McDowell in ATV accident

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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby politicalfootball » Sat Aug 05, 2017 7:02 pm

Do you know what I see, I see him coming back mid season and bringing a shot in the arm for the DL.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby obiken » Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:08 pm

politicalfootball wrote:Do you know what I see, I see him coming back mid season and bringing a shot in the arm for the DL.


I am glad you feel that way guy, but a cracked skull? your a Legacy member PF, you remember it took Kenny Hamlin Months to get back, and he was never the same. He's a kid, its negligence, not manslaughter. I feel for him he was the best prospect we had, IMHO.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:43 am

obiken wrote:I am glad you feel that way guy, but a cracked skull? your a Legacy member PF, you remember it took Kenny Hamlin Months to get back, and he was never the same. He's a kid, its negligence, not manslaughter. I feel for him he was the best prospect we had, IMHO.


Where did you hear that McDowell has a cracked skull?
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Hawk Sista » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:28 am

Rig, the only place I've read that he has broken bones (face/skull) have been in this thread. Everything else has been very vague with a giant ominous cloud overhead. I "think" what you are reading re: a skull fracture is conjecture. That said, I also think there are very specific reasons the team is so evasive and tight lipped; like perhaps it'll impact his pay and they don't want to put anything out there for agents or lawyers to nab onto. But that's conjecture also.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:06 am

My guess has been concussion and I base that on there being no definite timelines for recovery.
Some people recover quickly and others never do, and that's why we hear statements like he may be out for the year or career threatening.
I hope I'm wrong and it's something that just takes time to heal but since the team isn't talking, the guessing and conjecture will continue.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:37 am

Hawk Sista wrote:Rig, the only place I've read that he has broken bones (face/skull) have been in this thread. Everything else has been very vague with a giant ominous cloud overhead. I "think" what you are reading re: a skull fracture is conjecture. That said, I also think there are very specific reasons the team is so evasive and tight lipped; like perhaps it'll impact his pay and they don't want to put anything out there for agents or lawyers to nab onto. But that's conjecture also.


Yea, me, too. I've tried searching and can't come up with a thing. The Hawks are being unusually closed lipped about his injuries. Is McDowell exercising his right to privacy and not allowing them to disclose his condition? At some point, they're going to have to be a little more definitive at least about his playing status.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:25 pm

Not saying anything could mean a bunch of things but most of the reasons can't be a good outcome.

He's already been evaluated for 2 weeks back east and nearly a week here, and not a peep.

It just tells me he's messed up good.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Hawktawk » Sun Aug 06, 2017 2:47 pm

Could he be cut over this? Why pay high draft pick money for damaged goods when it happened on his own time?
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby mykc14 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:15 pm

Hawktawk wrote:Could he be cut over this? Why pay high draft pick money for damaged goods when it happened on his own time?


They *could* cut him this year but it would give them a 4 mill dead cap hit. Cutting him next year would give them a 3 mil dead cap hit, so it is really unlikely. Far better to hope he gets better than to eat 4 mil.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby c_hawkbob » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:25 pm

Yeah he'll be cut just like Kellen Winslow II was cut ...
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Hawktawk » Sun Aug 06, 2017 6:15 pm

c_hawkbob wrote:Yeah he'll be cut just like Kellen Winslow II was cut ...

I wasn't aware he was signed or is it just league rule it's a 4 million hit? Obviously I root for the kid to recover. I've got plenty of battle scars from crotch rockets that cost me half my junior season in football and a ruptured patella years later due to an old dirt bike crash injury. Stuff happens with young men. I was just curious what option the team may have.6
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby mykc14 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:50 pm

Hawktawk wrote:I wasn't aware he was signed or is it just league rule it's a 4 million hit?... I was just curious what option the team may have.



He did sign his rookie contract, so the dead money comes from that.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby jshawaii22 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:21 am

It's got to be pretty serious, but I think facial bones or concussion. If he had a 'cracked skull' I doubt his doctors would of let him fly.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Mon Aug 07, 2017 4:46 am

jshawaii22 wrote:It's got to be pretty serious, but I think facial bones or concussion. If he had a 'cracked skull' I doubt his doctors would of let him fly.


Good point.

I still don't understand all the secrecy behind these injuries. I can understand not wanting to comment before they have all the facts, but it's been a week now and still nothing.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:55 am

I read an article on my iPad (don't have the link) but it said just that - facial injuries and concussion.
Concussion is probably the worst injury a lineman (Defense or Offense) can have because of the nature of the positions and the butting of heads on every play.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:00 am

Dangit, we could have had Budda Baker, who is going to kill us twice a year.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:47 am

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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Tue Aug 08, 2017 5:16 am

Largent80 wrote:Not good news.

