HawkShack.com

The left side and the center are good it's the right side that needs help. Ifedi and Glowinski just don't have what it takes to be in the NFL. I know Wilson got some sacks because of them . No coaching can make them become what they should be. We need to start over with the RG and RT.

Glowinski is gone.
Fluker is expected to start at RG.
Ifedi has only played 1year at RT and with a different simpler and power centric blocking scheme he might be in a system that suits him better.

Most pressure and sacks came from LT.... RT was offsides penalties.... every lineman gives up sacks, especially when you have a QB that holds the ball a long time, and has tendency to scramble and improvise. Nature of the beast... far more concerned with look out blocks and going ass over tea kettle, something ifedi wasn't guilty of.... especially if they're the fourth highest paid player on the team..

From Art Thiel:

So at the end of mini-camp Thursday, the line appeared set. Going from the left: 11-year vet Brown, second-year Ethan Pocic (up 20 pounds to 320), fifth-year Britt, sixth-year Fluker and third-year Germain Ifedi. All were drafted in either the first or second rounds, none are rookies, only Fluker is a first-timer, and they’re all getting fresh takes from Solari.

Now I think if we can let this group (replacing 32 year old Brown when he either retires or Fant overtakes him) work together for a while we might actually have something.

IMO our biggest problem under Pete has been our constant turnover on the line more so than the talent involved.

http://sportspressnw.com/2240511/2018/t ... ed-to-line

It's along the lines of what me and others have been saying for the last couple of years.
Decide where they best fit and let them learn the position and the players beside them instead of shuffling them around the line with a complex blocking scheme.
It's especially important for the younger players who come from college largely unprepared for play in the NFL.
That being unprepared might also be why we are seeing very good Guards who can play at a high level like Norwell and Martin getting paid so much. There just aren't that many around
that can help with the running game and hold off the interior pass rushers.

What???? No they're all garbage, every single one for the last five years, the seahawks never invest in their line don't you know?

I Think most of our line is okay but we need a fa replacement for Ifedi.

politicalfootball wrote:I Think most of our line is okay but we need a fa replacement for Ifedi.

No we are NOT ok, our OL sucks, period. Its was the worst in the league, and we did nothing to improve it. Quit trying to find any hope in this area.

obiken wrote:No we are NOT ok, our OL sucks, period. Its was the worst in the league, and we did nothing to improve it. Quit trying to find any hope in this area.

I disagree that we didn't do anything to improve the OL. We got rid of our OC and our OL coach and drafted one of the top RB's in the draft. I don't expect to see this OL turn into The Hogs, but as you noted, it was the worst in the league last season so it's bound to improve some.

As well, Solari has a simpler scheme, which should help young players that haven't been well prepared by College.

"No we are NOT ok, our OL sucks, period. Its was the worst in the league, and we did nothing to improve it. Quit trying to find any hope in this area."

Well, bummer, guess they should just stop playing the games entirely then...

We had OL problems for sure. Big, embarrassing and maddening problems. But we were not the worst in the league. Having a solid LT helps a ton and Britt is a very solid center. Pocic is only getting better and getting rid of Cable will be key. If Ifedi takes a step forward (& not before the snap), I think we’ll be much improved. Penny & a healthy Carson + a blocking TE in Will, we will be at least decent. The sky will always be falling for some people.

We signed another LT? Sweet!!! Who?

Who hired Cable, and how long did it take Cable to find a job? You cannot take warmed over garbage and expect him to have made Filet mignon out of them. I hope all the cheerleaders are right and I am wrong. Our OL was THE weakness during the title years, it has gotten worse, not better. Moreover, IF you think one rookie RB is going to equal the outstanding year RW had last year, then some of you are just drunk. 9-7 at best, at worst I dont even want to go there.

Would love a broken down analysis of how many "warmed over garbage" lineman that started games for Seattle during his tenure that were gainfully employed in the NFL last season....

