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Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 1:45 pm
by NorthHawk
To the Eagles for a 5th and Marcus Johnson (WR) and we give them a 7th.
Sherman is also meeting with PC and JS today about his future.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 1:48 pm
by RiverDog
It's not confirmed yet, but it sure sounds like it. Here's a link:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/03/07/micha ... us-johnson

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:29 pm
by NorthHawk
Trades can't be confirmed until Mar 14th, so all trades are unofficial at this point.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:02 pm
by idhawkman
So we give up a mid round 7th and Bennett and get back the last pick of the 5th round (before compensatory picks) and a unheard of WR.

I think we won that trade hands down. No more drama on the sideline.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:33 am
by RiverDog
idhawkman wrote:So we give up a mid round 7th and Bennett and get back the last pick of the 5th round (before compensatory picks) and a unheard of WR.

I think we won that trade hands down. No more drama on the sideline.


And no more offside penalties. People forget just how many times that guy was offside.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:19 am
by c_hawkbob
Bennett's replacement just might have a mind of his own and be a bit aggressive too, it's not like those are qualities Pete shies away from ...

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:18 am
by RiverDog
c_hawkbob wrote:Bennett's replacement just might have a mind of his own and be a bit aggressive too, it's not like those are qualities Pete shies away from ...


It's very unlikely that Bennett's replacement will have anywhere near the number of offside penalties he racked up each and every season. Last year, Bennett had 50% more penalties than the #2 worst offender by position.

And I would argue that a lot of Bennett's offside penalties didn't have anything to do with being overly aggressive. More a lack of concentration and self discipline.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:20 am
by c_hawkbob
RiverDog wrote:And I would argue that a lot of Bennett's offside penalties didn't have anything to do with being overly aggressive. More a lack of concentration and self discipline.


I disagree, Bennett's game was to anticipate the snap and get the jump on the guy across from him, to already be in motion as the ball is snapped and his offensive counterpart is still in his stance. It's a very aggressive, high risk/high reward gamble and Pete was fully on board with it.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:28 am
by NorthHawk
That's the way I look at it, too, Bob. And to be honest although he had a lot of off sides, he was pretty effective in his play.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:40 am
by RiverDog
A number of Bennett's penalties were due to his lining up offside. Now you can't tell me that's due to being too overly aggressive.

Besides, take a look at the sack leaders from last season. They had about 1/4 of the offside penalties that Bennett had. I'm simply not buying that Bennett's penalties are due to his aggressiveness when none of the other pass rushing DE's rack up penalties like he does.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:09 pm
by idhawkman
NorthHawk wrote:That's the way I look at it, too, Bob. And to be honest although he had a lot of off sides, he was pretty effective in his play.


I think the key word there is "WAS". He hasn't been effective for 2 years now. So I think Pete's patience had run out. I agree with the move.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:35 pm
by Clem7
https://www.fieldgulls.com/2018/4/18/17 ... te-carroll

Certainly not the only reason Bennett is gone, but not helpful.
Familiarity breeds contempt. What it really breeds is a lack of respect.
And Bennett is not the only one, both now departed as well as not.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:45 pm
by mykc14
Clem7 wrote:https://www.fieldgulls.com/2018/4/18/17252800/why-seattle-seahawks-moved-on-michael-bennett-read-meetings-head-coach-pete-carroll

Certainly not the only reason Bennett is gone, but not helpful.
Familiarity breeds contempt. What it really breeds is a lack of respect.
And Bennett is not the only one, both now departed as well as not.


Yeah, that would be pretty frustrating as a coach. To me it doesn't matter what you have and haven't heard you are being paid a lot of money to be in those meetings and it doesn't matter how many times you've heard a message. Like I tell my senior captains. Part of your job is to be energetic and have high energy even when you don't want to. If you are giving 100% focus in those meetings/film session/etc the other players are giving 80%, so if your only giving 80% there only giving 60%. You've always got to at least pretend like this is the most important thing you've got going on during those times. Bennett's lack of focus during those times shows he wasn't completely there mentally and not there as a leader the way the Hawks needed him to be.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:52 pm
by NorthHawk
It's human nature to get complacent when the same things are said over and over again. Even self motivated people can fall into that trap a little.
Sherm was probably right when he said Pete's system probably works best with turning over players after 4 or 5 years because the message gets stale.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:56 pm
by mykc14
NorthHawk wrote:It's human nature to get complacent when the same things are said over and over again. Even self motivated people can fall into that trap a little.
Sherm was probably right when he said Pete's system probably works best with turning over players after 4 or 5 years because the message gets stale.


