The MEMO

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The MEMO

Postby Seahawks4Ever » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:02 pm

One big nothingburger. Rep. Nunes needs to resign so he can go to work for the Trump Admin. officially.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby burrrton » Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:08 pm

Predictably, it was WAY oversold by Republicans, and WAY undersold by Dems.
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'We Are Doing Putin's Job For Him'

Postby c_hawkbob » Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:43 pm

“The latest attacks against the FBI and Department of Justice serve no American interests ― no party’s, no President’s, only Putin’s. The American people deserve to know all the facts surrounding Russia’s ongoing efforts to subvert our democracy, which is why Special Counsel Mueller’s investigation must proceed unimpeded. Our nation’s elected officials, including the president, must stop looking at this investigation through the lens of politics and manufacturing political sideshows. If we continue to undermine our own rule of law, we are doing Putin’s job for him.”


-- Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.)
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Re: The MEMO

Postby Largent80 » Sat Feb 03, 2018 6:20 am

McCain is spot ON.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby burrrton » Sat Feb 03, 2018 1:05 pm

And there's *no question* the Mueller probe should continue.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby Aseahawkfan » Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:17 pm

What a clown show in D.C. People have to be looking across the pond wondering how America became the most powerful nation in the world. If this is not a signal that we are on the decline, I don't know what is.

We elected a reality TV star as our president. We allowed a dirty politician like Hilary Clinton to push an agenda of this reality TV star as some Russian puppet. One party is so focused on continuing the narrative of Russian interference in our elections that they are willing to waste massive amounts of time and money to find out Trump had very little to do with Russia and that Russia's effect on this election was minimal. We have a reality TV star that wants everything he does to be the greatest. He fights back at everything from his diet to the accusations to his hand size or inauguration crowd size because he triggered by just about any criticism directed at him like some ignorant child (one that I guess is a Russian spy/puppet). The two biggest parties are in engaged in games of oneupmanship to make the other look like corrupt idiots. They are both succeeding because so many of them are corrupt idiots. It's all so ridiculous I doubt a fiction writer could come up with this crap. It's embarrassing as an American. Both of these parties and their leading candidates are an embarrassment to this nation.

This country is becoming ridiculous. Even the last president Obama getting a Nobel Peace Prize's for having African ancestry and dark skin was stupid as he signed more drone assassinations, allowed North Korea to build a nuclear arsenal, and handled the Middle East situation in a poor fashion. We're just getting more and more idiocy with each new candidate.

Bush Jr. and his stupid speeches and general ineptitude.

When is the last time we had a truly competent leader in The White House. Eisenhower? FDR? It's hard to believe we have become this powerful with presidents based more on style and creative campaigning than competence. Where did all the great leaders go? Has winning the White House become something no competent person wants? I imagine too much of a microscope on your life for too little return for the truly high performing individuals in our society. They're too busy running businesses or doing other more personally rewarding things than manipulating the masses of ignorant voters and engaging in slimy politics to make other people look bad because they don't have enough going for them to look good.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby burrrton » Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:33 pm

When is the last time we had a truly competent leader in The White House.


Huh? Whether you agreed with their policies or not, Obama was competent, GWB was competent, Clinton was competent... I could go on.

I'm also not so sure I'd call Trump incompetent so much as I'd call him embarrassing (in his inability to resist responding to every slight like a spurned child).

He may prove me wrong, though- we'll see.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby Aseahawkfan » Sat Feb 03, 2018 6:49 pm

burrrton wrote:Huh? Whether you agreed with their policies or not, Obama was competent, GWB was competent, Clinton was competent... I could go on.

I'm also not so sure I'd call Trump incompetent so much as I'd call him embarrassing (in his inability to resist responding to every slight like a spurned child).

He may prove me wrong, though- we'll see.


What you and I consider competent differs. Those presidents were tolerable, but not what I consider highly competent. A bunch of facemen able to handle talking to the press. I guess that is all Americans need any longer to be considered "competent." Some of their cabinet members were good, just as Trump's are good while the men themselves are in over their heads.

