O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby RiverDog » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:32 am

c_hawkbob wrote:Russ is clearly physically hampered with injuries to each leg and his throwing shoulder. A very big part of the reason he is clearly hampred is the offensive line, whether it be the hits he takes due to ineffective blocking - which BTW I do agree is clearly better this year than last (boy is that a low bar) or his feeling like he has to "carry" the offensive load now in the absence of Marshawn. To "blame Wilson" is also an indictment of the O-line and by extension John and Pete. As it should be; this is a team game, our team's shortcomings are a team issue.

The sky really isn't falling though, we're still solidly in first place in our division, we're getting healthy and whether you want to acknowledge it or not the O-line really does look like they could be a decent group as the season goes on.

As for the article linked above, I hope they are correct that the current makeup of our cap distribution pie is more a function of which stars came due for their contracts first and not a team philosophy of skimping on the O-line. Looking back on how it all shook out I can accept that for now. We'll see going forward.


That's pretty much how I feel. Saying the OL is "drastically" improved over last year's unit is like bragging that your child is getting D's instead of F's. Yes, it's progress, but still clearly unsatisfactory and only reason it looks improved is because it's contrasted with the F (last year's OL).

I'm a little more skeptical about the reason for the currently out of balance salary cap distribution, though. What is curious is that we never resign any of our OL's to second contracts (Okung, Carpenter, Sweezy, McQ, Bruno), which means one of two things: Either we are very poor at identifying and developing OL talent or we don't have the commitment necessary to retain them and choose to skimp. Like North says, Britt will be a good testing of that philosophy.

And yes, the sky is not falling, at least not yet. With the possible exception of the Cowboys, of whom I'm still not completely convinced are for real, the NFC is wide open, and with a 4-2-1 record, we're not in that bad of shape all things considered.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Rambo2014 » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:59 am

Them Ryan boys are tough! Buff is about to smoke you guys. I would love to see Harvin run for a TD on a jet sweep! But no matter I just feel the O Line of Sea will be like old buildings in a Tsunami
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby c_hawkbob » Thu Nov 03, 2016 1:28 pm

HumanCockroach wrote:Actually I put that link there more for the info on the throwbacks that people really want to see ( and why that's not really going to happen unless the NFL changes their policies) not so much the line info ( though cutting sacks 2/3rds seems important).


Well I hope you don't mind too terribly much that I read the whole the whole article and made my own observations on what I thought was most relevant.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Thu Nov 03, 2016 2:43 pm

Take whatever you want out of it. I honestly don't care, just clarifying why I posted it. More than anything I didn't feel it deserved its own thread, and it gave an explanation for those regularly bringing up the throwbacks...

As for the line ( discussing it in the article is the only reason it ended up here instead of somewhere else) whatever. I really don't care what people at this point think about it. People formed their opinions a long time ago, and no matter the improvements, they'll never acknowledge it.

Peoples biggest complaint the last three seasons about Seattle's line has been pass protection, yet somehow despite people claiming otherwise weekly, Seattle is the third best in the NFL in sacks allowed and top half in pressures allowed. Feel free to claim that's a "D instead of an F" until you're blue in the face, personally, I wanted improvement and GOT it ( DRASTIC Improvement) and am willing to watch the young line develop.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby savvyman » Sat Nov 05, 2016 8:46 am

The Line has significantly outperformed last years version.

Our offense has too many receiving weapons and adequate running backs.

The problem this year has been the offensive schemes and packages and the situational play calling - its been awful all year - which means its all on the coaching staff.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Jjones84 » Mon Nov 07, 2016 8:01 am

Rambo2014 wrote:Them Ryan boys are tough! Buff is about to smoke you guys. I would love to see Harvin run for a TD on a jet sweep! But no matter I just feel the O Line of Sea will be like old buildings in a Tsunami


How did your rams do? Oh yeah, lost again. You are a pathetic loser. I bet your parents and siblings hate your guts too. Your grandma says you are an embarrassment in the trailer park she has her camper set up in. Don't forget to remind your sister to get her weekly shot, prostitution is a filthy business.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Rambo2014 » Mon Nov 07, 2016 1:38 pm

The Truth Hurts However;

Tonight Seahawks wilt at home under a constant diet of blitzes

Wilson gets sacked 8 times and out of the game in Q-3

A fading team before our eyes

Bills 33
Sea 9
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby ShackMod » Mon Nov 07, 2016 2:16 pm

Regardless of how the O - Line is performing, we hope that our forum contributes to fun and informative conversations about the hawks.
Lets leave observations about trailer parks in the off topic section.

