Olusegon Oluwatimi (Draft Steal/gem?

[tarlhawk]

The travesty of that trade was two fold.
1) They didn't have a viable replacement for Unger (and still haven't found a long term answer)
So we really got nothing out of that trade except long term lack of production at Center.
That they would draft players hoping that if they washed out at G or T then they could try them at Center says a lot about how they look at the position.

The only thing Jimmy G. provided was mostly unfulfilled excitement at what RW could do with Grahm in the Red Zone...by the time he became important his contract needed an expensive extension and our GM wanted to move on from what had become a "black mark" for his eagerness to "roll the dice"...and Jimmy got released only to punctuate his pain by being the "hero" for his new Green Bay Packer team in a clutch game we needed to win...so bad with an exclamation point. Justin Britt wasn't drafted in the "hope" of playing center if he didn't fit at T/G...he was a highly touted run blocking 6'6" tackle. Many teams slide drafted tackles inside to G if they can't handle pass pro at RT. He only was moved to center because Patrick Lewis was waived. Justin Britt played so well at center that his contract was renewed and only an ACL injury allowed Pocic to step in and keep the job after Britt was waived on failed physical. Both Britt and Pocic were productive centers without being all-pro caliber...pretty high bar for any O-line member to achieve.

(From wikipedia)
With Pro Bowl center Max Unger battling injuries, Lewis received more playing time than expected. In the 2014 season, he played in six games for the Seahawks, who kept a 4–0 record with Lewis as starting center. Even though Unger was traded to the New Orleans Saints in the offseason, Lewis was not named the starting center before the 2015 season. However, he regained the starting job from Drew Nowak prior to Week 10. He did an excellent job after regaining the center spot. On August 30, 2016, he was waived by the Seahawks Patrick Lewis was being "counted on" to be "next man up"

As for 2015 and 2016 production our team finished 10-6 and 10-5-1 (won NFC West) losing in 2nd playoff game of each year. Both years RW was able to throw for over 4000 yards and 2015 Thomas Rawls as an UDFA rookie had 800+ yards while in 2016 he split time with Christine Michael for 800 yds combined. Did we suffer losing Unger? No Doubt! Our resulting O-line wasn't stellar...but it wasn't embarrassing either as Justin Britt played well after taking over with Patrick Lewis's release.

[NorthHawk]

Then why wasn't Britt re-signed after his injury? He played well enough for other teams, but we just let him go and tried to slot another player into the Center spot and continued the revolving door.
OL's have to play together for a while to play well. They don't just run on the field and be effective. Our FO hasn't seemed to understand that - or maybe hasn't cared.

[tarlhawk]

Then why wasn't Britt re-signed after his injury? He played well enough for other teams, but we just let him go and tried to slot another player into the Center spot and continued the revolving door.
OL's have to play together for a while to play well. They don't just run on the field and be effective. Our FO hasn't seemed to understand that - or maybe hasn't cared.

Tried to slot?? Pocic was drafted in the 2nd rd as a competing center to keep Justin Britt playing at his best...which he did until his serious injury. As for Britt being re-signed...we held out for a respected amount of time...then released him the year following his ACL injury? Why? Only our GM knows...we can speculate plenty...getting released on a failed physical designation means we were at an injury cross-roads...was it medical advise from our team doctors? Was it bad timing with Cap Impact? Why did we release an injured Richard Sherman??

One year removed from Pocic hardly makes it a continued revolving door? Austin Blythe didn't lose his job in KC because he was a bad center...and he didn't lose to Creed in competition...he was injured allowing Creed to show he was "ready" and no need to make him wait to compete. Blythe made sense because of Waldron and Dickerson wanting his experience in their "system" being familiar to them when all 3 were on the same Rams team...the only gamble was his age (30) and eventual retirement risk. Olu is a solid high floor (plug and play) little to no ceiling...but if Andy Dickerson continues to mold and shape the rookies given to him...that floor can be very good indeed.

Olu is solid in pass pro and very good at getting into 2nd level (LB territory) in run blocking. He won't help in any designed "creative" schemes to roll to an outside the tackle zone block...but running between the tackles and holding up the pocket for Geno seems to be his forte. Go Hawks

[NorthHawk]

Tried to slot?? Pocic was drafted in the 2nd rd as a competing center to keep Justin Britt playing at his best

And how often did he get to play Center? He wasn't given time to develop as he was put at Guard and played mostly there.

One year removed from Pocic hardly makes it a continued revolving door?

