Okung Doubtful

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Just saw this on ESPN. I know the line hasn't been stellar with Okung in, but Alvin Bailey against Greg Hardy scares me. Here's hoping the running game takes over for us.

[Uppercut]

Okung has had glass toes since he came to the Hawks! Time to trade him away or let him go next year.

[NorthHawk]

Hardy would be scary against a healthy Seahawks OL of this year.
Bailey is overmatched against average DE's, so he will need some help. Do they have another T that can play Tackle Eligible to help out?

[RiverDog]

I thought that maybe since this was his contract year that he wouldn't be missing as many games as he has in the past.

[burrrton]

My only reaction to this:

*sigh*

[Hawktawk]

Okung has been awful this year, probably the worst of his career. Maybe its been the toe all along. God forbid the line cant get much worse

[Zorn76]

Among other things, we have to have hot reads for RW to go to when the pressure's on, preferably in the area vacated when the Cowboys decide to blitz. We haven't seen enough of those kind of outlet plays from the offense this year.

Wislon also needs to tuck it and run, instead of holding onto the ball and taking some of these sacks. Even if it's not for big gains, it will lessen the yardage lost when he's tackled. We have to stay out of 3rd and longs, especially on the road.

As for Okung, he'll end up leaving by getting more money somewhere else. His health has been an issue, and he only stays at a reasonable price here. I suspect another team will give him more though. We know for sure he won't get the F tag, because he definitely is not worth that kind of money.

[RiverDog]

I do not agree that Okung has been bad. He is surrounded by players learning their positions, and overall he has done well. Hopefully, we will sign him for more time with the team. Offensive line play around the league has not been good, but RO is among the top 10 LT's in the league, and we need to keep him if we can. He may not play against Dallas, and that is an area where he can be criticized, as he has missed games because of minor injuries, but when he is able to play, he is our best OL.

I'm sorry, my friend, but I have to disagree. Okung not only is injured a lot, he's a penalty machine and he quite frequently gets spun around like a turnstile. I realize that at LT he's going up against the best pass rushers in the league, but he's one player on our team that is not earning his paycheck. Even if we wanted to resign him, which I hope we don't, we probably won't be able to afford him.

The problem is replacing him. I thought that when we drafted Britt that we might be able to move him over there when Okung was done, but we've appeared to have thrown in the towel on him as a tackle. With a very limited number of LT FA's hitting the market, our best option is the draft.

[burrrton]

I do not agree that Okung has been bad.

when he is able to play, he is our best OL.

The second quote doesn't necessarily support the first. He can be both, and I'd say he is, although I'm not sure I'd call him "bad", but rather mediocre at best.

[NorthHawk]

Okung has said (or at least alluded) that he will enter FA after this year.
Like RD, I'm not hopeful that he will sign here so the draft or FA should be a high priority.

Someone to look at in the middle of the OL could be Graham Glasgow, Center from Michigan.
He's a little tall at 6'5" for a Center, but he also played both Guard spots, too. According to Great Blue North Draft Report he's smart, athletic, and is able to easily get to the 2nd level.
He might be someone to look for in the middle rounds.

They also talk about Taylor Fallin, OT from Memphis. GBN suggests he might be a 4th to 5th round pick
Does anyone know much about him?

Their comment:
"He can maul a bit at the line of scrimmage and gets to second level blocks well for his size. Has a wide base, aka a big caboose. Sets up squarely and stays on his feet well, allowing him to block until the whistle sounds most of the time. Uses his hands and arms well to move blockers the direction he wants them to go. He’s not an elite prospect but has veteran savvy and understands his job".

http://gbnreport.com/pigskins-weekly-prospects-review/

[Hawktawk]

[quote="Old but Slow"]I do not agree that Okung has been bad. He is surrounded by players learning their positions, and overall he has done well. Hopefully, we will sign him for more time with the team. Offensive line play around the league has not been good, but RO is among the top 10 LT's in the league, and we need to keep him if we can. He may not play against Dallas, and that is an area where he can be criticized, as he has missed games because of minor injuries, but when he is able to play, he is our best OL.[/quote

Maybe its the expectation thing to a degree OBS but the fact is this is a guy who was drafted in the early first round to be the most important member of the offensive line. Hes had periods of time in his career when he played very well, especially when healthy and with a halfway decent performing guard to his right. This year he has appeared dreadful at times, absolutely whiffing on edge rushers , getting beat inside with a variety of moves, and drawing multiple penalties not just for holding but false starts. Again, if his toe isn't right it would explain a lot but still, a LT who cant stay on the field isn't the future for the Hawks.