90%? 95%? Maybe only 85%? Time for y'all to acknowledge it. Seattle has had, and continues to have NFL caliber lineman, and has the entire time...

obiken wrote:Who hired Cable, and how long did it take Cable to find a job?

The Raydah's, and it didn't take long:

http://www.espn.com/blog/oakland-raider ... s-eyebrows

HumanCockroach wrote:Would love a broken down analysis of how many "warmed over garbage" lineman that started games for Seattle during his tenure that were gainfully employed in the NFL last season....

90%? 95%? Maybe only 85%? Time for y'all to acknowledge it. Seattle has had, and continues to have NFL caliber lineman, and has the entire time...

Really Human, then why were they so bad? Our QB runs for his life and we had no running game.

obiken wrote:Would love a broken down analysis of how many "warmed over garbage" lineman that started games for Seattle during his tenure that were gainfully employed in the NFL last season....

90%? 95%? Maybe only 85%? Time for y'all to acknowledge it. Seattle has had, and continues to have NFL caliber lineman, and has the entire time...

Really Human, then why were they so bad? Our QB runs for his life and we had no running game.

I'm with Obi on this one. Either we had poor personnel, poor coaching, a poor scheme, or some sort of combination of those things. Either way, the offensive line sucked, and any attempt to cover it up by noting a few linemen that played well with other teams is like putting lipstick on a pig.

Having said that, I am cautiously optimistic about our prospects for an improved unit this season.

Y'all can be whatever you want.... proof is in the pudding. The majority of those garbage lineman still gainfully employed, and starting.... if you can't figure it out, I'm not interested in discussing it. Ultimately all it creates is being told in saying things I'm not, taking positions I haven't, or feel ways I don't.

Time to take that drink, or die of thirst. I'M done attempting to push your stubborn heads into the water. If you have a scrambling QB that holds the ball to long, forego's open receivers underneath looking for a big play, as he was coached to do, you pair that with young lineman, and an offensive scheme PREDICATED on long, low completion percentage passing game, and the "scramble play", instead of the short to medium range passing game that was used so effectively during Wilson's best half season.... you're going to see exactly what you saw.... the SCRAMBLE DRILL.

Not my problem if you can't recognize the shift in offensive scheme that occurred the next season, it did, and you don't have to be some sort of football expert to recognize it. Go watch games from first two years, watch games from Wilson's destruction of the league forward, and it will slap you in the face.

So yes it's a "combination of things", including the line, but Obi ISN'T saying that, he's saying it's ALL the line, as many of you have, for the last 3 yrs.

Really Human, then why were they so bad? Our QB runs for his life and we had no running game

Scheme, coaching, QB decision making, inexperience on the line, scrambling QB, lack of productive running game, focus on explosive plays over high percentage ones when you need first downs, abandoning the running game even when successful, force feeding weapons, removing 2/3ds of the field for receivers to work * making it more difficult to get open, or gain yards after the catch, a love affair with the deep ball when receivers are standing alone 10 to 20 yards down the field and you need 6 yards... there's a LOT of reasons, unfortunate so many can't recognize them.

Scheme, coaching, QB decision making, inexperience on the line, scrambling QB, lack of productive running game, focus on explosive plays over high percentage ones when you need first downs, abandoning the running game even when successful, force feeding weapons, removing 2/3ds of the field for receivers to work * making it more difficult to get open, or gain yards after the catch, a love affair with the deep ball when receivers are standing alone 10 to 20 yards down the field and you need 6 yards... there's a LOT of reasons, unfortunate so many can't recognize them

Wow, I really hope I am as dumb as you and HS think, I really do.

HumanCockroach wrote:So yes it's a "combination of things", including the line, but Obi ISN'T saying that, he's saying it's ALL the line, as many of you have, for the last 3 yrs.

You're at it again, Roach. Re-inventing history, attributing statements to people that did not make them, over dramatizing remarks made by others.

