President Trump

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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:54 pm

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Last edited by RiverDog on Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:59 pm

c_hawkbob wrote:That's actually a fair article as it presents both viewpoints. All I can assume is that you stopped reading before you got to the "but other experts disagree" part when you decided iit was an article in support of your position ..


You assumed wrong. I read the whole thing. I just chose to believe what I did because it made the most sense to me. Just because the article showed differing viewpoints doesn't mean that one can't ascribe to one POV over the other.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:40 pm

LOL. GO Rump Jr. Treason Much??...... Be the DUMBEST F**** on the planet much? LOL


I would love to see an Ostrich love fest over this. Even someone with their head buried in their ass would have to be going WTF dude.....Hahahahahahahahaha.....HA!!!!
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:49 am

2020 campaign slogan. "Take a Dump with Trump".

Of course he won't even make it that far...LOL.
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Re: President Trump

Postby NorthHawk » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:14 am

2020 campaign slogan. "Take a Dump with Trump".

Of course he won't even make it that far...LOL.


Ugh. The though of 8 years...
He has a base in the Republican party that will take a strong candidate who is willing to challenge a sitting President.
Not sure if they have someone who could at this point.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:22 am

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/comm ... mg00000313

This article is from Dallas. This paper supported a democrat for president for the first time in 75 years.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:38 am

I see no way Trump is re elected if he makes it that far. At this point in the scandal he's less popular than Nixon and Nixon was gone a little over a year later. His base is down to 36 % and only 20% strongly approve of him although in "Trump Country" deep red states he apparently is sitting at 50% overall approval according to certain polls. But these were states he won easily in November.

I know the voters with their low information quotient and short attention span are tired of the Russia thing but it doesn't matter what they think. Its what Mueller and his prosecutors think and I suspect with bombshells like Trump Jrs multiple explanations for his damning Emails and meeting there is oh so much more to come. When guys like Shep Smith and Chris Wallace go ballistic on Faux over his web of lies and bizarre behavior its clear even his willing Pravda network is starting to play CYA which will doom him if it accelerates. Faux is where his 36% comes from. Flipping from any other network to Faux its like a parallel universe.

Now it looks like repeal and replace is done for and he's blaming those in his own party when its his own bizarre tweeting and intellectual laziness coupled with his dishonesty about everything that was the main factor. Whatever one thinks of Obama care Barack Obama skillfully negotiated it over a year plus with open hearings and an ability to eloquently articulate his vision of what the bill would accomplish. And he was widely considered aloof and standoffish towards the legislature. Trump is a disaster as a supposed dealmaker. The only deals he's making are apparently with Russia. Like Lindsay Graham said a couple of weeks ago "if you expect this President to have your back you better watch it".

I think by Nov 2018 Trump will be at about 20% approval when tax reform stalls as Republican lawmakers and voters flee him in panic. I know this lifelong Republican is voting straight ticket democrat even though I agree with very little of their ideology unless trump has resigned or been removed from office before the midterms. If a broken glass Republican like me feels this way I cant be alone.
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Re: President Trump

Postby burrrton » Tue Jul 18, 2017 1:54 pm

Now it looks like repeal and replace is done for and he's blaming those in his own party when its his own bizarre tweeting and intellectual laziness coupled with his dishonesty about everything that was the main factor. Whatever one thinks of Obama care Barack Obama skillfully negotiated it over a year plus with open hearings and an ability to eloquently articulate his vision of what the bill would accomplish.


Holy sh*t.

Yes, let's review a partial list of all these hallmarks of the honest and eloquent passage of a bill:

* "John, I won."
* "If you like your doctor, you can *keep* your doctor. PERIOD."
* "If you like your plan, you can keep your plan."
* "We have to pass the bill to find out what's in it."
* Louisiana Purchase
* Cornhusker Kickback
* Google: Jonathan Gruber
* On and on and on and on and on

That piece of sh*t legislation was the most dishonestly argued and passed bill in recent history, and it cost Dems the country. YES, this may very well do the same thing to Republicans, but portraying how O'care was passed as some paragon of virtue is *literally* laughable.

And for the record, I think the Rs may have it coming- once handouts are in place, you can't just yank them away especially when they pertain to health insurance. People plan their lives around such things, so once the cat's out of the bag, you've got your work cut out for you fixing it.

