Kam: hero, goat, and question mark

[Oly]

Kam was about 10 feet wide left from being the goat of this game, not long after he was the hero for keeping the Hawks in it. For me, that sums up his entire year, a mixture of goat (TE seam route TDs vs. the Panthers and Bengals come to mind) and some hero.

Which brings me to the question mark of next year. Has the defense been that much better with him in it that he's worth what he wants? I know we can't answer this question until the postseason is over, but this week got me thinking about it. The defense was off those first few games when he wasn't there to make the pack hunt together, in Sherman's words. And after several weeks of shaky play when he came back, the defense has been crazy good. The question for me is whether or not on a team with huge OL needs, the Hawks can afford what Kam wants. Are the Hawks that much better off with Kam compared to some other player that PC and Richard can coach up?

Thoughts?

[kalibane]

Kam is still one of the top defenders in the league, a team leader and there is no doubt he makes the team better. That being said I think he got too much credit for how much he means to the defense.

[NorthHawk]

His plays won us two games this year. That should be a big consideration and as well, practice and game attitude plays a large part in how valuable a player is to a team.

[Hawk Sista]

And his selfishness lost us one, and missed coverage lost us two if we are gonna boil a whole 60 minutes down to a play or two. The man signed a contract which, at the time, was one of the more lucrative in the business. We shall see what Sunday means and if Olsen TEs Kam or if Cam hits Kam for another pick 6. Time will tell; I know it is not right, but I do hold a little grudge against his role in the distractions that got us off to such a shaky start.

[RiverDog]

His plays won us two games this year. That should be a big consideration and as well, practice and game attitude plays a large part in how valuable a player is to a team.

If you're counting the Detroit game as one of those, you might want to credit the officiating with 1/2 of that win.

Kam's irrational, extremely selfish holdout turned me off big time. He's still an important cog in our defense, but if he's not going to honor his contract, then he can eat chit as far as I'm concerned.

And I agree, his pass coverage has been very spotty this season. His main job is to cover tight ends, and they've been the ones that have killed us this season. But it's hard to criticize any player on this defense. After all, we are the best points defense in the league for a 4th straight season.

[burrrton]

If you're counting the Detroit game as one of those, you might want to credit the officiating with 1/2 of that win.

No offense, and I tend to agree with how you feel about Kam right now, but I'm tired of hearing people try to make this argument.

It's a ridiculous, arcane rule that will likely be removed from the books this offseason, and KJ could have done literally anything else with that ball (dove on it, followed it out, etc). That he chose to use the one part of his anatomy that no one knew was illegal doesn't mean anyone has to thank the officiating for not penalizing him and giving DET an entirely undeserved bailout.

[/rant]

[RiverDog]

[
No offense, and I tend to agree with how you feel about Kam right now, but I'm tired of hearing people try to make this argument.

It's a ridiculous, arcane rule that will likely be removed from the books this offseason, and KJ could have done literally anything else with that ball (dove on it, followed it out, etc). That he chose to use the one part of his anatomy that no one knew was illegal doesn't mean anyone has to thank the officiating for not penalizing him and giving DET an entirely undeserved bailout.

[/rant]

Oh, I agree with you 100%. IMO the ref made the right call and used his head to determine that the violation was not going to change the outcome of the play and that they need to revise that rule, give the ref the flexibility to use his own judgment.

But the fact remains that had that play been called correctly... and there were a lot of refs out there saying that they would have made that call... we lose that game.

[Seahawks4Ever]

I was happy Kam not only showed up but played. I was starting to get paranoid after Lynch and his no show. But I was wrong about Kam, he showed up and delivered. I also would not call him a potential goat since that was a bogus P-I call. The Vikings receiver ran straight in to Kam, and Kam as a defender had every right to "stand his ground".

Does Kam deserve a contract rewrite? Well, he unfortunately missed a bunch of games this year. A couple by choice the others by injury.

What I remember was watching the players get off the plane last year after the Super Bowl and seeing how many of them were limping, especially Kam Chancellor, he had left it all on the field and you just can't pay a player like that enough because of what it shows to the other players.

As for Lynch, I am not mad at him for not playing, I am irked at him for not getting on the plane and being there for his "brothers at arms".

