commander in chief

[Hawktawk]

I always see the polls about what's most important to americans. Its usually the economy followed by this pandemic currently then on and on down the line. I never see commander in chief, national security anymore.

Correct me if I'm wrong on that but if I'm right there is just a stunning level of disconnect between americans sense of security and the current realities. Russia is menacing in europe, buzzing our airspace off Alaska in nuclear capable bombers at a rate as high as the cold war. They now have the world's largest and most sophisticated modern sub fleet and they are flooding the atlantic with an unprecedented number of them, three times as many as ever before to be exact. They have built the world's largest and most modern Nuke missile inventory including an ICBM dubbed Satan 2 that has such a massive payload it could wipe out texas with one missile carrying multiple warheads. Putin announced the missile at a press conference that featured a video animation of the missile striking Mara Lago btw. In contrast America still relies on some ICBMs from the 1980s although we are in the process of upgrading .They have hacked into our power grid and are suspected of a bizarre attack on a power station in california using heavy machine guns. They have snooped around our undersea communications cables with subs.

I could go on but enough about russia. China's hypersonic missile inventory poses a direct threat to the united states navy. Despite Trump going on and on about our hydrosonic missiles made by water pick apparently we simply are not at their level with the technology yet. They have the world's largest navy now too and are behaving in a menacing way in the south china sea, building artificial islands to stage weaponry etc.Menacing Taiwan.

Last but not least Putin said the other day he would not rule out an alliance militarily with China.He and Xei have met dozens of times during the Trump presidency.

Then there's Iran and NK, both far ahead of where they were 4 years ago. NK is definitely capable of hitting the US mainland with an ICBM according to military experts and may have as many as 50 warheads. They have enough conventional missiles to flatten SK
Iran started enriching again in defiance of the US after the deal was cancelled.

I dont want this to be just another anti trump rant other than to say exit polls in 2016 showed I believe at least 25% of Trump voters DIDN'T BELIEVE HE HAD THE TEMPERAMENT AND FITNESS TO BE COMMANDER IN CHIEF!!! I was astounded by that then and Im even more astounded now 4 years in to this presidents words and actions. My thoughts are known ad infinitum and I dont want to just beat the dead horse. Thousands have spoken to unfitness now,Generals, intelligence people influential people, career politicians committing career suicide. Yet we are possibly a few days from handing this guy the nuclear football for another 4 years.

We need a steady hand on the wheel in this dangerous world more than ever.

[Aseahawkfan]

This world is the least dangerous in history. I'm not sure what historical backing you have that this world is in a dangerous state. We are more interconnected, more aware, able to communicate better than we ever have. A few small dictators destined to fall does not change this. No nation has the motivation to go to war and we don't live in a colonial world. I have no idea if you spent much time reading on the causes of World War 1 and 2, but much of it had to do with old world colonial attitudes. For example, following World War 1 the colonial powers of Europe were dividing up the Middle East and Africa and one of the motivations for Germany to make war was to expand their empire because they missed out on the colonization of the rest of the world. One of the major catalysts of World War 2 was more of a continuation of World War 1 because the other European colonial powers like England and France had imposed too great a sanctions on Germany creating a economic situation that pushed Germany to the brink of economic collapse. German nationalism led to an economic rebirth and new desire to expand and conquer the same enemies from World War 1.

None of those catalysts exist in the current world environment. Our biggest concerns are regional instability versus any chance of a world war. No one has any tolerance or desire for military expansion as it is bad for business. Everyone's economy is intertwined. World leaders meet on a continuous basis to discussion economic and security matters.

There's just not the factors there to fuel any kind of world war. No one has the capability to conquer the other. It would all be too costly and there is no motivation to sustain a war for any people.

I would say the main national security concerns are economic. China is the main economic concern for anyone that isn't China. They are a large, economically powerful nation that is not playing fair in the world market. They are taking advantage of nations with open economic systems, while they maintain an insular, protected economic environment with tightly controlled currency, ownership requirements, technology, and the like.

On top of that, I do not want to be murdering or warring with any other group of people. Not Chinese, not Russians, not Middle Eastern folk, none of that trash. I hope these other nations as well as our own stop trying to use each other as pawns in some strange violent game of control. It is unnecessary, foolish, and costly. Russia is a poor nation that needs to do more to help their people prosper. China needs to treat their people better as well. We don't need to enter that situation in a war to harm anyone in either of those nations or vice versa. So any of this fear-mongering garbage making it seem like we need to go to war is nothing I'm buying.

[RiverDog]

I always see the polls about what's most important to americans. Its usually the economy followed by this pandemic currently then on and on down the line. I never see commander in chief, national security anymore.

