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Some people rise to the occasion. I feel as though Biden is rising to this challenge. His messaging of a unified nation hopefully carries through. One thing about this nation in its past we usually come together when times were tough like now.
I hope he can convince some of these Republicans to finally step up on their own on behalf of the nation. Clean the Trump stink off themselves.

Aseahawkfan wrote:Some people rise to the occasion. I feel as though Biden is rising to this challenge. His messaging of a unified nation hopefully carries through. One thing about this nation in its past we usually come together when times were tough like now.
I hope he can convince some of these Republicans to finally step up on their own on behalf of the nation. Clean the Trump stink off themselves.

In general, I like his message, too. But I think he's a little premature in his asking Americans to mask up for 'only' 100 days, which gets us to May 1st or thereabouts. We don't even have an approved vaccine yet. Too many things could go wrong, either with unexpected side effects or with distribution problems, that could cause us not to have this pandemic under control by then. Outside of that, I haven't a complaint about how Sleepy Joe has been putting together his administration. For the most part, he's maintained a low profile in Trump's efforts to overturn the election. He doesn't need any superficial distractions that aren't going to help him in his mission.

As long as we're on the subject of messaging, I really like what 3 of our former POTUS's have done to help convince people that the vaccine is safe. Now it's time for celebrities and sports stars to do the same and step up and do their part. If they are truly concerned about black lives, then their leaders need to be rolling up their sleeves and get poked on camera as a public service announcement. They can save more black lives by convincing their brothers and sisters that the vaccine is safe and effective than they can by marching in the streets and demanding the defunding of police departments. If they truly care about their friends and families, that they'll take the vaccine and do it in a very public setting.

I'm sure they will. Obama will likely reach out to the Americans of African descent community to push some public figure to get vaccinated.

Even though I had to admit they could mandate a vaccine, I knew they likely wouldn't as long as they can get enough people to take it to get herd immunity going and case counts to drop. I hope the initial roll out will show a substantial drop with no side effects, which will get people taking it in droves. Even my buddies who are pretty hardcore conservative plan to take the vaccine. My pro-Trump boss says he plans to take it and call it the Trump vaccine making sure people know it was Trump to implemented operation Warp Speed.

If people can convince Trump to take it publicly with the carrot that he gets to brag his administration got this vaccine made, things would go easier. But not sure how likely Trump will be to take the vaccine in public given he recently had the virus. Hopefully Trump at least tells his followers it's safe and to make sure people know he should get credit for it. Stroke his ego to get him to push his followers to take it.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I'm sure they will. Obama will likely reach out to the Americans of African descent community to push some public figure to get vaccinated.

Even though I had to admit they could mandate a vaccine, I knew they likely wouldn't as long as they can get enough people to take it to get herd immunity going and case counts to drop. I hope the initial roll out will show a substantial drop with no side effects, which will get people taking it in droves. Even my buddies who are pretty hardcore conservative plan to take the vaccine. My pro-Trump boss says he plans to take it and call it the Trump vaccine making sure people know it was Trump to implemented operation Warp Speed.

If people can convince Trump to take it publicly with the carrot that he gets to brag his administration got this vaccine made, things would go easier. But not sure how likely Trump will be to take the vaccine in public given he recently had the virus. Hopefully Trump at least tells his followers it's safe and to make sure people know he should get credit for it. Stroke his ego to get him to push his followers to take it.

Trump said back in July that he'd take a vaccine, but who knows what he's thinking now.

There's virtually no chance that the federal government won't mandate vaccinations, but there's a possibility that some local and state governments might for things like schools, nursing homes, hospitals, or other high risk areas. There's a strong likelihood that some employers might make it mandatory. I suggested to my former boss that they offer their employees a bonus, say $100, if they can show that they've been vaccinated. They used to have nurses come to our plant to give our employees flu shots. That probably wouldn't work with a COVID vaccine.

RiverDog wrote:Trump said back in July that he'd take a vaccine, but who knows what he's thinking now.

There's virtually no chance that the federal government won't mandate vaccinations, but there's a possibility that some local and state governments might for things like schools, nursing homes, hospitals, or other high risk areas. There's a strong likelihood that some employers might make it mandatory. I suggested to my former boss that they offer their employees a bonus, say $100, if they can show that they've been vaccinated. They used to have nurses come to our plant to give our employees flu shots. That probably wouldn't work with a COVID vaccine.