I doubt they as a party are up to it.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:57 pm

burrrton wrote:And for the record, I think the Rs may have it coming- once handouts are in place, you can't just yank them away especially when they pertain to health insurance. People plan their lives around such things, so once the cat's out of the bag, you've got your work cut out for you fixing it.

I doubt they as a party are up to it.


That's my sentiments exactly. I didn't like Obama Care, and it's failed predecessor, Hillary Care, for many of the reasons noted in Burr's post above. But once it was approved and made the law of the land, I oppose going back on the government's word, at least not with such short notice. If they are going to repeal it, at least make it effective in 2020 or 2022.

Speaking as a person only a few months away from retirement himself, once you hit 55 years old, you start projecting out potential revenues and expenses and try to figure out a retirement date. The biggest single item on the budgetary list is insurance premiums, especially if you want to retire before age 65, or pre-Medicare. If you knew 5-6 years ago that Obama Care wasn't going to be around to cover that gap, you might not have made the same decision. It's not like when you were 35 or 40 and can decide on a completely different tact if the rug is pulled out from underneath of you. We can't be moving the goal posts every 4 years.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:37 am

burrrton wrote:Now it looks like repeal and replace is done for and he's blaming those in his own party when its his own bizarre tweeting and intellectual laziness coupled with his dishonesty about everything that was the main factor. Whatever one thinks of Obama care Barack Obama skillfully negotiated it over a year plus with open hearings and an ability to eloquently articulate his vision of what the bill would accomplish.


Holy sh*t.

Yes, let's review a partial list of all these hallmarks of the honest and eloquent passage of a bill:

* "John, I won."
* "If you like your doctor, you can *keep* your doctor. PERIOD."
* "If you like your plan, you can keep your plan."
* "We have to pass the bill to find out what's in it."
* Louisiana Purchase
* Cornhusker Kickback
* Google: Jonathan Gruber
* On and on and on and on and on

That piece of sh*t legislation was the most dishonestly argued and passed bill in recent history, and it cost Dems the country. YES, this may very well do the same thing to Republicans, but portraying how O'care was passed as some paragon of virtue is *literally* laughable.

And for the record, I think the Rs may have it coming- once handouts are in place, you can't just yank them away especially when they pertain to health insurance. People plan their lives around such things, so once the cat's out of the bag, you've got your work cut out for you fixing it.

I doubt they as a party are up to it.

I said "whatever you think of obamacare". Personally I hated and still hate the law.I hate that politicians lie remorselessly and people get duped into voting for these slimeballs.Not me I voted for the honest guy Johnson. I don't agree Obamacare specifically cost the Dems the country. Obamas 8 years of malaise and condescension of the leadership role of our nation is what did that. Obama created an atmosphere where the current jackass could get votes from fed up people.

What I meant by skill regarding Obama is that he stayed on message throughout, dishonest as the talking points were. He gave many many eloquent speeches detailing the bill and sounded knowledgeable.
He was able to get enough democrats to pass it with no Republican support too.

As for Trump he spoke in choppy half sentences calling the R and R bill great, wonderful, saying everyone will have great healthcare and it will be cheaper, something that is just mathematically impossible.He is too dense to get into the particulars of any legislative idea. He has made so many conflicting statements regarding health care just in the last few days its mind boggling.

But the most telling statement a month or so ago was him saying "I thought it would be easy" I never thought it would be so hard". He held a Rose garden ceremony to take a victory lap and celebrate passage of the original repeal and replace in the house and 2 weeks later called it mean tossing every congressman under the bus. Then the early morning tweets all over the map about blood and women etc don't help at all. Now he says he "doesn't own it" regarding the failure when of course he does but never admits any mistake.

He tweeted the evening it was scrapped that they would work with democrats then the following morning that we should just let Obamacare fail and do nothing. His repeal only idea was immediately deep sixed by 4 moderate women. This isn't surprising given his leering and inappropriate comments to female reporters, media people and even the french first lady right in front of Melania. Who wants to stake their political future and reputation on this koo koo for cocoa puffs nutbag?

The party is a headless horseman. With the collapse of repeal and replace Trumps loyal media supporters are beginning to flee as well. Along with Faux anchors Wallace and smith Neil Cavuto recently told the president in an op ed commentary he and he alone is to blame for his and his administrations problems. Today I clicked on ultra conservative Drudge report and saw all negative Trump stories for the first time since he announced his candidacy.
Last night Andrew Napolitano said on Faux that Jrs meeting has "possibly the elements of a felony". He has previously been an absolute shill for Trump. Chris Christie said this morning the meeting was "unethical and probably illegal."
The rats are jumping off the sinking ship. When Trump loses Faux he is toast and its happening.