It doesn't matter. That's just an obstacle, rather small really, that you overcome. Many other guys on the team are in the same position, they have actually heard it more than Bennett and they don't have a problem getting past it, paying attention, and not reading a book. Nobody is saying that it doesn't get old but it's your job to keep as up beat and energized as possible, not that hard.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:29 pm
by RiverDog
Clem7 wrote:https://www.fieldgulls.com/2018/4/18/17252800/why-seattle-seahawks-moved-on-michael-bennett-read-meetings-head-coach-pete-carroll

Certainly not the only reason Bennett is gone, but not helpful.
Familiarity breeds contempt. What it really breeds is a lack of respect.
And Bennett is not the only one, both now departed as well as not.


I'm not at all surprised. Anyone wonder why the Hawks were on Kaepernick's case about where his head was before they worked him out?

Mykc is exactly right. After 40 years in essentially the same type of work, I've had to attend scores of redundant meetings, go through a first aid class every couple of years, incident command training once a year, cultural sensitivity training, you name it. But I have to at least act that I'm interested or else my attitude will spread to the others. Bennett showed just how selfish he is by not giving two hoots in hell about the education of his younger teammates or about the job his coaches have to do.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:42 pm
by burrrton
Bennett showed just how selfish he is by not giving two hoots in hell about the education of his younger teammates or about the job his coaches have to do.


More appallingly, the jackass knew good and well what Pete was saying led to great success when guys bought into it- yet he was comfortable sh*tting all over it because he'd heard it before.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:18 pm
by RiverDog
burrrton wrote:More appallingly, the jackass knew good and well what Pete was saying led to great success when guys bought into it- yet he was comfortable sh*tting all over it because he'd heard it before.


Yea, if winning a Super Bowl and getting within one yard of winning two in a row doesn't earn one's respect, then I don't know what would. The guy is a self centered prick.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:33 am
by idhawkman
RiverDog wrote:I have to at least act that I'm interested or else my attitude will spread to the others. Bennett showed just how selfish he is by not giving two hoots in hell about the education of his younger teammates or about the job his coaches have to do.

The large print is the biggest problem. The image and example that he showed others is apalling. I guess he thought he was showing leadership this way. Then he wants folks to listen to him on the field or join his Vegas cause with him? Screw him!!! This Sh@t counts - all the time! Does anyone still wonder why he kept jumping offsides? His head was not in the game and hasn't been for 2 years.

Now for the bigger problem: Why the hell didn't Carroll put an end to this when it happened? or at least his posiiton coach? Sit him on the bench, make an example of him or something. Allowing that to continue and infect the team is on Richard and Carroll. I hope they have it all rooted out and cleaned up now.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:44 am
by RiverDog
idhawkman wrote:Now for the bigger problem: Why the hell didn't Carroll put an end to this when it happened? or at least his posiiton coach? Sit him on the bench, make an example of him or something. Allowing that to continue and infect the team is on Richard and Carroll. I hope they have it all rooted out and cleaned up now.


We're not sure when all this started happening. It might have been just this last year.

If this story is true, then one can sure see why the Seahawks and Pete Carroll, who has gained a reputation as a player's coach, allows players to express themselves, and so on, seems to have had a change in heart represented by their insistance about Kaepernick's making known his "plan" before bringing him in for a look see.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:48 am
by NorthHawk
We don't know what really went on outside of Sundays.
It could be he was tuning out the message in the meetings, but come practice time or in the film room he was great at showing the younger guys what's expected and helping them develop.
We know he had players together to practice and upgrade their pass rush moves in the off season, and that may have been only part of it.
The point I'm making is it's just part of the picture and not the whole thing.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 10:26 am
by idhawkman
NorthHawk wrote:We don't know what really went on outside of Sundays.
It could be he was tuning out the message in the meetings, but come practice time or in the film room he was great at showing the younger guys what's expected and helping them develop.
We know he had players together to practice and upgrade their pass rush moves in the off season, and that may have been only part of it.
The point I'm making is it's just part of the picture and not the whole thing.

Its a TEAM game. I don't care what part of the planning, rehearsal or implementation you are not bought into. If I see you "not bought in" when the season's motto was "All in", then you are gone or at least on the bench until you get your head straight and get "bought in." "ALL IN"

I guarantee it would have only taken a week or two before his head got straightened out. Carroll should have remembered the positive effect of getting rid of Percy.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 10:48 am
by NorthHawk
What I'm getting at is you can't look at one event and conclude the total is all bad - or good for that matter.
Was his net a benefit or not? We can guess, but we don't know all of the facts to judge.
Often times what is reported is not the whole of what happened and we walk away with an impression that doesn't fit the facts.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 12:03 pm
by RiverDog
I have to agree with North Hawk on this one. As much as I don't care for Bennett, we're reacting to an unsubstantiated rumor. The fact that Carroll took swift and decisive action on Percy Harvin shows that he's not afraid to rid himself of a star athlete if he's affecting team chemistry.