Correct me if I'm wrong on that but if I'm right there is just a stunning level of disconnect between americans sense of security and the current realities. Russia is menacing in europe, buzzing our airspace off Alaska in nuclear capable bombers at a rate as high as the cold war. They now have the world's largest and most sophisticated modern sub fleet and they are flooding the atlantic with an unprecedented number of them, three times as many as ever before to be exact. They have built the world's largest and most modern Nuke missile inventory including an ICBM dubbed Satan 2 that has such a massive payload it could wipe out texas with one missile carrying multiple warheads. Putin announced the missile at a press conference that featured a video animation of the missile striking Mara Lago btw. In contrast America still relies on some ICBMs from the 1980s although we are in the process of upgrading .They have hacked into our power grid and are suspected of a bizarre attack on a power station in california using heavy machine guns. They have snooped around our undersea communications cables with subs.

I could go on but enough about russia. China's hypersonic missile inventory poses a direct threat to the united states navy. Despite Trump going on and on about our hydrosonic missiles made by water pick apparently we simply are not at their level with the technology yet. They have the world's largest navy now too and are behaving in a menacing way in the south china sea, building artificial islands to stage weaponry etc.Menacing Taiwan.

Last but not least Putin said the other day he would not rule out an alliance militarily with China.He and Xei have met dozens of times during the Trump presidency.

Then there's Iran and NK, both far ahead of where they were 4 years ago. NK is definitely capable of hitting the US mainland with an ICBM according to military experts and may have as many as 50 warheads. They have enough conventional missiles to flatten SK
Iran started enriching again in defiance of the US after the deal was cancelled.

I dont want this to be just another anti trump rant other than to say exit polls in 2016 showed I believe at least 25% of Trump voters DIDN'T BELIEVE HE HAD THE TEMPERAMENT AND FITNESS TO BE COMMANDER IN CHIEF!!! I was astounded by that then and Im even more astounded now 4 years in to this presidents words and actions. My thoughts are known ad infinitum and I dont want to just beat the dead horse. Thousands have spoken to unfitness now,Generals, intelligence people influential people, career politicians committing career suicide. Yet we are possibly a few days from handing this guy the nuclear football for another 4 years.

We need a steady hand on the wheel in this dangerous world more than ever.

You're over stating the national security issue. It's certainly a concern, but it doesn't top the major topics in this election: The coronavirus response and economic recovery.

The economy is always at or near the top of any election, but national security has a tendency to wax and wane. It was a big issue in 2004 in the aftermath of 9/11 and the Iraq War, but quite naturally, it's not an issue in this election.

[Hawktawk]

So the last actual baboon sighting was in the wee hours of wednesday AM when he got up in the hallowed room of the white house, the people's house and declared he had won and ordered votes stopped with 25 million plus out. His demeanor was frightening,a look of barely restrained fury on his face , sniffing deeply to get the remaining crushed adderall out of his nose as he spoke like a few other times I've seen him do the same thing. Just google Trump/adderall if you have any questions about the claims of others that he snorts the substance including allegations from conservative historian Max Boot that he does it in the white house.

Trump made no public appearances yesterday at all, sending out Giuliani and his wimp pink handed son Eric to plead his case as he mad tweeted in all caps, utter falsehoods and conspiracy theories that even twitter has flagged. Its increasingly looking like the man has in fact lost and so now we have an unfit madman more triggered than he has ever been in his life,deranged and furious, quite possibly abusing speed who will remain commander in chief for nearly 3 months more..I'm more relieved at the thought of Joe Biden behind the controls but were not there yet.

[RiverDog]

So the last actual baboon sighting was in the wee hours of wednesday AM when he got up in the hallowed room of the white house, the people's house and declared he had won and ordered votes stopped with 25 million plus out. His demeanor was frightening,a look of barely restrained fury on his face , sniffing deeply to get the remaining crushed adderall out of his nose as he spoke like a few other times I've seen him do the same thing. Just google Trump/adderall if you have any questions about the claims of others that he snorts the substance including allegations from conservative historian Max Boot that he does it in the white house.

Trump made no public appearances yesterday at all, sending out Giuliani and his wimp pink handed son Eric to plead his case as he mad tweeted in all caps, utter falsehoods and conspiracy theories that even twitter has flagged. Its increasingly looking like the man has in fact lost and so now we have an unfit madman more triggered than he has ever been in his life,deranged and furious, quite possibly abusing speed who will remain commander in chief for nearly 3 months more..I'm more relieved at the thought of Joe Biden behind the controls but were not there yet.

