Trump Tests Positive for COVID

[RiverDog]

I don't think I would jump in line to get a vaccine for myself or my kids. I've got to look at the risk vs reward. What are the side effects vs. me and my families overall risk of having a negative outcome if we were to catch the virus. If I were older (55+) or had other health conditions that dramatically raised my risk I would get it. I understand how vaccines work and the idea of creating a herd immunity is important, but this isn't Polio or Ebola in terms of individual risk. At this point I would imagine a largely untested vaccine poses more of a risk to most of the population than the virus itself. This might make it seem like I am taking the virus lightly (I am not) but I would argue that maybe some people are taking the possible side effects of a vaccine- both long term and short term- lightly. I am not an anti-vaxer, my kids are vaccinated for the most part but if you look at the amount of vaccination kids are getting today compared to 25 years ago it is pretty eye opening.

I'm not going to be the first in line, either. But as soon as I'm convinced it's safe and effective, I'm getting mine. The problem isn't individual risk so much as the risk posed to others. My wife has two autoimmune diseases and we're both over 65. We're counting on others to help protect us from the virus.

Ironically, I reached out to my former boss a couple of days ago regarding vaccinations. There's been some discussion about employers requiring that all employees receive a vaccination when one becomes available or continue to use masks until the local health department lifts their recommendations. It will be interesting to see how that develops.

We really need a national discussion about the vaccination issue in general. Where do you draw the line between the individual risk a person takes when they receive a vaccination vs. the risk they pose to others should they choose not to get one?

[mykc14]

I'm not going to be the first in line, either. But as soon as I'm convinced it's safe and effective, I'm getting mine. The problem isn't individual risk so much as the risk posed to others. My wife has two autoimmune diseases and we're both over 65. We're counting on others to help protect us from the virus.

I get that from your perspective the problem isn't individual risk, but the risk posed to others, but when I'm making that decision for myself and my family I need to take into account individual risk as well as the risk to others, which is what I meant when I was mentioning Polio and Ebola. I want to be able to protect you and your wife from the virus but I do need to take into account how a vaccine may or may not affect my family. My father in law is not in great health and we worry about him getting COVID all of the time. Obviously we will weigh that in deciding on whether or not to get the vaccine. I would wear a mask all day to protect somebody vulnerable but injecting a vaccine into my kids that I don't trust completely is a different story. I hope I don't sound callous, but I would think you would do the same thing if you were in my shoes. I agree that we need to have the discussion of vaccines as a country.

[mykc14]

We really need a national discussion about the vaccination issue in general. Where do you draw the line between the individual risk a person takes when they receive a vaccination vs. the risk they pose to others should they choose not to get one?

This is the question and it isn't an easy one to answer, especially considering miss-information from the media and POTUS. More and more citizens in our country are having to do our own research using sources that aren't exactly trustworthy.

[Aseahawkfan]

I won't get a vaccine myself. My immune system is strong. I've already fought off the COVID19 once. I feel like my body will do so again. Coronaviruses are notoriously adaptable. I have trouble believing that they can successfully engineer a safe vaccine this quickly. I think we're going to have to live with COVID19 and take the Swedish approach in the end. Soon as we open up, COVID is coming back. It's too efficient at survival and spreading. There's no real way to kill it off. We're going to have let it spread and do our best with it with available treatments. We can't keep locked down forever. It's not possible.

If you get sick, you need to not stress as much as possible. Do not lower the fever unless you have to as your body is trying to burn it out of the system. Do not drink caffeine or other stimulants, nothing to disrupt sleep. Eat, drink lots of water, and supplement or eat vitamin C and D foods in whatever quantities you can. Sleep a ton. The biggest mistake I've seen so many people make with this is not cutting out sleep disruptors and taking fever reducers. They are sabotaging their immune response by doing so. I wish they would stop.

I'm always surprised by the number of people that think fevers are something you want to reduce when sick, when they are a powerful immune response to kill whatever is in your system. Only get your fever reduced if your temperature reaches a dangerous level.

[RiverDog]

We really need a national discussion about the vaccination issue in general. Where do you draw the line between the individual risk a person takes when they receive a vaccination vs. the risk they pose to others should they choose not to get one?

This is the question and it isn't an easy one to answer, especially considering miss-information from the media and POTUS. More and more citizens in our country are having to do our own research using sources that aren't exactly trustworthy.

I trust the advice of my physician, and he's given me recommendations on what vaccinations he thinks I need. I'm not substituting my judgement for his.