I had an operation for a double hernia almost 20 years ago. I don't know how that compares to a "sports" hernia but I didn't feel "right" for months. I don't know if they put a mesh in you for a sports hernia like they did for my hernias but if they did it takes a long while to get used to a foreign object in your body. You also don't want to do ANYTHING that would mess up the healing either. I couldn't imagine going out and taking the punishment Lynch goes through when he is in "Beast-Mode" a mere 7 weeks after his operation. I recall that his personal trainer had mentioned a couple of weeks ago that Marshawn had only recently started to make contact rather than avoid it.

Like I said, what irked me was that he didn't bother to get on the plane and be there for his fellow team mates, even IF they were OK with it.

[burrrton]

Oh, I agree with you 100%. IMO the ref made the right call and used his head to determine that the violation was not going to change the outcome of the play and that they need to revise that rule, give the ref the flexibility to use his own judgment.

But the fact remains that had that play been called correctly... and there were a lot of refs out there saying that they would have made that call... we lose that game.

1. I think the ref *does* have leeway to use their own judgment on that rule (isn't "intent" part of the rule)?

2. It's disheartening to think there are referees essentially saying "I'd have screwed the Seahawks on a technicality" (and it was a technicality).

[HumanCockroach]

Kam has certainly had his issues, that said the two plays to the TE you attributed to him ( Panthers and Bengals) weren't his coverage ( Thomas was responsible for both.) The PI inn the Vikes game was crap. I don't care what anybody says about it. By rule offensive pass interference ( though 99% of the time just no call. Can't call penalties on offensive receivers don't you know)

He's had some poor plays, but he brings far more positives to the table then negatives. All players makes mistakes, he's no different.

[HumanCockroach]

And I agree, his pass coverage has been very spotty this season. His main job is to cover tight ends, and they've been the ones that have killed us this season. But it's hard to criticize any player on this defense. After all, we are the best points defense in the league for a 4th straight season.

Kams "main job" isn't covering the TE RD. I'm surprised you don't realise how Seattle uses him. It wasn't Kam locking down Graham two years ago, that was Wright, it isn't Kam 95% of the time man. Kam is used primarily in short zones close to the line of scrimmage, or occasionally as the deep third guy. He doesn't man cover anyone, at least not as a "primary" responsibility or with Any regularity. His coverage has ALWAYS been spotty. It shocks me. What defense have you been watching? Seattle covers the TE primarily with their LBs, and have since inserting Kam into the lineup once Milloy was pushed to the sunset.

[kalibane]

I have to ask what you're seeing and how you justify that as not pass interference. He tried to jump a route thinking the receiver was going to continue with the out and instead ran right into the receiver who was running an out and up then pushed him down with both arms and you're saying it was offensive pass interference?

[HumanCockroach]

Kam NEVER moves forward. So I'm curious what jumping of the route you are seeing? Chancellor is entitled to his space on the field. A defensive player is not, nor had ever been required to get out of an offensive players way. Rudolf runs directly into Chancellor, and then proceeds to shove him to the turf. OPI by rule, and in practice. Do you really think if Chancellor was going through Rudolf that Chancellor is the one on the ground? That's fricken laughable.

[HumanCockroach]

He tried to jump a route thinking the receiver was going to continue with the out and instead ran right into the receiver who was running an out and up then pushed him down with both arms and you're saying it was offensive pass interference?

This is like the bizarro version of what happened. Watch the play again. Rudolf's route was to the seem not an out and up. Chancellor ends up on the ground, not Rudolf after being shoved down, Chancellor is in a back peddle... WTF were you watching?

[burrrton]

I think where the disagreement comes in is in the fact that Kam didn't really jump the route- he simply stopped. At that point, the TE is still a couple steps away, and the TE continues and runs into Kam.

[edit- er, yeah- what HC said...]

[HumanCockroach]

I guess he stopped, though having just watched the play again his momentum was still pushing him backwards ( hence the ease with which Rudolf shoved him down) but the idea that Kam jumped a out and up ( a route that wasn't run) and pushed him down ( which never came close to happening) nah, that's loco.

And to be honest even if he was standing flat footed, it doesn't matter. He is entitled to his space or spot on the field whether a receiver needs to go there or not.

[EmeraldBullet]

The way I look at it is that the ball doesn't lie. If this was a backyard basketball game and your opponent calls foul when you played him hard and got a part of the ball, you give him the free throw attempt anyways because the ball doesn't lie. In this case the resulting FG was wide left. Shouldve been offensive PI, end of story.

