Biden Corruption

[curmudgeon]

Does anyone care?......

[c_hawkbob]

As compared to his opponent's corruption?

No, it doesn't even move the needle.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Person: “I can’t vote for politician A; he’s so corrupt. I am voting for politician B.”

Other person: “Politician B is corrupt, too.”

Person: “Politican B is less corrupt, though, which is better.”

Lovely state of affairs we are in.

[RiverDog]

As compared to his opponent's corruption?

No, it doesn't even move the needle.

My take, too. Besides, I just received my ballot yesterday and marked it for Joe Biden.

[curmudgeon]

Twitter, Facebook and You Tube selectively censoring free speech. Anyone bothered by this in the least?

[RiverDog]

Twitter, Facebook and You Tube selectively censoring free speech. Anyone bothered by this in the least?

Of course, I'm bothered by it. But your thread title is "Biden Corruption", and your OP made no mention of free speech and/or censorship.

They are two separate issues.

[c_hawkbob]

Twitter, Facebook and You Tube selectively censoring free speech. Anyone bothered by this in the least?

If they were government entities I'd be bothered, but as they are private enterprises they have the right to allow and disallow as they see fit. Furthermore I appreciate the effort to minimise disinformation.

[RiverDog]

If they (Facebook, Twitter, You Tube) were government entities I'd be bothered, but as they are private enterprises they have the right to allow and disallow as they see fit. Furthermore I appreciate the effort to minimise disinformation.

I agree, there should be no government regulation, and like you, I appreciate their attempting to minimize disinformation. But as members of the Fifth Estate and considering that they have a considerable impact on society, they should be taking it upon themselves to be as objective and non bias as possible in their presentation of information.

[c_hawkbob]

If they (Facebook, Twitter, You Tube) were government entities I'd be bothered, but as they are private enterprises they have the right to allow and disallow as they see fit. Furthermore I appreciate the effort to minimise disinformation.

I agree, there should be no government regulation, and like you, I appreciate their attempting to minimize disinformation. But as members of the Fifth Estate and considering that they have a considerable impact on society, they should be taking it upon themselves to be as objective and non bias as possible in their presentation of information.

And as far as I can tell just from my own personal experience they seem to be doing so. I've checked my timeline to see a couple shares disallowed due to unsubstantiated information myself. Can't say how often it happens to people posting from the right, but I do know for certain they are at least doing something about misinformation from the left as well.from

[RiverDog]

And as far as I can tell just from my own personal experience they seem to be doing so. I've checked my timeline to see a couple shares disallowed due to unsubstantiated information myself. Can't say how often it happens to people posting from the right, but I do know for certain they are at least doing something about misinformation from the left as well.from

Twitter has already acknowledged that they screwed up:

Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey admitted that blocking the URL related to the story without context was “unacceptable.”

Our (Twitter) communication around our actions on the @nypost article was not great. And blocking URL sharing via tweet or DM with zero context as to why we’re blocking: unacceptable.

Plus it's not only unethical, it could be against the law:

Sen. Josh Hawley (R-Miss.) said he would ask both Twitter and Facebook to explain their actions surrounding the Biden story under oath to the Senate subcommittee he chairs.

“These are potential violations of election law, and that’s a crime,” the Senator tweeted.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/facebook-twi ... 29419.html

[Aseahawkfan]

No. I don't care. I view all politicians and wealthy people as participating in the same game. This is nothing more than payback. Same as Trump as a Russian Spy was part of the payback and political game for what he did to Obama with birtherism. You want to compete in high level American or world politics, be prepared for these games. Someone will find and exploit some chink in your armor and blow it up to extreme levels. It's the nature of the political gamesmanship. There are very few rules to this game other than win.

Trump has invited the attacks on himself. Now he is trying launch his payback. It will likely work with his followers and be ignored by his opponents.

Right now I know people who are willing to overlook everything Trump does to vote and support him. I know people willing to ignore everything wrong with Biden to defeat Trump because they hate Trump. I know almost no one that thinks Biden is a great candidate. This entire election is Trump vs. Trump Hate. I barely see it as Trump vs. BIden. Biden just happens to be the guy people can vote for to get rid of Trump. I very rarely hear praise of Biden. Even his election message in Washington State is a fear-mongering message that we are fighting for the soul of our nation and other such crap like we haven't survived far worse than a jackass like Trump. The Democrats couldn't field anyone that could beat Trump on their merits, so they are completely relying on the Hate Trump campaign to win.

So no, this won't move the needle at all. This isn't an election of two candidates against each other on their merits. This is a single candidate election. There is Trump vs. the Trump Haters. Trump vs. Himself. Biden is just a proxy for all those that hate Trump.

It's why I'm not worried about the Republican Party at all. This is going to be a massive reset for them. Even if the Democrats win, the Republicans can find a candidate to beat Biden if he runs for a second term. Since Biden is unlikely to run for a second term, it's basically going to be a reset for both parties where you'll either see a very beatable Kamala Harris against a vetted Republican or two completely new candidates.