The republicans made a deal with the devil by hiring a man whom many believed lacked the temperament and judgement to be president but they still pulled the lever due to the unpalatable democratic alternative. They sold out for a conservative agenda.

Now that he cant deliver beyond executive orders the trajectory of his presidency is doomed. If he flubs tax reform he's absolutely toast and will be impeached by Republicans prior to 2018 for the Russia thing etc.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Wed Jul 19, 2017 12:24 pm

Hawktawk wrote:Now that he cant deliver beyond executive orders the trajectory of his presidency is doomed. If he flubs tax reform he's absolutely toast and will be impeached by Republicans prior to 2018 for the Russia thing etc.


I don't get how you are linking his legislative failures with impeachment. The whole impeachment thing hinges on the outcome of the Mueller investigation, which if I had to guess, won't result in impeachment proceedings.

Next to his inane tweets and off the rails behavior, Trump's biggest problem has been his lack of experience in government. You're right, despite having a majority in Congress, the only thing he's been able to do is implement a few executive orders. It's going pretty much the way I expected, and why I wasn't nearly as alarmed over a Trump presidency as you and some of our other friends are.

In some ways, Donald Trump reminds me of Jimmy Carter, an outsider that could never work with the legislative branch even though his party held a majority in both houses. Like Trump, Carter was unconventional in his dealings with Congress, showed little interest in negotiating and compromise, and eventually succeeded in splitting his party wide open and lost his bid for reelection in the process. I suspect that Trump will suffer the same fate.
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Re: President Trump

Postby burrrton » Wed Jul 19, 2017 12:41 pm

Speaking as a person only a few months away from retirement himself, once you hit 55 years old, you start projecting out potential revenues and expenses and try to figure out a retirement date. The biggest single item on the budgetary list is insurance premiums, especially if you want to retire before age 65, or pre-Medicare. If you knew 5-6 years ago that Obama Care wasn't going to be around to cover that gap, you might not have made the same decision. It's not like when you were 35 or 40 and can decide on a completely different tact if the rug is pulled out from underneath of you.


I don't know as much about whatever the h3ll the current bill is (or even if there is one anymore), but every previous Obamacare/Medicare fix I can recall had baked in coverage for people approaching retirement.

Any repeal or drop/change in coverage was on a sliding scale- the closer you were to retiring, the less of an effect it had on you.

In other words, you wouldn't have seen an iota of change, and I might have had a chance for it to still be around when I retire (which it assuredly will *not* be unless drastic measures are taken).
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:31 pm

I'm in that gap now. Almost 65 and O-Care has been there several times to help both my wife and I out (were both 64). Started getting SS benefits a couple years ago so out payments haven't been bad at all.

The pubbies are really looking like fools this summer. Repeal?, and replace with nothing?

These guys had better enjoy their last days in office because people are listening and they will speak with heads rolling.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:28 pm

burrrton wrote:I don't know as much about whatever the h3ll the current bill is (or even if there is one anymore), but every previous Obamacare/Medicare fix I can recall had baked in coverage for people approaching retirement.

Any repeal or drop/change in coverage was on a sliding scale- the closer you were to retiring, the less of an effect it had on you.

In other words, you wouldn't have seen an iota of change, and I might have had a chance for it to still be around when I retire (which it assuredly will *not* be unless drastic measures are taken).


I honestly don't know much about what kind of coverage was available via ObamaCare for a person in my predicament, ie 60-65 years old and close to retiring. I am eligible for an employer sponsored retiree medical plan so ObamaCare wasn't an option that I was considering to carry me until I'm eligible for Medicare. I was speaking in the generalities of "moving the goal posts" for those like me that are close to retirement and have irreversible decisions to make. I had retired and chosen to go with ObamaCare and the government suddenly dropped my coverage, I would not have been able to return to my company sponsored plan.

I had one retirement strategy that I was considering regarding social security, that I was going to draw 50% spousal benefits while deferring my own, but Obama and the Republican congress changed the rules on it a couple years ago, causing me to have to change strategies. I might not be working today if they hadn't changed that rule. But I'm not complaining. They need to do something to prop up social security, and that change seems reasonable.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:48 pm

Largent80 wrote:These guys had better enjoy their last days in office because people are listening and they will speak with heads rolling.


