Shane Ray

[c_hawkbob]

Got busted for hippie lettuce in a traffic stop yesterday. Now he joins my favorite pass rusher in this draft (Randy Gregory) as two top tier defenders hurting their draft stock more for stupidity than criminality.

Too bad neither of them will fall far enough to get to within our reach ...

[RiverDog]

Yea, #63 overall is a long ways for a consensus first round pick to fall, but teams may be more sensitive to red flag issues in this draft than they have been in the past, so who knows.

Rumor has it that for the first time in this regime's history that we may be trading up in this draft, perhaps even into the first round if the right player is within reach.

[NorthHawk]

It might create some turmoil within the first round, but I suspect it wouldn't have affected us at 31 if we had kept our pick.

I don't see us trading back into the first round. JS has said he doesn't see more than about 15 first round talents. Maybe move a few up in the 2nd, but history isn't on our side for that.
It depends on how they see the talent tiers and if there is a player that they think is an early 2nd round player falling close enough to make a deal.

Edit:
After just stating that, there is an article on PFT saying Ray might slide to the 4th round.

[c_hawkbob]

After just stating that, there is an article on PFT saying Ray might slide to the 4th round.

I'd be shocked but if either he or Gregory fall to us in the second we need to snap them right up!

[NorthHawk]

I doubt he falls to the 4th, but if both are available for us in the 2nd, I would take Gregory over Ray, but would be happy with either.

[RiverDog]

It might create some turmoil within the first round, but I suspect it wouldn't have affected us at 31 if we had kept our pick.

I don't see us trading back into the first round. JS has said he doesn't see more than about 15 first round talents. Maybe move a few up in the 2nd, but history isn't on our side for that.
It depends on how they see the talent tiers and if there is a player that they think is an early 2nd round player falling close enough to make a deal.

Edit:
After just stating that, there is an article on PFT saying Ray might slide to the 4th round.

Everyone lies this time of year, and JS and PC are no different.

This season is a little different than past ones. In the past, we went into the draft needing extra picks, so we had a motivation to trade down. This season, we have more picks than any team in the league and with relatively few holes, there's no need to keep all those picks. I do think we move up at some point.

[NorthHawk]

Certainly many lie at this time of year, but JS's comment about getting Graham and being better than the talent at 31 seems to me to show he's not considering moving back into the 1st.
Moving up later is very possible - maybe if Gregory or Ray are still there in the mid to late 40s he might want to ensure he gets a player they ranked as an early to mid 1st round pick (provided they in fact think of them that high).

[RiverDog]

Certainly many lie at this time of year, but JS's comment about getting Graham and being better than the talent at 31 seems to me to show he's not considering moving back into the 1st.
Moving up later is very possible - maybe if Gregory or Ray are still there in the mid to late 40s he might want to ensure he gets a player they ranked as an early to mid 1st round pick (provided they in fact think of them that high).

I agree, moving into the first round seems unlikely. But I do think we buck the trend this season and move up at some point. It doesn't make a lot of sense to keep all those draft picks when we don't have a whole lot of open roster spots.

[c_hawkbob]

I doubt he falls to the 4th, but if both are available for us in the 2nd, I would take Gregory over Ray, but would be happy with either.

Ditto.

[jshawaii22]

So you want a Pot-Head coming to Washington where it's legal to get stoned??? Wow, I just can't believe how you all blow off getting stoned. If you don't remember that CB of ours, Mr. Browner, another stoner, the team moved on and was signed and then dumped by New England. Smoking Pot absolutely has a negative effect on performance and attitude over time. The Pot takes over the brain. Let's move on and find someone else.
js

[NorthHawk]

So you want a Pot-Head coming to Washington where it's legal to get stoned??? Wow, I just can't believe how you all blow off getting stoned. If you don't remember that CB of ours, Mr. Browner, another stoner, the team moved on and was signed and then dumped by New England. Smoking Pot absolutely has a negative effect on performance and attitude over time. The Pot takes over the brain. Let's move on and find someone else.
js

It doesn't bother me in the least that he smokes pot.
I would think there is a large population of the NFL that does.
What does bother me is him not making a good decision just prior to the draft.
This might be an opportunity to get a guy who is one of the best DEs in the draft at a much lower price - and maybe get him with a chip on his shoulder.

[c_hawkbob]

So you want a Pot-Head coming to Washington where it's legal to get stoned??? Wow, I just can't believe how you all blow off getting stoned. If you don't remember that CB of ours, Mr. Browner, another stoner, the team moved on and was signed and then dumped by New England. Smoking Pot absolutely has a negative effect on performance and attitude over time. The Pot takes over the brain. Let's move on and find someone else.
js

Sorry you have such issues with smoking weed JS. Sounds as though it may be a personal issue for you, you have my sympathy.