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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Seahawks4Ever » Mon Nov 07, 2016 6:38 pm

Still think this group is better the last years??? How kicks have been blocked this year as opposed to last? CM lost 2 yards the first time he touched the ball, I don't remember many games like that last season. Maybe you ought to change the title of your post???
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Tue Nov 08, 2016 2:58 am

Interesting, less pressure, less hits, less sacks and I should change the title? Nah. I'm good. Wilson was responsible for two, line was responsible for two ( I was there, watching from above. Wilson STILL sometimes flees a clean pocket and runs INTO pressure, some may have to do with instincts, perhaps an internal clock, or maybe he just is improvising. I wouldn't change it, it makes him, him. That said, blaming the line when he does it is asinine). Wilson had time more often than not against the number one pass rush in the league through 9 weeks that brought constant blitzes and pressure. Not sure why Seattle insist on running against 8 in the box, but they do, every single run was into a blitz, 3 blockers vs 5 defenders isn't going to work. Just isn't, doesn't matter if it's Lynch, Campbell or Frickin Jim Brown back there.

Not sure if Wilson doesn't have the option of audibling for some reason or if they're being stubborn, but when a defense lines up in an unbalanced front with 5 or 6 on one side of the center, might want to run the other way.. just an idea ( honestly, you shouldn't even run the ball against 8 in the box with 5 blockers, like EVER. It is not rocket science).

I can live with 3 or 4 sacks weekly ( a DRASTIC improvement whatever your opinion is about it).
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Tue Nov 08, 2016 3:04 am

Rambo2014 wrote:The Truth Hurts However;

Tonight Seahawks wilt at home under a constant diet of blitzes

Wilson gets sacked 8 times and out of the game in Q-3

A fading team before our eyes

Bills 33
Sea 9


Oopsie. Making the spreads bigger, isn't going to improve your chances of being right.... 5 years without losing by more than 10 points ( and that only once). Yet weekly, you come on with a prediction of Seattle losing, and not just losing, but losing big. Is it the broken clock system ( at some point you'll be right as long as you keep claiming something, and despite being wrong time after time after time, you may someday get lucky?) Or are you generally just not any good at deciphering, knowing about, scouting, evaluating football?
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Hawkstar » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:50 pm

The Line has played back to back reasonable games. (Noted - a Healthier RW makes everything look better!) Anyway, do we stay with the current Five guys or does Sowell (sp) jump back in at LT?

If I had a say, I'd leave Fant in there. I keep hearing about a O line needing reps together and the current 5 have feel like our best bet this season and going forward.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Hawk Sista » Mon Nov 14, 2016 5:07 pm

Haven't heard anything difinitive from the coach, but I'd suspect you two are on the same page as am I. We shall see.

If this Fant thing works out... man, what a story. #hopeful
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby RiverDog » Mon Nov 14, 2016 5:38 pm

Hawkstar wrote:The Line has played back to back reasonable games. (Noted - a Healthier RW makes everything look better!) Anyway, do we stay with the current Five guys or does Sowell (sp) jump back in at LT?

If I had a say, I'd leave Fant in there. I keep hearing about a O line needing reps together and the current 5 have feel like our best bet this season and going forward.


They were reasonable in pass protection vs. the Bills. They sure as heck didn't open many holes in the running game.

But they looked great in all aspects last night, so I'll be more than happy to eat crow if they can sustain last night's effort through the rest of the season.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:34 pm

Hawkstar wrote:The Line has played back to back reasonable games. (Noted - a Healthier RW makes everything look better!) Anyway, do we stay with the current Five guys or does Sowell (sp) jump back in at LT?

If I had a say, I'd leave Fant in there. I keep hearing about a O line needing reps together and the current 5 have feel like our best bet this season and going forward.


I would leave Fant for now, but I'm not opposed to a short route for whomever they play. If Fant struggles mightily, no reason not to see if So well will play better, or vice versa. At this point Fant has shown strides every game, learns quickly and adjusts, So well might be the obviously more polished of the two, but according to Carroll still falls back into bad habits and techniques...

Think it's fairly safe to say the job is up for grabs, and honestly Do well was NEVER a long term solution ( really he wasn't supposed to be anything but depth, unfortunate that Webb was such a steaming pile of garbage).
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:37 pm

They were reasonable in pass protection vs. the Bills. They sure as heck didn't open many holes in the running game.