A Trump loss is a political reset for both parties. So both the Dems and Republicans are basically in a no lose situation right now. If Trump wins, the Dems need a decent candidate to take the White House back in 4 years. If Trump loses, the Republicans get a political reset and both will likely start at 0 next election.

[RiverDog]

Trump has invited the attacks on himself. Now he is trying launch his payback. It will likely work with his followers and be ignored by his opponents.

Agreed. It's not going to affect the election. It's not going to cause anyone to vote for Trump that wouldn't have before this came out.

[Hawktawk]

No. I don't care. I view all politicians and wealthy people as participating in the same game. This is nothing more than payback. Same as Trump as a Russian Spy was part of the payback and political game for what he did to Obama with birtherism. You want to compete in high level American or world politics, be prepared for these games. Someone will find and exploit some chink in your armor and blow it up to extreme levels. It's the nature of the political gamesmanship. There are very few rules to this game other than win.

Trump has invited the attacks on himself. Now he is trying launch his payback. It will likely work with his followers and be ignored by his opponents.

Right now I know people who are willing to overlook everything Trump does to vote and support him. I know people willing to ignore everything wrong with Biden to defeat Trump because they hate Trump. I know almost no one that thinks Biden is a great candidate. This entire election is Trump vs. Trump Hate. I barely see it as Trump vs. BIden. Biden just happens to be the guy people can vote for to get rid of Trump. I very rarely hear praise of Biden. Even his election message in Washington State is a fear-mongering message that we are fighting for the soul of our nation and other such crap like we haven't survived far worse than a jackass like Trump. The Democrats couldn't field anyone that could beat Trump on their merits, so they are completely relying on the Hate Trump campaign to win.

So no, this won't move the needle at all. This isn't an election of two candidates against each other on their merits. This is a single candidate election. There is Trump vs. the Trump Haters. Trump vs. Himself. Biden is just a proxy for all those that hate Trump.

It's why I'm not worried about the Republican Party at all. This is going to be a massive reset for them. Even if the Democrats win, the Republicans can find a candidate to beat Biden if he runs for a second term. Since Biden is unlikely to run for a second term, it's basically going to be a reset for both parties where you'll either see a very beatable Kamala Harris against a vetted Republican or two completely new candidates.

A Trump loss is a political reset for both parties. So both the Dems and Republicans are basically in a no lose situation right now. If Trump wins, the Dems need a decent candidate to take the White House back in 4 years. If Trump loses, the Republicans get a political reset and both will likely start at 0 next election.

I'd have completely agreed with this a few months ago, maybe even a few weeks ago. But not any more. I wont marginalize Joe Biden like that from here on out. The dueling town halls last night were a stark reminder of the clear choice between competency, dignity and decorum vs anger, chaos, mask denying, spewing QAnoon theories about UBL being killed by seals being a hoax perpetrated by Joe Biden. These things were spewed by an obviously mentally ill man holding the nuclear codes.

A candidate who puts forth plans for things like the economy, tax code, the pandemic vs a guy who has been there 4 years and has no plan, literally no platform for his second term except making America super duper greater than great.

Biden 2020. No protest vote this time. The trump party needs a silver bullet in the heart staring with the feckless amoral orange baboon.

And i disagree with you about the republican party. It doesn't exist anymore already. The remnants will tear asunder. It will take longer than watergate to repair this damage.Plenty of prominent R Senators are growing a pair now that its too late to primary them. Guys like Ben Sasse. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... angelicals
But I wont support them in 2024. Romney lost me with his vote to confirm ACB with 20 million people having already voted, likely 75% for Biden although his vote is to preserve his viability in 2024. I see no scenario i would ever support an R for president in the near future.I think an entire generation of voters will be permanently repulsed by this Trump apostasy.

As for Biden corruption please Curmudgeon. Biden has a really great late son Beau and a man skank sleazeball son Hunter. Lets talk about Donnie Jr, Eric and Svetlana Trumps real wife globetrotting around lining their pockets with secret service protection. No we dont care about Hunter Biden.

[RiverDog]

Biden 2020. No protest vote this time.

Me, too. And to my surprise, my wife received a ballot and cast her vote for Sleepy Joe, too. I didn't even know that she had registered. It's the first time in her life that she's voted.

And i disagree with you about the republican party. It doesn't exist anymore already. The remnants will tear asunder. It will take longer than watergate to repair this damage.Plenty of prominent R Senators are growing a pair now that its too late to primary them. Guys like Ben Sasse. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... angelicals
But I wont support them in 2024. Romney lost me with his vote to confirm ACB with 20 million people having already voted, likely 75% for Biden although his vote is to preserve his viability in 2024. I see no scenario i would ever support an R for president in the near future.I think an entire generation of voters will be permanently repulsed by this Trump apostasy.