After our back and forth, you should know we look for different traits in our leaders and where this nation should be taken. I am quite tired of being "leader of the free world" and other such foolish monikers that somehow force us to act like a world military/charity trying to defeat every villainous regime, right every wrong, take in every suffering human and their child, and the like. I see plenty of nations staying uninvolved in such affairs doing quite well, while we waste tons of money, lives, and time trying to control the globe under the guise of benevolent leadership because there are Americans like yourself that consider controlling the Middle East as "saving the world" because "oil." That is the type of logic that doesn't hold a bit of water given plenty of nations prosper fine without involving themselves militarily in the Middle East. The Middle East is willing to do business without that involvement because you know "money."

At the moment we're trapped in our political associations until the the D.C. politicians start to consider the costs of their global ventures is too costly to the American people in lives and cash, both of which we provide them. Until we can get rid of folks like the majority on this forum that swallowed the control the world propaganda while nations like Germany, Canada, and the Scandinavian nations live just fine without involving themselves militarily and monetarily in global affairs other than to trade, this will not change until we are bankrupt or we finally get to experience Shock and Awe on our homeland.

I'l leave you to your opinion as I imagine after years of justifying the tripe you seem to believe it is unlikely you will ever change your mind on how this nation should be governed. Thus I will hope that I don't get to be the generation that sees the final return on this bankrupt global power policy that ended the Soviet Union and may well end our time as the power nation.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby burrrton » Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:09 pm

I'l leave you to your opinion as I imagine after years of justifying the tripe you seem to believe


The guy peddling isolationism thinks my opinions on our role in the world are "tripe". Neat.

Good talk, asea.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby idhawkman » Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:04 pm

First let me say that I want the democratic memo to come out also without redaction (except for anything that would compromise methods - I don't care about sources at this point). Before anyone criticizes me about the sources, let me explain: Any U.S. citizen that helped the Russians or any other entity illegally influence our elections should be outed. Same and even more strongly for any foreigner such as Steele. I really don't care what happens to them by being exposed in this regard.

Second, What McCain said is just stupid. Releasing that memo to the American people so they could see what their government is doing is not doing Putin's work. If anyone is to blame it is the idiots that pulled this crap, not the poeple who are exposing it. I am looking past McCain's comments because he is under medical care and may not be in control of his faculties.

Third, this president is not going to fall for the same game that the other Republican presidents have fallen for and suffer death by a thousand cuts. So he responds to anything that they try to "nick" him with. The difference is that this president is doing so much each and every day that it is spinning the heads of the "white house" reporters. Since he sleeps only 4 hours a day, he accomplishes more than they can keep up with or at least more than they are used to having to cover and quite frankly, I think it pisses them off that they now have to work. One other thought on the twitter fights he picks. Maybe they are distractions so that the press doesn't cover and blow up all the regulations he's been shredding. Talk about a "rope-a-dope" on the press.

Now let's get to the meat of this "nothing memo".

1. A foreigner was paid by an opposition party to interfere with our election. That is not disputed and is a fact.
2. The FBI and DOJ would not ask for a FISA judge to give them a warrant to spy on a member of the other party without that foreigner's celatious document.
3. The FBI then unmasked numerous U.S. citizens caught up in the spying on that one citizen they got the controversial warrant on and distributed that information and those citizens across a wide array of government agencies and their employees.

Here's a couple of questions I want you to ask yourself based on the above.

1. Would you want the FBI to withhold information from a judge if they were prosecuting you or seeking a warrant against you where you had no defense for yourself?
2. How many other warrants have the FBI obtained like this? Think of James Rosen, Senator Jeff Sessions, Senator Rand Paul and others who have discovered they've been secretly surveilled by the FBI. In Sessions' case, just because he was at an event that the Russian ambassador was at.
3. If watergate was all about some Republican operatives breaking into Democrat National Committee's offices to get information on their strategy, what would you say about one political party weaponizing the most powerful investigative agency in the world against spying on the opposition through wiretaps and more?
4. Do you really want to blame the President for doing the opposite of what Nixon did? E.g. instead of covering it all up and hiding it from the American people, he releases the information so that we all can decide if the actions of our government is legitimate or not. Nixon was forced to resign, an act this president won't have to do by engaging in a cover up.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby Aseahawkfan » Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:30 pm

Id,

You already know this is partisan. You know they've been spying on people for ages, American and otherwise. Are you trying to pretend this is something isolated? Since The Patriot Act they have near carte blanche to spy on anyone for the smallest of reasons (though I think they've always been spying). Even when they don't do it themselves, they contact their friends in foreign agencies to obtain information or ask if they have anything. Fact is Washington is corrupt and off the rails. It doesn't matter who is in office, it is going to stay that way. We are a country of 320 million with interests all over the world. We will not be able to get a large enough number of Americans on the same page with how to run the nation, so the easily manipulated will continue to vote based on slick campaigns while the politicians agendas known to themselves and their big supporters while they throw table scraps to the American people.

