NFC West Champs

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NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:43 am

If Seattle loses this game, their odds of winning the NFC West drop to 3% if they win, it goes up to 69%

That's how you spell Must Win. Go Hawks.

http://www.espn.com/blog/seattle-seahawks/post/_/id/28675/how-important-is-beating-the-rams-seahawks-nfc-west-chances-would-drop-to-3-percent-if-they-dont
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby c_hawkbob » Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:47 am

Must win is a pretty high bar for me, but this is as close as it gets without being absolute.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:47 am

Hopefully it doesn't come down to relying on The Great Gazoo to win the game.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sat Dec 16, 2017 8:14 am

Largent80 wrote:Hopefully it doesn't come down to relying on The Great Gazoo to win the game.


Seriously, if we win this... he HAS to be replaced before the playoffs. If we lose this he HAS to be replaced before the next Sunday. There are some legitimate options out there. Particularly Rugby and Soccer players.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby politicalfootball » Sat Dec 16, 2017 9:29 am

I think if we win out we are set for HAD throughout the playoffs. Go Seahawks !
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sat Dec 16, 2017 9:41 am

politicalfootball wrote:I think if we win out we are set for HAD throughout the playoffs. Go Seahawks !


Possibly, the playoff predictors show us at #2 seed if we win out and there are a few key losses.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Rambo2014 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:00 pm

Seahawks/Playoffs = Oxymoron

Done tomorrow then you all can relax with a doobie

"Playoffs" " No. 2 Seed" OMG LOLOLOL
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Aseahawkfan » Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:49 pm

This is the game that matters the most this season. It is a must win. We win, we maintain control of our destiny. We lose and we're relying on other teams to lose rather than us winning. This game pretty much decides our season.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:52 pm

Rambo2014 wrote:Seahawks/Playoffs = Oxymoron

Done tomorrow then you all can relax with a doobie

"Playoffs" " No. 2 Seed" OMG LOLOLOL


Stranger things have happened.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby obiken » Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:06 pm

c_hawkbob wrote:Must win is a pretty high bar for me, but this is as close as it gets without being absolute.


I disagree Cbob, we have to win. IF not we would have to go on the road and win 3 games we are not a good road team. At this point with our MASH unit we will be lucky to even make it to 8-8. Again, I hope I am wrong.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby c_hawkbob » Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:51 pm

obiken wrote:
I disagree Cbob ...


Knew you would.

obiken wrote:we have to win. IF not we would have to go on the road and win 3 games we are not a good road team. At this point with our MASH unit we will be lucky to even make it to 8-8. Again, I hope I am wrong.


The fact that you had to explain why we ''have to" win is exactly why it's not an absolute must win. 'Must win' is a mathematical thing in my mind; it means if you don't win you are eliminated from the post season, not "effectively eliminated" or "essentially eliminated", but truly mathematically eliminated.

All other games are important, and this one is extremely important, but if we lose there is still a chance.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:37 am

While wanting to win extremely badly, I would take a loss if it means the team gets rid of at least 2 (un-named) coaches at the end of the year. We can talk about O-Line continuity and many other things. In the end The Seahawks just have no offensive identity, and the pay calling has been exactly the same for too many years. It doesn't help that Bevell completely abandons what is working to try and out cute the DC. We are not taking advantage of the people we have, and it's sad and a waste.

It's no coincidence that we have no running game just because Lynch isn't here. The special teams is almost a liability now. A kicker who the team and himself have no confidence in , and can't get the ball into the endzone on kickoffs without a huge tail wind and containment on punts and kickoffs has gone downhill.

Of course all of this is on Pete Carroll. He is the one that has chosen to remain the same. There really shouldn't be any question marks in his brain when he sees the exact thing that everyone else sees. He has been over loyal in my opinion.

Pete has always been keen on keeping his "system" run the ball well, and play good defense with cover 1/3.

Here's the problem with the defense for this years team:

Cover 1: is strictly man coverage. If the defense is able to win a majority of the 11 match ups, they will succeed with this coverage. Unfortunately, they can't.

Cover 3: Sherm commands and is tasked with defending the left side in both Cover 1 and Cover 3, but his presence is gone so Seattle has a tougher time playing these schemes. Cover 1/3 is Carrolls bread and butter, if it's not working, he's all out of ideas. What generally conceals Carrolls weaknesses in these two schemes are a great pass rush. Seattle is no longer a great pass rushing team. So, the defense is then exploited by an intelligent coordinator and solid QB. Maxwell was picked on fairly easily by Blake friggin Bortles last week, and Goff is way better than him.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:51 am

Win or lose there need to be some big coaching shake ups this off season for sure. I would START with a new strength and conditioning coach, followed by OC and OL positions. When your QB hires his own personal trainer and fitness coach to stay healthy, it's a sign.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby RiverDog » Sun Dec 17, 2017 8:25 am

Sox-n-hawks wrote:Win or lose there need to be some big coaching shake ups this off season for sure. I would START with a new strength and conditioning coach, followed by OC and OL positions. When your QB hires his own personal trainer and fitness coach to stay healthy, it's a sign.


