Official Seahawks vs Saints GAME Thread

[RiverDog]

One sided officiating. But there's a lot more wrong with this game than the refs.

[The POPE]

One sided officiating. But there's a lot more wrong with this game than the refs.

+ 1

This is FUGLY

[Hawkstar]

Did the Saints actually commit a penalty?? No!!!

[Hawk Sista]

We didn't deserve to win. Our clock management was awful. Our D was "ok", offense wasnt as lame as the play calling. Russell is just limited and we kept moving away from the run. Refs sucked too, but we beat ourselves.

[Hawkstar]

We didn't deserve to win. Our clock management was awful. Our D was "ok", offense was lame. It not as bad as the play calling. Russell is off. Refs sucked too, but we beat ourselves.

RW has been high with his misses - I'm sure it has to do with his injuries and limited time to get rid of the ball. Sure woulda loved to see that last play go to Jimmy.

[The POPE]

My how the NFC west has fallen. All the birds flying with broken wing, Niners are mining lead and the lambs are silent as usual. What's it gonna take to win the NFC. 8-8, 7-9. Rambo might have a chance at 7-9

[obiken]

The Play calling was lame, the OL sucked big donkey weenies, BUT the Cards got killed. I think its clear they lied to us on these injuries, we might as well not even listen to PC's press gaggle, he is worse than a politician. They will be back whenever they get back. Tough beat, we still should have won. RW's pick at the end of the half really hurt us. Question? Can Boykin play better than a wounded RW??

[Hawk Sista]

I'm not blaming the officials. But there were several calls and non-calls that had an impact. Again, that's always the case.. w/ every team in most games. We should have played better so the officiating didn't matter. I'm saying all this because I'm not sniveling over the officiating. The Hawks should have played better...period.

That said the phantom call that lead to extending a play that got them a f/g, the uncalled illegal picks that ended in scores, keeping the clock running after the saints went out of bounds etc... were tough to watch. 11 penalties to 2.... hmmmmm

[burrrton]

I'm not blaming the officials.

I am. That was the most one-sided officiating we've seen since 2006.

NO had, what, two penalties, neither of which were judgment calls, but came into the game as one of the most penalized teams in the league.

No, we didn't look great in phases of the game, but we played well enough to win this one.

[Zorn76]

We're gonna be OK.

Frustrating, to say the least, because the O is capable of a lot more, and certainly should've produced 27 or so against this Saints defense.

Our D, meanwhile, remains Awesome under circumstances that see them being on the field for 36 minutes and change.

it's maddening because our problems are correctable, but I'll think they'll do it.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

I'm not blaming the officials. But there were several calls and non-calls that had an impact. Again, that's always the case.. w/ every team in most games. We should have played better so the officiating didn't matter. I'm saying all this because I'm not sniveling over the officiating. The Hawks should have played better...period.

That said the phantom call that lead to extending a play that got them a f/g, the uncalled illegal picks that ended in scores, keeping the clock running after the saints went out of bounds etc... were tough to watch. 11 penalties to 2.... hmmmmm

Was I imagining Lane being blocked prior to the touchdown pass to Cooks, meaning, while the ball was in the air? I though that wasn't allowed.

[savvyman]

Mediocure Line - Russell being hobbled is acknowledged - However there is way too much talent in the receiving corp for the Seahawk's to be sucking so bad at offense.

It comes down to Offensive playbook design and play calling - that has been the issue all year.


For example when we had first down on the 5 yard line late in the 4th quarter and we come out in an empty set - what the f***? That was the time to call a run - instead we got a motion penalty and first and 10 and we ended up settling for a field goal.

[burrrton]

Not sure I want to know if this is true, but anyone see some of the people saying Kearse got his second foot down on the last play?

[Hawk Sista]

Very frustrating, indeed. While I appreciate that we never get blown out, I'd be ok if we blew a team out. It seems as though we coulda woulda shoulda.... irritating as hell to watch RW & the O move the ball soooooo well in the waning moments, but not before.

