Wilson amongst leaders all time NFL stats

[mykc14]

I consider most of what Russell was lacking as a failure to adjust, not a regression. Defenses were taking some things away from Russell. DE's were taking wider angles, and Russell didn't adjust by stepping up into the pocket. Until lately, he was holding onto the ball too long when he had receivers open (I saw this in person at Cincy), looking for either a much more wide open look or one further downfield. I think Roach said essentially the same thing in a game he went to in person. That's something that doesn't show up on TV. Also, he didn't learn how to throw to a 6'8" receiver, trying to drop the ball over his shoulder like he would it were Kearse or Baldwin.

All that looks to be in the past now, though.

I agree with most of this. It seems a little ridiculous now to be talking regression. You don't regress for half a season and then all of a sudden turn the corner like he has the last 3 games. To me that points to a offensive shift in philosophy. It seems like the offense as a whole were a little 'slow' (very relative term) to adjust to how the D's were playing them. Clear offensive shift has produced some pretty great offensive games.

[savvyman]

Give it up - Russell was not a top 10 QB during the first 9 games and furthermore was simply awful in a few of those.

That is exactly what "Regression" looks like.

[NorthHawk]

Wilsons play correlates to the performance of the OL.
The play calling helped, too as they went to quicker throws.

[mykc14]

Give it up - Russell was not a top 10 QB during the first 9 games and furthermore was simply awful in a few of those.

That is exactly what "Regression" looks like.

You give it up. Even if your conjecture is that he was 'not a top 10 QB' that wouldn't mean that he was 'simply awful.' You wanted the season to to fit into a certain narrative that you 'predicted' at the beginning of the year. You thought you saw that happening and decided to jump all over it. You were wrong, no big deal. There is NO WAY a QB would have "Suggnificant Regression' for 9 weeks and then put up the numbers that RW has the previous 3 weeks. Furthermore, there is no way a QB could have played 'simply awful' for 9 weeks, played well for 3 weeks and then all of the sudden have a 106 rating (tied for 2nd in the NFL). I could take 'he didn't play well,' or 'struggled a bit,' or 'failed to adjust' but you make it seem like he went from a top 5 QB last year to bottom 10 this year. That didn't happen. Why not just sit back and enjoy what RW clearly is: a top 10 (at the very least), probably top 5 (much more likely) QB in this league.

[Vegaseahawk]

Anyone can use stats to say anything they want to. Example:
"Proof" that 1 + 1 = 1
a = 1
b = 1

a = b
a2 = b2
a2 - b2 = 0
(a-b)(a+b) = 0
(a-b)(a+b)/(a-b) = 0/(a-b)
1(a+b) = 0
(a+b) = 0
1 + 1 = 0
2 = 0
1 = 0
1 + 1 = 1

[RiverDog]

Anyone can use stats to say anything they want to. Example:
"Proof" that 1 + 1 = 1
a = 1
b = 1

a = b
a2 = b2
a2 - b2 = 0
(a-b)(a+b) = 0
(a-b)(a+b)/(a-b) = 0/(a-b)
1(a+b) = 0
(a+b) = 0
1 + 1 = 0
2 = 0
1 = 0
1 + 1 = 1

That was the point I was trying to make earlier in the thread in my exchange with Cbob.

[EmeraldBullet]

Anyone can use stats to say anything they want to. Example:
"Proof" that 1 + 1 = 1
a = 1
b = 1

a = b
a2 = b2
a2 - b2 = 0
(a-b)(a+b) = 0
(a-b)(a+b)/(a-b) = 0/(a-b)
1(a+b) = 0
(a+b) = 0
1 + 1 = 0
2 = 0
1 = 0
1 + 1 = 1

This step is incorrect:

(a-b)(a+b)/(a-b) = 0/(a-b)

since both a and b =1, you would be dividing by zero. Nice try though.

Also, there's raw data and then there's the analysis of that data. The raw data is what it is, like cbob says. The analysis of that data is up for interpretation, what that data actually means (I think what Riverdog is trying to say).

[RiverDog]

Also, there's raw data and then there's the analysis of that data. The raw data is what it is, like cbob says. The analysis of that data is up for interpretation, what that data actually means (I think what Riverdog is trying to say).