Yeah, there's going to be a lot of drama, but it won't last long as the electoral college meets in early December. There's bound to be some isolated incidents of violence, but my guess is that it will pale in comparison to what we've gone through this summer.

Like I said, don't pay attention to the noise.

[Aseahawkfan]

And just like I predicted Republican leadership is not protecting Trump. They are in fact stating clearly they will go with the election results. They are even supporting letting mail in ballots be counted. They are fine with the election process.

Only people trying to seed waters concerning election fraud are the Trump supporters, not many of the other leaders of the Republican Party.

And if the Senate stays Red. We're all good.

And this mess gets handed over to Biden and the Democrats with a Republican stopgap.

Then in 4 years if the Republican Party can field a nice centrist Republican, they can take back the White House from a 81 year old Biden and a Kamala Harris unlikely to be very popular. Fact of the matter is this election was a result of Trump's handling of the coronavirus like I stated. If not for corona, Trump would have won fairly easily. Not a landslide, but a solid win.

This closeness of this election is a bigger acknowledgment of how many people despise the vision that American Democrats have for this nation. I can't wait for Trump to be gone, so people like Hawktawk can see how crazy the Democratic platform is again.

[RiverDog]

This closeness of this election is a bigger acknowledgment of how many people despise the vision that American Democrats have for this nation. I can't wait for Trump to be gone, so people like Hawktawk can see how crazy the Democratic platform is again.

It's not just the closeness of the Presidential race. It's the Dem's failure to re-take the Senate and lose seats in the House. Especially given the huge advantages the Democrats had going into the election, which includes a very caustic and divisive Presidential candidate and a huge numbers advantage in the Senate, Biden had zero coattails. We've been told for decades that a high turnout favors the Dems, and this was the biggest turnout in over a century.

The Dems need to take a long look at themselves in the mirror. The nation is telling them something.

[I-5]

The Dems need to take a long look at themselves in the mirror. The nation is telling them something.

I think that's definitely the conservative perspective (which is legit). My democrat friends are coming to a different takeaway. They are somewhat shocked to find that nearly half the country is ok with a xenophobic, narcissistic misogynist. Maybe both are true.

[RiverDog]

The Dems need to take a long look at themselves in the mirror. The nation is telling them something.

I think that's definitely the conservative perspective (which is legit). My democrat friends are coming to a different takeaway. They are somewhat shocked to find that nearly half the country is ok with a xenophobic, narcissistic misogynist. Maybe both are true.

People have different reasons for voting like they do. Some don't give to hoots in hell about Trump's personality and vote strictly on ideology. They aren't like Hillary Clinton classified them as being, a pack of racists, ie 'deplorables'.

Trump won Florida by painting Biden as a socialist. Whether or not that was fair or not is beside the point. They're afraid of a Democratic presidency because of their socialistic agenda. He was competitive in Nevada because people there have been hurt disproportionally by the shutdowns caused by the pandemic. In the rust belt, people are concerned about Biden's failure to come out against a fracking ban. I don't know how many people think like me, but I blame much of the violence this summer on big city Democrats. Indeed, that was the message Mack was telling us as to why he voted for Trump, and I hardly think that he's a "deplorable".

[Hawktawk]

I think that's definitely the conservative perspective (which is legit). My democrat friends are coming to a different takeaway. They are somewhat shocked to find that nearly half the country is ok with a xenophobic, narcissistic misogynist. Maybe both are true.

THIS RIGHT HERE^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Im stunned its close. I'm sad. nearly half this country will support a miserable nasty psychopath who has spent 4 years proving his unfitness on a daily basis.

And I see your comments Asea. I UNDERSTAND THE LEFT WING IS WHACKED. But Trump is a racist madman. I fear a racist madman far more than a centrist president with absolutely no ability to adopt a left wing program if he wanted to which he does not. Sleepy Joe was highly underestimated by many but not me. He's going to win in an electoral landslide, win states democrats haven't won in decades.Biden will pull 80 million votes.Not because people love Biden but because they fear this cult, this virus known as the trump party.

[RiverDog]

I think that's definitely the conservative perspective (which is legit). My democrat friends are coming to a different takeaway. They are somewhat shocked to find that nearly half the country is ok with a xenophobic, narcissistic misogynist. Maybe both are true.

THIS RIGHT HERE^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Im stunned its close. I'm sad. nearly half this country will support a miserable nasty psychopath who has spent 4 years proving his unfitness on a daily basis.

You're reaction is exactly what I'm talking about. The liberal left is simply tone deaf. They can't see through their hate of Trump and analyze why nearly half the nation voted for him in two separate elections 4 years apart rather than the alternatives they were presented with. If almost 50% supports someone or some group, you can't write it off to just some random cult movement. The nation isn't that gullible to where half of us willingly jump in the Kool-Aid line. Common sense tells us that something else is at work.