[RiverDog]

Okung has said (or at least alluded) that he will enter FA after this year.
Like RD, I'm not hopeful that he will sign here so the draft or FA should be a high priority.

Someone to look at in the middle of the OL could be Graham Glasgow, Center from Michigan.
He's a little tall at 6'5" for a Center, but he also played both Guard spots, too. According to Great Blue North Draft Report he's smart, athletic, and is able to easily get to the 2nd level.
He might be someone to look for in the middle rounds.

They also talk about Taylor Fallin, OT from Memphis. GBN suggests he might be a 4th to 5th round pick
Does anyone know much about him?

Their comment:
"He can maul a bit at the line of scrimmage and gets to second level blocks well for his size. Has a wide base, aka a big caboose. Sets up squarely and stays on his feet well, allowing him to block until the whistle sounds most of the time. Uses his hands and arms well to move blockers the direction he wants them to go. He’s not an elite prospect but has veteran savvy and understands his job".

http://gbnreport.com/pigskins-weekly-prospects-review/

Jeez, I hope we're willing to invest more than just a 4th or 5th rounder for a couple of OL's. IMO that's been part of the problem, that Pete is reluctant to devote much resources to the OL so what we end up with is a bunch of projects.

[HumanCockroach]

I do not agree that Okung has been bad. He is surrounded by players learning their positions, and overall he has done well. Hopefully, we will sign him for more time with the team. Offensive line play around the league has not been good, but RO is among the top 10 LT's in the league, and we need to keep him if we can. He may not play against Dallas, and that is an area where he can be criticized, as he has missed games because of minor injuries, but when he is able to play, he is our best OL.

I agree to a point. He hasn't been "bad" when playing, problem IMHO is that isn't often enough. I do think people tend to compare him to Jones, which IMHO is insane. There is only one Jones and comparing any left tackle to him is an enormous mistake. That said, Seattle cannot afford to pay him 10+ million dollars a year to play 8-10 games ( which I have little doubt with the dearth of actual talented lineman in the league he will indeed receive). I just don't see it as a realistic investment. Seattle seriously needs to be thinking " trade up" this coming draft and find a viable replacement. Thing is, everyone will expect Okungs level of success plus some, which is even MORE unrealistic than comparing Okung to Jones.

[NorthHawk]

"Jeez, I hope we're willing to invest more than just a 4th or 5th rounder for a couple of OL's. IMO that's been part of the problem, that Pete is reluctant to devote much resources to the OL so what we end up with is a bunch of projects."

I would like to as well, but sometimes you have to draft multiple players along the OL when there is really a need. Considering how often Gilliam gets beat and they have seemingly given up on Britt at RT, they might get 2 players that might eventually be starters.
Having said that, the best OT's will probably be gone by the last part of the 1st round of the draft so as we need interior OL as well, maybe someone like Vadal Alexander, G/T from LSU (who has been named SEC Offensive Lineman of the Week 3 times so far this year) or maybe Spencer Drango from Baylor who is playing OT in College, but might end up inside as well.

Here's a link to NFLDraftScout's page for their current rankings of OT's.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/pl ... &order=ASC

[RiverDog]

I would like to as well, but sometimes you have to draft multiple players along the OL when there is really a need. Considering how often Gilliam gets beat and they have seemingly given up on Britt at RT, they might get 2 players that might eventually be starters.
Having said that, the best OT's will probably be gone by the last part of the 1st round of the draft so as we need interior OL as well, maybe someone like Vadal Alexander, G/T from LSU (who has been named SEC Offensive Lineman of the Week 3 times so far this year) or maybe Spencer Drango from Baylor who is playing OT in College, but might end up inside as well.

Here's a link to NFLDraftScout's page for their current rankings of OT's.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/pl ... &order=ASC

Thanks for the link. I don't get too involved in researching college players, at least not until after the season is over.