It's too early to tell just how a Trump defeat will affect the Republican party. It seems likely that they'll lose the Senate and that a couple of Trump lap dogs, namely McConnell and Graham, will be among those to get the boot. The numbers in the Senate are against them again in 2022, with 20 R's up for re-election vs. 12 Dems, so we're probably looking at a Democratic congress for another 4 years. We'll have to see who emerges as the party leader. It's not going to be Romney.

But I doubt that their reclusion lasts beyond 2024. If there's been one constant in national politics over the past 40 years, it's the difficulty both parties have had holding onto power. The public and the press have a short attention span and will have moved on to something else. By 2024, Trump will be long forgotten.

As for Biden corruption please Curmudgeon. Biden has a really great late son Beau and a man skank sleazeball son Hunter. Lets talk about Donnie Jr, Eric and Svetlana Trumps real wife globetrotting around lining their pockets with secret service protection. No we dont care about Hunter Biden.

The Biden/Ukraine scandal is old news. It was a huge conflict of interest that Sleepy Joe should have taken care of when he was VP by insisting that his son not have agreed to sit on the board of directors Burisma, but there's no smoking gun that it ever extended beyond an appearance of impropriety.

[I-5]

The Biden/Ukraine scandal is old news. It was a huge conflict of interest that Sleepy Joe should have taken care of when he was VP by insisting that his son not have agreed to sit on the board of directors Burisma, but there's no smoking gun that it ever extended beyond an appearance of impropriety.

I agree 100% with you on this, but I guess we shouldn't be surprised that Trump's and his crew are determined to make this an issue, even if warned that Giuliani is being used as a tool by Russia. It shows that they really don't have anything else on Joe, otherwise they would have spent much more energy and time on it that they are using instead to chase the Hunter Biden story as far as they can take it. If I were them, I would have tried to tie Joe to Obama and tear him down that way by how they spin the accomplishments of the last administration (or lack of it), but I guess they don't believe that's a strong enough argument to make.

[Aseahawkfan]

I'd have completely agreed with this a few months ago, maybe even a few weeks ago. But not any more. I wont marginalize Joe Biden like that from here on out. The dueling town halls last night were a stark reminder of the clear choice between competency, dignity and decorum vs anger, chaos, mask denying, spewing QAnoon theories about UBL being killed by seals being a hoax perpetrated by Joe Biden. These things were spewed by an obviously mentally ill man holding the nuclear codes.

A candidate who puts forth plans for things like the economy, tax code, the pandemic vs a guy who has been there 4 years and has no plan, literally no platform for his second term except making America super duper greater than great.

Biden 2020. No protest vote this time. The trump party needs a silver bullet in the heart staring with the feckless amoral orange baboon.

And i disagree with you about the republican party. It doesn't exist anymore already. The remnants will tear asunder. It will take longer than watergate to repair this damage.Plenty of prominent R Senators are growing a pair now that its too late to primary them. Guys like Ben Sasse. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... angelicals
But I wont support them in 2024. Romney lost me with his vote to confirm ACB with 20 million people having already voted, likely 75% for Biden although his vote is to preserve his viability in 2024. I see no scenario i would ever support an R for president in the near future.I think an entire generation of voters will be permanently repulsed by this Trump apostasy.

As for Biden corruption please Curmudgeon. Biden has a really great late son Beau and a man skank sleazeball son Hunter. Lets talk about Donnie Jr, Eric and Svetlana Trumps real wife globetrotting around lining their pockets with secret service protection. No we dont care about Hunter Biden.

It will be 4 years if Biden wins until you are proven wrong. Maybe we'll both be on here. We shall see.

You remember what I wrote. The Republican Party won't experience even a bump in the road from Trump. What you don't seem to get is that Trump was elected because of how insane the Democratic left is. Once super crazy Trump is out of office, the insanity of the Socialist, borderline Communist moderate to extreme left will be on full display again. A moderate Republican will be welcomed back into office by America.

You have been so focused on Trump hate, you have completely ignored how the left has moved so far left with defund the police, tearing down statues, and the like that they have huge problems with their platform that will show up like sore thumbs once Dumb as Dirt out of office.

Remember what I wrote here. We'll see what happens in four years.

Your personal viewpoint is not at all representative of even close to a majority of rational human beings. You weren't rational when you were a Republican. You aren't rational now that you are against them. You don't understand politics. All you understand is your personal opinion which you seem to think affects the price of tea in China.

[Aseahawkfan]

I agree 100% with you on this, but I guess we shouldn't be surprised that Trump's and his crew are determined to make this an issue, even if warned that Giuliani is being used as a tool by Russia. It shows that they really don't have anything else on Joe, otherwise they would have spent much more energy and time on it that they are using instead to chase the Hunter Biden story as far as they can take it. If I were them, I would have tried to tie Joe to Obama and tear him down that way by how they spin the accomplishments of the last administration (or lack of it), but I guess they don't believe that's a strong enough argument to make.

