Im not worried

[LTH]

Look its going to take a while for the o-line to gel...we see improvement every game... I think the problem is the O is not sustaining drives when they need leaving the D on the field to long to and that to me still points at the o line...this is work in progress and as long as they take care of business in their division they will be alright... If they start losing divisional games thats when things will get sticky... just my take

LTH

[wait_a_sec]

Go Lions

[Hawk Sista]

I had the same thought re: the Lions a few hours ago. Man, the Cards are looking really good. Zoiks!

LTH - welcome aboard (you are new to me anyway). I agree with your sentiments. Barring significant injury, I believe we will get on a roll after a few more weeks of gelling. I'm hoping we are 4 n 4 (I'd settle for better) at the halfway mark and we'll be a force after that. As Bob pointed out in another thread, the issues on D are largely fixable (communication issues) and the o-line is showing improvement (over a better team on the road). It'll be ok.

Go Hawks!

[Zorn76]

It's such a narrow margin between wins and losses in this league, and we've learned the hard way so far this year when it comes to road games.

Ultimately, you have to stay with what's working and remain aggressive.
We didn't do that today, especially offensively, in terms of play calls and lack of execution.
Obviously, the defense shares the blame as well, as they weren't clutch, either.
I dunno, a game like this, if just one or two things go differently then we hang on to win.

Beyond that, we just have to hold home court and keep winning at The Clink, and try to put together at least 3 wins for away matchups.

[savvyman]

Im not worried

LTH

We are 2-3 after 5 games. You should be.

[HumanCockroach]

I am, if your offense scores 15 1/2 points a game, and your defense gives up 18, I don't see a lot of wins coming our way. I ain't no math wiz, but it seems upside down to me.

[Hawktawk]

I'm terrified. We are about another 4th quarter collapse from being back to being the same old seahawks before 2012. The time to figure it out is NOW!

[obiken]

I'm terrified. We are about another 4th quarter collapse from being back to being the same old seahawks before 2012. The time to figure it out is NOW!

Spot on. That is the biggest worry for as well. Champions find a way to win close games losers find a way to not to win them. We Couged it. My Ducks Couged it against the Cougars. Can I be put in Cryo Freezes till next FB season??

[mykc14]

A lot of people had those same worries last year when we were 3-3 and 6-4. Im not worried until I see continued regression. We have things we need to fix, but IMO we are trending in the right direction after a bad win on Monday. 5-3 on the road should get us at least to 12-4 on the season. We have lost 2 winnable games on the road to undefeated teams. Do you feel better about this team after the ugly win on Monday or the mostly well played loss today. The fact of the matter is the Hawks with RW have always played better with their backs against the wall. RW is allowed to play a little less conservatively and is able to make plays. With RW and this defense we still can beat anybody anywhere.

[mykc14]

Spot on. That is the biggest worry for as well. Champions find a way to win close games losers find a way to not to win them. We Couged it. My Ducks Couged it against the Cougars. Can I be put in Cryo Freezes till next FB season??

Yeah, except for the fact that almost every championship team in NFL history has lost close games in their championship season. Look at our SB winning season. We had a close 6 point loss against the Colts, a game in which we had the lead in the 4th quarter. We then had an ugly 2 point loss to the Niners, a game in which we had a 4th quarter lead. Then 2 games later we lost another game in which we had a 4th quarter lead, this time to the Cardinals at home after picking off Palmer 4 times. In fact all 3 of our losses this season look fairly similar to the losses we had that season. The big difference is one of those was at home and we actually looked much worse offensively in 2 of those games than we have this year. It wouldn't surprise me to see the same result this year as that season. Of course we have stuff to work on but we did in the SB season as well.

[obiken]

A lot of people had those same worries last year when we were 3-3 and 6-4. Im not worried until I see continued regression. We have things we need to fix, but IMO we are trending in the right direction after a bad win on Monday. 5-3 on the road should get us at least to 12-4 on the season. We have lost 2 winnable games on the road to undefeated teams. Do you feel better about this team after the ugly win on Monday or the mostly well played loss today. The fact of the matter is the Hawks with RW have always played better with their backs against the wall. RW is allowed to play a little less conservatively and is able to make plays. With RW and this defense we still can beat anybody anywhere.

Point taken. However your analogy to last year false and pejorative, last year CP went down and while we were winning they were losing. This year we are now 2-3 the Cards are 4-1. IMHO, as long as the Carson Palmer remains upright they are gold. They have 3 sure games next, so 7-1 is a probability; then they play us. We play the 4-0 Panthers next. IF we lose another close game to them and I think that is a probability, we would be 4-4 and the Cards 7-1; it becomes a must win game or its all over-the Cards would be 8-1 and would be out of it at 4-5. It could get worse if we lose to SF or the Cowboys, which is not out of the realm.