Any American that tries to do anything to disrupt the status quo will be slandered and lambasted until the manipulated American public turns against them. If you tried to do something serious to change this world, as a conservative you would be branded a violent racist more than likely and they'd find something in your past to throw doubt about your character.

I'm sorry. It's not smart to start Twitter battles and the like. It's not smart to speak outright lies like this was the most listened to State of the Union speech or the like. Trump worries about a lot of vain and foolish things that not even a supporter like you can cover up because he won't stop saying them, even when they are provably wrong. I don't think Trump even bothers to check for proof before he speaks. He just talks and talks and talks because he can't help himself.

I'm going to enjoy more of my money in my pocket though. That tax plan is going to be great for business and those that invest in them. I"m going to follow the old cliché, "If you can't beat them, join them." Then again I've always enjoyed investing. Making money from owning parts of growing businesses is one of the best things to do in America with your money.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby idhawkman » Mon Feb 05, 2018 7:04 am

Aseahawkfan wrote:Id,

You already know this is partisan. You know they've been spying on people for ages, American and otherwise. Are you trying to pretend this is something isolated? Since The Patriot Act they have near carte blanche to spy on anyone for the smallest of reasons (though I think they've always been spying). Even when they don't do it themselves, they contact their friends in foreign agencies to obtain information or ask if they have anything. Fact is Washington is corrupt and off the rails. It doesn't matter who is in office, it is going to stay that way.


Maybe so, but it is the first time they weaponized the DOJ and FBI against a political opponent. If this is where you are at and are "Okay" with it then what we know as a republic and "OUR" way of life has a very short future.

We are a country of 320 million with interests all over the world. We will not be able to get a large enough number of Americans on the same page with how to run the nation, so the easily manipulated will continue to vote based on slick campaigns while the politicians agendas known to themselves and their big supporters while they throw table scraps to the American people.


Maybe so, but we've seen this in history many times and it usually ends badly for those politicians.

Any American that tries to do anything to disrupt the status quo will be slandered and lambasted until the manipulated American public turns against them. If you tried to do something serious to change this world, as a conservative you would be branded a violent racist more than likely and they'd find something in your past to throw doubt about your character.


Exactly the reason Trump can't let them get away with even the slightest attack. You may not like it but it is about messaging and he's winning that battle at this time. The MSM has gone "all-in" on what you call slandering and lambasting him and the stakes are extremely high in who emerges from that battle.

I'm sorry. It's not smart to start Twitter battles and the like. It's not smart to speak outright lies like this was the most listened to State of the Union speech or the like. Trump worries about a lot of vain and foolish things that not even a supporter like you can cover up because he won't stop saying them, even when they are provably wrong. I don't think Trump even bothers to check for proof before he speaks. He just talks and talks and talks because he can't help himself.


I've already addressed the twitter wars above and why he can't let them get away with even one of the lies. Regarding "outright lies" who says they are lies? I know you to be a smart person and know the difference between messaging and lies. Why would he bother with checking to see if something is provably right or wrong. Everyone knows you can find numbers and statistics to prove anything you want (or disprove it). Do I believe that when a democrat talking head says, "The american people want (fill in the blank)" that they've actually checked that? NOPE! Those lies are also proveably wrong but I don't hear you crying out about that.

I'm going to enjoy more of my money in my pocket though. That tax plan is going to be great for business and those that invest in them. I"m going to follow the old cliché, "If you can't beat them, join them." Then again I've always enjoyed investing. Making money from owning parts of growing businesses is one of the best things to do in America with your money.