The simple political reality is Trump screwed up the coronavirus response and it will likely cost him the election. If not for the coronavirus and the economy was still at 3.5% unemployment, Trump would have won re-election fairly easily barring some unforeseen bombshell. It's pretty much that simple. The coronavirus combined with Trump's incompetent response may well put him out of office barring some surprise change, which can happen with Trump. That's why I won't feel sure he is done until he's done no matter what the polls indicate. His demise was forecast 4 years ago with huge leads by Hilary, but somehow the guy pulled it out. I'm still not sure how he did it.

This election can't get over fast enough.

[Aseahawkfan]

Why do you think McConnel is going to lose Riverdog? What poll are you looking at?

I heard Lindsay is close, but pretty far from a guarantee loss.

So not sure what you're looking at there.

[RiverDog]

Why do you think McConnel is going to lose Riverdog? What poll are you looking at?

I heard Lindsay is close, but pretty far from a guarantee loss.

So not sure what you're looking at there.

Yeah, I think you're right. McGrath is the underdog. It's entirely possible for her to pull off the upset depending on how long Biden's coat tails are, but the numbers favor McConnell.

[c_hawkbob]

Kentucky voting is already breaking records, they're expecting a million or more early votes, and from what I gather most of those early votes are Dems, although there are no exit polls so who actually knows. The point is, record turnout always bodes well for Democrats.

I don't think polls here can be trusted. There are more registered Democrats in KY than Republicans, but it's a very red state, a friend (that grew up here) told me they register Dem so they can vote in the primary for the weaker candidate. Deception is the norm here.

[RiverDog]

Kentucky voting is already breaking records, they're expecting a million or more early votes, and from what I gather most of those early votes are Dems, although there are no exit polls so who actually knows. The point is, record turnout always bodes well for Democrats.

I don't think polls here can be trusted. There are more registered Democrats in KY than Republicans, but it's a very red state, a friend (that grew up here) told me they register Dem so they can vote in the primary for the weaker candidate. Deception is the norm here.

Interesting observation.

Records for early voting are being broken everywhere, and that's to be expected. There's also the theory, based on reasonable assumptions, that Democrats will be more likely to take advantage of early voting/vote by mail and that more R's than D's will turn out at polling places on election day.

The sense I get is that there will be more people voting in this election than in the recent past.

[Aseahawkfan]

So we can't trust the polls when a Republican is winning, but we can when a Democrat is winning? Ok.

I personally doubt McConnell will lose. He's not as associated with Trump as people on here seem to think. I heard his office doesn't even associate much with Trump because he has different coronavirus rules. I rarely him speak well of Trump. McConnell seems to steer clear of Trump. I don't think he likes him myself.

Not sure on Graham, that race is close. Graham has a lot of very bad material on him. He runs his mouth too much. He's clearly been overly supportive of Trump.

Trump looks like he's going to lose, but the moron pulled it out last time. So far the bombs they're trying to drop on Biden aren't working. The mail in voting changes a lot. But supposedly Republican voter registrations are surging. We shall see. My buddy is voting for the first time in 20 years for Trump. He thinks the left is more dangerous for the nation, so he's voting for Trump. Me and my other buddy are likely going independent. One other buddy voted for Trump 2016 and loves him now, thinks myself and my other buddy are wasting our votes not voting for a major party. No idea why people think that as voting should be a representation of the manner you think the nation should be run, not some kind of battle between two evils. I will never buy into this garbage that either of these candidates are going to destroy our Democracy or ruin nation. That's just BS. America been here for 240 plus years and Trump or Biden are going to take us down? I don't think so. I won't buy into that garbage.

[RiverDog]

Trump looks like he's going to lose, but the moron pulled it out last time. So far the bombs they're trying to drop on Biden aren't working. The mail in voting changes a lot. But supposedly Republican voter registrations are surging. We shall see. My buddy is voting for the first time in 20 years for Trump. He thinks the left is more dangerous for the nation, so he's voting for Trump. Me and my other buddy are likely going independent. One other buddy voted for Trump 2016 and loves him now, thinks myself and my other buddy are wasting our votes not voting for a major party. No idea why people think that as voting should be a representation of the manner you think the nation should be run, not some kind of battle between two evils. I will never buy into this garbage that either of these candidates are going to destroy our Democracy or ruin nation. That's just BS. America been here for 240 plus years and Trump or Biden are going to take us down? I don't think so. I won't buy into that garbage.

The latest RCP average in Pennsylvania shows that Trump has closed the gap to less than 4%, which is within the margin of error. Less than 10 days ago, Biden was up by 7.3%. That's a pretty dramatic shift over such a short time span. I'm not sure what's driving that unless it's the SCOTUS appointment/court packing controversy. If Trump wins PA, it's going to get real interesting.