So how many Centers have we had since the Unger trade? We drafted Hunt and Pocic but Pocic was listed as a Guard and played there for the most part.
Otherwise we had a string of players that didn't make it or were just let go. In the mean time, we bypassed a bunch of very good Centers in favor of others.

[tarlhawk]

And how often did he get to play Center? He wasn't given time to develop as he was put at Guard and played mostly there.

So how many Centers have we had since the Unger trade? We drafted Hunt and Pocic but Pocic was listed as a Guard and played there for the most part.
Otherwise we had a string of players that didn't make it or were just let go. In the mean time, we bypassed a bunch of very good Centers in favor of others.

With the exception of 2015 when Patrick Lewis took back the center position from Drew Nowak...we have had Justin Britt and Ethen Pocic both 2nd rounders as our centers (Joey Hunt only was an injury fill-in when Britt got injured in 2019. Barring that injury Justin would have left on his terms and may have earned a 2nd extension.

As for Pocic not being given time to develop?? Ethan played center before we drafted him to challenge Britt...he still had camp and practices and coaching to prepare him for when his opportunity arrived 3 years after being drafted. He played guard to increase his roster value while waiting for his break. Being drafted doesn't guarantee opportunity especially if the guy you're trying to take a job from is playing pretty well...not a reflection on time to develop...a reflection on opportunity. Go Hawks

[NorthHawk]

Playing Guard is different from playing Center. Much different responsibilities.
Sol what happened to him? He went to Cleveland and actually played Center. He did so well he signed a 3 year $18M contract extension in March.
And we're still looking for a starting Center...
I sure hope Alu works out to end this ongoing saga.

[tarlhawk]

Playing Guard is different from playing Center. Much different responsibilities.
Sol what happened to him? He went to Cleveland and actually played Center. He did so well he signed a 3 year $18M contract extension in March.
And we're still looking for a starting Center...
I sure hope Alu works out to end this ongoing saga.

I'm missing your point concerning Pocic?? Ethan was drafted in 2nd rd as a center in 2017. Justin Britt was our established center so the rookie(6'6" 320lbs) filled in at guard due to injuries of starting guards...not because we wanted to have him as a starting guard...he was next man up able to play guard because of his back up role...only back up centers who would struggle at guard (Joey Hunt) would be exempt. When Britt got injured in 2019 mid season...Joey Hunt filled in finishing the season. 2020 had Pocic starting the season injured with a disastrous fill in by Kyle Fuller. Ethan came off IR after spending 4 games on IR and claimed the center role for 2020 and 2021 (missed two games because of concussion in 2021) so why would it be surprising he could play well at center for the Browns? Final contract years and free agency always play a role in players leaving.

[NorthHawk]

[quote]'m missing your point concerning Pocic?? Ethan was drafted in 2nd rd as a center in 2017. Justin Britt was our established center so the rookie(6'6" 320lbs) filled in at guard due to injuries of starting guards...not because we wanted to have him as a starting guard...he was next man up able to play guard because of his back up role...only back up centers who would struggle at guard (Joey Hunt) would be exempt. When Britt got injured in 2019 mid season...Joey Hunt filled in finishing the season. 2020 had Pocic starting the season injured with a disastrous fill in by Kyle Fuller. Ethan came off IR after spending 4 games on IR and claimed the center role for 2020 and 2021 (missed two games because of concussion in 2021) so why would it be surprising he could play well at center for the Browns? Final contract years and free agency always play a role in players leaving.[/quote]

The point is we drafted a Center then played him out of position and never gave him a real chance to play at his natural position then let him go only to see him become a starter on another team. It's a pattern along our OL over the years and I hope Olu can stop the continual changes at Center. It would be a welcome piece of the IOL puzzle if he works out.

[tarlhawk]

Point...counterpoint gets a bit old but its off season so why not? Just because you draft a center to "groom" for competition and eventual starting doesn't mean you put him in when your starting center is performing well...a good incumbent has a knack of keeping his job when faced by a rookie...so once again I'll state that while your team is "waiting" for the rookie to WIN the position you have him in a back-up role and injury fill in. The more positions a player can be back up for the more valuable the player (He wasn't going to forget how to play center...every training camp and practice gets a player better prepared for when they become "next man up".

Many players leave a team for a different team who offers a better chance to start or offers reasons a player desires another team...its called free agency and the Players Union didn't want players "shackled" to the team drafting them...minimizes hold outs for bargaining most of the time.