But it wouldn't surprise me one little bit if this rumor were true. With Bennett's anthem protest, his lawsuit against the LV cops, and the charges levied against him following the previous SB, the release of his book, his outspokenness, and so on and so on, makes this rumor very believable.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 12:16 pm
by Hawktawk
I cant for the life of me figure out what happened with Bennett, or Sherman for that matter. In 2013 Bennett was one of my favorite players, glib and funny and an absolute disrupter on defense, some saying the only better D end was JJ Watt in 2013-14. I remember him saying how fun it was to play for PC, like being coached by Willie Wonka. I wonder if the debacle on the one in AZ was the tipping point. And Sherman who had always had a tongue in cheek style and a grin on his face to go with his running mouth suddenly seemed angry all the time.

Both Sherm and Bennett talked crap about Wilson, Bennett most recently since leaving saying that "you don't want too many Russell Wilson's on your team but you want 4 or 5 beast modes". Excuse me? He doesn't want the guy with multiple NFL records and who has yet to miss a practice let alone a game in spite of being pummelled playing behind a joke of a line so guys like Bennett and Sherman could cash their fat paychecks and keep the defense together?

Meanwhile he wants 4 or 5 of the guy who for all his greatness mailed it in his last year in town after his injury, bailing for Cali to rehab and abandoning the team that was 4-5 when he left for 7 weeks while he rehabbed then taking the first team reps all week before the Minnesota playoff game before bailing off the team bus after reading the weather report. Russ played the game without gloves and Christine Michael was heroic with just under 80 yards, thoroughly outplaying AP.

One of the great blunders of Carroll's career was starting Lynch against the Panthers and I said so pregame. In short order he miscommunicated with Russ running a crossing pattern on a curl route giving Kuechly a walk in pick to start the first half landslide. He was completely ineffective in the game. But this is what Bennett wanted 4 or 5 of..... Yeah, Im glad hes gone, more so than Sherman who I hate seeing in the division. But hopefully his tank is on empty. I cant root for either of these A Holes ever again.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 12:46 pm
by Aseahawkfan
Hawktawk wrote:I cant for the life of me figure out what happened with Bennett, or Sherman for that matter. In 2013 Bennett was one of my favorite players, glib and funny and an absolute disrupter on defense, some saying the only better D end was JJ Watt in 2013-14. I remember him saying how fun it was to play for PC, like being coached by Willie Wonka. I wonder if the debacle on the one in AZ was the tipping point. And Sherman who had always had a tongue in cheek style and a grin on his face to go with his running mouth suddenly seemed angry all the time.

Both Sherm and Bennett talked crap about Wilson, Bennett most recently since leaving saying that "you don't want too many Russell Wilson's on your team but you want 4 or 5 beast modes". Excuse me? He doesn't want the guy with multiple NFL records and who has yet to miss a practice let alone a game in spite of being pummelled playing behind a joke of a line so guys like Bennett and Sherman could cash their fat paychecks and keep the defense together?

Meanwhile he wants 4 or 5 of the guy who for all his greatness mailed it in his last year in town after his injury, bailing for Cali to rehab and abandoning the team that was 4-5 when he left for 7 weeks while he rehabbed then taking the first team reps all week before the Minnesota playoff game before bailing off the team bus after reading the weather report. Russ played the game without gloves and Christine Michael was heroic with just under 80 yards, thoroughly outplaying AP.

One of the great blunders of Carroll's career was starting Lynch against the Panthers and I said so pregame. In short order he miscommunicated with Russ running a crossing pattern on a curl route giving Kuechly a walk in pick to start the first half landslide. He was completely ineffective in the game. But this is what Bennett wanted 4 or 5 of..... Yeah, Im glad hes gone, more so than Sherman who I hate seeing in the division. But hopefully his tank is on empty. I cant root for either of these A Holes ever again.