If there isn't more self reflection from people like you, we aren't going to unite the nation. We'll all stay in our separate corners.

[c_hawkbob]

BS, you're doing quite exactly what you're saying the "liberal left" is doing even by continuing to refer to them as such. Quit pretending you above the mire you're wading in.

[RiverDog]

BS, you're doing quite exactly what you're saying the "liberal left" is doing even by continuing to refer to them as such. Quit pretending you above the mire you're wading in.

Alright, so what do you want me to refer to the far left as? Progressives? I'll put whatever label you like on them.

[c_hawkbob]

BS, you're doing quite exactly what you're saying the "liberal left" is doing even by continuing to refer to them as such. Quit pretending you above the mire you're wading in.

Alright, so what do you want me to refer to the far left as? Progressives? I'll put whatever label you like on them.

It doesn't matter as long as your mind is still stuck on 'us vs them' rather than 'we'. There is more common ground in most peoples thinking thinking than this whole "left/right, red/blue, liberal/conservative' dynamic can accommodate. I'm sick to death of the politics of hate.

[RiverDog]

BS, you're doing quite exactly what you're saying the "liberal left" is doing even by continuing to refer to them as such. Quit pretending you above the mire you're wading in.

Alright, so what do you want me to refer to the far left as? Progressives? I'll put whatever label you like on them.

It doesn't matter as long as your mind is still stuck on 'us vs them' rather than 'we'. There is more common ground in most peoples thinking thinking than this whole "left/right, red/blue, liberal/conservative' dynamic can accommodate. I'm sick to death of the politics of hate.

I thought it did matter as you rapped my knuckles for referring to "them" as the "liberal left". But be that as it may.

I'm right there with you as far as being sick to death to the politics of hate. I was giving my opinion regarding what lessons we should be drawing from this wholly unexpected election, and apparently you disagree with my take, which is fine. What, if any, conclusions have you drawn from this election? You had to have been just as surprised as the rest of us were.

[c_hawkbob]

I haven't drawn any conclusions yet, I'll save that for the conclusion of this election. I would however like to see these election maps in shades of purple though instead of all the same shade of either blue or red.

[RiverDog]

I haven't drawn any conclusions yet, I'll save that for the conclusion of this election. I would however like to see these election maps in shades of purple though instead of all the same shade of either blue or red.

I agree about the red state vs. blue state designation. That's one of the things that the media has adapted that has the effect of dividing us into groups.

[Hawktawk]

Polls I saw this morning show that 93% of the hardest hit counties with the virus per capita in america voted for trump. Superspreader covid 45. And 48% of the country want to sign us all up for 4 more years????

I dont need to do any reflecting about my position on trump or his enablers as a guy who voted straight ticket R for 4 decades. For never Trump republicans it was about the man, the pathological narcissism, the unhinged behavior, the hundreds of tweets some days in all caps. The entire year out of 4 he spent golfing on our dime.The scandals and the corruption on a scale never seen in a president. The nasty combative demeanor, the relentless attack on our institutions, our free and adversarial media, the constitution, the rule of law.The destruction of the dignity, the decorum, the pageantry of the american presidency and lets not forget the faith of americans in their elections which he has pounded the theme for 5 years and now he has armed protesters menacing poll workers.This scares me way more than some dumb ass rioters fighting with white supremacists in some democratic cesspool. Portland and seattle mayor's are not the president.They aren't Joe Biden who has called for an end to this violence"Looting and rioting is not protesting". But the low information Trumpanzees bought the joe is a socialist thing hook line and sinker.Trumps actions fuel these protests.

Trump is trying to launch an civil war to hold an office when he has been roundly defeated in a free and fair election. It was the highest turnout in over a hundred years. Biden will easily bank the most votes in history and Trump the second most. Both bases turned out. But anyone who thinks thousands of poll workers in numerous red and blue states would risk their freedom out of hatred for trump is delusional. If that were the case the Dems wouldnt have lost seats and failed to capture the senate.If you're gonna rig it rig it right?

This was a referendum on DJT by a nation that split their vote and he needs to GTFO. He has told aides he will"never concede" will not attend Bidens inauguration etc. He will give some sort of a speech tonight i'm sure trying to incite more violence before or after Bidens anticipated victory speech which will sound presidential and will be the first presidential sounding utterance from a president in 4 years.