HC, I've often thought about the tendency to compare Okung with Big Walt, and every time Okung picks up a penalty, I think of how very few times Walt got penalized. It's the same thing when Largent was playing. Because Largent dropped maybe two or three passes in a season, I've developed a severe intolerance for any WR that dropped a pass. I must have died a thousand deaths when DJack and KRob were our wide outs back in 2004.

[Hawktawk]

HC, I've often thought about the tendency to compare Okung with Big Walt, and every time Okung picks up a penalty, I think of how very few times Walt got penalized. It's the same thing when Largent was playing. Because Largent dropped maybe two or three passes in a season, I've developed a severe intolerance for any WR that dropped a pass. I must have died a thousand deaths when DJack and KRob were our wide outs back in 2004.

I dont even remember Largent dropping 3 in a season RD. I'm thinking under ten for his entire career. It is a good comparison with WJ though. Okung isn't WJ, nobody on this team is Largent, and Mebane aint the Tez either. Thats why those guys are in the HOF. Still though no hardware for any of those 3 guys so it just goes to show it can be done without dominant position players.

Carroll and JS have proved it can at least once , almost twice and the jury is out going forward but we may have a verdict soon......

[HumanCockroach]

"Jeez, I hope we're willing to invest more than just a 4th or 5th rounder for a couple of OL's. IMO that's been part of the problem, that Pete is reluctant to devote much resources to the OL so what we end up with is a bunch of projects."

I would like to as well, but sometimes you have to draft multiple players along the OL when there is really a need. Considering how often Gilliam gets beat and they have seemingly given up on Britt at RT, they might get 2 players that might eventually be starters.
Having said that, the best OT's will probably be gone by the last part of the 1st round of the draft so as we need interior OL as well, maybe someone like Vadal Alexander, G/T from LSU (who has been named SEC Offensive Lineman of the Week 3 times so far this year) or maybe Spencer Drango from Baylor who is playing OT in College, but might end up inside as well.

Here's a link to NFLDraftScout's page for their current rankings of OT's.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/pl ... &order=ASC

I would be interested to find out when the last great offensive tackle was drafted outside of the top ten, much less the end of the first round. Truth is there aren't many "great" offensive tackles period. Much less multiples floating around at the end of round one. Great tackles come around about once every ten years or so, not once every ten picks. The idea that there are multiple may be the reason people aren't happy with ANY tackle, no matter what, and I have consistently said the same. Lineman, at least GREAT lineman don't fall out of trees anymore than franchise QBS, or lockdown corners. Hell GOOD lineman aren't common anymore.

Which is why there are so many teams in the same situation we so often lament in Seattle. I haven't changed my view on it, though it is certainly nice to see so many football analysts catching up. Clayton just reiterated what I have been saying for three years yesterday on my way home from work. This is NOT a Seattle problem, this IS a NFL problem.

[NorthHawk]

If you end up with an All Pro type LT from a pick in the last part of the draft it's probably good luck more than anything.
It's why I was discussing players like Alexander and Drango, and not the top rated Tackles.
However, I don't think The Packers OL consists of high 1st round picks but they are solid at pass protection and aren't too bad at run blocking. There are other teams as well that have solid but not All Pro players along the line that function quite well as a unit. It's a matter of making OL a priority over a number of drafts and not necessarily in the first if we are drafting late in the round.

Maybe this week is when we see a big jump in productivity along the line. The coaches keep saying this is a talented group, so if they aren't just blowing smoke, the line will at some time really improve.

As far as the draft goes, it wouldn't surprise me to see Defense again in the first and maybe second rounds with Mebane, Rubin, and Irvin all on the last year of their contracts. I hope we can re-sign two of them at least but other teams could out bid us.

[RiverDog]

I dont even remember Largent dropping 3 in a season RD. I'm thinking under ten for his entire career. It is a good comparison with WJ though. Okung isn't WJ, nobody on this team is Largent, and Mebane aint the Tez either. Thats why those guys are in the HOF. Still though no hardware for any of those 3 guys so it just goes to show it can be done without dominant position players.

Carroll and JS have proved it can at least once , almost twice and the jury is out going forward but we may have a verdict soon......

When I said that Largent dropped 3 passes per season, I was going on the high side so as not to sound too biased.