If it works with no side effects, should be an easy sell.

The one thing I believe whole-heartedly is people are so tired of these lockdowns and this hobbled economy that if this vaccine works with minimal side effects people will start taking it in droves. This situation sucks. Cities are ghost towns. If a vaccine ends it so people can travel and feel normal again, small price to pay save for perhaps some extremist anti-vaccine or conspiracy loons.

Aseahawkfan wrote:If it works with no side effects, should be an easy sell.

The one thing I believe whole-heartedly is people are so tired of these lockdowns and this hobbled economy that if this vaccine works with minimal side effects people will start taking it in droves. This situation sucks. Cities are ghost towns. If a vaccine ends it so people can travel and feel normal again, small price to pay save for perhaps some extremist anti-vaccine or conspiracy loons.

There's not going to be any extreme side effects, at least nothing more than a random person here and there. They've tested the 2 vaccines in over 40,000 people and didn't see anything serious. The only concern would be if a manufacturer were to screw up like what happened to the first polio vaccine in the 50's, but even that's extremely remote.

I hope you're right about the public's willingness to take the vaccine. Personally I think we'll be lucky to get to 70%. It's going to require an all hands on deck effort by our social leaders and sports heroes, people like Larry Fitzgerald, JJ Watt, LeBron James, country music stars, Hollywood, the whole bunch. That's one of the reasons why I was glad to see our 3 former POTUS's so willingly agree to do whatever it takes, that they could start a movement of well known celebrities to follow their lead.

RiverDog wrote:There's not going to be any extreme side effects, at least nothing more than a random person here and there. They've tested the 2 vaccines in over 40,000 people and didn't see anything serious. The only concern would be if a manufacturer were to screw up like what happened to the first polio vaccine in the 50's, but even that's extremely remote.

I hope you're right about the public's willingness to take the vaccine. Personally I think we'll be lucky to get to 70%. It's going to require an all hands on deck effort by our social leaders and sports heroes, people like Larry Fitzgerald, JJ Watt, LeBron James, country music stars, Hollywood, the whole bunch. That's one of the reasons why I was glad to see our 3 former POTUS's so willingly agree to do whatever it takes, that they could start a movement of well known celebrities to follow their lead.

I thought it might be a hard sell as well. But after querying my conservative friends, they will take the vaccine. The cost benefit is too great in favor of taking it. Even talking to them, some of the reasons they are willing to take it:

1. Because Trump's administration started the program.

2. Want to protect their parents and family.

3. Need the economy to get back open, so they can get a job or change jobs.

4. Want to be able to travel and take vacations again.

5. Tired of wearing masks and isolating.

6. Want to play soccer, go back to gym, and exercise outside again.

There are so many reasons people want this vaccine to work and to get back to normal. They are getting desperate. Besides the real anti-vaccination loons, any vaccine that offers a chance to return to normal people will take the risk.

Look at our options.

Option 1: lockdown forever, keep the economy in digital format, never leave your home, never have sporting events again, constantly have lockdown orders threatening to ruin holidays, travel, and associating with friends. Always wear masks and social distance. School online. Everything online. Work from home and have to manage your job from home and your kids from home. And everything that goes with this lockdown envrionment.

Option 2: Take a vaccine with minimal side effects to get the world back to normal.

You tell me what option is looking good to you right now after 10 months and still going of these lockdowns and restrictions? People are going to be demanding this vaccine if it works, literally screaming for it.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I thought it might be a hard sell as well. But after querying my conservative friends, they will take the vaccine. The cost benefit is too great in favor of taking it

Option 1: lockdown forever, keep the economy in digital format, never leave your home, never have sporting events again, constantly have lockdown orders threatening to ruin holidays, travel, and associating with friends. Always wear masks and social distance. School online. Everything online. Work from home and have to manage your job from home and your kids from home. And everything that goes with this lockdown envrionment.

Option 2: Take a vaccine with minimal side effects to get the world back to normal.

You tell me what option is looking good to you right now after 10 months and still going of these lockdowns and restrictions? People are going to be demanding this vaccine if it works, literally screaming for it.