[kalibane]

I watched it again before I replied in the other thread. You are insane

You can argue about the semantics of "jumping a route" all you want but that's semantics. He guessed that it was going to be an out and stopped to go underneath in anticipation of making a play on the ball just like the next play he got beat on and missed the tackle because he tried to come underneath on the out pattern.

At the end of the day Kam guessed wrong, got caught flat footed and then extended BOTH arms which redirected Rudolph while the ball was in the air. It's textbook PI on the defense.

Offensive PI is laughable, Kam had no play on the ball and Rudolph wasn't pushing off to get open. The only argument for a no call is if Kam doesn't use his hands, as soon as he threw his hands out there it was over and it was the right call.

[burrrton]

He guessed that it was going to be an out and stopped to go underneath in anticipation of making a play on the ball

Yes, but he's *allowed* to stop without being penalized for the receiver barreling into him.

Again, I'm not going to dig in and say there's no way DPI should ever be called, but to characterize it as cut-and-dry DPI is bananas. The TE cut into Kam and created the contact.

I watched it again before I replied in the other thread.

I've got it right in front of me in glorious HD.

[Oly]

Kam has certainly had his issues, that said the two plays to the TE you attributed to him ( Panthers and Bengals) weren't his coverage ( Thomas was responsible for both.) The PI inn the Vikes game was crap. I don't care what anybody says about it. By rule offensive pass interference ( though 99% of the time just no call. Can't call penalties on offensive receivers don't you know)

He's had some poor plays, but he brings far more positives to the table then negatives. All players makes mistakes, he's no different.

Kam had the short zone and he's supposed to pass him off to Thomas on seam routes. But passing off means that he has to cover him for long enough for Thomas to get there. He has to know that in the compressed red zone, Earl can't get there that quickly. Kam didn't stay on the TE really at all, and not even the fastest FS in the game could have possibly gotten there.

I agree Kam brings more positives, but there are enough question marks that I wonder if it's the best way to spend limited dollars.

[HumanCockroach]

I watched it again before I replied in the other thread. You are insane

You can argue about the semantics of "jumping a route" all you want but that's semantics. He guessed that it was going to be an out and stopped to go underneath in anticipation of making a play on the ball just like the next play he got beat on and missed the tackle because he tried to come underneath on the out pattern.

At the end of the day Kam guessed wrong, got caught flat footed and then extended BOTH arms which redirected Rudolph while the ball was in the air. It's textbook PI on the defense.

Offensive PI is laughable, Kam had no play on the ball and Rudolph wasn't pushing off to get open. The only argument for a no call is if Kam doesn't use his hands, as soon as he threw his hands out there it was over and it was the right call.

Not arguing semantics, nor am I interested in explaining the actual rules to you or anyone else. I don't need to explain it. I know the rules intimately in regards to defensive players rights to his place on the field. You can't play the position or coach the position for years without knowing them. Kam had every right to that spot, Rudolf didn't, it's that simple, not complicated, or confusing if you know the rules. It's unfortunate that OPI is ignored or worse called DPI but that doesn't change them, nor make your assessment correct.

Believe what you want, it was a poor call based on the rules put in place, 9 out of 10 times a ref while not calling OPI ( which is the correct call) swallow that flag, because while they erroneously refuse to penalise offensive players for initiating contact, they grasp that a defender has a right to that spot every single time.

[HumanCockroach]

Sorry Oly, Kam wasn't even on Olsen in the Panther game ( that was Sherm who passed him off to ET) Sherm was incredibly angry with Thomas. In Cincy it was Chancellor, but he was supposed to "sit" on the underneath receiver, twice he did what the call said to do. Neither time ( there was actually two times the same thing happened) Chancellor was responsible for the "underneath" receiver and did exactly what he was supposed to do ( honestly he also got vocally upset with ET on the field) seems to me, when there are three instances of different players getting angry with the same player for not doing what was called that the "culprit" is the guy the multiple different players are more than likely right...

That said there was definitely communications problems throughout the first part of the season ( and find out exceedingly interesting that once Mr. Williams was released that those types of miscommunication ceased. Makes me think that ET had to play his spot plus bail him out which put him out of position).