[Zorn76]

mykc14,

IMO, while there is some similarities to last year, this season still has a different *feel* to it - so far.
I don't know when the last time was when we had a 17 pt lead in the 4th quarter, then subsequently lost the game. Maybe it's happened more recently than I think, or maybe it was a bit less - say a 10 pt lead in the 4th - but regardless it's still troublesome.

From a offensive standpoint, it comes down to trust. And Bevell decided to play it "safe", which turned out to be the wrong call. Even with a lead like we had today, our defense clearly is not being as clutch as they used to be, particularly late in games (just like the O). Again, all of this may just be temporary for now, but it's still cause for legit concern.

I think it really boils down to being clutch. We are a good football team, but we have not been clutch when needed. That's the biggest difference, especially when playing good and/or tough teams in their house.

And while we're more than capable of righting the ship, we're gonna have to see vast improvement, starting with the OL. It's a very tiresome topic, I know, but it remains the biggest question mark moving forward. They had some nice moments today - Rawls had an amazing game - and there was some protection here and there for RW. Beyond that, the D cannot surrender long drives that lead to momentum change. I mean, you could just feel this game slip away in the 4th.

We can't expect perfection, but this game in particular is as discouraging as it was encouraging (for 3 quarters).

Everybody on this team needs to step it up. Coaching, offense, defense, and even ST's. They've done it before, and they can do it again. But overall I feel there is way less margin for error, given what we've seen so far.

[obiken]

Sure and make it clear they will always be our Hawks, but I cheer with my heart and analyze with my head. The problem is with the Panthers being 4-0 and Atlanta being 5-0, the Wild card is not going to come out of the West. We need to start playing better, and we need some luck, both in a real hurry.

[Zorn76]

obiken,

It is worth noting that the Cards wins have come against the Saints, Bears, 49ers, and Lions. There one loss, at home vs the Rams, did show that they are vulnerable against a good defense.

Yes, our 2 wins have come vs the Bears and Lions as well. But losing to Stl (on top of it being week 1), GB, and now Cincy, all on the road, wasn't entirely unexpected going in. Obviously, the way things went today, we should've had the win.

Point is, The Cards have yet to face more than one decent team (Stl). And, yes, things are looking good for them over the next few weeks (@ M. Vick led Steelers, home vs Ravens, then @ Cleveland). You can make a good case for them being 7-1 at that point. The rest of their schedule does get a whole lot more interesting though. It's a week by week thing for every team.

Right now, they are sitting pretty. But they still gotta play the games.

Meanwhile, we have some tough games ahead of us as well, but you can also make a case that we have played the toughest part of our season already. Obviously, we have 5 division games left, including 2 vs AZ. But Seattle is still capable of going on a nice run themselves here.

I know it's very discouraging right now, but it's not as big of a stretch as we might think. Margin for error seems to change each Sunday. Right now it feels it's working against us. We'll see if it remains that way.

[Hawktawk]

[quote="Zorn76"]

IMO, while there is some similarities to last year, this season still has a different *feel* to it - so far.
I don't know when the last time was when we had a 17 pt lead in the 4th quarter, then subsequently lost the game. Maybe it's happened more recently than I think, or maybe it was a bit less - say a 10 pt lead in the 4th - but regardless it's still troublesome.

Zorn the last time the Hawks lost a 17 point 4th quarter lead was 2004 week 4. Coming off a shutout of the 9ers and sitting 3-0 we hosted the Rams at the Klink. We were up 17 with LESS THAN 7 MINUTES to play and lost to the Rams in OT. There was another one in 2003 vs Baltimore, that was the 4 timeout game mistake by officials.The script for both games was about the same as yesterday too as I recall. Timid offensive play calling and a soft defensive scheme.
Either way those Seattle teams both wound up being weak fringe playoff teams who were one and done in the postseason. Great teams find a way to win and mediocre to bad teams find a way to lose.

Id say 2-3 is mediocre at best.There are no style points. I look at the Texans from 2013. They were a 2-1 ballclub who had a huge lead on Seattle late and got beat in overtime in week 4 2013. They have NEVER recovered. This has been a mentally tough team with more talent than that one but still.....Undefeated Carolina team with 2 weeks to prepare and recent familiarity with our stadium and fans rolls in next week. Its a must win IMO just to be in the Wild card mix going forward.
Very worried.

