Largent80 wrote:These kinds of contracts kill teams ability to field competitive teams and RW is surely going to want more come the next contract.
Also, the fans help pay for it with rising costs across the board.
Largent80 wrote:These kinds of contracts kill teams ability to field competitive teams and RW is surely going to want more come the next contract.
Also, the fans help pay for it with rising costs across the board.
NorthHawk wrote:There was a thought a few years ago that suggested the QB's be exempt from the Cap (maybe a % of their salary exempt) or have a separate category for QB's with less restrictive rules.
I can see there being a push for that again if teams suffer too much because of the cost of a franchise QB.
Largent80 wrote:This kinda reminds me of Flynn. Had one killer game, gets a big conthen can't even win the starting job from a rookie.
I'm not saying JG isn't the starter, just the overpaid QB aspect for a relatively unproven player. Hey as a Hawk fan I like that they can't pay anyone else on their team now as we've poached dozens of players from them over the years.
One from this year may be Hyde.
Futureite wrote:The Patriots already attempted to offer him $17 mil/yr. He rejected it.
Alex Smith just got $74 mil guaranteed; roughly the same amount as JG. Can you, with a straight face, claim you'd not pay Alex Smith money for JG?
He's already filled a stadium that was likely half full most game days. He's a marketing dream for any organization. He speaks well. Women love him. Most people like him period. If you are the 49ers, how much is that worth?
This signing sets the table for FAs to come here. It puts the coach, GM and QB on the same page for 5 years. How much is "cohesion" worth for an organization that has had very little of it, even in the recent good years? It's worth a lot.
If you add all of this up, there is a lot of upside with this and very little downside. And we have not even started talking about what he actually did this year, on the football side.
Largent80 wrote:This kinda reminds me of Flynn. Had one killer game, gets a big conthen can't even win the starting job from a rookie.
I'm not saying JG isn't the starter, just the overpaid QB aspect for a relatively unproven player. Hey as a Hawk fan I like that they can't pay anyone else on their team now as we've poached dozens of players from them over the years.
One from this year may be Hyde.
Largent80 wrote:Sorry dude, I just see the resemblances, you can blow holes in my post if it makes you feel better.
Futureite wrote:ASF, I disagree. And here is why.
First, people are focusing on his absolute salary rather than the salary cap hit. From what I am reading, it is around 15%. We still have the 3rd most cap space in the league. This doesn’t hamstring the organization. In fact, my bet is that it will attract more FAs than we otherwise would have gotten. People talk about costs, but they continually ignore the opportunity costs. You franchise him, maybe you don’t get those FAs. Maybe you pay a lot more when it comes time to negotiate again - and you hold up the entire org in the meantime. This eliminates all of the “what if”, the other side of the
Futureite wrote:Mykc14;
After watching him play, do you really see Cousins, Palmer, Alex Smith talent? And when I say talent, I don't mean arm strength, etc. I am talking talent at playing the position. I know this is a Seahawks board, but man. I'd have puked if they gave any one of those 3 you named a contract, let alone this type of money. We all have our allegiances and biases, but I think the consensus around the league already is that he's a very good QB with the potential to be great. If he can do what he did with a group of scrubs, terrible pass blocking O-line and no real knowledge of the system, we're all excited here to see what'll happen in 2018 with obvious changes.
Anyhow, not here to change your mind. The bottom line is, no one knows until the games are played. IMO, it's the best decision we've made in a long time. We'll see.
Futureite wrote:Mykc14;
Those are fair points. We'll have to see how it all plays out. A lot of variables at play. We still have a ton of holes on O so I am curious if we use FA/draft to address those, try to get some big playmakers or address the holes on D. My dream pick is Saquon Barkley. Things are going to change a lot one way or the other.
Futureite wrote:ASF, I disagree. And here is why.