Anyway you slice it, Kams coverage skills never has been, and never will be what makes him special. He wasn't good ( in fact he was pretty horrible as a rookie, something I pointed out then) and it remains pretty mediocre, but average coverage skills can be compensated for, for a player that is "special" in every other area.

[Hawktawk]

The call on Kam was awful. It was OPI if anything. The reciever basically plowed into him trying to draw the flag and it worked. It was crap.

As for Kam in general hes a big part of our heart and soul and always gives everything. I like whatever were paying him lot more than the fat hog Lynch is cutting making 12 million not to even show.

[Oly]

Sorry Oly, Kam wasn't even on Olsen in the Panther game ( that was Sherm who passed him off to ET) Sherm was incredibly angry with Thomas. In Cincy it was Chancellor, but he was supposed to "sit" on the underneath receiver, twice he did what the call said to do. Neither time ( there was actually two times the same thing happened) Chancellor was responsible for the "underneath" receiver and did exactly what he was supposed to do ( honestly he also got vocally upset with ET on the field) seems to me, when there are three instances of different players getting angry with the same player for not doing what was called that the "culprit" is the guy the multiple different players are more than likely right...

That said there was definitely communications problems throughout the first part of the season ( and find out exceedingly interesting that once Mr. Williams was released that those types of miscommunication ceased. Makes me think that ET had to play his spot plus bail him out which put him out of position).

Anyway you slice it, Kams coverage skills never has been, and never will be what makes him special. He wasn't good ( in fact he was pretty horrible as a rookie, something I pointed out then) and it remains pretty mediocre, but average coverage skills can be compensated for, for a player that is "special" in every other area.

I stand corrected on the Panther game. But in Cincy, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. Sure, he has the underneath zone, but in that situation you keep everything in front of you, which means dropping with the guy running through your zone until your help comes over the top. Even dropping a few yards would have put him or Thomas in position on that play. Kam just can't expect Earl to cover a 10-yard wide box that close to the LOS. I know I'm not alone in seeing it this way--I remember reading several things after the game, including this one (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300000 ... n-coverage), saying basically what I'm saying.

In any case, I agree that Kam is one of the better SS in the game, and what he's special at he's really special at. I'm not dogging him. I'm just noting that his coverage issues have been problems this year, enough that I'm not sure he's worth what he wants, especially with holes on the OL. He might be, but I think it's anything but a clear case right now.

I suppose we'll see how he fares against Olsen this time around, which will go a long way toward settling the issue.

[HumanCockroach]

Again I feel it necessary to point out, Kam won't be "responsible" for Olsen anymore so than he is "responsible" for the TE in any other game Seattle has played. This isn't Jr High, This is the NFL, it isn't as easy as saying the SS covers the TE, the Corners cover the outside receiver, and the FS rotates down if there is a slot receiver, the Mike is responsible for the back out of the backfield, rush the passer. It simply isn't the way the majority of the time they use Kam. If Olsen is running free I recommend paying close attention to Earl and the LB's as they typically have some form of either man up by a LB, or a "bracket" coverage of LB/SS short zone underneath with Earl over the top, it's been pretty standard. Occasionally Kam plays man up on the TE, but it's pretty rare. Maybe 15 to 25 percent of the game. Kams basically a fourth LB, who plays on the line at the same ( or close to the same depth) as the LB's. Typically he only gets manned up on a TE when the TE releases on a blitz ( though even that isn't always the case).

I'm not saying "don't be critical" but it seems plenty are more than willing to assess blame for missing coverage, that wasn't his to begin with. Think back on all of Kams HUGE interceptions, were they him making a play while following the TE? Nope, in fact I can't think of a SINGLE pick that occurred while doing that, there may be one or two I have forgotten, but more often than not, it's him falling into a short zone, waiting for a crosser, or deeking the QB into making a throw that appears open but isn't. The Panthers pick six, the Broncos pick six, his pick off of Kaepernik in the NFCCG, ALL short zones, all NOT TE's and ALL HUGE plays. It isn't his strong suit, and never has been, and never WILL be. Some players have the speed and footwork to make plays on the ball when manned up, Kam never has, and never will, but Seattle doesn't NEED him to ( to be honest here that isn't a huge knock on Kam, MOST SS don't have that ability) Seattle uses Kam and Earl as perfect pieces to the puzzle.