But they looked great in all aspects last night, so I'll be more than happy to eat crow if they can sustain last night's effort through the rest of the season


They won't consistently perform like that, doesn't work that way for any line in the NFL. Every line makes mistakes, just like every player, if you're expecting that performance every week, no wonder you can't acknowledge the obvious improvements.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby RiverDog » Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:22 am

HumanCockroach wrote:They won't consistently perform like that, doesn't work that way for any line in the NFL. Every line makes mistakes, just like every player, if you're expecting that performance every week, no wonder you can't acknowledge the obvious improvements.


It doesn't work that way for most lines in the NFL, but then again, most lines in the NFL don't win Lombardi's, either.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Jjones84 » Tue Nov 15, 2016 5:50 am

I think some people need to stop flip-flopping week to week. Which is it, do the hawks suck, or are they good. It can't be good after a win, suck after a loss. That my friends, is a fair weather fan.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby MackStrongIsMyHero » Tue Nov 15, 2016 6:53 am

No line wins a Lombardi. You know as well as I do that teams win Lombardis. The young line is improving, but they are still going to struggle. Despite that, the Seahawks are still a Superbowl contender and very much capable of winning it.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:34 pm

It doesn't work that way for most lines in the NFL, but then again, most lines in the NFL don't win Lombardi's, either


Absolutely, I would feel secure in saying that 31 lines fail every year, including the "best" line more often than not.... Remind me how many titles Dallas' line has amongst them? SF line a couple season gathered how many rings? Dem' Hogs were the best line for about a decade, how many SB's did they win?

Amazingly enough, the line is one aspect of championship teams, and obviously not the most important one for some reason.. you're pretending like all lines don't have bad games, which is silly. All of them do, INCLUDING the ones that win Lombardi's, and the ones trying to.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby monkey » Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:28 pm

This week will be an interesting test to see how far the line has come, the Eagle's front seven is terrific.
I suspect the line will have quite a few more problems than they did against the Patriots.
Then again, every o line would...
Last edited by monkey on Wed Nov 16, 2016 8:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby HumanCockroach » Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:57 pm

They absolutely will have more issues, same as having faced other elite front sevens this season... Good news is, we can all look forward to statements about how awful the line is in short order with zero contemplation about who they were playing...
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby monkey » Wed Nov 16, 2016 8:45 pm

HumanCockroach wrote:Good news is, we can all look forward to statements about how awful the line is in short order with zero contemplation about who they were playing...

Yup been that way the last few years now. Gets old.
Side note. I think that perhaps the most underrated story of the whole season to date, is the redemption of Justin Britt. People were falling over themselves to get behind the Christine Michael redemption angle, yet not much has been said about the guy who has gone from being the weakest leak on a lousy line, (and one of the most hated player's in recent years), to quite possibly our best lineman, and a better center than we had any right to expect.
I could easily make the argument that he's a better center than Unger was for us, partly because Unger was always hurt, but also because Britt is a fantastic run blocker from the center spot.
No one is talking about it, but Britt's ability to block at the second level and to block on the move, pulling etc..., is legitimately elite level.
I could EASILY make the argument that he belongs in the pro bowl this year.
Think about that... Amazing. Last year virtually everyone was ready to cut him, and had given up on him. No one, not anyone, can honestly claim they saw this coming.
I sure hoped, that he could do this, and I definitely saw the potential that Cable was seeing, but anyone claiming they saw this coming, is lying.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby MackStrongIsMyHero » Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:01 pm

Saw on Seahawks.com that Fant is staying at LT and Sowell will compete for the RT spot. Pretty sure a poster predicted this very thing.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby Hawkstar » Thu Nov 17, 2016 9:26 am

MackStrongIsMyHero wrote:Saw on Seahawks.com that Fant is staying at LT and Sowell will compete for the RT spot. Pretty sure a poster predicted this very thing.

Pretty cool story with Fant. I believe that same article said Fant was perfect in his assignments against the Pats. He may have been beaten a few times, but apparently he didn't make mental mistakes. You have to imagine that The Pats threw a ton at him.

The question now is Brad better than Gary at RT.
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Re: O - Line performing drastically better than 2015 group

Postby NorthHawk » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:12 pm

Talk about climbing the learning curve.
Fant has been a real surprise in how far he's come from the pre-season.
If he's just scratching the surface of his abilities, he might be the next player to legitimately try to reach the levels of big Walt.
He won't get there of course, but if he can be a starter for the next 10 years, that would be a great story.
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