Honest question: Do other NFL QB's hire a personal fitness trainer? I know that other highly paid athletes do.

I advocate getting rid of Bevell and especially Cable, but I wouldn't be shocked if Pete makes any high level changes like that. He's shown a pretty devoted loyalty towards coaches on hi staff.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby c_hawkbob » Sun Dec 17, 2017 8:34 am

Largent80 wrote:While wanting to win extremely badly, I would take a loss if it means the team gets rid of at least 2 (un-named) coaches at the end of the year.


Not me. Ever.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby RiverDog » Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:06 am

c_hawkbob wrote:"While wanting to win extremely badly, I would take a loss if it means the team gets rid of at least 2 (un-named) coaches at the end of the year."

Not me. Ever.


Same here. Besides, that kind of strategy often times backfires, as you could very well end up jumping from the frying pan into the fire.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 10:07 am

I'm simply tired of watching the team get wasted and aged with an offense that obviously has. I've already stated my intentions of not giving the NFL any more of my money, and time is money so I value my time on this planet more than a football game, especially one that is being mismanaged. It just isn't fun watching it for me, so whatever, if they win great, if not, so what?
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby idhawkman » Sun Dec 17, 2017 12:33 pm

Yeah, I'm on the side of not losing just to get rid of a couple of coaches. I'd rather the win.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sun Dec 17, 2017 1:33 pm

RiverDog wrote:
Honest question: Do other NFL QB's hire a personal fitness trainer? I know that other highly paid athletes do.

I advocate getting rid of Bevell and especially Cable, but I wouldn't be shocked if Pete makes any high level changes like that. He's shown a pretty devoted loyalty towards coaches on hi staff.


While not necessarily uncommon, having to make a complete U-turn on the direction the team's Strength and Conditioning coach has you going is strange. Especially when the injury bug bites. Interestingly enough, RW has been solid this season while other team members are getting wrecked.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Aseahawkfan » Sun Dec 17, 2017 1:53 pm

RiverDog wrote:Honest question: Do other NFL QB's hire a personal fitness trainer? I know that other highly paid athletes do.

I advocate getting rid of Bevell and especially Cable, but I wouldn't be shocked if Pete makes any high level changes like that. He's shown a pretty devoted loyalty towards coaches on hi staff.


Brady has a nutritionist and trainer I believe. I know a lot of guys hire trainers to prepare for the draft.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:38 pm

idhawkman wrote:Yeah, I'm on the side of not losing just to get rid of a couple of coaches. I'd rather the win.


Gonna be a long wait for you. This team left itself .
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:42 pm

Largent80 wrote:While wanting to win extremely badly, I would take a loss if it means the team gets rid of at least 2 (un-named) coaches at the end of the year. We can talk about O-Line continuity and many other things. In the end The Seahawks just have no offensive identity, and the pay calling has been exactly the same for too many years. It doesn't help that Bevell completely abandons what is working to try and out cute the DC. We are not taking advantage of the people we have, and it's sad and a waste.

It's no coincidence that we have no running game just because Lynch isn't here. The special teams is almost a liability now. A kicker who the team and himself have no confidence in , and can't get the ball into the endzone on kickoffs without a huge tail wind and containment on punts and kickoffs has gone downhill.

Of course all of this is on Pete Carroll. He is the one that has chosen to remain the same. There really shouldn't be any question marks in his brain when he sees the exact thing that everyone else sees. He has been over loyal in my opinion.

Pete has always been keen on keeping his "system" run the ball well, and play good defense with cover 1/3.

Here's the problem with the defense for this years team:

Cover 1: is strictly man coverage. If the defense is able to win a majority of the 11 match ups, they will succeed with this coverage. Unfortunately, they can't.

Cover 3: Sherm commands and is tasked with defending the left side in both Cover 1 and Cover 3, but his presence is gone so Seattle has a tougher time playing these schemes. Cover 1/3 is Carrolls bread and butter, if it's not working, he's all out of ideas. What generally conceals Carrolls weaknesses in these two schemes are a great pass rush. Seattle is no longer a great pass rushing team. So, the defense is then exploited by an intelligent coordinator and solid QB. Maxwell was picked on fairly easily by Blake friggin Bortles last week, and Goff is way better than him.


And I said this BEFORE the game.. :o
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Sox-n-hawks » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:50 pm

L-80, you called it! Now a tough road game against another rushing team. Ugh..... Bevell to NY Giants! C'mon!
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:52 pm

Here's some BUTT nuggets for ya......