Oh, you don't have to convince me about the risk/benefit of taking a vaccine. I've been taking vaccines ever since I can remember. I consider them to be a marvel of the 20th century, helped us tame diseases like polio, small pox, yellow fever, measles, mumps, and so on. But in order to effectively eliminate a disease, they have to be taken by a very high percentage of the population. We're lucky that the efficacy of these vaccines are as high as they are. The lower the efficacy, the higher the percentage of people that have to take them to achieve herd immunity.

I just don't think it's going to be that easy. Even my daughter, the charge nurse in an urgent care clinic and who is no Trump supporter or anti vaxxer, said she wants to look at the data first (a proposition that irritated me as I asked her "WTF do you expect to see?"). She might have been acting smart for her old man, like she could analyze hundreds of volumes of data, but her comments demonstrates that there are more than just the conservatives out there that are hesitant. Many blacks and other minorities are hesitant.

Britain is starting the inoculations this week, I think so there should be some news if there are problems before the rollout
really gets a head of steam on this side of the Atlantic. That should give some of those wishing to see data some comfort
or concern and help them make a decision.

NorthHawk wrote:Britain is starting the inoculations this week, I think so there should be some news if there are problems before the rollout
really gets a head of steam on this side of the Atlantic. That should give some of those wishing to see data some comfort
or concern and help them make a decision.

Some of the Brits are gloating because they beat us by being the first to approve it. Fauci got his tit in a bit of a wringer after he pretty much slammed them for being hasty.

We should know by the end of the week if the FDA is going to approve the Pfizer vaccine. I think I heard that they were expected to announce their decision by the 11th, which is this Friday.

RiverDog wrote:Oh, you don't have to convince me about the risk/benefit of taking a vaccine. I've been taking vaccines ever since I can remember. I consider them to be a marvel of the 20th century, helped us tame diseases like polio, small pox, yellow fever, measles, mumps, and so on. But in order to effectively eliminate a disease, they have to be taken by a very high percentage of the population. We're lucky that the efficacy of these vaccines are as high as they are. The lower the efficacy, the higher the percentage of people that have to take them to achieve herd immunity.

I just don't think it's going to be that easy. Even my daughter, the charge nurse in an urgent care clinic and who is no Trump supporter or anti vaxxer, said she wants to look at the data first (a proposition that irritated me as I asked her "WTF do you expect to see?"). She might have been acting smart for her old man, like she could analyze hundreds of volumes of data, but her comments demonstrates that there are more than just the conservatives out there that are hesitant. Many blacks and other minorities are hesitant.

That's why I said if this thing has no real side effects and does fine, the anecdotal data will make people who want to see the data rush to get it. It's natural for people to be cautious of a vaccine produced this quickly. But once people start taking it, numbers start dropping, and that information is pushed by the media, dam of caution is going to break and people will start rushing to get it. I'm not worried about that at all.

I'm a natural homebody. In my normal life I go to the grocery store, work, the gym 2 to 4 times a week, and to my friends house usually once a week. I don't take many vacations. I don't like crowds or loud events. I do most of my shopping online or at night when not many people are around. I order food online and have it delivered home. I go to the movies maybe once or twice a year for a major blockbuster. I live alone and prefer isolation as talking and dealing with other people is mentally difficult for me for extended periods of time.

Why I am describing this? Because I should be ok with this lockdown as I'm not a big outdoor person. But even I have reached the end of my rope with this lockdown. I am so tired of this lockdown environment, I may go on a vacation or somewhere outside just because I'm so tired of this lockdown crap. It's one thing to stay in your home by choice, but being forced to shelter in your home due to government restrictions and fear of getting a deadly disease is terrible. This vaccine can't come soon enough. I hope it works as well as the evidence suggests.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I'm a natural homebody. In my normal life I go to the grocery store, work, the gym 2 to 4 times a week, and to my friends house usually once a week. I don't take many vacations. I don't like crowds or loud events. I do most of my shopping online or at night when not many people are around. I order food online and have it delivered home. I go to the movies maybe once or twice a year for a major blockbuster. I live alone and prefer isolation as talking and dealing with other people is mentally difficult for me for extended periods of time.

Why I am describing this? Because I should be ok with this lockdown as I'm not a big outdoor person. But even I have reached the end of my rope with this lockdown. I am so tired of this lockdown environment, I may go on a vacation or somewhere outside just because I'm so tired of this lockdown crap. It's one thing to stay in your home by choice, but being forced to shelter in your home due to government restrictions and fear of getting a deadly disease is terrible. This vaccine can't come soon enough. I hope it works as well as the evidence suggests.