They lost that second Super Bowl by a margin so thin and a mistake so bad, it's like acid in their stomachs. Something like that would drive me mad if I were a player. It already pisses me off as a fan. I knew after that loss if they didn't get back to a Super Bowl quick, that loss would slowly destroy the team's morale. To be 1 yard from a second Super Bowl ring, only to have the coaches make one of the dumbest calls in history with a Hall of Fame RB and one of the best running QBs in the league has to drive you to madness when you know what could of been. I think after that loss, it's eating at them creating anxiety, unhappiness, and every negative to be magnified. It's why Pete should have seen this earlier and jettisoned Bevell much earlier to start to repair the morale of this team. He waited too long not accepting that the Super Bowl loss wasn't just some loss, it was a mistake of a magnitude unseen in Super Bowl history where the blame is squarely on the coaches. 1 yard from back to back wins, 1 yard with Beastmode in your backfield. That's like swallowing acid to a team like ours with a defense like we had.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 6:58 pm
by RiverDog
Aseahawkfan wrote:They lost that second Super Bowl by a margin so thin and a mistake so bad, it's like acid in their stomachs. Something like that would drive me mad if I were a player. It already pisses me off as a fan. I knew after that loss if they didn't get back to a Super Bowl quick, that loss would slowly destroy the team's morale. To be 1 yard from a second Super Bowl ring, only to have the coaches make one of the dumbest calls in history with a Hall of Fame RB and one of the best running QBs in the line has to drive you to madness when you know what could of been. I think after that loss, it's eating at them creating anxiety, unhappiness, and every negative to be magnified. It's why Pete should have seen this earlier and jettisoned Bevell much earlier to start to repair the morale of this team. He waited too long not accepting that the Super Bowl loss wasn't just some loss, it was a mistake of a magnitude unseen in Super Bowl history where the blame is squarely on the coaches. 1 yard from back to back wins, 1 yard with Beastmode in your backfield. That's like swallowing acid to a team like ours with a defense like we had.


I said that within 24 hours of that dreadful loss in SB49, that getting this team to overcome such a loss would be a bigger challenge for Pete Carroll than building a SB champion in the first place. That's why I advocated firing Bevell within the first two weeks of the end of the SB. There aren't many singular mistakes that can cost one their job, but they do exist, and blowing that call qualifies as one of them.

But that doesn't excuse Bennett, Sherman, Beast, Wilson, Pete, Bevell, or anyone else. Facing adversity is part of life. To one degree or another, we've all had to do it in at least one point of our lives.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:23 pm
by curmudgeon
The exorcism has started, unfortunately a few years too late.......

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 5:11 am
by Oly
RiverDog wrote:I said that within 24 hours of that dreadful loss in SB49, that getting this team to overcome such a loss would be a bigger challenge for Pete Carroll than building a SB champion in the first place. That's why I advocated firing Bevell within the first two weeks of the end of the SB. There aren't many singular mistakes that can cost one their job, but they do exist, and blowing that call qualifies as one of them.


Yeah, I'm with you and Asea here. Even though I wasn't as angry at the call to pass as some--just angry at the specific call and having Lockett as the read--it's clear that the players had a HUGE problem with the call. Bevell had to be let go simply to get the team chemistry back in balance.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 7:33 am
by NorthHawk
I thought at the time they would get over it, but RD and others were right. It became a sore that never healed and maybe if they had fired Bevell then it would have had a healing effect.

As far as the call goes, with the Pats Defense in that formation, I didn't have a problem with a pass play, but it should have been one where Wilson rolled out and put pressure on the edge of the Defense and have their players make a decision as to whether to attack Wilson and leave their man or cover their receiver.
The worst thing that would happen is he could then throw it away and go to the next play.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 8:25 am
by burrrton
Not sure if I've posted this before, but seems appropriate again:

Marshawn_XLIX.jpg
Marshawn_XLIX.jpg (17.69 KiB) Viewed 1975 times

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 9:58 am
by obiken
NorthHawk wrote:I thought at the time they would get over it, but RD and others were right. It became a sore that never healed and maybe if they had fired Bevell then it would have had a healing effect.
As far as the call goes, with the Pats Defense in that formation, I didn't have a problem with a pass play, but it should have been one where Wilson rolled out and put pressure on the edge of the Defense and have their players make a decision as to whether to attack Wilson and leave their man or cover their receiver.
The worst thing that would happen is he could then throw it away and go to the next play.


That's what I said! But a slant pass from a 5-10 1/2 QB????????

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:40 am
by NorthHawk
Height is irrelevant with such a bad play called in that situation. Even with Paxton Lynch at 6-7, it would have been a bad call.

Re: Bennett Traded

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:05 am
by RiverDog
NorthHawk wrote:As far as the call goes, with the Pats Defense in that formation, I didn't have a problem with a pass play, but it should have been one where Wilson rolled out and put pressure on the edge of the Defense and have their players make a decision as to whether to attack Wilson and leave their man or cover their receiver.
The worst thing that would happen is he could then throw it away and go to the next play.


We've probably beat that play into the ground more than any single play in Seahawks history.

But you're exactly right. We had a timeout to burn, so I would have preferred that they had given Russell some type of run pass option. If he decided to run and didn't get in the end zone or out of bounds, we could have still called our last TO and had one more play. Either that or some type of timing route to the corner where only our guy could catch it. Firing the ball over the middle is asking for trouble even if Butler hadn't sniff it out.