Don't count your chickens before they hatch. 15 months ago, I heard many a person laugh at the Republicans after it became apparent that Trump was going to win their nomination. Those same people aren't laughing anymore.
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Re: President Trump

Postby burrrton » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:46 pm

I had retired and chosen to go with ObamaCare and the government suddenly dropped my coverage, I would not have been able to return to my company sponsored plan.


I'm with ya- my point is, any changes I heard about weren't going to affect someone like you an *iota*, as it should be.

I had one retirement strategy that I was considering regarding social security, that I was going to draw 50% spousal benefits while deferring my own, but Obama and the Republican congress changed the rules on it a couple years ago, causing me to have to change strategies. I might not be working today if they hadn't changed that rule. But I'm not complaining. They need to do something to prop up social security, and that change seems reasonable.


Yeah, SS is a different animal- small course corrections are all that's needed, and yeah, they probably won't be a problem for most, even recent (or impending) retirees- we just need people to quit demagogueing the ever-loving fck out of those corrections and we can get there.

If we don't, people currently on it or soon entering it will see a sudden 100% cease in coverage (due to bankruptcy) and people my age who didn't plan for it not being there (unlike me) will be screwed.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:56 pm

burrrton wrote:Yeah, SS is a different animal- small course corrections are all that's needed, and yeah, they probably won't be a problem for most, even recent (or impending) retirees- we just need people to quit demagogueing the ever-loving fck out of those corrections and we can get there.

If we don't, people currently on it or soon entering it will see a sudden 100% cease in coverage (due to bankruptcy) and people my age who didn't plan for it not being there (unlike me) will be screwed.


Anyone that's 50 or younger that's counting on anything from SS being available by the time they retire should have their heads examined. It's doomed to failure. The ratio of worker to retiree has been dropping steadily and is expected to keep dropping for the foreseeable future. Between it and Medicare, it's either going to require a very large payroll tax increase or a very large reduction of benefits, neither of which will be politically popular, to keep it afloat. You young'uns need to be contributing a minimum of 15% to your 401K's or IRA's.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:02 am

^^^^ How about NOT spending multiple billions of dollars on the military? How about cutting the salaries of congress and house members who simply vote against the other party to keep things from happening?

The money is always there. The govt. just does an excellent job of telling you it isn't while they forge ahead with their agendas.

Like I said before, Rump getting elected and the comedy show and embarrasment that has ensued is exactly what was needed to wake people up. Yes, there will be idiots like Ostrich out there that will always be idiots, but guys like the dinasaur McConnel's days are numbered.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:10 am

RiverDog wrote:Now that he cant deliver beyond executive orders the trajectory of his presidency is doomed. If he flubs tax reform he's absolutely toast and will be impeached by Republicans prior to 2018 for the Russia thing etc.


I don't get how you are linking his legislative failures with impeachment. The whole impeachment thing hinges on the outcome of the Mueller investigation, which if I had to guess, won't result in impeachment proceedings.

Next to his inane tweets and off the rails behavior, Trump's biggest problem has been his lack of experience in government. You're right, despite having a majority in Congress, the only thing he's been able to do is implement a few executive orders. It's going pretty much the way I expected, and why I wasn't nearly as alarmed over a Trump presidency as you and some of our other friends are.

In some ways, Donald Trump reminds me of Jimmy Carter, an outsider that could never work with the legislative branch even though his party held a majority in both houses. Like Trump, Carter was unconventional in his dealings with Congress, showed little interest in negotiating and compromise, and eventually succeeded in splitting his party wide open and lost his bid for reelection in the process. I suspect that Trump will suffer the same fate.


Carter? Carter was incompetent but looks like a political wizard compared to this crackpot fiasco. And he was a prince as a human being. It's a horrible analogy and an insult to Carter to be compared to this white casino trash vulgarian. there's never been a guy like him disgracing the oval office and I hope we survive 4 years or hopefully much less.

I've said it many times RD, if I'm ever on trial for a crime I want you as my jury foreman, its how leniently and open mindedly you view wrongdoing.

Follow along. First of all there is already enough stuff for impeachment proceedings to begin immediately IMO and several Dems already have filed articles.
Yes its democrats but even they aren't frivolous enough to want to look idiotic making unfounded charges.There's something very dark about the russia thing.

I wont get carpal tunnel detailing all of it but it is clear there was collusion based on Jrs meeting and the subsequent Email chain. Is that a crime? Likely according now to some of Trumps steadfast SUPPORTERS and I believe its only the TIP OF AN ICEBERG.