First, people are focusing on his absolute salary rather than the salary cap hit. From what I am reading, it is around 15%. We still have the 3rd most cap space in the league. This doesn’t hamstring the organization. In fact, my bet is that it will attract more FAs than we otherwise would have gotten. People talk about costs, but they continually ignore the opportunity costs. You franchise him, maybe you don’t get those FAs. Maybe you pay a lot more when it comes time to negotiate again - and you hold up the entire org in the meantime. This eliminates all of the “what if”, the other side of the coin.
Second, people continually paint this as boom or bust. How much more do we need to see to say for certain that he win’t be a “bust”? He came to one of the worst pass blocking Os in the league, throwing to Trent Taylor, Kendrick Bourne, Marquise Goodwin and Garret Celek and instantly turned our O into the highest scoring O in the league over his starts. The guy has quiet feet snd is incredibly accurate under pressure. He was great in the clutch. Showed great leadership. All of this is not to say he’ll be “great”, but there’s enough here to say with relative certainty he’ll be “good”. So if he does underperform, how much will it be in dollars? Overpaid by $5 mil, $8 mil? That’s easily a risk you take.
Flynn, Osweiler, heck even Kap (whom I still like) all did what they did with a great supporting cast. This guy did it on a 1-9 team with limited knowledge of the O. You take this risk everytime IMO. Who knows how good he’ll be. Maybe just decent. But maybe great. We will see!
Futureite wrote:Mykc14;
After watching him play, do you really see Cousins, Palmer, Alex Smith talent? And when I say talent, I don't mean arm strength, etc. I am talking talent at playing the position. I know this is a Seahawks board, but man. I'd have puked if they gave any one of those 3 you named a contract, let alone this type of money. We all have our allegiances and biases, but I think the consensus around the league already is that he's a very good QB with the potential to be great. If he can do what he did with a group of scrubs, terrible pass blocking O-line and no real knowledge of the system, we're all excited here to see what'll happen in 2018 with obvious changes.
Anyhow, not here to change your mind. The bottom line is, no one knows until the games are played. IMO, it's the best decision we've made in a long time. We'll see.
HumanCockroach wrote:Truly unfortunate as this obscene contract doesn't just sink the Niners if he turns out to be as mediocre as his stats predict * ain't no one buying 7tds and 5ints is equivalent to 130 mil plus, well I guess except delusional niner "faithful"* but it absolutely burdens teams with proven QBs looking to stay competitive ( say Seattle, NO, GB etc).
Who knows, maybe the Niners plan was to instead of improving to compete, destroy other teams rosters to drag them back to their level.... lol
Futureite wrote:I am comparing RW and JG side by side. Tell me who is the "homer" and who is looking at this objectively. I bolded the stat where each QB leads compared to the other. I left out YDs/GM as it is skewed by the several snaps JG took V Hawks, which counted as a "game" - but not a "start":
Russell Wilson 2017 stats - Completing percentage, 61.3%; YDS/Attempt 7.2; TD INT Ratio 3.09; Rating 95.4
Jimmy Garropolo 2017 stats - Completion percentage 67.4%; YDS/Attempt 8.8; TD INT Ratio 1.4; Rating 96.4.
What am I missing here. Neither had any sort of pass protection, so that is no longer an excuse. JG had no Jimmy Graham or even a Doug Baldwin. Not a single guy that had previously posted 1,000 yds receiving. He had no 5 years in the same system as Wilson did. Now don't go all crazy, because I am not saying he is better than Wilson (will have to prove that to make it true) but we didn't average 28 PPG and go 5-0 in his starts based upon poor play. I gave Russell his due and put him right at about the top 5 of all NFL QBs. "If" you are truly objective, you'd at least admit that was an incredible start. He didn't do that in some new or gimmick system either, where "film" or the league will catch up to him. He did it under the worst possible conditions a QB could be expected to excel in. You can claim he'll flop or bust, and that is fine. As of now though he's demonstrated that he's a classic pocket passer and he's only going to get much, much better.
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