Here ya go.......

https://www.fieldgulls.com/2017/8/7/161 ... or-a-while


Here's part of the answer to why we haven't heard more details regarding his injuries:

Carroll later added that McDowell did suffer a concussion but otherwise did not go into specifics on said injuries, once again respecting the wishes of Malik’s family.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Tue Aug 08, 2017 6:43 am

I keep hearing that once you have one concussion, the others happen a lot easier and the more severe the concussions the symptoms can linger for months or maybe years.
I hate to say it, but this may actually be career threatening if not career limiting.
Not to sound completely uncaring but at least by moving down we got extra picks. Maybe one of them will become a starter.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 8:58 am

It may be time to put a "use common sense" clause into contracts since some dunderheads simply don't understand how much rides on all the procedures it takes to procure and pick these players. While McCrash was "just having fun" his actions severely impacted not just the team, but all of us who invest our time and a LOT of money into our team.

I mean, if he was a guy on that ride in Ohio that failed, that's different, because he could control what happened to him as opposed to being on a failing ride.

This stinks, but the Hawks will be fine without him anyway.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 9:09 am

Since this guys injuries are so obviously career threatening, why can't they at LEAST say what they are?

I hate this about PC and the Hawks, they just hem and haw about injuries.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 10:14 am

The Nazir Jones pick is now huge, couple that with Reed being in his second year and we will be ok?
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Tue Aug 08, 2017 10:24 am

Largent80 wrote:The Nazir Jones pick is now huge, couple that with Reed being in his second year and we will be ok?


Maybe if Cassius Marsh steps up on the outside and if Quinton Jefferson is healthy on the inside, we could actually see an improved DL.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:02 am

NorthHawk wrote:The Nazir Jones pick is now huge, couple that with Reed being in his second year and we will be ok?


Maybe if Cassius Marsh steps up on the outside and if Quinton Jefferson is healthy on the inside, we could actually see an improved DL.[/quote]

I think we know what we have with Marsh. Jefferson could be "that guy" but he needs health to prove it.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:14 am

Marsh has been working with Bennett in the off season learning how to effectively rush the passer as well as defend the run and thinks it might be his year.
I hope he's right.
It's Jefferson's 2nd year so maybe he will be healthy after an extensive rehab and now knowing what it takes to play in the NFL.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby c_hawkbob » Tue Aug 08, 2017 12:42 pm

Largent80 wrote:Since this guys injuries are so obviously career threatening, why can't they at LEAST say what they are?

I hate this about PC and the Hawks, they just hem and haw about injuries.


I don't know that we need to know specifically what the injuries are. When answering questions about it Pete said there are "multiple injuries" including injuries to his head and that he'd be out quite a while. He did mention the bye, so I think we're sending him home to heal up and we'll re-evaluate after the bye. I think that pretty much covers what we need to know.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2027 ... ident-july
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Tue Aug 08, 2017 1:17 pm

"Just got to wait it out," Carroll said. "Wait out recovery. He's not working out yet. He can't do anything as far as the physical workouts. He's walking. That's what he's doing. He feels fine. It's very frustrating for him because he feels fine, but he's just got to make it through the recovery."

Carroll said he doesn't think McDowell's injuries are career-threatening. He was asked if McDowell could play this year.

"I don't know that," he said. "I like to hope so, but I don't know that."


From the linked article. It sounds more and more like a concussion.
I was reading about Sidney Crosby who was concussed and out for a few months a couple of years ago and he was talking about a similar thing. He could walk, but not work out while he recovered.
I'd rather it be bone breaks as they can heal and it can be defined, but concussions can't in the same way.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Wed Aug 09, 2017 8:43 am

Largent80 wrote:Since this guys injuries are so obviously career threatening, why can't they at LEAST say what they are?

I hate this about PC and the Hawks, they just hem and haw about injuries.


I saw somewhere that McDowell's family doesn't want the extent of his injuries disclosed. We do have medical privacy laws that employers have to honor or risk a lawsuit if they violate them.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:02 am

I hope he recovers but don't care anymore. This guy has never been a Seahawk and probably never will.

Next Man (or draft pick) up.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:58 am

This guy is an embarrasment for the Hawks organization.

He slipped to the 2nd round, yet the Hawks coveted him, he was "their guy". Oh man....another dunderhead coveted (see Moffitt).

Quit all the dumb trading of picks and actually snag a real player with a head on their shoulders Seahawks.

Yes, I'm bashing the F.O.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:20 am

The draft is about selecting potential. Often it comes with smarts, but sometimes it doesn't.
Letting McDowell slip and getting more picks was a good strategic move as maybe one of the extra picks will become a starter.
Should McDowell recover fully, he is the type of player that could be a game changer. Height in the middle is becoming more
important to try to limit the underneath passes (note they selected Nadir Jones 6' 5" as a DT) and they want him to eventually be a Mike Bennett type playing both DE and DT.
He has some tremendous natural abilities that can't be overlooked when drafting potential, but 20 year olds are still pretty dumb in many cases and make poor decisions in life
regardless of where they are picked.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Largent80 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:31 am

I think I understand WHY they drafted him, however there were many other areas in this teams make-up that could have used a first round talent and they chose to garner more picks and let all of those players get taken in front of us.