[mykc14]

I trust the advice of my physician, and he's given me recommendations on what vaccinations he thinks I need. I'm not substituting my judgement for his.

I’ve got a good friend who is older(63) and a doctor. He has no problem with the vaccine and he says I shouldn’t have too much reservation in vaccinating my kid. My personal doctor is younger (40) and has kids my age. He’s not getting the vaccine and won’t vaccinate his kids. His recommendation to me is to do the same.

[RiverDog]

I trust the advice of my physician, and he's given me recommendations on what vaccinations he thinks I need. I'm not substituting my judgement for his.

I’ve got a good friend who is older(63) and a doctor. He has no problem with the vaccine and he says I shouldn’t have too much reservation in vaccinating my kid. My personal doctor is younger (40) and has kids my age. He’s not getting the vaccine and won’t vaccinate his kids. His recommendation to me is to do the same.

Are you talking about the COVID vaccine? At this point, how does anyone, doctor or layman, know that it is or isn't safe and effective? Isn't that what the trials are about?

[Aseahawkfan]

I would read extensively on any vaccine prior to taking it. You need to know the mechanism by which it operates and the possible side effects. Then have questions ready for your doctor. I would not take the first wave of the vaccine. Let the vaccine make it past the live test before taking it unless you want to be a guinea pig.

[RiverDog]

I would read extensively on any vaccine prior to taking it. You need to know the mechanism by which it operates and the possible side effects. Then have questions ready for your doctor. I would not take the first wave of the vaccine. Let the vaccine make it past the live test before taking it unless you want to be a guinea pig.

That I can agree with.

The 'live tests' are in progress. It's the step that Trump is trying to circumvent in order to have it ready before the election.

[Aseahawkfan]

That I can agree with.

The 'live tests' are in progress. It's the step that Trump is trying to circumvent in order to have it ready before the election.

This election can't get over fast enough. If dumb as dirt dude wins, man, I can't even imagine what chaos will ensue. Pelosi is a weak House leader. She can't stand up to Trump. She's pathetic. I can't believe they can't come to a stimulus deal at this point given how screwed Americans are right now. It is ridiculous.

[RiverDog]

That I can agree with.

The 'live tests' are in progress. It's the step that Trump is trying to circumvent in order to have it ready before the election.

This election can't get over fast enough. If dumb as dirt dude wins, man, I can't even imagine what chaos will ensue. Pelosi is a weak House leader. She can't stand up to Trump. She's pathetic. I can't believe they can't come to a stimulus deal at this point given how screwed Americans are right now. It is ridiculous.

Regarding the stimulus plan. I agreed with the first stimulus plan as there were a whole lot of people laid off initially and they had to get money to them quickly, and trying to craft something that was targeted and politically acceptable to both parties would have taken many months. The circumstances dictated a shotgun approach.

But things are different this time around. The unemployment rate is half of what it was back in April and they've supplemented unemployment benefits. I'm for getting money out to people that need it, but there needs to be a little more care taken this time around. Personally I'd like to see them supplement small businesses that are most affected by the pandemic to help keep them in business and from laying off employees.

[c_hawkbob]

If the aim of the stimulus checks is to stimulate the economy I think as check to each consumer is a perfect way to do it. For the most part this is not money that is going to be hoarded away or put into saving accounts, it is money that will be spent withing days or weeks at most of the checks arrival. Spent on food, auto repairs, home repairs and paying bills, all thing that will provide an immediate boost to the economy. Even if some of it goes to people that don't need it to survive and it pays for a vacation, that's a boost to very fragile travel and hospitality industries.

As for unemployment supplemental payments, haven't those run out for quite some time now?

[RiverDog]

If the aim of the stimulus checks is to stimulate the economy I think as check to each consumer is a perfect way to do it. For the most part this is not money that is going to be hoarded away or put into saving accounts, it is money that will be spent withing days or weeks at most of the checks arrival. Spent on food, auto repairs, home repairs and paying bills, all thing that will provide an immediate boost to the economy. Even if some of it goes to people that don't need it to survive and it pays for a vacation, that's a boost to very fragile travel and hospitality industries.

As for unemployment supplemental payments, haven't those run out for quite some time now?

IMO the objective of the "stimulus" payments shouldn't be to stimulate the economy as much as it should be directed towards areas that need it to keep afloat for the next 6-9 months. I'm not sure how it would work, but my preference would be to focus it on keeping people working and avoiding layoff situations rather than just throwing money at it.