Reading the tea leaves on Mueller's appointments which are heavily loaded with guys with money laundering and financial improprieties experience its clear the real story is likely financial improprieties between Trump and Russia over a long period of time, perhaps involving billions of dollars. One of the mystery guests at the meeting with the ever evolving narrative was a US citizen from Russia who was responsible for setting up approximately 2000 phony accounts to launder russian money through US firms.

Just last night Trump gave an interview where he trashed Sessions for recusing himself from the investigation and threatened Mueller not to go after his families finances. He addressed the salacious dossier about he and russian hookers playing golden showers on film saying it was "phony junk" and that Comey had dangled it over his head to keep his job.Why keep bringing that up?

Nobody acts more like they are under Russia's thumb than Trump which is absolutely chilling to me and I am mystified why its not 100% of America that finds it unacceptable.

The connection to legislation is that with a Republican majority you are correct they are not currently inclined to impeach but it is when they see the guy cannot deliver on their agenda and his rock bottom poll numbers are destroying their chance to hold a majority they will move on him with the cover of impropriety and fitness for office.

I believe when Mueller moves in and starts indicting people such as his son and son in law, former campaign chairman Manafort, former NSA advisor Flynn etc even they will have had enough at some point and he will in fact be impeached.
Time will tell but the story is picking up speed every day.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:10 am

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/ ... id=UE07DHP
More dancing around the edge of obstruction of justice. What a guilty of all of it sleaze ball. I will have a party when this MF goes down.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:14 am

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/ ... id=UE07DHP
Maybe the low information don't give a crap voters are unconcerned but those who know the best certainly are more and more all the time.

There's something sinister here, like our President is a Manchurian candidate, an actual Russian agent.
We have never been in more peril than with this Kremlin loving nut job in the WH.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:36 am

And the comedy continues. Rump will have "Made in America week". While he has a company based in China that makes his line of ties, and a majority of his fake daughters clothing line.

So much source material for guys like Colbert, Oliver, and Maher. You seriously could't make up a better real life comedy/tragedy than this Dolt.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... businesses
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Re: President Trump

Postby NorthHawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:57 am

Hawktawk wrote:http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trumps-embrace-of-russia-raises-concerns-with-top-advisers/ar-AAou5w8?ocid=UE07DHP
Maybe the low information don't give a crap voters are unconcerned but those who know the best certainly are more and more all the time.

There's something sinister here, like our President is a Manchurian candidate, an actual Russian agent.
We have never been in more peril than with this Kremlin loving nut job in the WH.


Codename: Agent Orange

I've been on the business dealings thing for his downfall from the start. There's just too much stuff he and his family is avoiding and too much love for Russia and Putin for any person who has no involvement with them.
He obviously wants to be a dictator (he yearns for a military parade down a main avenue in Washington, ruling by decree, vilifying the press, etc.) and seems to have little patience for the due process of a democratic society.
It's good to have someone from outside the political arena come in, but they have to respect the systems that have been in place for a couple of hundred years that protect freedoms and democracy from those that want to destroy it.

Ultimately the Constitution and rules will win as time isn't on his side, but he can do some damage while he's in office. Let's hope the Republicans can find their moral compass and stand up for what they have traditionally believed in rather than
an expedient path to cling to power.
That's what it's really all about. Attaining power and holding on to it, but all politics has that element.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:09 am

Largent80 wrote:And the comedy continues. Rump will have "Made in America week". While he has a company based in China that makes his line of ties, and a majority of his fake daughters clothing line.

So much source material for guys like Colbert, Oliver, and Maher. You seriously could't make up a better real life comedy/tragedy than this Dolt.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... businesses


I don't agree with your politics much Largent buy I'm 100 percent in agreement on this.
Don't forget the Chinese steel in all his buildings but now he makes an executive order that American builders must use American steel.
Do as I say not as I do in almost every aspect of his life. The man has no shame.
How stupid must people be to buy this line of crap from this remorseless serial liar?
The truth of this administration is stranger than fiction because there is almost no truth whatever and 30 something % of Americans don't care.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:19 am

Breaking news today that Mueller has indeed launched an investigation into the Trump organizations business dealings. He's going down I'm telling you. Jr's idiotic use of an unsecured Email to discuss collusion and say he "loves it" demonstrates an incredible carelessness and lack of common sense. These ham fisted arrogant people have trampled the law in their greed and lust for power. There will be plenty of things to uncover.
Its already been reported they have skirted the laws and manipulated their *charities* for personal gain. If they will do that so carelessly what wouldn't they do? Answer? nothing.....
They are going down.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:57 am

Largent80 wrote:^^^^ How about NOT spending multiple billions of dollars on the military? How about cutting the salaries of congress and house members who simply vote against the other party to keep things from happening?