It's worked before, but NOT this time. That isn't their fault in the drafting process, but at some point before the break to TC they failed to communicate the importance of not putting oneself in harms way beit with DWI, Assault, or in this case, lack of judgement with an ATV.

I don't think he will recover from this to be an NFL player. It's too Hush-Hush.

This is all on McCrash, but the FO needs a few lessons on things and these are obvious.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby EmeraldBullet » Wed Aug 09, 2017 11:29 pm

I am every bit as disappointed with the situation as any of you. But I guess I have a different take on it.

I don't blame the FO, for drafting him, he was a solid pick at the time and we received more draft picks that might develop into something (I will say if it were my draft pick, I would've done something different, and I said this before the accident, but I was optimistic about the pick.)

I also don't blame the guy for doing something he loves during the offseason. Accidents happen randomly, you don't ever think they will happen no matter what your doing. If the guy got hurt in a boating accident fishing for salmon would you have the same thoughts as you do for him, with it being an atv....both hobbies have their risks. Anything fun you do has risks.

There's no point in working if you can't do the things you love. I don't blame this guy for having an accident. I regret that it happened, but I guarantee you, he regrets it even more.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:01 am

Largent80 wrote:Quit all the dumb trading of picks and actually snag a real player with a head on their shoulders Seahawks.


I'm beginning to question our tendency to trade down at the top of drafts. It's like a shotgun approach. We don't have players that we target, we trade down, accumulate picks, then hope that one or two of them work out. The only player we've had in the past couple of drafts that has produced was Lockett, and we traded up to get him. I'm wondering how good our talent appraisal has been if we can't find those "must have" players then do what we need to do to get them.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby obiken » Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:24 am

I agree River, we are still really running the core group that we drafted 4 or 5 years ago. The last 3 years IMHO, have been warmed over dog food.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Zorn76 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 4:24 am

It's a bummer, but I don't think him even being out the entire year is something that will be difficult to overcome.
He f'd up, and it's costing team and him plenty in terms of experience, in addition to any possible fines or contract issues.

But I really don't see this being a make or break injury in terms of our season's SB chances in the least.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby Hawk Sista » Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:06 am

I really don't get throwing in the towel on the guy and the FO w/ this little information. All we really have is speculation and conjecture at this point. He was a solid pick and may well still pan out. In the meantime, I think our D will be just fine. If RW stays healthy, we will win the division.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby RiverDog » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:23 am

Hawk Sista wrote:I really don't get throwing in the towel on the guy and the FO w/ this little information. All we really have is speculation and conjecture at this point. He was a solid pick and may well still pan out. In the meantime, I think our D will be just fine. If RW stays healthy, we will win the division.


Speaking for myself, I'm not 'throwing in the towel' on McDowell, nor am I rapping the FO for this particular selection. I'm just wondering out loud about our strategy of trading down to accumulate picks as it relates to our overall talent appraisal. It's like we have this arrogant overconfidence in an ability that we, alone, are blessed with that other teams will bypass players that only we have highly ranked and allow us to pick them up at a discounted rate. I don't see a lot of evidence to where that strategy has paid off.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby mykc14 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:15 am

RiverDog wrote:Speaking for myself, I'm not 'throwing in the towel' on McDowell, nor am I rapping the FO for this particular selection. I'm just wondering out loud about our strategy of trading down to accumulate picks as it relates to our overall talent appraisal. It's like we have this arrogant overconfidence in an ability that we, alone, are blessed with that other teams will bypass players that only we have highly ranked and allow us to pick them up at a discounted rate. I don't see a lot of evidence to where that strategy has paid off.


I don't really mind our draft strategy, in fact I really like it. We have consistently been picking at the end of round 1. The talent/potential of players drafted 20-40 is pretty similar. We feel like we can get the same type of player early in round 2 as we would have picked late round 1. We gather more picks which we use to target specific players later in the draft. A perfect example of this was Tyler Lockett a few years ago. Last year we moved down to draft Ifedi (a player they probably would have drafted in their original spot) got more picks and then used those picks to move up and get Jarron Reed early in round 2. You may disagree with who they are drafting but the strategy is really solid, IMO.
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Re: McDowell in ATV accident

Postby NorthHawk » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:03 am

JS/PC look for players with specific qualities both measurable and intangible. A lot of teams don't, so if a player is "out of favor" with most teams, it doesn't matter to us.
That means we might be able to get a player a number of spots lower than our draft position and pick up more draft picks in the process. It can be a win win deal for us, after all
no draft pick is a guaranteed success so more picks increase the odds that a player will make it. This year by trading down we got S Delano Hill, S Tedrick Thompson, and RB Chris Carson
and still got the guy they wanted. If all 3 make the team, it was great move and if McDowell does come back, it's a bonus, but if only 1 makes the team then we haven't completely
lost the value of the selection.
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