Its becoming sedition IMO and that of many experts.He's suing republican election officials to start counts, stop counts etc. He really should be removed from power immediately upon the call of this election and Pence serve the remainder of his term under the 25th amendment.But many party operatives and some politicians feel continuing a fight they know is a loser based on lies will help them down the road with their base. The base is the problem. DJT should never have gotten out of the primaries and that he did and came so close to 4 more years is a scary thing for america.Im sickened actually to see what's become of the party of Lincoln and Reagan.

He's not fit. America has been damn near ruined by this grifter. If they run anyone named trump out in 4 years the same damn thing is gonna happen. Im all for some of what both parties have top offer, against much as well but either the guy can fly the plane or he cant.
He couldn't. I hope Joe pulls us out of this death spiral.

[I-5]

Trump is trying to launch an civil war to hold an office when he has been roundly defeated in a free and fair election. It was the highest turnout in over a hundred years. Biden will easily bank the most votes in history and Trump the second most. Both bases turned out. But anyone who thinks thousands of poll workers in numerous red and blue states would risk their freedom out of hatred for trump is delusional. If that were the case the Dems wouldnt have lost seats and failed to capture the senate.If you're gonna rig it rig it right?

He absolutely doesn't care about the country and actively would support a civil war if it keeps him in power, and more importantly, out of prison. As far as I'm concerned, he is by far the biggest national security threat, with his words and actions. More than Russia or China.

[RiverDog]

Trump is trying to launch an civil war to hold an office when he has been roundly defeated in a free and fair election. It was the highest turnout in over a hundred years. Biden will easily bank the most votes in history and Trump the second most. Both bases turned out. But anyone who thinks thousands of poll workers in numerous red and blue states would risk their freedom out of hatred for trump is delusional. If that were the case the Dems wouldnt have lost seats and failed to capture the senate.If you're gonna rig it rig it right?

He absolutely doesn't care about the country and actively would support a civil war if it keeps him in power, and more importantly, out of prison. As far as I'm concerned, he is by far the biggest national security threat, with his words and actions. More than Russia or China.

I don't doubt that Trump would try to physically retain power and stay out of jail if he could, but you honestly feel that he's by far our biggest national security threat? Do you genuinely think that there would be anyone with any kind of authority in our military that would join such an effort?

[I-5]

I don't doubt that Trump would try to physically retain power and stay out of jail if he could, but you honestly feel that he's by far our biggest national security threat? Do you genuinely think that there would be anyone with any kind of authority in our military that would join such an effort?

Whether or not the military leaders resist his efforts (thanks God), it doesn't diminish his irresponsibility. He can do a lot of damage in the Oval Office, much easier than a foreign adversary can. Inviting the russian ambassador to the Oval Office and banishing the US press was a shock, having his son in law attempt to set up a private channel through the russian embassy, willingly/unwillingly sharing classified information with other countries. The list can go on and on.

[RiverDog]

Whether or not the military leaders resist his efforts (thanks God), it doesn't diminish his irresponsibility. He can do a lot of damage in the Oval Office, much easier than a foreign adversary can. Inviting the russian ambassador to the Oval Office and banishing the US press was a shock, having his son in law attempt to set up a private channel through the russian embassy, willingly/unwillingly sharing classified information with other countries. The list can go on and on.

As if he hasn't had that opportunity for the past 3+ years. Sorry if I don't join you in your sleepless nights.

I'm actually overjoyed, especially if the R's can hold onto the Senate. I'm not so naive to believe that all of our problems will be over on January 20th, but at least it will be a good start to a new year. This election has been one of the very few good things that's happened in 2020.

[Hawktawk]

[quote="I-5"

He absolutely doesn't care about the country and actively would support a civil war if it keeps him in power, and more importantly, out of prison. As far as I'm concerned, he is by far the biggest national security threat, with his words and actions. More than Russia or China.[/quote]

Yeah agree completely. Its what the thread is about. Hes allowed these countries to become more menacing and they have. But its the loony toon thing Ive seen from day one that people just poo poo.Saying he "fell in love" with Kin Jong Un, exchanged 8 letters while they muilt and tested an ICBM and pounded out as many as 50 warheads. Put us on the brink of all out war with Iran but doesn't say a peep about Putin's menacing actions. Jim Mattis Yakima native and great american slept in uniform he was so afraid of the erratic commander in chief and what he might do, what he might start.Its staggering the number of people from his cabinet have repudiated him and spoken to his unfitness. Its chilling to think about what the man could do as lame duck commander in chief. He's desperate. He could very well spend the rest of his life in prison with the investigations put on hold only by his status as a sitting president and he knows it,its leaked he has discussed it with confidants. Its a scary scary time right now. Its why the doomsday clock is 55 seconds to midnight.

Competence matters more than ever.This is the worst lame duck president in history.

[RiverDog]

Jim Mattis Yakima native and great american...