[mykc14]

[quote="Hawktawk[list=]

Zorn the last time the Hawks lost a 17 point 4th quarter lead was 2004 week 4. Coming off a shutout of the 9ers and sitting 3-0 we hosted the Rams at the Klink. We were up 17 with LESS THAN 7 MINUTES to play and lost to the Rams in OT. There was another one in 2003 vs Baltimore, that was the 4 timeout game mistake by officials.The script for both games was about the same as yesterday too as I recall. Timid offensive play calling and a soft defensive scheme.
Either way those Seattle teams both wound up being weak fringe playoff teams who were one and done in the postseason. Great teams find a way to win and mediocre to bad teams find a way to lose.

Id say 2-3 is mediocre at best.There are no style points. I look at the Texans from 2013. They were a 2-1 ballclub who had a huge lead on Seattle late and got beat in overtime in week 4 2013. They have NEVER recovered. This has been a mentally tough team with more talent than that one but still.....Undefeated Carolina team with 2 weeks to prepare and recent familiarity with our stadium and fans rolls in next week. Its a must win IMO just to be in the Wild card mix going forward.
Very worried.[/quote]

The fact that we lost those types of games with fringe playoff teams in the past is completely irrelevant as there are no common aspects to those teams and our current Hawks. Not the same players or coaches. Also are you really comparing us to the Texans? That team had a journey QB (has he started for anybody since the Texans that year) and have never been to the SB. Come on people, lets not blow this out of proportion. I am not saying we are definitely going to win the SB but in the previous 2 seasons we only lost a total of 8 games, but we had a number of games that we could have lost. We are the same team either way. We can still beat anybody anywhere anytime. We are not playing our best football and that is ok. Lets clean up those issues and we will be fine. Don't fix those small problems and we will be an 8 or 9 win team, but lets at least give them a chance.

[Hawk Sista]

I really have to decide to be positive. I drive my partner crazy w/ saying things like "we are gonna blow it, I can just feel it" after the Bengals scored their 1st of their comeback points. It takes some time and reflection to get to a point that I'm not yelling and scaring the dog.

After thinking about it, in each of the last two seasons we had some things bounce our way. Last year, RW fumbled 12/13 times and we recovered every single fumble. This year, we've been losing those - 1 to a TD against the Lions. Sometimes it really is the way the ball bounces. Remember how poorly we played in Houston and against the Titans and Bucks at home? One play either way in all of those games (oh yeah, and the Green Bay game) and we are out of the playoffs. One play either way in one or two and we lose HFA.

Our three losses have all been on the road to good teams (1 after a short week w/ no Beast - Rawls was great, but he's not yet the closer that Lynch has been). Our strong safety hijacked the 1st two games from us and we are down our ID/closer on O and yet, we had our chances in all three.

It may well be that we sneak in to the playoffs or miss them entirely. Instead of singling out who is to blame - I prefer to realize any one of a number of things could have made each of those games better/worse. The national media (local too) seem to have a need to polarize and talk in extremes, when in reality - our 2-3 start is more a matter of a handful of plays. Pete has shown the ability to overcome rough starts to games and seasons and I'm going to choose to keep the faith.

Remember the NFCCGs the last two years?

[obiken]

obiken,

It is worth noting that the Cards wins have come against the Saints, Bears, 49ers, and Lions. There one loss, at home vs the Rams, did show that they are vulnerable against a good defense.

Yes, our 2 wins have come vs the Bears and Lions as well. But losing to Stl (on top of it being week 1), GB, and now Cincy, all on the road, wasn't entirely unexpected going in. Obviously, the way things went today, we should've had the win.

Point is, The Cards have yet to face more than one decent team (Stl). And, yes, things are looking good for them over the next few weeks (@ M. Vick led Steelers, home vs Ravens, then @ Cleveland). You can make a good case for them being 7-1 at that point. The rest of their schedule does get a whole lot more interesting though. It's a week by week thing for every team.

Right now, they are sitting pretty. But they still gotta play the games.

Meanwhile, we have some tough games ahead of us as well, but you can also make a case that we have played the toughest part of our season already. Obviously, we have 5 division games left, including 2 vs AZ. But Seattle is still capable of going on a nice run themselves here.

I know it's very discouraging right now, but it's not as big of a stretch as we might think. Margin for error seems to change each Sunday. Right now it feels it's working against us. We'll see if it remains that way.

No doubt, the season could turn around no doubt, and we all hope it will. IF we won out and Zona loses a couple maybe we'll be ok. But we are backed to the wall any more loses we are toast.

[mykc14]

No doubt, the season could turn around no doubt, and we all hope it will. IF we won out and Zona loses a couple maybe we'll be ok. But we are backed to the wall any more loses we are toast.

If we win out we will win the division.

[RiverDog]

mykc14,

IMO, while there is some similarities to last year, this season still has a different *feel* to it - so far.
I don't know when the last time was when we had a 17 pt lead in the 4th quarter, then subsequently lost the game. Maybe it's happened more recently than I think, or maybe it was a bit less - say a 10 pt lead in the 4th - but regardless it's still troublesome.