We're two weeks from the election and more and more people are voting every day. There's one more debate scheduled for this week. Time's running short.

[I-5]

As much as I would love see McConnell finally out in Kentucky, I have a hard time seeing it, even with the high turnout. I sure hope I’m wrong.

I watched a video of people with black lung in Kentucky that are alive today for no other reason than they have Obamacare, otherwise the treatment at $6k a month is downright impossible to afford. But guess who they voted for president in 2016? Yup. They probably will vote for Trump again, even if it goes against their very lives. That’s how ingrained the party is. It’s completely insane...and sad. The only reason one can give is that Trump promised to ‘repeal and replace’, but does any serious person think Trump or the republican party is actually going to do that if they haven’t done so already? I would have made that bet during his first term, and if he gets a second term, I’d still be willing to bet that all he ever will do if allowed to is to kill it, and not replace it, especially for those with pre-existing conditions. It’s simply not part of the platform, no matter how much Trump says so.

https://youtu.be/3etsGxdaBUM

[Aseahawkfan]

As much as I would love see McConnell finally out in Kentucky, I have a hard time seeing it, even with the high turnout. I sure hope I’m wrong.

I watched a video of people with black lung in Kentucky that are alive today for no other reason than they have Obamacare, otherwise the treatment at $6k a month is downright impossible to afford. But guess who they voted for president in 2016? Yup. They probably will vote for Trump again, even if it goes against their very lives. That’s how ingrained the party is. It’s completely insane...and sad. The only reason one can give is that Trump promised to ‘repeal and replace’, but does any serious person think Trump or the republican party is actually going to do that if they haven’t done so already? I would have made that bet during his first term, and if he gets a second term, I’d still be willing to bet that all he ever will do if allowed to is to kill it, and not replace it, especially for those with pre-existing conditions. It’s simply not part of the platform, no matter how much Trump says so.

https://youtu.be/3etsGxdaBUM

Both parties are very good at making the other look evil. I imagine in the minds of folks from Kentucky voting for Trump with black lung, they just see a bunch of cop hating, gun taking, freedom taking, money taking Democrats looking to ruin America. Same thing a couple of my buddies here see when they look at Democrats and a few people I work with. All they see when they listen to Democrats is a bunch of supporters of government tyranny and taxation. My one friend literally thinks Democrats hate America and my co-worker thinks Democrats hate white men.

I don't hate Democrats quite as a bad and I'm supportive of unions and nationalized medicine, but only insofar as it supports capitalism in other areas. When I listen to the Democrats talk, it feels like they are so dependent on the far left for votes that all they seem to be wanting to sell America is handout programs, social engineering, and ideas of race and identity that seem to be leading to more division and strife. There doesn't seem to be any appreciation for freedom or love of our Constitution, just empty rhetoric with policies against our Constitution. They want to impose more and more taxes on us. They don't want to hold bad actors accountable for their actions such as drug addicts. They want to keep minorities and "poor" folk thinking of themselves as victims of the system that the Democrats never seem able to fix. They are a very dishonest group of politicians that have this attitude that we know better than you what you need. And as an American I don't want a government telling me what I need. I want one that adheres to the idea of life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness.

The greatest crime we could see in the modern day would be for this nation to finally have the means to be free and for even minorities to finally have the opportunity to be equally free, but for the government to rob us of our freedom through excessive taxes and regulation. That would be terrible.

[RiverDog]

As much as I would love see McConnell finally out in Kentucky, I have a hard time seeing it, even with the high turnout. I sure hope I’m wrong.

I'm still very much a fiscal conservative, but I hope to hell that McConnell gets his arse whipped, for several reasons. The only reason I want to see him win is that I don't want to see one party completely control both the executive and legislative branches.

I watched a video of people with black lung in Kentucky that are alive today for no other reason than they have Obamacare, otherwise the treatment at $6k a month is downright impossible to afford. But guess who they voted for president in 2016? Yup. They probably will vote for Trump again, even if it goes against their very lives. That’s how ingrained the party is. It’s completely insane...and sad. The only reason one can give is that Trump promised to ‘repeal and replace’, but does any serious person think Trump or the republican party is actually going to do that if they haven’t done so already? I would have made that bet during his first term, and if he gets a second term, I’d still be willing to bet that all he ever will do if allowed to is to kill it, and not replace it, especially for those with pre-existing conditions. It’s simply not part of the platform, no matter how much Trump says so.

https://youtu.be/3etsGxdaBUM

We already have a government program that's been in place for over 50 years that's supposed to address that situation, and it's called Medicaid.

Having said that, now that Obamacare is part of our landscape, I am against removing it unless there is a hand-in-hand proposal to replace it. I don't like the idea of moving the goal posts on people without a viable alternative. I don't want to be the person that pulls the carpet out from underneath some poor sucker.