Mattis is a native of Richland, WA. They've had several articles on him here in our local newspaper and he has done some public service ads about COVID for local TV stations. I have a friend that met him personally when Mattis was Trump's defense secretary, said that Mattis came up to him and struck up a conversation. He also showed up unannounced at a bar in Prosser around Christmas in 2017 and hung out with the patrons. He's one of the reasons why I trust our military leaders more than I do our elected politicians.

Biden would be well advised to offer Mattis the defense secretary position in his cabinet.

[Hawktawk]

My bad I knew he was from that general area. My understanding he's a super cool guy and in a perfect world he would not be political like this. But his resignation following Trump getting off the phone with Turkish strongman Erogadon and immediately ordering our mechanized armor out of syria made him the object of Trump's scorn.

He falsely claimed he fired Mattis, questioned his intelligence,said he was wrong a lot. Thousands of Kurds who we relied on in our war on ISIS died in a slaughter by Syrian and Turkish forces which pissed off a lot of US military who were serving along side them for years. ISIS regrouped and is conducting international terror attacks again exactly like Mattis said they would. Oh and BTW the armor went back into Syria rather quietly a few months ago.Bolton said the decision to pull troops was to benefit him personally$$$ with Turkey and that he makes foreign and military policy all the time to help himself. Maybe along with the suckers and losers comments that's why Biden is the first Dem in forever to be holding his own and actually gaining ground among active duty military.

Maybe not a good idea hiring a failed international real estate developer with interests all over the globe financially to run a country with interests all over the globe. Especially if he's unwell mentally and extremely dishonest and has not even pretended to divest from his organization. These president/ business dynamics will be in play till Jan 20.

He already got almost 300 million in unpaid loans written off his first term, may have committed tax fraud as president actually, and tax documents obtain by the NYT show he's got almost half a billion in personally guaranteed signature loans due in the next 2 years. He has no way to legally pay them. He's in deep doo doo. I read an article by a highly placed counterintelligence expert who said Trump is a classic flight risk. Fly AF1 to a foreign country and declare asylum,refuse to reboard much like Cuban athletes in the day. etc etc etc. Get on someones private jet. I know it aint Mara Lago but it beats rotting in jail. He's truly in very bad legal jeopardy.

I could go on. Yes he is our greatest national security threat. that anyone would think its even ok to have to debate whether the military would go along with some crazy wag the dog plan to hold on to power just demonstrates what a crazy loon we have for the next 3 months. I'm stunned he didn't come out railing after Joe Biden's remarks. Maybe its sinking in or they have him sedated or something. We can check twitter I guess. If its crazy all caps its him.

[I-5]

I'd be on board with bringing back General Mattis. He was the ONLY cabinet member from the Trump administration that I respected.

I think Trump as a lame duck is more dangerous than Trump as president. There is no one I can think of who is more childish and vindictive, and I could easily see him doing his best to sabotage his successor, unlike how he might act if he was preparing for his second term. It's simply human nature 101 for narcissists.

[Aseahawkfan]

Biden is unlikely to go with Mattis.

From Wiki: "He also criticized Obama for seeing allies as "free-loading", saying: "For a sitting US President to see our allies as freeloaders is nuts."[157] He has cited the importance of the United Arab Emirates and Jordan as countries that wanted to help, for example, in filling in the gaps in Afghanistan. He criticized Obama's defense strategy as giving "the perception we're pulling back" from US allies.[158] He stresses the need for the US to bolster its ties with allied intelligence agencies, particularly those of Jordan, Egypt and Saudi Arabia.[159] In 2012 Mattis argued for providing weapons to Syrian rebels as a way to fight back against Iranian proxies in Syria.[160]"

Mattis was critical of the Obama Admin. He is more a military interventionist, likes to keep our military deployed in foreign nations. Not something I think Biden will focus much on.

[Aseahawkfan]

He absolutely doesn't care about the country and actively would support a civil war if it keeps him in power, and more importantly, out of prison. As far as I'm concerned, he is by far the biggest national security threat, with his words and actions. More than Russia or China.

This trash again. You're like left wing version of an Alex Jones type, just buying all this conspiracy crap.

Trump will leave office. No one will support his efforts. He's not a threat to national security. He's all done. There won't be any Civil War or anything of the kind. It will be the usual handover on January 20. Trump will rant a bit, finally be talked down, then leave office. He won't do anything that will cause more headaches other than maybe make a deal to clear his legal troubles or sign in some stimulus for one last cheer from his followers.

Stop building Trump into worse than he is. Yon and hawktawk just crazy. I had to listen to this same crap from conservatives with Obama. He's going to launch a coup. He's going to for a third term. He's a danger to national security. He's a Muslim not even born here.

