Largent80 wrote:This team was built on the running game and strong defense.
Running game is just now starting to look like one with only 3 games to go.
The defense has so many key injuries that it is amazing we can even hang in games. But when you see a VERY average QB like Bortles have the kind of day he had, it's not a good sign and neither is the fact about RW.
Pete wants to keep trotting Bevell out as OC when he should have been long gone after the call in SB 49. The rest of the league has copied, and passed us, and Pete is so enamored with loyalty that he's blinded by it.
RW should NOT be the sole weapon but it is what it is.
Sox-n-hawks wrote:Because the OC could kill ANY scoring drive. Look at how we were gashing the Jax defense with Adams, then he pulls that halfback pass BS. PSSST if something works DO IT. Instead, we trick ourselves into not scoring... rely on the defense and boom.. next thing we know the defense is banged up, the offense is down by a score or two and RW HAS to comeback. Let the offense fly I say. Before RW ends up injured again.
HumanCockroach wrote: unfortunately, expecting a banged up defense to carry a football team for 3 quarters week in and week out, simply isn't a winning recipe.
GO HAWKS?!?
idhawkman wrote:TOTALLY AGREE WITH THE OP.
I've been saying this for quite some time and have caught a lot of flak from other forums because I won't dub RW as "elite". In my mind, elite players play all 4 quarters of a game and not just one. We all know the PC mantra of "you can't win it in the 1st qtr, you can't win it in the 2nd qtr, you can't win it in the 3rd qtr but you sure can win it in the 4th qtr." Well, that is now how the team plays. They do NOT "compete" all the time.
NorthHawk wrote:He does start slow, but I think a lot of that is the play calling which includes many scripted plays. I've heard the first 15 which would take us near the end of the 1st Quarter if the other team had a long drive and we had a couple of 3 and outs.
You would think they would practice the he!! out of those first plays so there are no mental errors and the timing is perfect, but it doesn't seem that's the case. At least the results don't show it.
c_hawkbob wrote:I don't agree that Russ is "a mediocre to below mediocre QB the other 75% of the time". He's at least very good the other 75 percent of the time.
idhawkman wrote:
He may well be but his numbers as the OP points out, don't bear that out.
c_hawkbob wrote:
Not buying that either, I'd have to see all of the numbers to believe that, not just TDs and INTs.
Sox-n-hawks wrote:
Guess who holds the record for the most Interceptions in NFL history........
mykc14 wrote:
Interceptions thrown? Gotta be HOFer Brett Favre, right?
RiverDog wrote:It might sound like an oxymoron, but I don't think RW is elite and would rank him somewhere between #4 and #10 of current NFL QB's. However, I wouldn't trade him for anyone, in part due to his play...in a tight game, his ability to scramble and improvise is priceless... and in part because he's such a great guy that I want him on our team.
Sox-n-hawks wrote:Let's see your Top Ten list of current QBs......My top QBs look like this
1. Tom Brady
2. Drew Brees
2. Russell Wilson
2. Aaron Rogers
5. Matt Ryan
6. Ben Roethlisberger
7. Eli Manning
8. Matt Stafford
9. Cam Newton
10. Carson Palmer
I would be able to agree with this if he was a flash in the pan. One season and done. However, we're going on 6 seasons of elite play (he set the single season FBS record in Wisconsin the only year he played there so I'll count that.) This past offseason was make or break for him. RW showed the work ethic of an elite QB by losing weight, improving mobility and getting rid of the injury bug. He did not go the route of guys like Michael Vick, RG3 or others who have a season with an injury and go from great to mediocre in the bat of an eye. Your reasons for not wanting to trade him are the exact reasons guys like Joe Montana, Brett Favre, John Elway (4q king) are elite. RW is a legitimate HOF contender if Bevell doesn't get him killed on the field through poor game plans and Tom Cable doesn't get him killed by a lack of O-Line development.