I'm glad you understand the difference. Russell Wilson's 102 passer rating, by itself, is raw or primary data. It is factual. However, the chart in the OP is not primary data as it contains multiple bits of primary data that have been organized and ranked in a specific order, highest to lowest. That was the point I was trying to make when I got accused of making things up.

[Hawktawk]

Greedapalooza regressing celebrity strikes again........
Someone not only has an unrealistic beef with Wilson but also has a cranial position that causes them to need a windshield wiper on their belly button to see where they are going.

THANK GOD FOR WILSON I CANT BELIVE WE GOT HIM!!!!!

[HumanCockroach]

Wilson has a passer rating of at least 138.5 in his last three games. The only other quarterbacks to do that are:

Aaron Rodgers, 2011
Kurt Warner, 1999
Roger Staubach, 1971

Staubach and Warner would go on the win the superbowl that year.

*Found this on a Seahawks group so I haven't verified it or not, and it isn't my info, but thought it was cool just the same.

[RiverDog]

Wilson has a passer rating of at least 138.5 in his last three games. The only other quarterbacks to do that are:

Aaron Rodgers, 2011
Kurt Warner, 1999
Roger Staubach, 1971

Staubach and Warner would go on the win the superbowl that year.

*Found this on a Seahawks group so I haven't verified it or not, and it isn't my info, but thought it was cool just the same.

Seeing Staubach's name in that group surprises me. I guess you'd call that an anomaly given that so few quarterbacks from 25+ years ago had ratings that high. They didn't even keep track of QB ratings in 1971. It also seems odd as I think that was the year that Landry two platooned Staubach with Craig Morton. It was only the second regular season after the merger.

That's more like raw data, and doesn't cause my briefs to bunch up like the rankings do.

[Hawktawk]

quote="RiverDog"][quarterbacks to do that are:

Aaron Rodgers, 2011
Kurt Warner, 1999
Roger Staubach, 1971

Staubach and Warner would go on the win the superbowl that year.



Seeing Staubach's name in that group surprises me. I guess you'd call that an anomaly given that so few quarterbacks from 25+ years ago had ratings that high. They didn't even keep track of QB ratings in 1971. It also seems odd as I think that was the year that Landry two platooned Staubach with Craig Morton. It was only the second regular season after the merger.

RD go back and look at some film of Roger the Dodger. I had forgotten how much he and Wilsons game resemble one another. That and Fran Tarkington but I hadn't remembered Staubach as being quite as much of a Houdini as he was.
And he was another guy who always looked downfield while on the move.
Being in the company with 3 HOFers isn't bad in any way for Mr. Wilson.

[RiverDog]

RD go back and look at some film of Roger the Dodger. I had forgotten how much he and Wilsons game resemble one another. That and Fran Tarkington but I hadn't remembered Staubach as being quite as much of a Houdini as he was.
And he was another guy who always looked downfield while on the move.
Being in the company with 3 HOFers isn't bad in any way for Mr. Wilson.

I agree, Staubach, Tarkenton, and Russell all share similar characteristics. I'd also include another HOF'er, Steve Young, although Young was bigger and more physical than the aforementioned 3.

Randall Cunningham was another QB that had a similar style, although he was not nearly as successful throwing the ball and played for some absolutely horrendous Eagles teams.

[HumanCockroach]

http://espn.go.com/blog/seattle-seahawk ... l-wilson-2

Pretty cool article with numbers both pre and post offensive explosion.

[burrrton]

Give it up - Russell was not a top 10 QB during the first 9 games and furthermore was simply awful in a few of those.

That is exactly what "Regression" looks like.

Huh?? He had a terrible game against ARI, but other than that he was on pace to have an outstanding year statistically (arguably the best of his career at a number of points iirc).

Take the last 3 games into account and this year looks like one of the best *in history* (assuming all things continue, a big assumption).

This is *not* what "regression" looks like.

[RiverDog]

Huh?? He had a terrible game against ARI, but other than that he was on pace to have an outstanding year statistically (arguably the best of his career at a number of points iirc).

Take the last 3 games into account and this year looks like one of the best *in history* (assuming all things continue, a big assumption).

This is *not* what "regression" looks like.

I'm going to fall in between you and savvy. Yes, Russell's individual stats look excellent, but some very important team stats that he bears a direct responsibility for suck, such as points scored (by the offense), red zone efficiency, first downs, and most importantly, w/l percentage. Looking simply at individual stats, Anthony's style, and concluding that he's having his best year in history absolves Russell of any responsibility for the lack of success of our offense and our team this season (first 9 games, that is).

