first 6 qbs that went in the first round this year.

I do not think that this team is ready to make a serious run at the Superb Bowl, so I hope it is a poor year. That does not mean tanking the season, I still want to see good football, but this is a time to test your depth, give lots of snaps to the young players rather than sticking to more experienced vets.

After last year's regression, they aren't unless they show otherwise. Bad run defense, bad tackling, blown assignments, and stupid penalties derailed some winnable games. McDonald has his work cut out for him to bring it back in line.

Prediction? Ten win. Darn it.

Doable, but I won't be surprised if they fall short.

[River_Dog]

I can understand ObS's take. 10 wins is in a never-never land. You aren't bad enough to blow everything up, improve the team with high draft picks, and play against a 4th place schedule the next season, but just good enough to perpetuate the mirage, like a thirsty cowboy wandering in the desert leading his horse to a lake that doesn't exist. That was Pete Carroll/Russell Wilson over the past 8 years. I'd rather see a 5 win season than 10 wins/one and done in the playoffs. Mac has a one- or two-year grace period. Why not tank the season and get some high draft picks and make a run at the SB in 2026.

But I do think that this team has potential, and if Mac is as good of a coach as I've been led to believe, he can coach up some of these guys who appear to have good talent but have fallen short, guys like Woolen, Mafe, Hall, etc. I'm looking forward to seeing how this all plays out.

[trents]

I'm not focusing on W/L record but on the field I expect to see an improved run defense and better tackling. On the sidelines, I expect to see better clock management and more creative play calling. And oh, better judgement used when throwing out the challenge flag. I always thought Pete was terrible at that. But I guess that sort of falls under the heading of clock management. And one more thing I expect to see and that is more consistency in holding players accountable for misbehavior.

[NorthHawk]

From what I've heard of MacDonald, he's more of an old school coach so things in Training Camp should be quite different. Probably no loud music and less fun.

The Defense should be a lot better with the additions of Murphy II at DE and Hankins anchoring the middle with the others rotating and last years rookie NT Young having had a full year of NFL strength training.

On Offense I would expect that whenever DK gets single coverage he would automatically be the target, much like how Odunze was last year in college. If Grubb is as creative as advertised, we might just see a modern day Offense for the first time in 14 years.

But there is still going to be an adjustment phase on both sides of the ball and it might cost a couple of games as the players and coaches figure out how each player plays within the schemes and adjustments are made.

[River_Dog]

I'm not focusing on W/L record but on the field I expect to see an improved run defense and better tackling. On the sidelines, I expect to see better clock management and more creative play calling. And oh, better judgement used when throwing out the challenge flag. I always thought Pete was terrible at that. But I guess that sort of falls under the heading of clock management. And one more thing I expect to see and that is more consistency in holding players accountable for misbehavior.

I agree that we shouldn't be using a W/L record to appraise our progress. However, at the end of the day, it's all about wins and losses, which is how we tend to think.

Agreed about Pete's clock management. Holmgren wasn't any better, arguably worse. It seems to be something inherent with our teams. But the challenge flags you can't blame the HC, at least not in its entirety. He's depending on his staff in the booth to give him an accurate opinion. The HC doesn't have the benefit of seeing a close-up replay. He's lucky if he sees on the stadium display.

The other thing I hope to see is a more disciplined team, something more like what we saw under Holmgren. No more stupid penalties. If Metcalf gets a personal foul for jacking his jaw at an opponent, I expect Mac to sit his ass. That part about Pete really bugged me. It was like he didn't have control over his players, that they would say or do anything that pleased them without fear of consequences. There's a difference between an aggressive team and a stupid one.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Why not tank the season and get some high draft picks and make a run at the SB in 2026.

You don't build a winning culture this way, and I highly doubt Mac came to tank.

[c_hawkbob]

Never. Ever. Tank.

[River_Dog]

Why not tank the season and get some high draft picks and make a run at the SB in 2026.

You don't build a winning culture this way, and I highly doubt Mac came to tank.

That was taken out of context. I meant that sarcastically, that if we were in an endless loop of .500ish teams, in retrospect, we would have been better off to have tanked the season. I should have been more precise.

I'm with both you and Cbob. You never tank a game let alone an entire season.

[Old but Slow]

Looking at the QBs available in 2025, there are several that are intriguing, but they do not seem to be bunched at the top, so there will be options to take one. It is interesting that Neon Deion Sanders's son is highly rated as a top 10 pick at QB. He plays at Colorado. A quarterback is a need. If John can't find one in this class he is not serious.

The new coaching staff is exciting to me, and I am expecting to see some good things from them. Both the offense and defense will be improved, and hopefully the tackling problem will not reoccur, but there could still be problems about how to use the resources in place. Will we become a truly a run first team, or revert to relying on Smith's arm?

Earlier I suggested that we should use backups in key positions to give us a better draft position in '25, but after looking at the upcoming draft ratings I am thinking differently, as there might be some reasonable options throughout the first round next year.

Darrell Taylor is a good candidate for someone who could flourish under different coaching. He is a dynamic athlete with great pass rush potential, but he is terrible against the run, even though he is large enough to be good (269 pounds). Defensive coaches could affect that.