I agree, we will be ok. It's frustrating that we are literally 3 plays away from being 7 - 0, even w/ how much we leave out there. We will get it going in a week or two and won't lose again.

[Hawkstar]

Not sure I want to know if this is true, but anyone see some of the people saying Kearse got his second foot down on the last play?

I havent seen or heard anyone saying Kearse got his feet down - it sure didnt look like it from the coverage shown during the game. I wish they would have split Jimmy out wide for the final play...

[Hawk Sista]

The post game commentators said it was worthy of review, but it was clearly not a TD.

[burrrton]

The post game commentators said it was worthy of review, but it was clearly not a TD.

That's honestly good to hear- I haven't even been able to bring myself to go up and watch it again to check. Just trying to let it go...

[RiverDog]

Russell has now gone 3 straight games without throwing a TD pass. We've had 1 TD in our last 23 drives. Our offense scored 13 points against the worst points defense team in the league, and 7 of those were courtesy of a gimmick play. For the 2nd time in two weeks, we botched a FG attempt.

This is not a Super Bowl quality team.

[NorthHawk]

I'm wondering why they stopped running up the gut in the 3rd quarter. The interior of the OL was opening some good holes and Michael was getting good yards, then they started to run wide. The first part of the first series after the half we went back to Seahawks football - hard runs up the middle. Then we seemed to abandon that idea and started to run horizontally.

Another note. Fant played well considering his lack of experience. The N.O. DL isn't the best in the league, but they are NFL players and for him to hold his own like he did might mean we have our LT of the future. We'll see how he does the next time he gets a chance to play.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

NO D-line isn't the greatest, but they did put their best, Cameron Jordan, on Fant all day. I agree he held up fairly well. There was a false start penalty on Fant where I saw Britt giving Fant the business afterward, but he patted him on the helmet immediately after. I guess I'm just saying I like that Britt is acting like a leader on the o-line.

[RiverDog]

I'm wondering why they stopped running up the gut in the 3rd quarter. The interior of the OL was opening some good holes and Michael was getting good yards, then they started to run wide. The first part of the first series after the half we went back to Seahawks football - hard runs up the middle. Then we seemed to abandon that idea and started to run horizontally.

Another note. Fant played well considering his lack of experience. The N.O. DL isn't the best in the league, but they are NFL players and for him to hold his own like he did might mean we have our LT of the future. We'll see how he does the next time he gets a chance to play.

I agree about Fant, although his two penalties in the first half both killed drives. I'd still like to see a trade for Thomas or Staley, though.

[HumanCockroach]

The line played well... Again.... Not exceptional, but well enough to win the game. 4.4 yards a carry with only 17 runs doesn't make much sense. I'm not entirely sure why the Seahawks have abandoned the run ( pretty much the entire year). It's nice and all to have a franchise QB, and outside weapons, that said BALANCED attacks win football games ( even NE understands that) not pass heavy offenses.

I'm not sure why they have decided to attempt to turn in to NO or GB west, but until that thought process is remedied the Seahawks will struggle to win games. You slow the rush by running the ball effectively, and quick short passes consistently( which in turn opens the PA deeper patterns), unfortunately, it seems Bevell missed that basic lesson somehow.

[Hawktawk]

Absolutely correct HC .The Saints could not stop the run in the second half. Seattle just unilaterally surrendered the run. I don't understand all the empty sets with a banged up Wilson and a line that run blocks best right now. bevfool is at it agin just like last year but he doesn't have his poster boy saving dead plays for him. If Russ's mobility was not appreciated before it sure is now. I was proud of the way he battled through it and like always no matter the adversity Seattle was still throwing in the end zone to win at the end.
Yes this is still a championship caliber squad. October is the time to get this garbage out of their system.
They are going to win the division and then we will see.