As far as the supplement stimulating the hospitality industry, it's probably not going to happen until the pandemic is over with so it's likely going to end up sitting in someone's bank account. Besides, we don't want people going to restaurants and hotels at this time.

To answer your question about the supplemental unemployment payments, most states are still supplementing it by $300 a month, or half of the amount that ran out in July.

https://www.fema.gov/fact-sheet/lost-wa ... ved-states

[Aseahawkfan]

Regarding the stimulus plan. I agreed with the first stimulus plan as there were a whole lot of people laid off initially and they had to get money to them quickly, and trying to craft something that was targeted and politically acceptable to both parties would have taken many months. The circumstances dictated a shotgun approach.

But things are different this time around. The unemployment rate is half of what it was back in April and they've supplemented unemployment benefits. I'm for getting money out to people that need it, but there needs to be a little more care taken this time around. Personally I'd like to see them supplement small businesses that are most affected by the pandemic to help keep them in business and from laying off employees.

Why do you think the unemployment rate isn't as bad as it was? The fricking stimulus. The rent-mortgage deferrals. The money inflow in loans and unemployment benefits. Companies are starting to lay people off again because the stimulus has dried up. There is a haves and a have not economy right now. Tech companies, delivery restaurants, and the like are the haves. The have nots airlines, oil companies, theaters, sit in restaurants, walk in retail, and the like. The stimulus has sustained these people through the downturn. My one buddy in Hawaii just had to lay off his employees and close 2 more of his stores due to a lack of stimulus. My other buddy is getting $235 a week in unemployment and his former job likely isn't even bringing him back in February because of Boeing getting decimated.

Jerome Powell did not get up there and tell Congress we need more stimulus for his health. The economy is driven by stimulus right now, not organic growth. Cities are still very empty compared to before. Only a segment of the economy is thriving right now, while the other half is destroyed. It's not some kind of even split or wealth spread over the economy. It's a stimulus, credit driven economy right now that is holding up by a thread on the rumor or more stimulus that needs to come. A large segment of the population is still not doing well. Our employment rate not including people who have stopped looking for work is 8%, 2% off what it reached during The Great Recession. Not anywhere near to what it was before. This is with the unemployment rate being manipulated to look better than it is by not including workers who have stopped looking for work due to the terrible COVID environment.

These dumbasses in Congress and the White House need to get more money out to the people and industries that need it or we're going to go off a cliff again. It's amazing that people think we're even close to ok right now economiically. We are not ok. We are a very divided economy driven by the tech industry who has been able to operate in this terrible environment.

They need to shoot the economy with another stimulus package to get us through to this vaccine they keep talking about and a return to normalcy. If they want to narrow it some fine, but get it the hell done. What is wrong with these idiots?

[RiverDog]

Regarding the stimulus plan. I agreed with the first stimulus plan as there were a whole lot of people laid off initially and they had to get money to them quickly, and trying to craft something that was targeted and politically acceptable to both parties would have taken many months. The circumstances dictated a shotgun approach.

But things are different this time around. The unemployment rate is half of what it was back in April and they've supplemented unemployment benefits. I'm for getting money out to people that need it, but there needs to be a little more care taken this time around. Personally I'd like to see them supplement small businesses that are most affected by the pandemic to help keep them in business and from laying off employees.

Why do you think the unemployment rate isn't as bad as it was? The fricking stimulus. The rent-mortgage deferrals. The money inflow in loans and unemployment benefits. Companies are starting to lay people off again because the stimulus has dried up. There is a haves and a have not economy right now. Tech companies, delivery restaurants, and the like are the haves. The have nots airlines, oil companies, theaters, sit in restaurants, walk in retail, and the like. The stimulus has sustained these people through the downturn. My one buddy in Hawaii just had to lay off his employees and close 2 more of his stores due to a lack of stimulus. My other buddy is getting $235 a week in unemployment and his former job likely isn't even bringing him back in February because of Boeing getting decimated.

The first stimulus has dried up and the economy has opened back up to a much greater degree than it was in April. We need to get help to those that need it. But I'm not one of them. My wife and I didn't use the first one. All we did was put it on our bank account. They need to make it more efficient this time around. We can't just go around printing money like there's no tomorrow.

I agree with getting money to people like your friends that are laid off and companies that are struggling to stay afloat. That's not where the rub comes. Where the rub comes is where they are giving money to people like my wife and I. We didn't need the first stimulus and we sure as hell don't need a second one. All we did was put it in the bank. We did not buy one penny's worth of goods or services that we wouldn't have bought without it, so it didn't help the economy one iota. It was a complete waste. Give it to those that need it most.