The money is always there. The govt. just does an excellent job of telling you it isn't while they forge ahead with their agendas.


Defense spending pales in comparison to entitlement programs, like Social Security, Medicare, and Medicade. Entitlements make up 63% of the budget. Government pensions ALONE take up a bigger share of the pie (25%) than does defense (22%). Plus a lot of that defense spending comes back to the government coffers in the form of defense related jobs, with hundreds of thousands of workers paying taxes back into the system and staying off unemployment.

Cutting Congressional salaries makes for good PR, but it does next to nothing in solving our budgetary crisis.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:05 am

Hawktawk wrote:Carter? Carter was incompetent but looks like a political wizard compared to this crackpot fiasco. And he was a prince as a human being. It's a horrible analogy and an insult to Carter to be compared to this white casino trash vulgarian. there's never been a guy like him disgracing the oval office and I hope we survive 4 years or hopefully much less.


I am simply noting some similarities between Trump and Carter. I am not saying that they are exactly alike. As you have noted, there are many more dissimilarities between the two than there are things that they have in common.

Like I said before, I'm waiting until Mueller finishes his investigation and presents his report before I pass judgement on any potential impeachment proceedings. You seem to be jumping the gun. However, I will say that he's turning over some interesting stones. I like the way he's going about his business.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:26 am

River Dog. I served in the military. I've seen where the money goes, and if you believe numbers thrown out there for the public to look at then you are naive.

The money is there for us to take care of our own people. There are other places to pull money from that I didn't even mention and wouldn't bother to anyway. As I have said in other threads, I'm not here to try and change anyones minds or to prop myself up on a pedestal professing to know everything. But what I do know is the government takes in way more money than what they say, sound like many wealthy people?
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Re: President Trump

Postby c_hawkbob » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:35 pm

Largent80 wrote:^^^^ How about NOT spending multiple billions of dollars on the military? How about cutting the salaries of congress and house members who simply vote against the other party to keep things from happening?

The money is always there. The govt. just does an excellent job of telling you it isn't while they forge ahead with their agendas.


RiverDog wrote:Defense spending pales in comparison to entitlement programs, like Social Security, Medicare, and Medicade. Entitlements make up 63% of the budget. Government pensions ALONE take up a bigger share of the pie (25%) than does defense (22%). Plus a lot of that defense spending comes back to the government coffers in the form of defense related jobs, with hundreds of thousands of workers paying taxes back into the system and staying off unemployment.

Cutting Congressional salaries makes for good PR, but it does next to nothing in solving our budgetary crisis.


Many of the "entitlement programs" are self funding (SS for instance) whereas the military is not at all self funding so total expenditures is not a valid comparison.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:37 pm

c_hawkbob wrote:Many of the "entitlement programs" are self funding (SS for instance) whereas the military is not at all self funding so total expenditures is not a valid comparison.


Very true.

But I was using the percent of budgetary expenditures to illustrate just how expensive these entitlement programs are. Simply slashing the defense budget and plowing the savings back into entitlement programs is not going to do the trick. Besides, in addition to the economic impacts large defense cuts would have, given the current world situation, I'm not real comfortable cutting defense.

There's only two ways to remedy the situation, at least as it applies to SS and Medicare: A massive tax increase or a massive reduction in benefits. They aren't going to be self funding much longer.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:05 pm

Wow big news day today. White House council spokesman resigns and hrs later news breaks that trumps legal team is exploring his ability to pardon associates, relatives and even HIMSELF!!!!!
Same lawyers are digging for dirt on muellers hires looking for stuff like political contributions to democrats. Of course that's who trump was contributing to until recently however.