[I-5]

I don't like the idea of moving the goal posts on people without a viable alternative. I don't want to be the person that pulls the carpet out from underneath some poor sucker.

I don't like the idea either...but that is exactly the republican plan. They say 'repeal and replace' but are you willing to bet your life that they'll replace? They show no track record of doing such a thing. And based on the video I watched, it's only due to Obamacare some of these people are still breathing, so I don't think Medicaid covers to that extent.

[I-5]

When I listen to the Democrats talk, it feels like they are so dependent on the far left for votes that all they seem to be wanting to sell America is handout programs, social engineering, and ideas of race and identity that seem to be leading to more division and strife.

I couldn't possibly disagree with you more. You might fashion yourself an independent, but your obvious disdain for anyone left of center makes you look pretty far to the right of Riv, who seems to be more of a moderate based on multiple posts. I'm not saying you're far right because I don't know you, but the more you talk about dems, that's how you sound. I may not like most of the republican party right now, but I have plenty of republican friends who I respect, even the ones who might vote for Trump. I don't villify them for their perspective. And If the dems win in Nov 3, it's moderates and the 'suburban moms' that are going to take them there....not the far left. Not even close.

[c_hawkbob]

I couldn't possibly disagree with you more. You might fashion yourself an independent, but your obvious disdain for anyone left of center makes you look pretty far to the right of Riv, who seems to be more of a moderate based on multiple posts. I'm not saying you're far right because I don't know you, but the more you talk about dems, that's how you sound. I may not like most of the republican party right now, but I have plenty of republican friends who I respect, even the ones who might vote for Trump. I don't villify them for their perspective. And If the dems win in Nov 3, it's moderates and the 'suburban moms' that are going to take them there....not the far left. Not even close.

Agreed on all counts. You've got more patients for it than I have though, I tend to stop reading, or at least start skimming, as soon as someone start in with using the terms 'democrat and 'liberal' as virtual curse words. I have a hard time taking anything they say seriously after that.

[Hawktawk]

It will be 4 years if Biden wins until you are proven wrong. Maybe we'll both be on here. We shall see.

You remember what I wrote. The Republican Party won't experience even a bump in the road from Trump. What you don't seem to get is that Trump was elected because of how insane the Democratic left is. Once super crazy Trump is out of office, the insanity of the Socialist, borderline Communist moderate to extreme left will be on full display again. A moderate Republican will be welcomed back into office by America.

You have been so focused on Trump hate, you have completely ignored how the left has moved so far left with defund the police, tearing down statues, and the like that they have huge problems with their platform that will show up like sore thumbs once Dumb as Dirt out of office.

Remember what I wrote here. We'll see what happens in four years.

Your personal viewpoint is not at all representative of even close to a majority of rational human beings. You weren't rational when you were a Republican. You aren't rational now that you are against them. You don't understand politics. All you understand is your personal opinion which you seem to think affects the price of tea in China.

My personal viewpoint regarding this POTUS is shared by a majority of americans. And FYI the Lincoln Project is not leftists. The Dem ticket is not wild eyed leftists. Trump hate and fear has actually pushed the leadership of the Dem Party to the center as observed by their lightning quick coalescence around Biden when it was clear they were looking at Bernie sanders vs Trump. The party has pulled together. AOC got one minute at the convention and when asked about Biden's comments saying hes "not a green new deal fan" she demurred and said they would be working to address climate change and pointing out trump doesn't even believe in it.. Biden bypassed on Warren, Abrams etc for a candidate with experience in law enforcement.
You have your own bogeymen asea.No rational person supports riots in the streets but I dont remember year long riots under Obama or GW or Clinton or..Maybe since we have our first fascist president its a factor? If someone wants statues removed that offend millions of americans Im over that.

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I'm more afraid of proud boys standing outside polling places, sending threatening Emails to Florida voters saying vote trump or else. I'm way more afraid of China staging hypersonic missiles near taiwan,telling their people to prepare for war, Russian planes menacing our airspace, Kim Jong Un parading a humongous ICBM capable of multiple warheads. My personal viewpoint regarding this potus is shared by thousands of REPUBLICAN intelligence, law enforcement, former 4 star generals and cabinet officers.Presidential campaign managers from numerous Republican presidential administrations. Former republican party chair Michael Steele endorsed Biden yesterday. Are they rational? Or are they not?

frankly the problem in cyberspace is everyone talks a lot of crap but never eats crow when its clear they should. I've eaten plenty which makes me rare. I've eaten crow on Obama. I thought he disrespected the office by golfing too much, too much regulation, too many taxes. I was appalled he appeared without a tie to announce the killing of daniel pearl and was photographed 20 minutes later on the first tee with friends laughing and smiling. I thought he was soft on russia Hindsight is 2020.