You sound a lot like my wife. She hates crowds, won't go to football games with me, doesn't like meeting strangers. She won't go to my high school reunions with me anymore because she doesn't know anyone. I'm the exact opposite, love big crowds, packed bars, etc.

Everyone is getting fatigued. We'd love to go visit our kids and family but we just don't want to take the chance. We figure that we've made it this far and don't want to blow it in the last couple of months. I have two trips planned, one to Las Vegas this spring and one to Iceland in June, plus we want to do a bunch of traveling in our motor home. But it's going to be a long winter.

Everyone is getting fatigued.

I'll say. My daughter works the covid wing of a very large assisted care facility (yes, they have an entire long hall of rooms dedicated to covid patients) and says that the local hospital is daily sending them patients (some recovering, some not so much) to make more room for beds at the hospital. she's had 4 in her hall die. She's exhausted and scared. I'm just glad that her and my son in law who works at the same place are first in line for the vaccine once it is approved.

Everyone is getting fatigued.

c_hawkbob wrote:I'll say. My daughter works the covid wing of a very large assisted care facility (yes, they have an entire long hall of rooms dedicated to covid patients) and says that the local hospital is daily sending them patients (some recovering, some not so much) to make more room for beds at the hospital. she's had 4 in her hall die. She's exhausted and scared. I'm just glad that her and my son in law who works at the same place are first in line for the vaccine once it is approved.

My heart goes out to your daughter. My wife worked in nursing homes as a nurse for over 40 years. It's odd, because despite her loving her residents to death, when they died, it didn't phase her all that much, but when one of her pets died, she'd cry endlessly.

We all just have to hang in there another 3-4 months. My wife and I are taking the attitude that since we've come this far and haven't contracted the virus, it would be really stupid to blow it now by breaking our routine and getting infected.

Thanks and I agree. They're actually talking like it could be as soon as a couple weeks on the vaccine (or the first instalment thereof), maybe they're getting more information than John Q Public is.

I liker Bidens messaging too. I think "sleepy joe' might be the antidote to trumpanzee land. Its reassuring to see a serious thoughtful focused on americans person in the wings.States and localities are already coordinating with his incoming administration.

Its alarming the games witholding cooperation and shared intelligence being played by the pentagon now full of synchophants at the very top, people who have advocated martial law, cast conspiratorial theories regarding the election.

We just gotta make it till jan 20 without a war in the middle east or some declaration of martial law by the desperate baboon.

c_hawkbob wrote:Thanks and I agree. They're actually talking like it could be as soon as a couple weeks on the vaccine (or the first instalment thereof), maybe they're getting more information than John Q Public is.

A couple of weeks for the vaccine for first responders and health care workers, especially nursing homes, sounds about right, assuming the FDA approves them. I've heard they'll have 40 million doses delivered by the end of the year, enough to vaccinate 20 million people.

I'm hoping that my wife and I will be able to get vaccinated sometime in late February or early March. I have a couple of trips planned that I don't want to take until I've been vaccinated.

I just want to go to the gym again and see a movie now and again. Cardio is not my bag. If I can't lift heavy weights, not many other forms of exercise appeal to me.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I just want to go to the gym again and see a movie now and again. Cardio is not my bag. If I can't lift heavy weights, not many other forms of exercise appeal to me.

I pumped iron 30 years ago and got pretty big. My shoulders and elbows are shot now. Don't even try.

I want to go to sportys for breakfast, go to Hawks games, karaoke bars. Take off the damn mask.
Fortunately for my wife and I we have some things that helped us have a relatively good year despite covid. A boat, a classic Chrysler 300, a violently fast 750 hp supercharged methanol injected grand cherokee jeep strt8 and an RV lot at the legacy where I work . We spent almost every weekend in it this summer. I golf for free even though I suck these days .

But definitely I want this over, Sadly asea I see so much noncompliance, resistance to vaccines this might take a long time here in America.

Hawktawk wrote: I pumped iron 30 years ago and got pretty big. My shoulders and elbows are shot now. Don't even try.

I want to go to sportys for breakfast, go to Hawks games, karaoke bars. Take off the damn mask.
Fortunately for my wife and I we have some things that helped us have a relatively good year despite covid. A boat, a classic Chrysler 300, a violently fast 750 hp supercharged methanol injected grand cherokee jeep strt8 and an RV lot at the legacy where I work . We spent almost every weekend in it this summer. I golf for free even though I suck these days .