[Agent 86]

The line played well... Again.... Not exceptional, but well enough to win the game. 4.4 yards a carry with only 17 runs doesn't make much sense. I'm not entirely sure why the Seahawks have abandoned the run ( pretty much the entire year). It's nice and all to have a franchise QB, and outside weapons, that said BALANCED attacks win football games ( even NE understands that) not pass heavy offenses.

I'm not sure why they have decided to attempt to turn in to NO or GB west, but until that thought process is remedied the Seahawks will struggle to win games. You slow the rush by running the ball effectively, and quick short passes consistently( which in turn opens the PA deeper patterns), unfortunately, it seems Bevell missed that basic lesson somehow.

This. Same thing in the first half against Arizona last week, I seem to recall they had 5 running plays in the first half. I am not sure what the deal is, I get Beast is no longer there, but that is not a reason to abandon a style that has been successful for 4 straight years prior. Tired of seeing a pass play on first down that goes incomplete, and then run on 2nd for 1-2 yards, setting up another 3rd and long.

Penalties were brutal yesterday, but still not THE reason Hawks lost. They still had a chance in the end to win a game.

Honestly, RW3's injuries are a huge factor in this offense going stale, obviously. But play calling has been just as horrendous.

[RiverDog]

Same thing in the first half against Arizona last week, I seem to recall they had 5 running plays in the first half.

We only had 13 offensive plays in the first half vs. Arizona, which works out to 38% run vs. pass. That's pretty close to our 42% average for the season.

The problem isn't that we're not calling enough running plays, it's that we're not gaining any yardage from them. And it's not just that we don't have Beast, it's that we don't have a healthy Russell Wilson and we don't have good, run blocking offensive linemen. And last week, it seemed like every time we got something going, we had a drive killing penalty that put us in long yardage, passing situations.

This is the weakest offense unit we've had since the days of TJack.

[Oly]

I think Carroll has de-emphasized the run because of Michael. I don't think he's a workhorse type of back and he's been the only decent healthy runner on the team for most of the season. I don't think he'd hold up to the kind of load that Carroll likes, and if he got injured the Hawks would be well and truly f**ked.

Not that this in any way excuses 5 runs in a half of football, but I think it's part of why we're closer to 40% than 50% running plays on the year (with the other part, obviously, being Wilson's injuries).

[RiverDog]

Just to highlight the impact that Russell's injuries have had on our running game, in his first 4 seasons, Russell has averaged just over 100 carries per season. After the first 7 games this season, he's had just 25 rushing attempts. Not only that, but his injuries has taken away one of our bread and butter running plays, the read option, out of our arsenal as his injuries makes it more difficult to sell his threat to run.

Plus this season, we've found ourselves in fewer 1st and 10, 2nd and 4, and 3rd and 1 situations. Indeed, we rank 29th in the league in total first downs (skewed somewhat by the number of games played), putting us in a higher percentage of passing situations than in years past, and as we all know, down and distance affects play calling.

I also don't think that Bevell trusts Michael like he did Beast and Rawls. Michael has had a reputation as a fumbler and his well documented brain farts do not lend itself to him being leaned on as a workhorse. I know that I'm not a huge Michael fan, and it's very likely that Bevell isn't, either. Even if Rawls doesn't come back for another 3-4 games, I wouldn't be surprised to see Michael's carries diminish now that Prosise and Collins are getting more experience

Bottom line is that I don't think we've voluntarily gotten away from our core belief as a run-first team as much as the injuries to Russell, the game situation, and the realities of our roster has forced us away from it.

[Seahawks4Ever]

Marshawn Lynch wouldn't do any better running behind this line that CM has.

[NorthHawk]

In Lynch's last healthy season he had 105 broken tackles.
I think had he broken around 45 - 50 by now, we might have won 2 more games.
He had a penchant for busting a big play when we needed it and we haven't seen that this year.
Yet, I hope.

[HumanCockroach]

Unfortunately, that was two seasons ago. I'm honestly a touch surprised how quickly and thoroughly people write this team off. The Seahawks certainly weren't 4-2-1 last season at this point, nor were they TWO years ago ( it seems people have incredibly short memories of were that season ended).