At some point, we're going to have to stop printing money without any regard to how it's being used.

[Aseahawkfan]

I agree with getting money to people like your friends that are laid off and companies that are struggling to stay afloat. That's not where the rub comes. Where the rub comes is where they are giving money to people like my wife and I. We didn't need the first stimulus and we sure as hell don't need a second one. All we did was put it in the bank. We did not buy one penny's worth of goods or services that we wouldn't have bought without it, so it didn't help the economy one iota. It was a complete waste. Give it to those that need it most.

At some point, we're going to have to stop printing money without any regard to how it's being used.

Hopefully at some point when the economy opens and starts to rebound, you'll have some extra money to help the recovery you can use to take a trip or buy some big ticket items. Even though much of the stock market is doing fine, all those smaller local businesses that don't trade on the market will need help recovering.

As far as the money printing, doubt it will stop soon. We are not good, not at all.

[RiverDog]

Hopefully at some point when the economy opens and starts to rebound, you'll have some extra money to help the recovery you can use to take a trip or buy some big ticket items. Even though much of the stock market is doing fine, all those smaller local businesses that don't trade on the market will need help recovering.

As far as the money printing, doubt it will stop soon. We are not good, not at all.

The stimulus isn't going to cause me to spend anymore than I normally would.

I agree with getting people that need help the assistance they need. I just don't like the idea of politicians wandering around throwing money into the air and making it rain just because it plays well back home.

[Aseahawkfan]

The stimulus isn't going to cause me to spend anymore than I normally would.

I agree with getting people that need help the assistance they need. I just don't like the idea of politicians wandering around throwing money into the air and making it rain just because it plays well back home.

You got free money from the government. You should use it to support a few businesses that need help getting back on their feet when they re-open. Force yourself to find something you want locally and help out. If you don't have anything to spend it on right now, then so be it. When things re-open I guarantee some of the small businesses in your area could use a hand, so take that free money and give them a hand.

That's what the money is for. I didn't need the money either. I spent it on some take out food to help these businesses stay afloat.

[RiverDog]

You got free money from the government. You should use it to support a few businesses that need help getting back on their feet when they re-open. Force yourself to find something you want locally and help out. If you don't have anything to spend it on right now, then so be it. When things re-open I guarantee some of the small businesses in your area could use a hand, so take that free money and give them a hand.

That's what the money is for. I didn't need the money either. I spent it on some take out food to help these businesses stay afloat.

I'll probably end up donating a lot of it to charity. Although it wasn't close to $2400, we've made a healthy donation to a foundation sponsored by our local hospital that does stuff like put on free Medicare classes by a specialist that does nothing but, including one-on-one appointments, has free classes on aging issues, etc, that we've taken advantage of over the past few years. They get their operating funds from donations and the proceeds of the hospital gift shop but it was closed for a large part of the year due to COVID. My wife has also made a couple of large donations to an animal shelter. Non profits like those are taking just as big of a hit as private businesses do as donations tend to dry up in a poor economy.

But the point isn't about our spending of the stimulus money. The point is that we don't need it, and I know a TON of people in a similar situation to ours that don't need it and won't spend it as it's intended. Retirees like me have much lower incomes than when we were working and raising families so we'll qualify for the stimulus money, but we have much fewer expenses than a working middle class household. Our kids are grown and out of the nest and our home has been paid off for 10 years. If you're retired, you don't have to worry about a loss if income during a recession. All I worry about is the solvency of my pension, of SS and Medicare, and the performance of my IRA's.

They need to take a closer look at where the stimulus money is going and do a better job of establishing who qualifies for it. The only qualification they had on the last one was based solely on earned income.

[Aseahawkfan]

I'll probably end up donating a lot of it to charity. Although it wasn't close to $2400, we've made a healthy donation to a foundation sponsored by our local hospital that does stuff like put on free Medicare classes by a specialist that does nothing but, including one-on-one appointments, has free classes on aging issues, etc, that we've taken advantage of over the past few years. They get their operating funds from donations and the proceeds of the hospital gift shop but it was closed for a large part of the year due to COVID. My wife has also made a couple of large donations to an animal shelter. Non profits like those are taking just as big of a hit as private businesses do as donations tend to dry up in a poor economy.