"A real chance tp play?" He was our solid starter for two out of the 4 seasons we had him under contract. Simple logic vice effort to support any claims of Pocic being misused as a "pattern". Go Hawks

[NorthHawk]

Point...counterpoint gets a bit old but its off season so why not? Just because you draft a center to "groom" for competition and eventual starting doesn't mean you put him in when your starting center is performing well...a good incumbent has a knack of keeping his job when faced by a rookie...so once again I'll state that while your team is "waiting" for the rookie to WIN the position you have him in a back-up role and injury fill in. The more positions a player can be back up for the more valuable the player (He wasn't going to forget how to play center...every training camp and practice gets a player better prepared for when they become "next man up".

Many players leave a team for a different team who offers a better chance to start or offers reasons a player desires another team...its called free agency and the Players Union didn't want players "shackled" to the team drafting them...minimizes hold outs for bargaining most of the time.

"A real chance tp play?" He was our solid starter for two out of the 4 seasons we had him under contract. Simple logic vice effort to support any claims of Pocic being misused as a "pattern". Go Hawks

Right. They didn't play him at Center. Now he's in Cleveland on a 3 year contract. Playing Center.
We have done this far too often with the OL. Just look at the players we got ready to start then discarded. To name a few: Carpenter, Glowinski, and Ifedi (ruined his career by playing him out of position) not to mention Pocic.
The point is we give up on players far too early or just don't let them develop at one position. We almost did the same with Lewis by moving him from RG to LG and if the pattern holds we won't re-sign him after this contract is over.
So I'm hoping Olu who is a pure Center can stop the carousel in the middle of the OL and maybe we can get some stability there for the first time in a long time.

[tarlhawk]

hehe I see our "record" is stuck (keeps skipping on the "we didn't play him at center" track...instead of the narrative he finally won the center position in 2020 and maintained the starting center position in 2021...so starting as CENTER his final two seasons out of his 4 yr contract...means he didn't get to play center?? Oh well...I'll leave you at that.

[tarlhawk]

Olu "lasted" into the 5th round because of the current emphasis for athletic centers in outside zone blocking schemes...but what makes a center the glue that improves the O-line as a whole? The Combine is no place to "measure" the football IQ and any emphasis on cerebral abilities of a center. Whether pass pro or run blocking (shedding off double teaming with guard)...into LB/Safety zone with effective seal blocks that "spring a runner free" Olu shows his football IQ and instincts in being a "wall" in pass pro and the dynamic chess piece in inside zone blocking. Next to QB itself the unmeasured cerebral football IQ of a center is a key element often undervalued. His awards on a national level (Rimington and Outland Awards) reflect the IQ that elevates the full use of his given athleticism. Olu is a gem being available in the 5th! Go Hawks

[NorthHawk]

Lots of Centers are drafted late and do well. I'm of the impression that he wasn't their first choice, but he was on their list of Centers they would be happy selecting.

[tarlhawk]

Lots of Centers are drafted late and do well. I'm of the impression that he wasn't their first choice, but he was on their list of Centers they would be happy selecting.

Your impression is probably accurate. I suspect John Michael Schmitz as a top 30 visitor was tops on their center board...but they prized their top 4 actual selections (Spoon/JSN/Hall/Charbonnet) more...and no way Schmitz was gonna last till the 3rd rd. I think Evan Brown allowed them not to "reach" to get Schmitz...and having Olu available at his drafted spot allows Evan to push Olu before becoming a valuable backup at either center or guard...win/win. Good fortune has a knack of favoring the bold while victimizing the timid. Go Hawks

[Oly]

Your impression is probably accurate. I suspect John Michael Schmitz as a top 30 visitor was tops on their center board...but they prized their top 4 actual selections (Spoon/JSN/Hall/Charbonnet) more...

According to that detailed article on Seahawks.com (biased, obviously, but it was either a genuine recap of the day or full of blatant lies) the first three choices were on a very short list of players with first-round grades, and Charbonnet also seemed to be so high on their list that they couldn't overlook him. That fits with your speculation here.

[Old but Slow]

While I do not know if Olu is the best choice or not, but I am just glad that they have addressed the position.

[c_hawkbob]

Me too ObS. While I liked the players we did get early I wasn't happy with this draft until this pick. While maybe not the best potential player at his position or my personal fave, I think he could wind up the bargain of the draft. To be the Outland (best college lineman) and Rimington (best college center) Trophy winner, as well as being a consensus All American is truly remarkable for his draft position. He can't be the best center in college football on the field but still be that poor a pro prospect. And why? Small hands??