Just attempting to be clear about how he's used, not insulting you, or saying you're wrong in the assessment that his coverage isn't the greatest, just pointing out that I've seen a LOT of blame directed towards him for errors that weren't his responsibilities, I haven't the foggiest how ET covers that box, but I think it's a pretty big stretch to say Kam should "know" that Earl can't, because you are exactly right, they have been playing together for five seasons, if Kam "knew he couldn't cover that area" I haven't a doubt in my mind that he would carry him deeper,he didn't, so IMHO that means Earl CAN actually cover that area, the coaches wouldn't call the play if he couldn't, and Kam wouldn't release the TE if he couldn't. This also isn't a "safety is the deepest man" kind of situation, ( really the NFL isn't set up that way) i's to simple of a statement for that level. ESPECIALLY if it's a SS. Seattle doesn't play Tampa two, which mean 95% of the time Kam ISN'T SUPPOSED to be the "deepest" man, or even CLOSE to the deepest man, his play keeps him close to the LOS by design.

[obiken]

I dont really care who is responsible for Olsen, as long as he is 2X covered and we dont get the *uck that we got last game with them.
Cam is a Hero in my book but he is hanging out there after the hold out. We'll see.

[Oly]

Think back on all of Kams HUGE interceptions, were they him making a play while following the TE? Nope, in fact I can't think of a SINGLE pick that occurred while doing that, there may be one or two I have forgotten, but more often than not, it's him falling into a short zone, waiting for a crosser, or deeking the QB into making a throw that appears open but isn't. The Panthers pick six, the Broncos pick six, his pick off of Kaepernik in the NFCCG, ALL short zones, all NOT TE's and ALL HUGE plays. ...

...if Kam "knew he couldn't cover that area" I haven't a doubt in my mind that he would carry him deeper,he didn't, so IMHO that means Earl CAN actually cover that area, the coaches wouldn't call the play if he couldn't, and Kam wouldn't release the TE if he couldn't. ...

I would agree with just about everything in your post, but I want to quote these to say what I think may have happened. I think that in the first 80 yards of the field, you're right on the money. But in the red zone, I think the importance of keeping the play in front of you increases, which is why I think that he has to give Earl another moment to get to the seam route. I think that Kam was thinking of the big play--pick, big hit, etc.--and just didn't consider if Earl would get there. I think, in that moment, he didn't "know" Earl couldn't get there because he wasn't thinking about it. It sounds like we agree on the coverage and how the short zone is played, but you have confidence that Kam did what he did because that is how it is drawn up or he chose wisely based on years of chemistry with Earl, but I think he just missed a wrinkle in red zone coverage.

But even aside from those plays, his coverage seems even worse than his typical average coverage abilities.

[monkey]

I watched it again before I replied in the other thread. You are insane

You can argue about the semantics of "jumping a route" all you want but that's semantics. He guessed that it was going to be an out and stopped to go underneath in anticipation of making a play on the ball just like the next play he got beat on and missed the tackle because he tried to come underneath on the out pattern.

At the end of the day Kam guessed wrong, got caught flat footed and then extended BOTH arms which redirected Rudolph while the ball was in the air. It's textbook PI on the defense.

Offensive PI is laughable, Kam had no play on the ball and Rudolph wasn't pushing off to get open. The only argument for a no call is if Kam doesn't use his hands, as soon as he threw his hands out there it was over and it was the right call.

I disagree.
Kam beat Rudolf to the spot, and stopped, (he has every right to do that) then Rudolf initiated the contact, clearly looking to get a call on an uncatchable pass.
Yes, Kam lifted his arms, as he was being shoved down, I cannot tell if he is trying to redirect the TE, or just get his balance, or both, but to me, the defender has every right to that spot, and a TE shouldn't be allowed to crash into him, trying to get a flag. That's the same to me as flopping in basketball.

[mykc14]

I would agree with just about everything in your post, but I want to quote these to say what I think may have happened. I think that in the first 80 yards of the field, you're right on the money. But in the red zone, I think the importance of keeping the play in front of you increases, which is why I think that he has to give Earl another moment to get to the seam route. I think that Kam was thinking of the big play--pick, big hit, etc.--and just didn't consider if Earl would get there. I think, in that moment, he didn't "know" Earl couldn't get there because he wasn't thinking about it. It sounds like we agree on the coverage and how the short zone is played, but you have confidence that Kam did what he did because that is how it is drawn up or he chose wisely based on years of chemistry with Earl, but I think he just missed a wrinkle in red zone coverage.