But as I said before, saying that he regressed is going way over the top. He hasn't progressed or adjusted to the changes in his team like he should have (again, first 9 games). If you want to know what regression looks like, take a look at Andrew Luck or Colin Kaepernick.

[burrrton]

I'm going to fall in between you and savvy. Yes, Russell's individual stats look excellent, but some very important team stats that he bears a direct responsibility for suck, such as points scored (by the offense), red zone efficiency, first downs, and most importantly, w/l percentage.

Fair points.

[Hawktawk]

Wilson ran into adversity this year. Teams devised the way to stop him which was to deploy a picket fence of 5 defenders without spying and then collapse. It took he and Bevell time to adjust, along with horrible combination on the line.

Russel's first half performance this season wasn't a regression as much as a miracle. We might have been 2-6 without some of the plays he made in those early games. Now look at the bounce back.The man has put up historic numbers in the last 3 weeks. I swear he developed some new spin moves before the Vikings game. His play is off the charts and yet he has time for children hospital and is a first in last out guy at practice. Its a bonus that he is a megastar bringing publicity to our city,team,and Russell's causes. Whats not to love?

[HumanCockroach]

Wow, 1st QB since NFL merger to have 4 straight games with QB rating over 138. Guy just keeps setting records. Truly impressive no matter what decade, whatever his issues were at the beginning of this year, he has had a stretch I've personally never seen another QB duplicate. I don't care what his name is. Not Brady or Montana, Not Young or Graham, not Elway, Marino, Kelly nor Namath, Brees, Manning or Rodgers.... No one I have ever watched on tape or live has played at this level consistently over a full months time. None.

[monkey]

Though it's true that the teams we've played the last four-five games have been MUCH easier than the ones we played earlier this year, BY FAR the biggest difference in Wilson's game from those early games to these last four-five, has been the line play.
It is SO clear that right now Wilson is trusting the line more than he did early on (for all the reasons you can see with your eyes, no stats needed) and is going through his progressions better than he did earlier. Because Wilson is trusting his line more, he is able to keep his eyes downfield, rather than looking at the collapsing protection and trying to make something out of nothing.

Two quick observations.
1. Pete Prisco must be losing his mind right now seeing what Wilson is doing from within the pocket. Though I'm sure he's just doubling donw on his stupdiity and trying to stand by his moronic takes, EVERYONE with eyes, and without an axe to grind is laughing at the fool right now.
2. Through the first four years of a QB's career, the single best comparison to Russell Wilson, is Tom Brady. Wilson's career trajectory is as good or better than that of Tom Brady's! Just let that sink in.

[NorthHawk]

Though it's true that the teams we've played the last four-five games have been MUCH easier than the ones we played earlier this year, BY FAR the biggest difference in Wilson's game from those early games to these last four-five, has been the line play.
It is SO clear that right now Wilson is trusting the line more than he did early on (for all the reasons you can see with your eyes, no stats needed) and is going through his progressions better than he did earlier. Because Wilson is trusting his line more, he is able to keep his eyes downfield, rather than looking at the collapsing protection and trying to make something out of nothing.

Two quick observations.
1. Pete Prisco must be losing his mind right now seeing what Wilson is doing from within the pocket. Though I'm sure he's just doubling donw on his stupdiity and trying to stand by his moronic takes, EVERYONE with eyes, and without an axe to grind is laughing at the fool right now.
2. Through the first four years of a QB's career, the single best comparison to Russell Wilson, is Tom Brady. Wilson's career trajectory is as good or better than that of Tom Brady's! Just let that sink in.

Man I'm marching to the beat of that drum.
There will be even more on his and the OL's shoulders with Rawls also out, so these next few games could get interesting, and I hope Lynch doesn't try to return too soon in an effort to help out.

[RiverDog]

Though it's true that the teams we've played the last four-five games have been MUCH easier than the ones we played earlier this year, BY FAR the biggest difference in Wilson's game from those early games to these last four-five, has been the line play.
It is SO clear that right now Wilson is trusting the line more than he did early on (for all the reasons you can see with your eyes, no stats needed) and is going through his progressions better than he did earlier. Because Wilson is trusting his line more, he is able to keep his eyes downfield, rather than looking at the collapsing protection and trying to make something out of nothing.