First off, obi didn't say that it's all on the OL. He's simply saying that our talent level on the OL isn't acceptable, something that I've agreed with. Secondly, personally I have, indeed complained about the talent level on the OL, primarily that Cable wasn't a good judge of talent, at least not for the system he ran while he was here. But I've also recognized many of the other factors you've mentioned, including the difficulty in blocking for a scrambling QB, trading away a Pro Bowl center for a soft tight end, our QB holding onto the ball too long looking for the home run, Bevell's play calling, and so on. Yet you accuse us of using a simplistic argument that our problems are all because we've had garbage for talent on the OL.

The fact that some former Hawk OL have had some success with other teams is not proof that our talent level was acceptable. It simply means that some of them were a better fit for their new teams than they were here.

If I am, you would certainly know RD. I learned from you, obi and Anthony after all.

HumanCockroach wrote:If I am, you would certainly know RD. I learned from you, obi ams Anthony after all.

OMG, Obi has been around longer than you Roach, there is zero percent chance he's Anthony.

HumanCockroach wrote:If I am, you would certainly know RD. I learned from you, obi ams Anthony after all.

Regardless of how you aquired it, it's an annoying habit. You are a good football mind and make solid arguments, but for the life of me, I do not understand why you feel the need to actentuate your case by making others look extreme and/or foolish.

Um, Bob I didn't say obi was Anthony... lol

I know I've got a good football mind. You're confusing accentuating with clarifying, something this forum has made me do for years at a time...

As for " making others look foolish".. whatever, if you act the fool, you look foolish, that's life. For someone so adamantly against this watered down PC society ( at least if past positions are to be considered) you sure do get offended awfully easily when it comes to me.

HumanCockroach wrote:Um, Bob I didn't say obi was Anthony... lol

Well that is what it looked like before you edited ... I figure "Obi ams Anthony" was some kinda new internet slang the kids are using nowadays.

HumanCockroach wrote:For someone so adamantly against this watered down PC society ( at least if past positions are to be considered) you sure do get offended awfully easily when it comes to me.

It wasn't me that was getting offended, you were attacking obi.

But you're right. I have developed a thinner skin lately, even when insults aren't directed at me. Old age, I guess.

It wasn't me that was getting offended, you were attacking obi.

But you're right. I have developed a thinner skin lately, even when insults aren't directed at me. Old age, I guess.

River, I don't think I am pie in the sky, and I don't feel I am gloom and doom, but even when out OL was good, BA of the Cards has said over and over that he never fear it. Sorry, If you look at the schedule and analytically break down each game you might get 9 wins, but sorry, I just don't see us being a playoff team. Moreover, we have gaping holes on defense now.

obiken wrote:River, I don't think I am pie in the sky, and I don't feel I am gloom and doom, but even when out OL was good, BA of the Cards has said over and over that he never fear it. Sorry, If you look at the schedule and analytically break down each game you might get 9 wins, but sorry, I just don't see us being a playoff team. Moreover, we have gaping holes on defense now.

Not gloom and doom? Aren't you the guy that declared the season over because a division rival drafted some unproven QB?

obiken wrote:River, I don't think I am pie in the sky, and I don't feel I am gloom and doom, but even when out OL was good, BA of the Cards has said over and over that he never fear it. Sorry, If you look at the schedule and analytically break down each game you might get 9 wins, but sorry, I just don't see us being a playoff team. Moreover, we have gaping holes on defense now.

Our OL hasn't been "good" since Holmgren was here, and certainly not at any time when Airans was HC of the Cards. We survived because we had one of the best YAC running backs and one of the most mobile QB's since the turn of the century. Once Beast was gone and Russell aged and became more injury prone, it took away Cable's fig leaf.

But I get your point, and I think that PC does, too, which is why he cleaned house, especially on the offensive side of the ball, and why he went after what they felt was the 2nd best running back in the draft after Barkley.