But even aside from those plays, his coverage seems even worse than his typical average coverage abilities.

Honestly I think the TD's to Eifert had a lot to do with the fact that Kam and ET hadn't played much together in Kris's system combined with the fact that they called the right play against a coverage we weren't exactly familiar with. Not quite blown, but there was a hole in our zone. Maybe Kam should have carried him up the seam a few more yards. Maybe ET lined up a little too wide. After the game PC said something about them catching them with that play/formation/route concept. The same thing, but more obvious can be said about the Olson TD, except that was blown, presumably by ET. I think the LOB has been a little 'loose' in their zones at times this season. IMO that has a lot to do with all the missed training camp time, Carrie Williams playing terrible, and the 'new' system Kris is running (I know it isn't exactly new but he certainly has put his wrinkle on this D and it asks a lot from the DB's).

[RiverDog]

I watched it again before I replied in the other thread. You are insane

You can argue about the semantics of "jumping a route" all you want but that's semantics. He guessed that it was going to be an out and stopped to go underneath in anticipation of making a play on the ball just like the next play he got beat on and missed the tackle because he tried to come underneath on the out pattern.

At the end of the day Kam guessed wrong, got caught flat footed and then extended BOTH arms which redirected Rudolph while the ball was in the air. It's textbook PI on the defense.

Offensive PI is laughable, Kam had no play on the ball and Rudolph wasn't pushing off to get open. The only argument for a no call is if Kam doesn't use his hands, as soon as he threw his hands out there it was over and it was the right call.

I don't think HC is insane, Kal. Pete has asked the league for an explanation for the call, something he rarely does, so there's definitely some doubt in his mind as well.

I can see both sides. I do think that Kam intended to impede the receiver's route and he did extend his arms some, but that it wasn't blatant or obvious. In general, especially at critical junctures like this one, I tend to come down on the side of letting the players play and not let the refs determine the outcome of a game, that if you are going to call it close, do it in the first quarter to set the trend.

[burrrton]

That play reminds me of the Arizona game when Earl and Fitz (iirc) collided on that INT.

In both cases, the receiver simply chose to run over the defender, and also in both cases, as I ponder this debate, I ask myself "If that's DPI, is there any way for the defender to *not* get flagged, short of having to just get out of the way?"

I think the answer is "no", hence I don't think either one of them *had* to be flagged (and ET wasn't, but Kam was).

[HumanCockroach]

Sorry Oly, just don't agree. The idea inside the twenty isn't to keep the play in front of you, its to keep the play in front of the end line. Otherwise, you are going to be giving up a TD 99.8% of the time. Personally I hate, HATE zone coverage that close to the goal line, but that's a personal thing, not a schematic thing. Seattle runs it a lot, always has, that said, there are calculated gambles that on that level are taken repeatedly. If Kam doesn't "sit" as was clearly what he was supposed to do, and they throw tho the underneath receiver it's still a TD and one Kam is directly responsible for. There's no "winning" in the situation. I guess we just completely disagree. I can live with its a bad call by Richard, or even a communication problem, or even Earl was out of position, or they were fooled by film study, our ET was trying to help Williams, but I just won't agree that was Kams fault for not knowing ET couldn't get there.

[burrrton]

Some explanation from the league to Pete:

http://espn.go.com/blog/seattle-seahawk ... or-penalty

He had a right to his position, but his hand went up on the outside- if his hand stays in, it's no more or less a penalty, but probably wouldn't have been called. It was also nearly identical to the Earl/Fitz collision.

Funny how correct everyone was, on *both* sides.

[EmeraldBullet]

Hmm...NFL never wants to make a real call and leaves everything up to judgment to an extent. Then the league allows the refs to get blamed for their judgment. The rules are so vague, but NFL isn't to blame lol

[Hawktawk]

Its the identical play to what Fitz tried with ET last week. Teams must be watching how Seattle safeties sit down in their zone and simply having receivers running in to them trying to get cheap calls. Arians head was redder than his hat but he and Fitz needed to F off.So did Aikman going on and on for several minutes about how it should have been a penalty on Seattle.