I'm actually saddened to hear you say this and maybe you will reconsider at some point when the storm boots come for you. All that evil needs to succeed is the absence of good.
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Re: The MEMO

Postby Aseahawkfan » Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:58 pm

idhawkman wrote:Maybe so, but it is the first time they weaponized the DOJ and FBI against a political opponent. If this is where you are at and are "Okay" with it then what we know as a republic and "OUR" way of life has a very short future.


What do you mean? Hoover used to use the FBI to crush and control political opponents. You think that this is the first time? Then there were the McCarthy hearings. Don't be a Trump, read your history.

Maybe so, but we've seen this in history many times and it usually ends badly for those politicians.


Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. Bill Clinton stayed in office 8 years with his corrupt actions, even after impeachment and lying on camera to the American people. And his wife just about won The White House with all her dirty scandals. Trump won The White House even though he is known to not be religious, trade in wives when they get too old and cheat on them, and supporting Democrat and Republican candidates with money to obtain political influence. Bush Sr. didn't experience a lick of negative when he won The White House after the Iran-Contra Scandal he was likely directing or knew heavily about given being a former CIA director. You think these people aren't spying all the time using friends and contacts in all the various intelligence and law enforcement agencies, you are more naive than I expected given your age and military experience.

There was even a time in the 80s where it was proven that the CIA was running drugs into America to fund black budgets and very little happened to them because of it. The people in DC look at you and me as people to be manipulated for what they and their friends want to do whether it is good for us or not. That is the reality that history clearly paints.

The only thing keeping things in line is that they have so much dirt on each other that they keep each other quiet.

Exactly the reason Trump can't let them get away with even the slightest attack. You may not like it but it is about messaging and he's winning that battle at this time. The MSM has gone "all-in" on what you call slandering and lambasting him and the stakes are extremely high in who emerges from that battle.


He could handle it a different way like nearly every other president has done. You want to sit in The Oval Office and you need to know how to deal with the heat without allowing your opponent to make you look stupid. Trump is learning that ias the little b**** Democrats in the meetings with them will take anything he says and run to the press. He's learning that lesson hopefully. None of these people in Washington are people he can trust to speak frankly around. So far he's holding his own on the information warfare front, he would do a lot better to watch his language around the Democrats. They are his enemy and he needs to learn that well. Anything he says or does they will leak to the press to make him look bad. The triggered left will take anything from his McDonalds meals to his wife not standing to attack him as they have been doing. That's why you keep quiet waiting for moments to attack and rip them up.

I've already addressed the twitter wars above and why he can't let them get away with even one of the lies. Regarding "outright lies" who says they are lies? I know you to be a smart person and know the difference between messaging and lies. Why would he bother with checking to see if something is provably right or wrong. Everyone knows you can find numbers and statistics to prove anything you want (or disprove it). Do I believe that when a democrat talking head says, "The american people want (fill in the blank)" that they've actually checked that? NOPE! Those lies are also proveably wrong but I don't hear you crying out about that.


What are you talking about? I've hammered the Democrats plenty for their crap. But I'm not going to give a Republican a pass if he's lying like you seem to want to do. Trump is lying. He is worrying about stupid things. Wake up to the reality. It's dumb to worry about his State of the Union address or inauguration crowd sizes. It's low character and vain. I call it like it is.

I'm actually saddened to hear you say this and maybe you will reconsider at some point when the storm boots come for you. All that evil needs to succeed is the absence of good.


You're saddened to hear I've joined the Trump make money train? I thought you were a Trump supporter. About all he has done at this point was create an environment where people can make a lot of money and keep more of it than before.

And you think Trump is good? You don't know what good is if you think that. Let me add something to that quote, "Evil will always succeed if men don't know what good is." You don't seem to know what it means to be good. You only seem interested in partisan politics regardless of the damage it does to this nation. When you cannot trust your president because he tells bold-faced lies that are easily proven to be untrue and he practices vanity, narcissism, and rudeness as an example to the people he leads, that is not good no matter how many excuses you try to make for the man.

You are a follower of partisan politics disinterested in the truth of our situation or the quality of character of the president. I wish more people that served their nation with conservative viewpoint were capable of seeing the lies from their
chosen party, so we might have a chance of truly changing this nation in a positive fashion. I hope someday you wake up that the current parties will not do that and electing narcissistic billionaires is also not a good way to accomplish a return to quality.
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