Also reported that the money laundering investigation in New York City real estate of fired by trump prosecutor Preet Baraha has been absorbed by mueller . It's getting ugly for Donald Dump.mf is going down and the sooner the better.
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Re: President Trump

Postby NorthHawk » Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:42 am

What a mess.
The aspect of pardons for even himself looks like a possible way to avoid penalties or maybe as far as subvert justice.
If you can believe it, it might get even rougher than it is today.
Hold onto your hats!
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Re: President Trump

Postby c_hawkbob » Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:21 am

Now even Spicer, his right hand liar, has said 'no mas' ... I wonder how much of a fool he's feeling like he's been played for now.
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Re: President Trump

Postby burrrton » Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:30 am

Many of the "entitlement programs" are self funding (SS for instance)


Not sure about the "many" part. While we do pay into Medicare, that contribution can be realistically disregarded because we consume far, FAR more than we contribute (unless you die young).

SS *is* different than the others, but without tweaking, it doesn't come *close* to 'self-funding', either. SS is the one that would be easy (well, easiER) to fix, but that would require people to quit claiming anyone who proposes a tweak is "throwing Granny off a cliff". You think pols on either side of this sh*t-show are going to drop the demagoguery?

It won't happen- if you're under 40 or so, don't plan on seeing a red cent of Medicare or SS money.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:57 pm

burrrton wrote:Not sure about the "many" part. While we do pay into Medicare, that contribution can be realistically disregarded because we consume far, FAR more than we contribute (unless you die young).

SS *is* different than the others, but without tweaking, it doesn't come *close* to 'self-funding', either. SS is the one that would be easy (well, easiER) to fix, but that would require people to quit claiming anyone who proposes a tweak is "throwing Granny off a cliff". You think pols on either side of this sh*t-show are going to drop the demagoguery?

It won't happen- if you're under 40 or so, don't plan on seeing a red cent of Medicare or SS money.


I'm surprised that they haven't raised the minimum age for Medicare from 65 to 67 as they've done with Social Security, although that's not a long term fix, more like kicking the can down the road.
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:40 am

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Re: President Trump

Postby Hawktawk » Sun Jul 23, 2017 5:15 am

Outgoing NSA director James Clapper said as I have previously quoted "Watergate pales in comparison to the Russian scandal". He said it based on things he knew that he could not disclose and he said it months ago.

Hey 36% ers if there really are that many of you left. Is it OK if Drumph has been propped up in his business by Russian oligarchs to the tune of possibly billions in laundered money over decades at the direction of Vlad Putin? That he is possibly bought and paid for so completely that he will buck every single member of his cabinet including guys like Gen Mattis, HR McMaster etc, every foreign ally, to suck up to the ruthless killer leading Americas sworn enemy, as Romney so correctly stated our "greatest geopolitical foe" in 2012 debates.

Do you wonder why Trump has gone ballistic as the investigation has gone from collusion to influence peddling and outright corruption on a previously unheard of scale? By ballistic I mean encouraging his recused AG to resign by publicly trashing him in a naked attempt to install someone who will fire Bob Mueller since Rod Rosenstein wont. By ballistic I mean talking to his attorneys about how much pardoning authority he has. Then after they have denied he discussed it he tweets "everyone agrees the president has ultimate authority to pardon". That's what I mean by ballistic.
36%ers is it OK if our president was careless and depraved enough to wind up on film playing golden showers with Russian Hookers in a Moscow hotel? Naw trump is too wise and prudent and careful to ever do something like that.....Plus as he said at the time "im a germaphobe"
Is all this OK with you? hey make America Great again right?

Peering into the wide open by tweet mind of this raging lunatic is truly a frightening grotesque sight. Even more frightening is the level of apathy and resignation in the mind of the masses who installed this utter piece of human refuse in the WH. Savvy? Monkey, Hello?
America has never been in greater peril.
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Re: President Trump

Postby RiverDog » Sun Jul 23, 2017 9:20 am

Hawktawk wrote:America has never been in greater peril.


I'm going to submit three dates without comment:

October 24th, 1929

December 7th, 1941

September 11th, 2001
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Re: President Trump

Postby Largent80 » Sun Jul 23, 2017 1:51 pm

Money...aka Ostrich can't see or hear anything because when the s*** started hitting the fan he buried his head.
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Re: President Trump

Postby burrrton » Sun Jul 23, 2017 2:39 pm

RiverDog wrote:I'm surprised that they haven't raised the minimum age for Medicare from 65 to 67 as they've done with Social Security, although that's not a long term fix, more like kicking the can down the road.


Yeah, incremental steps like that could help a lot, especially if coupled with means testing (sorry, it's going to have to happen). Problem is: as soon as anyone mentions it, the "UR LITERALLY MURDERING PEOPLE" press conferences and campaign commercials start.
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