Same with last Sunday but they got it.Minnesota was desperate, running out of time and unable to move the ball.They tried to draw a flag but they dont have anyone that can take the top off like Lockette and Teddy cant throw it anyway so they tried this BS successfully.All Kam could do was move or fall down, the guy plowed right into him.It makes no difference where his hands were whatsoever. It was Horsechit X10.Wide left was poetic justice after that travesty ROFLMAO .

Hopefully after Carolls complaint the officials will watch for the OPI which was the correct call in both instances.

[EmeraldBullet]

Its the identical play to what Fitz tried with ET last week. Teams must be watching how Seattle safeties sit down in their zone and simply having receivers running in to them trying to get cheap calls. Arians head was redder than his hat but he and Fitz needed to F off.So did Aikman going on and on for several minutes about how it should have been a penalty on Seattle.

Same with last Sunday but they got it.Minnesota was desperate, running out of time and unable to move the ball.They tried to draw a flag but they dont have anyone that can take the top off like Lockette and Teddy cant throw it anyway so they tried this BS successfully.All Kam could do was move or fall down, the guy plowed right into him.It makes no difference where his hands were whatsoever. It was Horsechit X10.Wide left was poetic justice after that travesty ROFLMAO .

Hopefully after Carolls complaint the officials will watch for the OPI which was the correct call in both instances.

Glad someone agrees with me. Ball does not lie.

[Seahawks4Ever]

I am not sold on Kris Richard for DC. Our defense just is not as aggressive as they were under our previous two DC's. By aggressive, I mean our CB's are not doing anything to disrupt the timing between the opposing QB and receivers, especially on 3rd. and long and in the red zone. I am SICK to DEATH of how easy all of our opponents this year have converted 3rd. down passes, whether for short yardage or long. If we would disrupt the timing on many plays our pass rush could get to the QB more often and cause a hurry, bat down the ball, or even get the rare sack.

Just as Bevell has been castigated for playing not to lose so too has K.R. It is like Desa Vu all over again watching teams move right down the field to get the points they need to get a needed score. It gives me nightmares of the Atlanta game when our defense let them get in to FG position in less than 30 seconds. Maybe Richard is trying to channel his inner Gus B. Doesn't he realize that many of us felt that Jacksonville did us a major favor by hiring Bradley as their HC????

Our offense has to be better this season because our defense is not as good as they have been in the past. I know we lost a few players to other teams and our depth isn't as deep but really there is no excuse for this much of a drop off. The ONLY thing I can point to is our new D.C.

He did get better after the bye, but, I think Pete needs to "coach up" K.R. or replace him in the off season.

[Oly]

Sorry Oly, just don't agree. The idea inside the twenty isn't to keep the play in front of you, its to keep the play in front of the end line. Otherwise, you are going to be giving up a TD 99.8% of the time. Personally I hate, HATE zone coverage that close to the goal line, but that's a personal thing, not a schematic thing. Seattle runs it a lot, always has, that said, there are calculated gambles that on that level are taken repeatedly. If Kam doesn't "sit" as was clearly what he was supposed to do, and they throw tho the underneath receiver it's still a TD and one Kam is directly responsible for. There's no "winning" in the situation. I guess we just completely disagree. I can live with its a bad call by Richard, or even a communication problem, or even Earl was out of position, or they were fooled by film study, our ET was trying to help Williams, but I just won't agree that was Kams fault for not knowing ET couldn't get there.

Fair enough. To be clear, I do think your explanations are totally plausible. I'm just not giving Kam the benefit of the doubt when it comes to coverage.

As you said, coverage isn't his strong suit, and this came up against the Vikings: http://www.fieldgulls.com/football-brea ... l-playoffs

The question for me is really whether or not his skills as the 4th LB who shuts down crossing routes, but little else, are worth what he wants. Right now, I just don't think so.

[Hawktawk]

Unless I'm mistaken Kam had been out for a few weeks with an incredibly painful tailbone injury. I cant imagine it went from unable to go to fine in a week, especially in the severe cold. It had to hurt bad to move laterally and try to accelerate, hence maybe the worse than average coverage? At least the man nutted up and showed up and made enough plays to win. How many yards did Lynch have again......???????
I got no problem with Kam. He was as good as anyone when we got our ring and is still one of the most explosive intimidating hitters and ball hawks in the league.