This felt like the end of an era. The Rams were younger, they were healthier and they were better in each and every aspect of a game that was billed as Seattle’s most pivotal regular-season game at CenturyLink Field since Russell Wilson became quarterback.

Instead, it was Seattle’s most pathetic showing since the Seahawks were beaten 41-7 by the Giants back on Nov. 7, 2010, when Pete Carroll was in his first season as Seattle’s coach and Charlie Whitehurst started for an injured Matt Hasselbeck.

The Rams began five drives in Seattle’s half of the field in the first half. Compare that to the Seahawks, who ran exactly one play from Los Angeles’ half of the field. That play resulted in a fumble.

The Rams had 109 yards worth of punt returns in the first half; the Seahawks had 59 yards of total offense.

Wilson completed 12 passes in the first three quarters of the game and had been sacked five times entering the final period.

It didn’t get better in the fourth quarter with Wilson flagged for intentional grounding from his own end zone with 10 minutes remaining after he threw a pass toward the sideline on a play in which receiver Paul Richardson had broken inside.

Rams running back Todd Gurley scored four touchdowns, and his 57-yard touchdown run in the final minute of the first half was just the last play in an utterly miserable half of football for Seattle.

The Seahawks had four first downs and committed two turnovers. The only two plays that could even be called a highlight for the Seahawks were a pair of completions to J.D. McKissic. One converted a third-and-7, the other produced a 26-yard gain.

Seattle’s second-longest gain of the first half turned out to be the Seahawks’ worst play as receiver Tanner McEvoy caught a pass on third down, picked up the first down and then fumbled after gaining 22 yards.

The Seahawks trailed 13-0 by the time they converted another first down in a first half with a disparity that was best evidenced by the field position. Seattle’s average starting position was its own 22. The Rams’ average starting position was the Seattle 42, and of the Rams’ seven first-half possessions, five began on Seattle’s half of the field.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby mykc14 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:21 pm

Largent80 wrote:Here's some BUTT nuggets for ya......

This felt like the end of an era. The Rams were younger, they were healthier and they were better in each and every aspect of a game that was billed as Seattle’s most pivotal regular-season game at CenturyLink Field since Russell Wilson became quarterback.

Instead, it was Seattle’s most pathetic showing since the Seahawks were beaten 41-7 by the Giants back on Nov. 7, 2010, when Pete Carroll was in his first season as Seattle’s coach and Charlie Whitehurst started for an injured Matt Hasselbeck.

The Rams began five drives in Seattle’s half of the field in the first half. Compare that to the Seahawks, who ran exactly one play from Los Angeles’ half of the field. That play resulted in a fumble.

The Rams had 109 yards worth of punt returns in the first half; the Seahawks had 59 yards of total offense.

Wilson completed 12 passes in the first three quarters of the game and had been sacked five times entering the final period.

It didn’t get better in the fourth quarter with Wilson flagged for intentional grounding from his own end zone with 10 minutes remaining after he threw a pass toward the sideline on a play in which receiver Paul Richardson had broken inside.

Rams running back Todd Gurley scored four touchdowns, and his 57-yard touchdown run in the final minute of the first half was just the last play in an utterly miserable half of football for Seattle.

The Seahawks had four first downs and committed two turnovers. The only two plays that could even be called a highlight for the Seahawks were a pair of completions to J.D. McKissic. One converted a third-and-7, the other produced a 26-yard gain.

Seattle’s second-longest gain of the first half turned out to be the Seahawks’ worst play as receiver Tanner McEvoy caught a pass on third down, picked up the first down and then fumbled after gaining 22 yards.

The Seahawks trailed 13-0 by the time they converted another first down in a first half with a disparity that was best evidenced by the field position. Seattle’s average starting position was its own 22. The Rams’ average starting position was the Seattle 42, and of the Rams’ seven first-half possessions, five began on Seattle’s half of the field.


I don’t see a changing of the guard yet. Let’s see what happens when the league has a chance to prepare a whole offseason and they play a first place schedule next year. If they win the division again I might give them a changeingbof the guard, but let’s not forget we’ve withstood the niners and cards short periods of dominance. The difference is how bad we lost to the rams, who by the way were full strength. We had 4 pro-bowlers our on D and a 5th who was a shell of himself. It could be the end but I’m going to need more than 1 good season to turn the keys over to them. Offensively the Hawks have some work to do. The OL has improved before the past two weeks but we’re playing two of the best D-lines in the league...
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:36 pm

A first place schedule means squat in the NFL. That team and s young and hungry, remember that??

Our teams core players are getting up there and appear to be injury prone.