I went from a guy who never voted for a democrat, never had a problem supporting any republican to chills down my spine when the orange baboon descended the escalator.I opposed his nomination strenuously. I sounded the alarm that he is not mentally fit to be in the office days into his administration. Now that all the generals not currently in his employ agree maybe I should get some credit for being right and being a man of conviction instead of blindly following someone because there's an R or a D next to their name.As a bipolar man Im emotional, but also very intelligent and a great judge of character. I nailed Trumps character and his danger to the planet day one and was called a loon. Crow is available

As for "understanding politics" maybe you're right. Well actually you are. I dont understand how a single american voter can accept trump at this point regardless of what he's promised them. I dont know how guys Like Lindsey Graham look in the mirror. Mitch McConnell who is slamming though your new favorite jurist but telling Trump not to cut a stimulus deal before the election.I didn't feel any different about the sleazeballs who negotiated Bill Clinton through his absolutely disqualifying behavior either so I'm no hypocrite now.You may well be right about the 2 or 4 year cycle of politics but I dont recall the amount of disarray at the very top of party leadership and frankly Id have put up with 4 years of Sanders to wipe this blot off the history of my lifelong party. I hope Biden is reelected in 4 years in a landslide which will mean something good has happened in america. Its going to be a mess for whoever wins with 6 trillion in spending and 3 trillion in debt not counting all the trillions the FED is dumping into the market. We cant afford too many more failed administrations like this current utter fail. Frankly IMO we will not be a solvent functional country in 4 years or less if trump wins. Might not if Buiden wins either. You're the numbers guy. Its a mess.

[RiverDog]

I don't like the idea of moving the goal posts on people without a viable alternative. I don't want to be the person that pulls the carpet out from underneath some poor sucker.

I don't like the idea either...but that is exactly the republican plan. They say 'repeal and replace' but are you willing to bet your life that they'll replace? They show no track record of doing such a thing. And based on the video I watched, it's only due to Obamacare some of these people are still breathing, so I don't think Medicaid covers to that extent.

As I said, I do not agree with the Republican plan to disassemble Obama Care until they have a viable, equivalent proposal on the table.

As far as Medicaid not covering the situation to the extent you referred to, the original purpose of Medicaid was to address the inequities that you are referring to. Admitting that it doesn't shows the failure of a government run health care program to deliver as promised.

[RiverDog]

My personal viewpoint regarding this POTUS is shared by a majority of americans.

Don't be so facetious. The views you have expressed here in this forum are not anywhere close to those shared by a majority of the public. Biden's polling numbers are barely at the 50% mark and not all of those people hate Trump to anywhere near the same degree that either of us does. Many of them are single issue voters that simply prefer Biden because they think he'll have a better response to the coronavirus.

Biden bypassed on Warren, Abrams etc for a candidate with experience in law enforcement.

Biden bypassed on Warren because she was white. As far as Harris's qualifications, who knows exactly why he picked her other than she fit the criteria given to him of being a woman of color. There are a lot of other parts of her resume, such as being a US Senator and already having an established nation wide campaign team that could merge with his. Personally, I doubt that Harris's background as a prosecuting attorney had a lot to do with her selection, but neither of us know exactly why she's on the ticket and someone like Abrams isn't.

No rational person supports riots in the streets but I dont remember year long riots under Obama or GW or Clinton.

No one openly supports riots in the street, but there are damn sure a lot of otherwise rational people that aren't uncomfortable with them enough to put a stop to them. To a lot of people, the riots are nothing more than collateral damage, like when Timothy McVeigh rationalized his killing of children when he bombed the federal building in OKC. No pain and sacrifice is too great for someone else to bear.

As far as year long riots not occurring under Clinton, Bush, or Obama, they never had a crisis anywhere near the proportion that this pandemic has put upon this country over the past 9 months. We can blame Trump for a lot of things, but we can't blame him for the riots.

[Hawktawk]

So we can't trust the polls when a Republican is winning, but we can when a Democrat is winning? Ok.

I personally doubt McConnell will lose. He's not as associated with Trump as people on here seem to think. I heard his office doesn't even associate much with Trump because he has different coronavirus rules. I rarely him speak well of Trump. McConnell seems to steer clear of Trump. I don't think he likes him myself.

Not sure on Graham, that race is close. Graham has a lot of very bad material on him. He runs his mouth too much. He's clearly been overly supportive of Trump.

Trump looks like he's going to lose, but the moron pulled it out last time. So far the bombs they're trying to drop on Biden aren't working. The mail in voting changes a lot. But supposedly Republican voter registrations are surging. We shall see. My buddy is voting for the first time in 20 years for Trump. He thinks the left is more dangerous for the nation, so he's voting for Trump. Me and my other buddy are likely going independent. One other buddy voted for Trump 2016 and loves him now, thinks myself and my other buddy are wasting our votes not voting for a major party. No idea why people think that as voting should be a representation of the manner you think the nation should be run, not some kind of battle between two evils. I will never buy into this garbage that either of these candidates are going to destroy our Democracy or ruin nation. That's just BS. America been here for 240 plus years and Trump or Biden are going to take us down? I don't think so. I won't buy into that garbage.