3 Pro Bowls in his first 4 years in the league and it would likely have been four if he wasn't injured.
Over 21,000 passing yards already
Every time I see a metric with his name, the guys around it are HOF caliber QBs
Let's see your Top Ten list of current QBs......My top QBs look like this
1. Tom Brady
2. Drew Brees
2. Russell Wilson
2. Aaron Rogers
5. Matt Ryan
6. Ben Roethlisberger
7. Eli Manning
8. Matt Stafford
9. Cam Newton
10. Carson Palmer
Sox-n-hawks 85 Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:27 am Pacific NW
HumanCockroach wrote:
The problem is, you seem to be missing that you haven't seen six seasons of elite play, you've seen 3, a rookie year, and the last two seasons of 75% mediocre to below play, with some 4th quarter magic. It is fantastic that he can play like that in the 4th, but I'm inclined to ask, how many points on average is Seattle losing by, and how many of those losses are a direct result of horrible turnovers, inability to find open receivers, continually looking for the big 50/50 plays down the field instead of taking the wide open first down staring him in the face, hell, generously 40% of those sacks are on Wilson and his desire to get a "bigger " play, leaving clean pockets, bypassing open receivers, refusing to throw the ball away....
You can look at all those stats, claim HOF, and there's a valid argument to be made, IF you aren't watching the games, and looking at stats alone. Ultimately, elite, bona fide HOF And are CONSISTENTLY great, CONSISTENTLY raising the level of play. They may have bad games here and there, happens to everybody, but what they don't do, is throw balls directly into DBs guts, they don't intentionally ground the ball while being sacked 5 out of 6 games, they don't only play one quarter of football week and week out for two FULL seasons....
currently, Wilson has played ONE game this season, well, through four quarters, do you really believe it's coincidence that that particular game is the only game Seattle has dominated from start to finish? Seattle has walked in to half trailing teams like the Colts, NYGs, tied with SF... truly the dregs of the NFL. Simply no way to believe that's good enough, or even remotely close to good enough.
Hawktawk wrote:Russ needs 18 rushing yards and 1 td pass to be the first man in the history of the NFL to have 30 td passes and 500 yards rushing in 2 seasons. I trade him for nobody. He’s hall of fame bound imo and already holds numerous dual threat QB records like first man to rush for 100 and pass for 200 on MNF. First man to pass for 300 and rush for 100 in history.
The guy had one bad game and he’s suddenly bad to mediocre. He’s the greatest dual threat QB of all time.
You people are so spoiled. I remember guys like gelbaugh and McGuire and kemp. Even our second and third best ever Hass and Krieg can’t touch him. Aside from Wilson’s athletic ability it is his belief system that brings wins even with his D game. It’s why they almost never get blown out. When Hass and Krieg started slow you knew it was going to be a long day. Russ has a HOF attitude.
HumanCockroach wrote:The problem is, you seem to be missing that you haven't seen six seasons of elite play, you've seen 3, a rookie year, and the last two seasons of 75% mediocre to below play, with some 4th quarter magic.
Ultimately, elite, bona fide HOF And are CONSISTENTLY great, CONSISTENTLY raising the level of play. They may have bad games here and there, happens to everybody, but what they don't do, is throw balls directly into DBs guts, they don't intentionally ground the ball while being sacked 5 out of 6 games, they don't only play one quarter of football week and week out for two FULL seasons.
HumanCockroach wrote:If you think Favre and Elway played season upon season of 3 quarters of mediocrity for the entirety of their career, I'm not sure I can help you. They made their reputations there, they certainly didn't build HOF careers based on fourth quarter effectivness alone.
HumanCockroach wrote:Since you seem interested in doing so, why not breakdown turnover to TD rate and completion percentage over a period of time, I recommend going back to the NFCCG and moving forward.
Nothing changes his performance for the last two years, and prior to starting a debate, if you would like to compare contemporary numbers please do, but spare me the first five years of Favre, and Elway ( both of whom played initially in a vastly different landscape, and both had detractors regarding their erratic play and unforced turnovers.)
No matter what numbers you ultimately throw out though, there is simply no way to wash those numbers. 12/10 under 60 completion percentage and almost a 1 to 1 td to interception ratio every every 3 quarters of football, isn't anything but mediocre to below mediocre.
Last season might have been merely two, to two and a half quarters of anemic play, but I assure you, after the better parts of two seasons, it isn't an outlier.
mykc14 wrote:
YEAR:................15...........16
Completion percentage:
Q1....................65%.........71%
Q2....................67%.........62%
Q3....................69%.........61%
Q4....................66%.........64%
TD/INT:
Q1...................4/1.........1/0
Q2...................12/4.......11/6
Q3...................11/5.......2/2
Q4...................11/1.......11/5
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