From a offensive standpoint, it comes down to trust. And Bevell decided to play it "safe", which turned out to be the wrong call. Even with a lead like we had today, our defense clearly is not being as clutch as they used to be, particularly late in games (just like the O). Again, all of this may just be temporary for now, but it's still cause for legit concern.

I think it really boils down to being clutch. We are a good football team, but we have not been clutch when needed. That's the biggest difference, especially when playing good and/or tough teams in their house.

And while we're more than capable of righting the ship, we're gonna have to see vast improvement, starting with the OL. It's a very tiresome topic, I know, but it remains the biggest question mark moving forward. They had some nice moments today - Rawls had an amazing game - and there was some protection here and there for RW. Beyond that, the D cannot surrender long drives that lead to momentum change. I mean, you could just feel this game slip away in the 4th.

We can't expect perfection, but this game in particular is as discouraging as it was encouraging (for 3 quarters).

Everybody on this team needs to step it up. Coaching, offense, defense, and even ST's. They've done it before, and they can do it again. But overall I feel there is way less margin for error, given what we've seen so far.

Yes, this season does have a whole lot different feel to it. We started out last season by absolutely destroying a very good team in the Packers then beat another very good team in the Bronco by winning a clutch game when our offense took the bull by the horns and kept Peyton Manning on the bench. We started out 3-1 then slipped to 3-3 before we rid ourselves of the Harvin cancer and went on to nearly run the table.

This season, we've lost three very winnable games, two of which went into overtime, and our only two wins have come at home against teams that have a combined 2-8 record. Our offense used to be able to perform in OT. Now they melt like butter. Our current 2-3 record feels a lot worse than what our 3-3 low point felt like last season. We can't put games away in the 4th quarter and we don't perform in overtime.

[Hawktawk]

[quote

Yes, this season does have a whole lot different feel to it. We started out last season by absolutely destroying a very good team in the Packers then beat another very good team in the Bronco by winning a clutch game when our offense took the bull by the horns and kept Peyton Manning on the bench. We started out 3-1 then slipped to 3-3 before we rid ourselves of the Harvin cancer and went on to nearly run the table.

This season, we've lost three very winnable games, two of which went into overtime, and our only two wins have come at home against teams that have a combined 2-8 record. Our offense used to be able to perform in OT. Now they melt like butter. Our current 2-3 record feels a lot worse than what our 3-3 low point felt like last season. We can't put games away in the 4th quarter and we don't perform in overtime.

True RD. I had the discussion with my 20 year old son last night. He said Dad we were 3-3 last year. I said we aren't even 3-3 yet and had 3 really impressive games under our belt by now last year too.

It has a way different feel and I expect a battle royale with Carolina this weekend. Hopefully Seattle plays like they did against Cincy for 3 quarters all game. If they lose here the wheels have come off completely IMO. If they win then we can talk about putting a run together. Any margin of victory will do.

[Futureite]

obiken,

It is worth noting that the Cards wins have come against the Saints, Bears, 49ers, and Lions. There one loss, at home vs the Rams, did show that they are vulnerable against a good defense.

Yes, our 2 wins have come vs the Bears and Lions as well. But losing to Stl (on top of it being week 1), GB, and now Cincy, all on the road, wasn't entirely unexpected going in. Obviously, the way things went today, we should've had the win.

Point is, The Cards have yet to face more than one decent team (Stl). And, yes, things are looking good for them over the next few weeks (@ M. Vick led Steelers, home vs Ravens, then @ Cleveland). You can make a good case for them being 7-1 at that point. The rest of their schedule does get a whole lot more interesting though. It's a week by week thing for every team.

Right now, they are sitting pretty. But they still gotta play the games.

Meanwhile, we have some tough games ahead of us as well, but you can also make a case that we have played the toughest part of our season already. Obviously, we have 5 division games left, including 2 vs AZ. But Seattle is still capable of going on a nice run themselves here.

I know it's very discouraging right now, but it's not as big of a stretch as we might think. Margin for error seems to change each Sunday. Right now it feels it's working against us. We'll see if it remains that way.

Your point about Cards is valid. The Hawks can definitely beat them and have the D to get their season turned around. The run O looked the best it has all yr Sunday.

That said, this Cards team is no joke. Their secondary is 2nd now only to Hawks in this Div, and is one of the better groups in the NFL. Peterson, Buchanon, Mathieu - all very talented. They are big and physical upfront, and they love to bring pressure. They are far more balanced this yr than prior yrs. They are most likely a 12 win team min. Going to be real tough to wrestle the div from them at this point. We had iur run, Hawks had theirs, and now it looks like the Cards turn.