The offensive coaches should have been gone 2 years ago. It's all showing now regardless of injuries.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby mykc14 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:47 pm

Largent80 wrote:A first place schedule means squat in the NFL. That team and s young and hungry, remember that??

Our teams core players are getting up there and appear to be injury prone.

The offensive coaches should have been gone 2 years ago. It's all showing now regardless of injuries.


There is no doubt that they are young and hungry, but a first place schedule can add two tough games that can turn a season around, depending on who they play. Next year that could be the difference between having to play the Eagles Cowboys or Redskins, but it’s true you don’t know who the best team in the division is until the season actually starts...
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby obiken » Sun Dec 17, 2017 8:24 pm

I agree with Largent, the Rams have a great team even with all our defensive guys, we are a good team. We cannot, nor will we in the next 2 years, be able to run the ball.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby mykc14 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:04 pm

obiken wrote:I agree with Largent, the Rams have a great team even with all our defensive guys, we are a good team. We cannot, nor will we in the next 2 years, be able to run the ball.


What do you mean we won’t be able to run the ball in the next 2 years? Against the rams or just in general? I don’t think I’m ready to call them a great team yet. They are very good and no doubt have the potential to be a great team but how about a team does it for more than 1 year before we just hand them the division for the next 5 years. Like I said before do it when the nfl has had an off-season to prepare for you, then we will start talking. Look at last years best new thing, the Cowboys. Or the Bucs And Raiders who were both supposed to take a huge jump forward this year, only to fall of considerably. Teams will adjust to what you do well eventually, how you respond will determine how long you can sustain success in this league. This year in the NFC we are going to have 4 different division champions. It would shock me to see 4 new one next year. We need to get healthy, shore up the OL, get another run stopping DT and we will be fine.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby NorthHawk » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:03 am

They've also been relatively healthy this year.
We haven't seen how much depth they have if an injury at a significant position along the OL or a RB happens.
Good health usually results in some measure of success and maybe more than a team deserves some years.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby idhawkman » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:04 pm

Largent80 wrote:A first place schedule means squat in the NFL. That team and s young and hungry, remember that??

Our teams core players are getting up there and appear to be injury prone.

The offensive coaches should have been gone 2 years ago. It's all showing now regardless of injuries.

I agree with this. I think after the stars got paid following the 2 SBs they no longer were hungry. I think they've coasted for the past few years and really haven't had that eye of the tiger in them.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby NorthHawk » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:44 pm

Possibly or maybe they've played a lot of high intensity football in the last 5 years and have just been ground down to the point where they need a year to refill the tank.
I think the will is there, but I'm beginning to doubt their bodies can keep up the pace and the injuries seem to support that to an extent.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:01 pm

NorthHawk wrote:Possibly or maybe they've played a lot of high intensity football in the last 5 years and have just been ground down to the point where they need a year to refill the tank.
I think the will is there, but I'm beginning to doubt their bodies can keep up the pace and the injuries seem to support that to an extent.

C'mon man. These are elite athletes. All of them are asked to perform.


Do ya think the Rams athlete's performed much?

Do ya think you saw Seahawk athletes trying to even come close to matching the Rams?

Coming up with excuses is easy. Fixing the actual problems are way more difficult.

Not so difficult for Seahawk Top Brass. This team needs a re-do.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby NorthHawk » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:36 pm

The Rams haven't played nearly as many games as the Seahawks over the last 5 years. The Hawks have played 12 playoff games, the Rams none. Those high intensity games tend to wear players out over time.
It's a cumulative effect and I think the turning point was last year when we tied the Cards and the Defense was just whipped after the game.
They haven't been the same since IMO and the injuries are popping up.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby Largent80 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:08 pm

And someone else said we haven't been the same since 49. So what is it 49 or something else?

It's a NEED for change is exactly what it is.
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Re: NFC West Champs

Postby RiverDog » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:59 pm

mykc14 wrote:There is no doubt that they are young and hungry, but a first place schedule can add two tough games that can turn a season around, depending on who they play. Next year that could be the difference between having to play the Eagles Cowboys or Redskins, but it’s true you don’t know who the best team in the division is until the season actually starts...


There's only two games in our 2018 schedule that are not pre-determined: We play the same place finishers in the NFC South (at home) and NFC East (on the road). If the season were to end today, we'd be playing the Panthers at home and the Cowboys on the road.

It is extremely difficult to handicap a schedule this far out as the SOS can and does change, sometimes dramatically. There's no better example than our 2017 schedule: As a first place finisher, we drew the now 7-7 Packers and the 8-5 Falcons while the Rams drew the 11-3 Vikings and the 10-4 Saints. At this point, next year's schedule vs. our other divisional opponents is a no never mind, not even worth the time it takes to discuss the what if's as there's so many variables in it.
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