Two quick observations.
1. Pete Prisco must be losing his mind right now seeing what Wilson is doing from within the pocket. Though I'm sure he's just doubling donw on his stupdiity and trying to stand by his moronic takes, EVERYONE with eyes, and without an axe to grind is laughing at the fool right now.
2. Through the first four years of a QB's career, the single best comparison to Russell Wilson, is Tom Brady. Wilson's career trajectory is as good or better than that of Tom Brady's! Just let that sink in.

That's definitely one of the differences, and one of the differences in that line is Patrick Lewis. But we also have to recognize that Russell's getting the ball out of his hands quickly is another very big difference between then and now. Plus we have a much more consistent running game that wasn't always there.

There's a lot of reasons why this is a different team than the one that choked away 4th quarter leads.

[monkey]

That's definitely one of the differences, and one of the differences in that line is Patrick Lewis.

Agreed, completely.

But we also have to recognize that Russell's getting the ball out of his hands quickly is another very big difference between then and now. Plus we have a much more consistent running game that wasn't always there.

There's a lot of reasons why this is a different team than the one that choked away 4th quarter leads.

Again I agree, but I would still argue that it all starts with the improvement of the offensive line.
The improved run game, directly correlates with the improved blocking of the O-line. So does Wilson getting the ball out more quickly. When a QB isn't thinking about, and worrying about his protection, then he's able to go through his progressions and make quick, concise reads and deliveries.
Bad line play makes a QB more likely to hold onto the ball too long, (not less, as I have heard argued from some rather stupid people).

[RiverDog]

Again I agree, but I would still argue that it all starts with the improvement of the offensive line.
The improved run game, directly correlates with the improved blocking of the O-line. So does Wilson getting the ball out more quickly. When a QB isn't thinking about, and worrying about his protection, then he's able to go through his progressions and make quick, concise reads and deliveries.
Bad line play makes a QB more likely to hold onto the ball too long, (not less, as I have heard argued from some rather stupid people).

We're singing off the same page of music, monkey. The only thing I disagree with you on is your use of the words "BY FAR".

[NorthHawk]

We'll see how much of an effect a diminished run game has against the Breveland Clowns. Their Defense can at times play pretty well, then the Rams who always play us tough come to town. That should show us what we have and how much our OL has improved.

[RiverDog]

We'll see how much of an effect a diminished run game has against the Breveland Clowns. Their Defense can at times play pretty well, then the Rams who always play us tough come to town. That should show us what we have and how much our OL has improved.

We'll wax Cleveland no matter who lines up behind Russell, and I'm gonna bet that Beast is ready to go by the time the Rams come to town. He might not get 20 carries, but I'll bet he plays.

[mykc14]

I know passer rating is a convoluted stat at best, but RW now leads the league in that stat at 110. Pretty impressive run he's on.

[HumanCockroach]

http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/ ... ates-again

Never before done, NFL history ( again ).

[jshawaii22]

add one more. He now is in elite, NFL company. Only three QB's in the history of the NFL have had a stretch of 4 games with 17 TD's and Zero Ints...

Russell, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.

[Hawktawk]

After winning Superbowl 48 Wilson stated that his long term goal was to be the best QB in NFL history. It seemed like another case of Wilson saying something over the top considering his relatively pedestrian numbers at that stage of his career.Now RW is playing out of his mind and we are going to levels we have never seen as a franchise before his career is over.

Just a few months ago fans and pundits were split on whether to pay the man a top NFL QB wage, calling him greedy, calling his very professional and orderly negotiating process greedapalooza tour BLAH BLAH BLAH.
A month ago fans were trying to break up the mans relationship.


Just an observation but man there has been very little crow eaten in here that Ive seen and there is plenty to eat.

[c_hawkbob]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14363989/russell-wilson-playing-best-qb-second-half-ot-season-nfl

Seattle's star quarterback just put up what could very well be considered the best four-game stretch in modern NFL history. ...

Since losing to the Cardinals in Week 10, Wilson's numbers are surreal. It would be unfair to call them video game numbers; they're video game numbers you might post against a particularly talented household pet. Over that four-game stretch, he has gone 89-for-118 for 1,171 passing yards. That's a staggering 75.4 percent completion percentage and an average of 9.9 yards per pass attempt. Even more impressively, he has thrown 16 touchdowns without a single interception.