There are number of very good football players on this team to build around, and with different eyes looking at them they could be even better.

I am very optimistic. Not necessarily for this season, but for the future.

[River_Dog]

Darrell Taylor is a good candidate for someone who could flourish under different coaching. He is a dynamic athlete with great pass rush potential, but he is terrible against the run, even though he is large enough to be good (269 pounds). Defensive coaches could affect that.

Darrell Taylor is entering his 4th season and has yet to show that he deserves to be in the NFL. He's been through two DC's and they weren't able to have any positive effect on his play, so I am skeptical that Mac's crew can fare any better. As you pointed out, he's a horrible tackler, and tackling is more of a fundamental trait that's developed from a very young age. Coaching can put players in better positions, but tackling is a basic that you either have or don't have. IMO he's a candidate to be cut. It's the same story with Riq Woolen and why I'm pessimistic about his chances.

The player who has underperformed whom I think stands the best chance of being coached up by this new staff is Derick Hall, who is entering his second season.

[NorthHawk]

To be honest, nobody played well on Defense under the last 2 DC's.
MacDonald has a reputation of using a players strengths as an asset and not try to force them into roles they will fail at.
I don't know what will happen with Taylor, but I have an open mind and want to give him a chance. Maybe he won't make it past Training Camp but maybe he becomes a starter.

[River_Dog]

To be honest, nobody played well on Defense under the last 2 DC's.
MacDonald has a reputation of using a players strengths as an asset and not try to force them into roles they will fail at.
I don't know what will happen with Taylor, but I have an open mind and want to give him a chance. Maybe he won't make it past Training Camp but maybe he becomes a starter.

Oh, I'm going into the season with an open mind. Plus, I'm very aware of my own limitations, that my judgement is often times wrong, perhaps more so than any other poster on this board.

I can remember my old high school coach, telling us how to position ourselves on defense. His instructions would end with "...and play football from here." 'Play football' meant blocking and/or tackling. I remember a coach once saying "50% of football is tackling and 50% is blocking. Anything else is incidental." Of course, back then it was the three yards and a cloud of dust offenses that ruled, but nevertheless, it demonstrates how fundamental tackling is, that you use the same technique at every level.

That's why I'm so pessimistic about Taylor and Woolen, that their problems aren't fixable. We probably didn't see just how bad of a tackler Woolen is in his rookie season because the secondary wasn't expected to stop runs like they were this past year. Same with Quandre Diggs. If the players up front are doing their jobs, the secondary shouldn't have to tackle that often. A player in the secondary can get by with sloppy tackling if the players in front of them are good. Deion Sanders was one of the worst tackling defensive backs ever, but he made the HOF.

[NorthHawk]

I think Woolen watched Adams and Diggs making ‘Business decisions’ and followed suit. I think I remember him being a more willing tackler earlier in his first year than last year. But that was 2 years ago now…

[River_Dog]

I think Woolen watched Adams and Diggs making ‘Business decisions’ and followed suit. I think I remember him being a more willing tackler earlier in his first year than last year. But that was 2 years ago now…

Half the defense seemed to suffer from the sloppy tackling disease, and there's a lot of blame to be spread around.

Playing the role of a stats monkey, our time of possession was the worst in the league by quite a margin at 26:38 minutes per game. Our offense ran an average of 58.5 plays per game, also worst in the league, and our defense had the highest number of plays ran at them at 67.5. Our third down conversion percentage was in the bottom 1/3 of the league, so we can point our finger at the offense as well. They certainly didn't help matters.

The defense couldn't get off the field and the offense couldn't stay on it. The problems snowballed, fed on themselves, and it exposed players like Woolen, Diggs, Adams, and Taylor. There is a silver lining in that it showed us just who was weak at that part of the game and who wasn't, and obviously led to a decision not to retain a couple of those players. Mike Jackson and Julian Love were much better tacklers than the players who started in front of them. I'm not sure if that would have been so apparent if our defense in general wasn't so bad.

If players like Woolen and Taylor don't come to the party and do so quickly, I wouldn't hesitate to cut bait on them.

[Irish Greg 2.0]

I think it's going to be a few seasons of middling then this team will be good again.

Roster youth, an entirely new staff with a head coach who has never been a head coach before, tons of new faces, new schemes, new culture ... I expect some growing pains. I also expect they will be competitive, and especially on defense will make things much more difficult on the opponent.

Offensively? I don't know. Is Grubb ready to modify his offense for the NFL? I really wish we would have come out of the draft with a move tight end who can be a weapon ... Cade Stover was sitting right there when we took Barner. This team has longed for a tight end threat. It seems like they want Fant to be that guy, but I am skeptical.

For all the yapping about Pete being a defensive guru, he sure lost the bubble in the last 3 seasons. Of course, his Achilles was (a) bad hires and (b) loyalty to those hires.

It's really hard to tell when all of this will gel, but I am optimistic down the road. I am also curious to see if a struggle season (not 9-8, which new fans to the franchise think is awful) alienates the fan base? Us old timers went through a lot of lean years with the Seahawks. All the newbies that jumped onboard in 2012-2014 haven't really felt the pain.