But the point isn't about our spending of the stimulus money. The point is that we don't need it, and I know a TON of people in a similar situation to ours that don't need it and won't spend it as it's intended. Retirees like me have much lower incomes than when we were working and raising families so we'll qualify for the stimulus money, but we have much fewer expenses than a working middle class household. Our kids are grown and out of the nest and our home has been paid off for 10 years. If you're retired, you don't have to worry about a loss if income during a recession. All I worry about is the solvency of my pension, of SS and Medicare, and the performance of my IRA's.

They need to take a closer look at where the stimulus money is going and do a better job of establishing who qualifies for it. The only qualification they had on the last one was based solely on earned income.

They're trying to encourage stimulus through consumption. Even if you send it to charity, should be good. Charities will use it for consumption or helping someone. That's what's important. It's a way for the government to encourage consumption. Hopefully at some point most of it finds its way back into the economy. So many of these small businesses are destroyed. So many jobs are lost in so many industries right now. It's a terrible situation. I really hope people who have extra money will get out there and use it when some of these stores re-open. I like shopping online, but it would be sad to see all the theaters, malls, stores, restaurants, and the like go out of business or be reduced to a very low level not seen in America for some time. I guess the youth would get used to everything online as they spend more time online than any generation in history, but man, I'd still like to know humans are interacting face to face.

[mykc14]

I really hope people who have extra money will get out there and use it when some of these stores re-open. I like shopping online, but it would be sad to see all the theaters, malls, stores, restaurants, and the like go out of business or be reduced to a very low level not seen in America for some time. I guess the youth would get used to everything online as they spend more time online than any generation in history, but man, I'd still like to know humans are interacting face to face.

I agree with most of this. Stimulate through spending. On another note if you are looking for charities/people who need donations during this time try contacting your local school. There are a lot of kids out there who rely on in-person school for a lot of things and they aren't able to get those right now.

[Hawktawk]

Now the WH staff has infections in the mid 30s. Nobody will say when trump was last tested negative. He wasn't tested daily. Its entirely possible he was positive for the debate and possibly before. Chris Christie is still hospitalized. Members of the joint chiefs of staff are infected, quarantined as is owner of the guards of the nuclear football. His former and current campaign managers. His press secretary.The secretary of the marines.

Hey trust us on this pandemic america we are all infected Trump is clearly roid raging even more incoherent than normal. I guess the 25th amendment is as big a joke as impeachment. I hope we make it to Jan 20. If Trump somehow steals this we won't exist in 4 years. Anyone supporting him now has a death wish....

[Aseahawkfan]

Now the WH staff has infections in the mid 30s. Nobody will say when trump was last tested negative. He wasn't tested daily. Its entirely possible he was positive for the debate and possibly before. Chris Christie is still hospitalized. Members of the joint chiefs of staff are infected, quarantined as is owner of the guards of the nuclear football. His former and current campaign managers. His press secretary.The secretary of the marines.

Hey trust us on this pandemic america we are all infected Trump is clearly roid raging even more incoherent than normal. I guess the 25th amendment is as big a joke as impeachment. I hope we make it to Jan 20. If Trump somehow steals this we won't exist in 4 years. Anyone supporting him now has a death wish....

Won't exist in 4 years? Why can't you stop while you're ahead?

They flip the Senate November 3rd, they can pursue the 25th Amendment is Mr. Looney President keeps wandering around with COVID infecting people. Pretty nuts that this idiot can't sit still and get well. Why he is wandering around spreading COVID where he goes I can't imagine.

My buddies are still confident he will win. They still hate the Democrats worse and think like you, "The country will end if the Democrats win." Same foolish talk, other side of the coin.

I think both of you are overblowing things.

[RiverDog]

They're trying to encourage stimulus through consumption. Even if you send it to charity, should be good. Charities will use it for consumption or helping someone. That's what's important. It's a way for the government to encourage consumption. Hopefully at some point most of it finds its way back into the economy. So many of these small businesses are destroyed. So many jobs are lost in so many industries right now. It's a terrible situation. I really hope people who have extra money will get out there and use it when some of these stores re-open. I like shopping online, but it would be sad to see all the theaters, malls, stores, restaurants, and the like go out of business or be reduced to a very low level not seen in America for some time. I guess the youth would get used to everything online as they spend more time online than any generation in history, but man, I'd still like to know humans are interacting face to face.

The point is that there are better ways to stimulate the economy, better ways to get people most in need some support, than just blindly throwing $1200 at every single person whether they need it or not. They need to do a better job of targeting the money.