It all adds up to a passer rating of 145.9. Pro-football-reference.com has game logs for quarterbacks going back through the 1960 season, 10 years before the AFL-NFL merger.

Do you know how many quarterbacks have thrown 100 or more attempts over a four-game stretch and posted a better passer rating over that span than Wilson? Zero. It has never happened before:

(at this point in the article there is a fantastic table I cant C&P and do justice to, so do yourselves a favor and check it out)

Then the author goes on to attribute Russel's break out to the Offensive line and Bevel's play construction:

After being pressured on a league-high 40.8 percent of his dropbacks during the 2014 season, Wilson remained under siege for most of the 2015 campaign. Through the loss to the Cardinals in Week 10, Wilson was being pressured on 40.9 percent of pass plays, the highest figure in the league by a notable margin, given that second-placed Colin Kaepernick was more than five percentage points away at 35.5 percent. ...

but they've looked like a different unit from Week 11 on. Wilson has been pressured on just 24.8 percent of his dropbacks over that timespan, which is only 11th among starting quarterbacks. It's not exactly the turf cabana Andy Dalton enjoyed for most of this year, but it's a drastic change for the league's most-hurried passer.

Inside the pocket over the past four weeks, Wilson is 81-for-96 (84.3 percent) for 1,094 yards with 15 touchdowns, zero interceptions and an absurd QBR of 98.5.

[burrrton]

But I was told he couldn't throw from the pocket??

[c_hawkbob]

But I was told he couldn't throw from the pocket??

How could anyone know? He never really had a pocket ...

[RiverDog]

All of those individual stats are no doubt impressive and is great information if you're ever engaged in a trivia contest with a 49'ers fan, but for me, the most meaningful stat is that Russell has the best winning percentage in his first 4 years than any other quarterback's first 4 in the history of the league. THAT's what I care about most, how his play affects our team's performance. All those other achievements are nothing but window dressing when compared to the success our team has had with him at quarterback.

[c_hawkbob]

All of those individual stats are no doubt impressive and is great information if you're ever engaged in a trivia contest with a 49'ers fan, but for me, the most meaningful stat is that Russell has the best winning percentage in his first 4 years than any other quarterback's first 4 in the history of the league. THAT's what I care about most, how his play affects our team's performance. All those other achievements are nothing but window dressing when compared to the success our team has had with him at quarterback.

He had that before these last 4 games but he was still not considered elite by many, now he's getting mentions as a darkhorse MVP candidate. I like that he's getting both.

[RiverDog]

He had that before these last 4 games but he was still not considered elite by many, now he's getting mentions as a darkhorse MVP candidate. I like that he's getting both.

Except as it relates to the team's performance, I could care less if he gets the MVP award. The award I want to see him get is the Super Bowl MVP.

[c_hawkbob]

OK, and I want to see him get the individual accolades he deserves as well. I'm as much a fan of the players that make up the team as I am of the team.

[burrrton]

[edited- deleted- I see what Bob was getting at.]

[RiverDog]

OK, and I want to see him get the individual accolades he deserves as well. I'm as much a fan of the players that make up the team as I am of the team.

I understand, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't be a fan of individual players. I fully recognize that I hold a somewhat minority opinion when it comes to paying homage to professional athletes, including those that play for my team, even those, such as Russell, that I hold in high regard.

I'm more likely to be amused at individual records and awards after they retire. While they are active, my attitude is best reflected in Lombardi's famous "Winning isn't the most important thing, it's the only thing" philosophy. The only thing that matters to me is winning. Russell could have 16 straight games with a rating of 130+ and it wouldn't mean a damn thing to me if we weren't winning.

I didn't always harbor that POV. It was only after the game became more of a business and less like a game that I adapted a more cynical attitude towards individual players. The players strike had a lot to do with my change of attitude towards them and continues through today with chit like Kam's very selfish holdout or Alex Rodríguez claiming he wanted to play for a contender then signing with a last place team. I still have my favorites, and Russell is one of them, probably my #1 active player in all of professional sports, but I don't drink his bathwater like some do. He's my favorite, not my hero.

That's why you won't catch me wearing someone else's name or number. They're no better and no worse than you or me.

[mykc14]

That's why you won't catch me wearing someone else's name or number. They're no better and no worse than you or me.

They are definitely better than me at football.