Seattle struggles every year in the first half, they always have under Carroll. Hell the year they went 13-3 with a Lombardi is the last time they had a record this good at the half way point ( and struggled to win games that year as well. How quick people are to forget close calls against the dregs of the NFL that year. Misrembering escaping with victories over Houston and Tampa, etc).

Not entirely sure WHY that's their pattern, certainly wish it wasn't, but unrealistic expectations of perfection and domination each and every week is silly.

[RiverDog]

Marshawn Lynch wouldn't do any better running behind this line that CM has.

I disagree. I'll tell you one thing, Beast would have never stepped out of bounds a yard short of a first down in a close game like Michael did. Not in a million years.

[HumanCockroach]

So you're admitting this line is better than last year's line finally RD? Bully for you, glad you can finally see things for what they are. Nicely done.

[RiverDog]

So you're admitting this line is better than last year's line finally RD? Bully for you, glad you can finally see things for what they are. Nicely done.

I never said I wasn't. What I said was that it wasn't "drastically" better than last year's, and I stand by that remark. More like marginally better.

[HumanCockroach]

Must have been someone else that called it the worst offensive line in 40 years. My mistake.

[RiverDog]

Must have been someone else that called it the worst offensive line in 40 years. My mistake.

I backed off that assessment not too long after I said it. Glad that my words stick with you, though.

[Hawktawk]

Seattle tore it up last year without beast. Micheal had several excellent games in that span. What happened?

[RiverDog]

Seattle tore it up last year without beast. Micheal had several excellent games in that span. What happened?

Our offensive line "drastically" improved.

[NorthHawk]

Seattle tore it up last year without beast. Michael had several excellent games in that span. What happened?

4 of the 5 players on the OL are either playing new positions or are new to the team (I include Glowinski because he had such little experience).
This line looks like it has a real chance to be much better than the last 2 years, but it will take time. If you consider the limited amount of practice time permitted with the new CBA, it's a much harder job to get them all on the same page than it used to be.

It's a gamble to make such a drastic change with what is the most important position group on Offense within a championship window, but it had to be done considering the mess it devolved into. I think Ifedi is an improvement on Sweezy, who in my opinion was at best an average RG at least within our Offense, and Britt is much better at C than last years participants. I'm not yet sold on Sowell at LT, and Gilliam has been a bit of a disappointment in his play, but the concern over the last few years has been letting starting caliber players along the OL go without any seemingly suitable replacements ready to take over. I seriously wonder if Okung didn't want to be here considering what is reported he signed for in Denver, and maybe Carp wanted out, too, but the facts are they are good players that are playing fairly well on their new teams and could have provided some continuity along the OL.

[HumanCockroach]

I'm excited and optimistic about the current line and where they are headed. Ultimately the 3 interior lineman have performed above and beyond the Lombardi winning interior, Gilliam has performed on par, Sowell is crap, but at least he's less odorous than Webb. Not sure about Fant, but he did a decent job considering it was his first start in a football game since jr high... Right now, they have played as a whole better than last year's group, and better than the lines first half two years ago that played in a SB.... Granted no one knows if they will perform the second half of the season at that level, but to date it's been more good than bad.

If nothing else, they have found 3/5ths of a LONG TERM answer, with possibly a fourth or fifth option, depending on how quickly they learn, develop and grow ( not talking about Sowell but Gilliam and Fant)... Barring serious stunted growth or major injuries, they have found a bulk of their line, and I for one am excited to see how it all plays out.

[NorthHawk]

If nothing else, they have found 3/5ths of a LONG TERM answer,

Britts contract is up after next year. Gilliam and Sowell are up after this year, so as long as they re-sign Britt, provided he continues to play well at C, that statement will be true.
I think they are at the point that they can't afford to let him walk after all of the problems along the line the last few years. The interior might have a chance to be pretty good if they can keep them them together for a few years.