It really is analogous to DK falling to the third over a perceived bad 3 cone drill despite an otherwise mind blowing combine.

[RiverDog]

Me too ObS. While I liked the players we did get early I wasn't happy with this draft until this pick. While maybe not the best potential player at his position or my personal fave, I think he could wind up the bargain of the draft. To be the Outland (best college lineman) and Rimington (best college center) Trophy winner, as well as being a consensus All American is truly remarkable for his draft position. He can't be the best center in college football on the field but still be that poor a pro prospect. And why? Small hands??

It really is analogous to DK falling to the third over a perceived bad 3 cone drill despite an otherwise mind blowing combine.

Olu has had some documented struggles on the field against physically bigger opponents, so I don't think it's a fair to say that he fell to the 5th round simply because he has small hands. Here's what B/R had to say about him:

Due to his middling stature, length and power, though, Oluwatimi struggles to root his feet and brace and absorb force when isolated against bigger interior rushers that get into his frame. This causes him to get walked back, pried open or shed too easily. His strike timing against shifty interior rushers can also be late, leaving him vulnerable to losing across his face without enough foot quickness to reliably recover.

However, Oluwatimi struggles to uproot and sustain on base, drive and down blocks against defensive tackles without help, frequently getting stood up, knocked back and shed.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/100 ... 20contract.

While I agree that Olu may turn out to be this draft's bargain (so might a lot of players) and that he's a good value pick, Olu has some significant physical weaknesses that he's going to have to overcome in order to be successful at the next level, assuming that he's able to beat out Evan Brown for the starting job.

[tarlhawk]

Well many of you are doing your best to temper your enthusiasm of this pick. Football IQ and leadership with his team mates are not tangible traits discovered by normal scouting and especially not at a combine. As for scouting reports there are many sources so whatever you're "looking for" can be found. I'll include a little from Pro Football Network of his pros and cons.

Pros:

Sports a wide, dense, and compact frame with great natural leverage.
Assignment-sound blocker who has great awareness of attack angles.
Utilizes great functional power, slabbing opponents with heavy hands and torque.
Has the grip strength to latch and maintain his anchor amidst stress.
Active and alert as a help blocker, and can easily gather defenders stunting across-face.
Has enough mobility to pull in space and seal off defenders with his hip flexibility.

Cons:

Non-elite athlete who lacks overwhelming explosiveness and recovery capacity.
With average length, raw power and displacement capacity aren’t quite elite.
Despite natural leverage, high-cut frame does prevent proper loading in base at times.
Plays tall in space and as a help blocker, and isn’t always able to acquire leverage.

No college football player earned more Team of the Week spots from Pro Football Network than Oluwatimi. Almost every other week, it seemed as though Oluwatimi anchored the TOTW offensive line, with standout performance after standout performance as a Michigan Wolverine.

Most everyone expected Oluwatimi to be a stud at Michigan. It’s what he was at Virginia, for several years before transferring to the Big Ten. In 2022, Oluwatimi came to Michigan with lofty expectations, and he somehow exceeded them. He was a primary force in earning the unit’s second consecutive Joe Moore Award. And for his dominant play week in and week out, he finally won the Rimington — given to the best center in college football. Oluwatimi also won the Outland, given to the best interior lineman on either side of the ball.

Here's the negative assessment :

...But Oluwatimi also lacks elite traits to build around. He’s an above-average athlete at best, who lacks elite knock-back power, and at times struggles to fully load his base with his high-cut frame.

As long as Oluwatimi continues to iron out inconsistencies with his footwork and hands, he can develop into an above-average starter at the NFL level, with some versatility between gap and zone schemes. And he has the experience and necessary utility to provide quality depth in the immediate timeline.

So to sum it up Oluwatimi is short in stature making his body build improvement a low ceiling but his understanding of the position is demonstrated by two of College football's most prestigious awards for a trench warrior giving him a high floor. Usually high floor means a plug and play type player at the NFL level with little chance to attain and develop the high ceiling skills of centers picked before him. Olu is the type of center who will make his fellow O-linemen better and be a steady reliable hand without drawing individual accolades. Olu will make our young developing O-Line continue to grow which will help Geno and his supporting strong cast of play makers. Go Olu Go Hawks

[tarlhawk]

Olu was a stalwart in pass pro for Michigan playing in the Big 10...from Pro football buzz.com:

After season's end Oluwatimi transferred to Michigan where as a senior Oluwatimi saw action in 13 games and played a total of 834 snaps for the Wolverines. He allowed 4 QB hurries, 5 QB hits, and no sacks while playing at center.