Now I listen to this crap from Trump haters exaggerating his power and effect on the nation. That is one thing I will be happy to hopefully see gone from the national dialogue. Only problem is I'll now be hearing this about Biden as I already have a few friends thinking Biden is the end of the world, he'll institute socialism, take everyone's guns, and turn us super left with AOC manipulating him like she's some puppet master.

Man, what I wouldn't do to find a way to cleanse the lunacy from humanity. The things humans believe is unreal with barely any proof to back up what they believe other than innuendo, rumor, and exaggerated supposition.

[I-5]

This trash again. You're like left wing version of an Alex Jones type, just buying all this conspiracy crap.

And the more you spew hyperbole, the more you sound like a right wing lunatic...just throwing it back at you. What is outlandish about describing Trump accurately, since he has acted unpresidential the entire time he's been in the White House? Do you think I'm describing him in a way that isn't consistent with what he has been demonstrating repeatedly? The paranoia about Obama is a non-sequiter because he isn't all those things that the far right describe (muslim, not a US citizen, etc).

Of course Trump will leave office. No one hear said wouldn't leave. It's the manner we're discussing. Calm down. In a way, I think you are the most reactionary on this board, and there isn't anyone close.

[Hawktawk]

Now Trump is not only refusing to concede but considering holding I got cheated rallies in the swing states he lost. Campaign manager Bill Stepien released a statement saying he may need Trump supporters in the streets waving flags and chanting his name. If this happens I'm sure they will be maskless and packing around long guns.His team is giving no help whatever to the Biden transition.

What a freak, what a tiny little 74 year old baby. Worst president in american history by miles and still proving ity on a daily basis . I remember 2000 when Al Gore who I absolutely did not support one minute wound up losing by 500 votes in an election where he carried the popular vote. Having CALLED Bush election night to offer congratulations he CALLED BACK and retracted it as the Florida vote tightened to a razor thin margin. His court challenge of the ballot rigging in urban areas was serious and very nearly overturned the original counts until the SCOTUS stepped in. Immediately upon their ruling stopping the recount Al Gore formally conceded to George Bush in a gracious dignified manner in A TELEVISED SPEECH. Hillary lost by a far smaller vote margin in the upper midwest and called and graciously concede to a man she loathed who had personally insulted her for months on end.

The back story from the 2000 election is that the Bush transition team was greatly delayed in getting up to speed and 8 months in 911 happened. Now we are in far greater peril than the attack that the Fuctoplous blamed on GW, said he didn't protect us on 911.


Trump will allow this crisis to continue to worsen as he has for months rather than be a leader. He's dropped out of sight other than golf.wild conspiracy theories in all caps on twitter and dispatching lawyers. He's abandoned america and a few of his bobblehead sycophants like lap dog lindsey and Kevin McCarthy are urging him to press on, to never concede or congratulate Biden. These people are despicable feeding the ego of a narcissistic madman.America hasn't been less great in my lifetime.For them its about 2 senate runoffs and their own political futures if they cross the orange baboon. Despicable . I've read articles discussing concern about a "rudderless" pentagon during this particular transition to return to the subject. We dont have a commander in chief..

Its impossible to make trump out to be worse than he is. He earns his hate. Its not fake news. GTFO of the people's house grifter. Jail to the thief. I hope we make it to Jan 20 in one piece.

[Hawktawk]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics ... li=BBorjTa
Another destabilizing move, utterly pointless other than to settle a score for some perceived grievance by the 74 year old infant as our enemies menace more every day. Now the pentagon is truly rudderless. who is signing up for 70 days of this?

[Hawktawk]

https://www.usnews.com/news/national-ne ... ction-loss
A little meat on the bone here. As I've said elsewhere Esper is quoted as saying "who comes after me? Some yes man and then GOD HELP US" I saw a military analyst point out that trump had asked esper to put active duty military on US streets and he had refused, also Esper had apologized for being dragged into Trumps fascist photo op after smashing peaceful protesters in lafayette square. Now he's gone with 70 days to go. What does happen? How many troop withdrawals? How many sweet deals for despots. Will Trump force the US military to make a choice? Whos going to stop him?
This evil man will burn america down if he's allowed to.