But definitely I want this over, Sadly asea I see so much noncompliance, resistance to vaccines this might take a long time here in America.

The one thing that we all have in common is getting through these next few months and an end to the pandemic. Although my wife and I have made the least of financial sacrifices and it's easy for us to self quarantine, the emotional strain has been tremendous on both of us. My best friend, who is rather dismissive of the pandemic to begin with, had his girlfriend test positive so I don't dare visit him, mask or no mask. Another good friend of mine is flying back from his work assignment in Argentina for a couple of weeks this Christmas and I won't be able to visit him. Once every few weekends, about 6-8 of my old buddies/gals from work would get together for SNF or MNF, but not this year.

Speaking of RV's, I still want to get up to Mardon and visit with you, perhaps shoot a round of golf with you and make you feel better about your own game. We've put down a deposit on a new, factory ordered motor home and we'll be anxious to get out in it, even for the short drive to Othello.

RiverDog wrote:
The one thing that we all have in common is getting through these next few months and an end to the pandemic. Although my wife and I have made the least of financial sacrifices and it's easy for us to self quarantine, the emotional strain has been tremendous on both of us. My best friend, who is rather dismissive of the pandemic to begin with, had his girlfriend test positive so I don't dare visit him, mask or no mask. Another good friend of mine is flying back from his work assignment in Argentina for a couple of weeks this Christmas and I won't be able to visit him. Once every few weekends, about 6-8 of my old buddies/gals from work would get together for SNF or MNF, but not this year.

Speaking of RV's, I still want to get up to Mardon and visit with you, perhaps shoot a round of golf with you and make you feel better about your own game. We've put down a deposit on a new, factory ordered motor home and we'll be anxious to get out in it, even for the short drive to Othello.

The meeting with whatsurprob in the day kind of made me once bitten twice shy about meeting guys from the forum but you're someone Id meet for sure. I had a lot of fun with that guy as well in the first super bowl season but too intense on a regular basis.
I've got a lot of connections here at legacy. We have some full hookup spec lots for sale and I could possibly get you a demo night or 2.I love the one we bought. The short drive is awesome. From my place its pack a cooler and a suitcase and a 25 minute drive and we are on vacation for the weekend.

As for golf we will see. If your worse than me its sad. Its especially rough since I was an 8 handicap 25 years ago and im a legit 30 plus now.

Hawktawk wrote: I pumped iron 30 years ago and got pretty big. My shoulders and elbows are shot now. Don't even try.

I want to go to sportys for breakfast, go to Hawks games, karaoke bars. Take off the damn mask.
Fortunately for my wife and I we have some things that helped us have a relatively good year despite covid. A boat, a classic Chrysler 300, a violently fast 750 hp supercharged methanol injected grand cherokee jeep strt8 and an RV lot at the legacy where I work . We spent almost every weekend in it this summer. I golf for free even though I suck these days .

But definitely I want this over, Sadly asea I see so much noncompliance, resistance to vaccines this might take a long time here in America.

I feel like things will change when Biden is in office just like they did with Trump. Some people are like sports fans when it comes to the president. Rabid when their player is in their fighting, but die down when the season is over. Trump's season is almost over. Just a little over a month and this clown is out either of his volition or the hard way, either way I don't care. Once Trump season is over all these loons will lose their source of motivation and we'll see how many enemies Trump has built up come for him.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I feel like things will change when Biden is in office just like they did with Trump. Some people are like sports fans when it comes to the president. Rabid when their player is in their fighting, but die down when the season is over. Trump's season is almost over. Just a little over a month and this clown is out either of his volition or the hard way, either way I don't care. Once Trump season is over all these loons will loose their source of motivation and we'll see how many enemies Trump has built up come for him.

I think so, too, but it will take a little longer on this occasion, mainly because we'll still be in the pandemic for at least Biden's first 100 days.

There's a lot of pent up demand waiting to explode once the pandemic is over, a lot of people itching to go places and do things. No matter what Biden does, the economy should come roaring back. The fact that Wall Street is doing so well is a reflection of this optimistic POV.

This is going to be a long winter. We have another 6 weeks of Trump to tolerate, another couple months before we have access to a vaccine.