Geno will appreciate this guy!

[NorthHawk]

Olu has had some documented struggles on the field against physically bigger opponents, so I don't think it's a fair to say that he fell to the 5th round simply because he has small hands. Here's what B/R had to say about him:

Due to his middling stature, length and power, though, Oluwatimi struggles to root his feet and brace and absorb force when isolated against bigger interior rushers that get into his frame. This causes him to get walked back, pried open or shed too easily. His strike timing against shifty interior rushers can also be late, leaving him vulnerable to losing across his face without enough foot quickness to reliably recover.

However, Oluwatimi struggles to uproot and sustain on base, drive and down blocks against defensive tackles without help, frequently getting stood up, knocked back and shed.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/100 ... 20contract.

While I agree that Olu may turn out to be this draft's bargain (so might a lot of players) and that he's a good value pick, Olu has some significant physical weaknesses that he's going to have to overcome in order to be successful at the next level, assuming that he's able to beat out Evan Brown for the starting job.

I think it can be said about most draft picks along the LoS that they need more time in the weight room and probably better nutrition. But he knows how to play the position in a Pro style Offense and that's a big advantage coming straight from college. It doesn't mean he won't wash out, but it gives us some hope he can be a solid and dependable Center who might have an up side.
Edit: As well, Pete specifically said he likes shorter Centers because he believes it gives them better leverage. I don't know if the leverage part is true, but it could explain why they are comfortable with his stature.

[RiverDog]

There's no doubt that Olu is loaded with intangibles, and I'll mention a couple of more: He's had something like 48 starts at two D1 schools, all at center. That means that he has no injury history to speak of, that he's had to adjust to two different systems, and that he's experienced at diagnosing defenses, all important attributes that could point to a successful career.

But it cuts both ways. Why would someone with such obvious intangible traits as Olu has drop all the way to the 5th round? Are we to believe that the other 31 GM's are a bunch of idiots?

How about we wait until this guy at least wins the starting job, something that is far from a foregone conclusion, before we declare with such certainty that our QB is going to fall in love with him?

[RiverDog]

Edit: As well, Pete specifically said he likes shorter Centers because he believes it gives them better leverage. I don't know if the leverage part is true, but it could explain why they are comfortable with his stature.

Do you think that the fact that Pete's starting quarterback for 10 years was just 5'10" tall might have something to do with his attraction to short centers?

[NorthHawk]

He said that this year.

[c_hawkbob]

Why would someone with such obvious intangible traits as Olu has drop all the way to the 5th round? Are we to believe that the other 31 GM's are a bunch of idiots?

Same reason a HOF DT like John Randle could go undrafted: GM's in the NFL have always been unforgiving of 'undersize' being a trait in linemen. GM's do get it wrong

[RiverDog]

Why would someone with such obvious intangible traits as Olu has drop all the way to the 5th round? Are we to believe that the other 31 GM's are a bunch of idiots?

Same reason a HOF DT like John Randle could go undrafted: GM's in the NFL have always been unforgiving of 'undersize' being a trait in linemen. GM's do get it wrong

Yeah, and so was Sam Mills, Donnie Shell, and Drew Pearson, all HOF inductees. No matter what the subject is, when you're dealing in such large numbers as there is in the NFL draft, there's always going to be exceptions one can point to which would support their argument.

But I would venture a guess that on any player selected at random, the odds that the consensus opinion of the league's GM's is wrong are pretty slim.

[c_hawkbob]

No more slim than the odds of the Rimmington and Outland awards and not just 1st team but consensus All America awards are.

[RiverDog]

No more slim than the odds of the Rimmington and Outland awards and not just 1st team but consensus All America awards are.

If college football awards were a good indicator of NFL success, Tim Tebow, Johnny Manziel, Jamis Winston, Baker Mayfield, and Marcus Mariota all would have been stars.

My point is that we're getting way out ahead of ourselves with regard to Olu. There's a good chance that he might not even start.

[c_hawkbob]

Those are all QB's, totally different animal. I still say that 1- he's the steal of the draft and 2- he's as important to our O-line as our bookend tackles were last year.

[NorthHawk]

I've been saying for years we needed a solid starting Center, but at this point it's only potential. I have high hopes for him, but his play will determine if he's the answer or not.