As far as the gaping holes on defense, Pete is a magician. Our defense is organic in that it can heal Thyself. In his first year, Pete turned over the roster by over 50% and still put a quality defense on the field (8th in scoring defense). Although I don't expect it to be top 5, we're going to be respectable, in the upper half of the league IMO, especially if we're successful in improving our running game.

And I don't expect playoffs, either, although it wouldn't surprise me if we made them. I'm expecting a .500 season.

Ams =and... not sure why phone auto corrected to that... but I certainly don't have any idea about young internet slang... some of you have me in years, but most don't have me by much, if at all.

Think you need to reread this thread. Nowhere did I "attack " obi, though he had no qualms doing so to political did he RD?

I made light of his doom and gloom statement, and it wasn't I insisting that the line was garbage with zero talent (something I did indeed call him on), or that the saintly, never to be blamed QB was forever running for his life through no fault of his own....

Seems to me, the people you agree with get a pass, those who call them on it, get a talking to. "If I wanted a father figure, I wouldn't have killed my own... "... lol

HumanCockroach wrote:Think you need to reread this thread. Nowhere did I "attack " obi, though he had no qualms doing so to political did he RD?

I made light of his doom and gloom statement, and it wasn't I insisting that the line was garbage with zero talent (something I did indeed call him on), or that the saintly, never to be blamed QB was forever running for his life through no fault of his own....

Seems to me, the people you agree with get a pass, those who call them on it, get a talking to. "If I wanted a father figure, I wouldn't have killed my own... "... lol

Yea, I might have been a little on edge as I'm so used to your bomb throwing that I didn't put in context your comments, so for that, you have my apology.

But as far as those that I agree with getting a pass, I disagree with obi all the time, including in this very thread just a few posts above. Additionally, I agree with you at least 90% of the time, it's your style that I don't like. So I guess I'm not the only one guilty of jumping to conclusions before fully comprehending remarks.

I Think It's a crying shame that we don't get some more help from FA on the OL. There's gotta be someone else to fit in our line. Somebody who can play decent and keep Wilson in the pocket. Glad we got Flunked but it's not enough we need to replace Ifedi too.

politicalfootball wrote:I Think It's a crying shame that we don't get some more help from FA on the OL. There's gotta be someone else to fit in our line. Somebody who can play decent and keep Wilson in the pocket. Glad we got Flunked but it's not enough we need to replace Ifedi too.

The problem is OLineman are the hardest to keep and find in FA. WR, RB's, and DB's, are a dime a dozen, average to good lineman are gold. Look at Nate Soldier, or Okung. RO's best Fb is behind him, but he is still getting way overpaid.

Regarding Ifedi, you can't give up on a high pick after having him learn 2 positions in 2 years and now provide a scheme that on the surface seems to fit his physicality better.
That's a recipe for no continuity in an area where it's the most important.

NorthHawk wrote:Regarding Ifedi, you can't give up on a high pick after having him learn 2 positions in 2 years and now provide a scheme that on the surface seems to fit his physicality better.
That's a recipe for no continuity in an area where it's the most important.

Yea, well if it hadn't been for the fact that he was a first round draft choice, they probably would have cut him rather than trying to save face by moving him to another position. He hasn't been able to master either one of them and about the only thing he does well is draw penalties.

The clock is ticking. This will be Ifedi's 3rd season, and he needs to start showing the potential that someone saw in him when we made him a first round selection. We're running out of excuses to explain his disappointing performance. Time for him to come to the party.

He was a rookie Guard then a rookie RT coming from a system where he more often than not did not use a 3 point stance.
Adding to it was a complex system to learn 2 positions and considering most competent OL take 3 to 4 years to get it together, he should be given more leeway.
There was an article (I'm not sure if it was PFF or another) that showed his progress was in line with the development of starting OL across the league.
The physical, simpler system that Solari brings should help him with his development and provide some consistency along the OL.
That's no guarantee, but the change in coaching and responsibilities might just make him a better player as it plays to his strengths.