So you dont trust generals like Mattis who slept in his uniform he was so terrified of Trump's erratic foreign policy? John Kelley who calls him "the most flawed human being I've ever met". All the people in his administration that have seen the sweating spitting babbling magenta lunatic we see in debates all day every day?

[Hawktawk]

No one openly supports riots in the street, but there are damn sure a lot of otherwise rational people that aren't uncomfortable with them enough to put a stop to them. To a lot of people, the riots are nothing more than collateral damage, like when Timothy McVeigh rationalized his killing of children when he bombed the federal building in OKC. No pain and sacrifice is too great for someone else to bear.

As far as year long riots not occurring under Clinton, Bush, or Obama, they never had a crisis anywhere near the proportion that this pandemic has put upon this country over the past 9 months. We can blame Trump for a lot of things, but we can't blame him for the riots.

I have to disagree. Pandemic weirdness aside the fascist actions of this president in Lafayette square shortly after the Kenosha shoot turbocharged these protests and ended any chance of reconciliation. Embarrassed by accounts he had gone to the white house bunker the evening before during protests and violence he had riot police literally smash peaceful protesters, gas them, shoot them with rubber bullets so he could walk across the street and hold up a bible flanked by the AG and military leadership. Not give a speech or make any statement. Just hold up a bible.

Joint Chiefs chairman Mark Milley apologized to the country saying he was unaware of the nature of the appearance or would not have come. It was this act that fueled Gen Mattis comments that" for the first time in my life we have a president who doesn't even try to unite us. he tries to divide us" . These are astounding comments as are those of John Kelley"most flawed human being I've ever met"

The guy tells the proud boys to stand back and stand by. He spews QAanon theories. These protests are ALL about him NOW regardless of the extenuating issues that caused them to start. You are not naive but come on. Ill give you another example. Back a few years 2017 maybe when the protests had faded and there were maybe 4 guys kneeling then Trump called them SOB's said they should be fired and the next week every team protested, seahawks didn't even leave the locker room, even Jerry jones kneeled. There's no a lot in the middle on Trump RD. 47% STRONGLY disapprove. This is Trumps america, on fire and swept by pandemic with our enemies menacing. We cant take 4 more years of it.

[Hawktawk]

https://dnyuz.com/2020/10/20/trump-reco ... -pursuits/
speaking of potential corruption and poof goes the Biden is a chinese puppet attack angle. Race you to the bottom

[c_hawkbob]

Well at least he pays his taxes in China.

[Hawktawk]

Well at least he pays his taxes in China.

yeah no kidding

[RiverDog]

I have to disagree. Pandemic weirdness aside the fascist actions of this president in Lafayette square shortly after the Kenosha shoot turbocharged these protests and ended any chance of reconciliation. Embarrassed by accounts he had gone to the white house bunker the evening before during protests and violence he had riot police literally smash peaceful protesters, gas them, shoot them with rubber bullets so he could walk across the street and hold up a bible flanked by the AG and military leadership. Not give a speech or make any statement. Just hold up a bible.

I agree that Trump poured fuel on the fire, but even so, his actions were not the source of the riots. It was the pandemic that provided the dry kindling for an underlying issue that's been decades in the making and the George Floyd murder the spark that ignited it.

[Hawktawk]

I stick by my theory to the 80% at least but you have a point . Domestic abuse has skyrocketed. I saw a report that all deaths are up by 300k meaning 100 k deaths have been collateral damage , ods murders, people not going to doctors etc. it’s a mess but when we are banned from Canada it’s not been handled well . Hence the riots are ultimately largely Trumps fault assuming this pandemic is a factor . His mask denying Covid truther lunacy has made a big problem far worse .

[RiverDog]

I stick by my theory to the 80% at least but you have a point . Domestic abuse has skyrocketed. I saw a report that all deaths are up by 300k meaning 100 k deaths have been collateral damage , ods murders, people not going to doctors etc. it’s a mess but when we are banned from Canada it’s not been handled well . Hence the riots are ultimately largely Trumps fault assuming this pandemic is a factor . His mask denying Covid truther lunacy has made a big problem far worse .

I agree that Trump has made the problem worse, both in his inept handling of the pandemic and his incendiary actions he's taken over the course of the past 3.5 years with regard to race relations. But once again, he's not the root cause. He's a contributing factor, mainly responsible for the veracity of the riots, not the riots themselves.

You're right about the other effects of the pandemic. I read an article where Tacoma has already had more murders this year than they have in any one year in over two decades, and it's been all over the city and not just over thing like gangs and drugs. There's no way you can hang all that violence on Trump.

https://www.myjournalcourier.com/news/a ... 648367.php