[Aseahawkfan]

Be nice if this guy turned out to be a great starting center.

[Old but Slow]

Whether or not he starts immediately, he can grow into a serviceable center. Brown will likely start for a few games, but I fully expect that Olu will start by the end. What I value in a pure center is the recognition of defenses to make the right line calls, is assignment correct, and can protect the passer. He does not need to be a great run blocker, just get in the way, and his ability to pick up stunts can be huge.

I like him.

[RiverDog]

Those are all QB's, totally different animal. I still say that 1- he's the steal of the draft and 2- he's as important to our O-line as our bookend tackles were last year.

It's a popularity contest voted on by sportswriters, not an in-depth evaluation of a player's skills that a scout might come up with. If those awards were as meaningful as you claim they are, then why were there 3 centers taken ahead of him?

[c_hawkbob]

Exactly my point: GM's don't always get it right! I'm not bothered as much that he was the 4th center taken as much as how far he fell. The proof will be in the pudding, if he plays comparable to as well as those chosen ahead of him my point will have been proved.

And while The Outland Trophy is sportswriters, The Rimmington and All America teams include coaches and AD's in equal parts.

[RiverDog]

Exactly my point: GM's don't always get it right! I'm not bothered as much that he was the 4th center taken as much as how far he fell. The proof will be in the pudding, if he plays comparable to as well as those chosen ahead of him my point will have been proved.

And while The Outland Trophy is sportswriters, The Rimmington and All America teams include coaches and AD's in equal parts.

No one, and certainly not me, ever said that GM's always get it right. All I said was that they (likely) get it right more often than other so-called gurus. I'll trust their judgment before I'll trust that of sportswriters, college coaches/AD's, et al.

And I agree, Olu's dropping to the 5th round is more of a concern than his being the 4th center taken. My point is that I get the sense that some of us are getting the wagon in front of the horses. Olu is going to have to first win a starting position before we start talking about how he might be the steal of the draft or a hidden gem, and that is far from a foregone conclusion.

[c_hawkbob]

And I get the impression that some among us are just afraid of optimism so they don't get disappointed if things don't work out.

I ain't getting no cart in front of no horse, I'm making my call. As I said the proof will be in the pudding.

[tarlhawk]

Well I made the boast so I'll try to sum it up...Those College Awards are "College Level" with college comparisons. From earlier post: No college football player earned more Team of the Week spots from Pro Football Network than Oluwatimi. In college many players get buzz from week to week...remember their season is shorter. The awards aren't based on projecting players with NFL potential...they are a tool but do give some value to expectations for a high floor value.
NFL is really an exponential jump for demanding actual physical metrics that are a stronger indicator of traits relatable to growth potential better known as "upside".

Physical metrics alone don't define leadership...football IQ...playing speed vice track speed. This is why higher draft selections don't always outperform lower drafted or even undrafted players...hence the label "crap shoot". Improved odds rest with the higher picks...but drafting team/opportunity to start/ability to be coached up are bigger determiners of which draft selections get a handicapped boost.

NFL teams aren't cookie cut for their ability to develop let alone assess the best time to declare a player "ready" to compete at the highest levels (ie "earn" your contract/justify your draft position) Olu seems to have a good head on his shoulders and fairly close to "plug and play" ability...but if Evan Brown holds off the rookie then perhaps Evan is being undervalued. Andy Dickerson will know so I'll be listening to any interviews with Dickerson during training camp/pre-season.

[RiverDog]

And I get the impression that some among us are just afraid of optimism so they don't get disappointed if things don't work out.

I ain't getting no cart in front of no horse, I'm making my call. As I said the proof will be in the pudding.

That's a big part of it, yes. Especially when it involves a 5th round draft pick.

I'd like to at least wait until I see the guy in preseason before I make my call.

[NorthHawk]

I don't have a problem with a Center being drafted later and think he might be a good pick.
Most teams are settled at Center and the top rated went early, so if a player should be rated a late 2nd round pick or early 3rd, he could fall a few rounds because the need for teams isn't there. As well, we see the top athletes going early in drafts, but the Center position is a lot more than that. It's the intellectual part that we don't see or is obvious for the most part. So we could end up with a good player that just fell because that's how the draft went.
But like with any player in the draft, it's still just potential at this point. He has to produce on the field.

[tarlhawk]

Potential is always speculated for any of our offensive/defensive "trench warriors" before the pads come on and our coaches can scrutinize the "pad level" our guys are playing with for leverage...just have to wait for training camp/pre-season.