[I-5]

The Secretary of State is in denial (no surprise, since he violated the law during the campaign), he is fully on board trying to undermine the results of the election, with zero evidence. At some point, ALL of them will need to be escorted out. No panic, but that will be some good TV.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4922286/secretary-pompeo-there-smooth-transition-trump-administration&fbclid=IwAR3p7Y4g7X46rhRPmMCAQLPYVTys8Xdv7-EwXj8qZB63iQZg9B-EcwoCYRs#

[RiverDog]

Look, folks. If you've been awake during these past 4 years, you shouldn't be surprised at any of Trump's actions. This fits perfectly with his narcissist personality. He cannot admit defeat. He's a spoiled rich kid that's been pampered all his life. We're going to be subjected to frivolous lawsuits and meaningless recounts for the next several weeks right up until the electoral college meets in mid December, so you might as well get used to it.

I'm a lot more interested in Biden's cabinet selections and his plan to address the COVID crisis than I am in anything that Trump is doing.

[mykc14]

Look, folks. If you've been awake during these past 4 years, you shouldn't be surprised at any of Trump's actions. This fits perfectly with his narcissist personality. He cannot admit defeat. He's a spoiled rich kid that's been pampered all his life. We're going to be subjected to frivolous lawsuits and meaningless recounts for the next several weeks right up until the electoral college meets in mid December, so you might as well get used to it.

I'm a lot more interested in Biden's cabinet selections and his plan to address the COVID crisis than I am in anything that Trump is doing.

This is where I'm at as well. Trump is going to do his normal thing. I actually don't mind us investigating for voter fraud because I think it is rampant on both sides. I don't think it was enough to change the outcome of the election, but I do think we should root it out and try to figure out ways to stop it in the future. I also don't think he's going to burn the country down like CNN would have people believe. I do think he's going to do what he can politically and within the inner workings of the White House to make the transition as hard as possible on Biden. As far as his cabinet I'm also interested. Hopefully it's as moderate as possible.

[I-5]

I completely agree. However, without the Trump team's cooperation (through the General Services arm), President-elect Biden is prevented from receiving: a) daily intelligence briefings and b) about $6M in discretionary funds to assist in the transition process. I also saw a post that up to 40% of republicans don't believe it was a fair election...of course, had they won, would they feel differently?

[RiverDog]

Look, folks. If you've been awake during these past 4 years, you shouldn't be surprised at any of Trump's actions. This fits perfectly with his narcissist personality. He cannot admit defeat. He's a spoiled rich kid that's been pampered all his life. We're going to be subjected to frivolous lawsuits and meaningless recounts for the next several weeks right up until the electoral college meets in mid December, so you might as well get used to it.

I'm a lot more interested in Biden's cabinet selections and his plan to address the COVID crisis than I am in anything that Trump is doing.

This is where I'm at as well. Trump is going to do his normal thing. I actually don't mind us investigating for voter fraud because I think it is rampant on both sides. I don't think it was enough to change the outcome of the election, but I do think we should root it out and try to figure out ways to stop it in the future. I also don't think he's going to burn the country down like CNN would have people believe. I do think he's going to do what he can politically and within the inner workings of the White House to make the transition as hard as possible on Biden. As far as his cabinet I'm also interested. Hopefully it's as moderate as possible.

I don't mind investigating possible election fraud, either, and I do think that Trump has raised some valid points, like mailing out ballots to all registered voters rather than just those that voted in the previous election. There's hundreds of thousands of unaccounted ballots that never get returned. If a person isn't interested enough to vote in the previous election, then they should have to opt in for the next one. The other thing I would like to do is get USPS out of the loop for the majority of Americans and go to drop off locations instead, both for security reasons and for matters of expedience in validating ballots and tabulating results.

[I-5]

I actually don't mind us investigating for voter fraud because I think it is rampant on both sides.

Fraud? Says who? Are you saying there are politically motivated employees within the election process doing harmful actions to benefit their own interest?

[c_hawkbob]

Yeah "massive" voter fraud is a myth. It's always small scale and sporadic if it exists at all.

[RiverDog]

I completely agree. However, without the Trump team's cooperation (through the General Services arm), President-elect Biden is prevented from receiving: a) daily intelligence briefings and b) about $6M in discretionary funds to assist in the transition process. I also saw a post that up to 40% of republicans don't believe it was a fair election...of course, had they won, would they feel differently?

I agree with that take, too. There is absolutely no justifiable reason not to start the transition process, and I, too, am outraged at Trump's attitude during the aftermath of the election. It's having a tangible effect on the country.

I'm reminded of an event in July of 1945 where British Prime Minister Winston Churchill took his political opponent, Clement Attlee, with him to the Potsdam Conference to meet with Harry Truman and Joseph Stalin. Britain was in the middle of an election and Churchill wanted to make sure that if he lost, which he ultimately did, that his successor would have the experience of dealing with the two major post war power brokers and have a clear understanding of any agreements they reached. Can you imagine Donald Trump having that kind of concern for our country and the world?