In my estimation however of all the ways you can get yourself afoul of the law, either as an NFL player or a prospective employee or even as one of my children, getting busted for weed is about the least objectionable I can imagine. There is stupidity involved for certain, but there are a lot worse things a person can be than stupid.

And Brandon Browner is certainly not a cautionary example in my book, he was a huge success for us and a founding member of The Legion, he'll always be a personal favorite.

[HumanCockroach]

So you want a Pot-Head coming to Washington where it's legal to get stoned??? Wow, I just can't believe how you all blow off getting stoned. If you don't remember that CB of ours, Mr. Browner, another stoner, the team moved on and was signed and then dumped by New England. Smoking Pot absolutely has a negative effect on performance and attitude over time. The Pot takes over the brain. Let's move on and find someone else.
js

Huh? My understanding of the Browner situation was that he had one failed test his rookie year, was dinged for missing test while not in the league, then failed a second 7 years later. Not sure that fits into the " pot head" group. Also even the NFL is hedging on this topic, and odds are that within the next 2-4 season will not only not be a suspendable offense, but something used instead of heavy narcotic cocktails they regularly hand out now ( far more habit forming as well) to mitigate pain.

I am not saying a thing about this particular player, just that it seems as if you have a strong bias, that the majority of society do not happen to have in regards to weed.

I do not smoke it ( and never really did) but have met, and been friends with many who have, and there is simply no denying it's benefits in helping with consistent pain ( hence the long standing medical marijuana use) .

[Hawk Sista]

ooooooooooooh! the devil's cabbage. I'd take a chance on either one of these guys at 63 were they to be there, but so would a lot of teams and they will not be there by the time we make a selection.

Riv - you say "Rumor has it that for the first time in this regime's history that we may be trading up in this draft, perhaps even into the first round if the right player is within reach."

Where are you reading/hearing this rumor? I have not heard that one.

[NorthHawk]

There is a medical component for it for some people and unlike chemical combinations there are usually no or very little side effects, so as the nation moves toward legalization, it will probably be dropped from the testing protocols of the NFL.

HC is correct, Browner failed because he was playing in the CFL and couldn't take the tests.
That put him at the final stage for suspension unbeknownst to him (and probably most people considering he was working for a different employer when he missed the tests).

[RiverDog]

So you want a Pot-Head coming to Washington where it's legal to get stoned??? Wow, I just can't believe how you all blow off getting stoned. If you don't remember that CB of ours, Mr. Browner, another stoner, the team moved on and was signed and then dumped by New England. Smoking Pot absolutely has a negative effect on performance and attitude over time. The Pot takes over the brain. Let's move on and find someone else.
js

For me, it depends on the circumstances. When Percy Harvin, a player that had multiple issues with failed drug tests and was on his way to a team meeting, got pulled over reeking of the stuff, it sent up a big red flag when combined with other past disciplinary issues throughout his career. This guy got pulled over speeding and had some unsmoked weed in his car. That's one strike against him for sure, but it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me if that's the only character issue he has.

[Hawktawk]

In my estimation however of all the ways you can get yourself afoul of the law, either as an NFL player or a prospective employee or even as one of my children, getting busted for weed is about the least objectionable I can imagine. There is stupidity involved for certain, but there are a lot worse things a person can be than stupid.

And Brandon Browner is certainly not a cautionary example in my book, he was a huge success for us and a founding member of The Legion, he'll always be a personal favorite.

Dittos on that one Bob. Anything will kick your tail if you are a slave to it but weed is so ridiculously overblown in the grand scheme of things. Id worry a lot more about a chronic drinker, both as an employee and on my football team as well.And the NFL should really take a look at a policy punishing players for smoking a bowl while handing them a cocktail of muscle relaxers and Opiates for pain management. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

But you are correct that knowing the rules of the testing it is stupid to set yourself up to fail,especially with millions on the line.But still....

Draft him.

[jshawaii22]

Sorry folks. I've lived it, seen it, dealt with it and had a couple years of DEA helicopters flying over my house at tree top level. You're all correct about the short term effects. Smoke it once or twice, maybe a couple times a month, no issue. But that's NOT how most users do it. It becomes a habit, like drinking or meth or any one drug. It is obvious? No, it's the easiest drum to hide. But if you do it regularly, good luck performing at 100%, let alone at NFL level for long.

Again, this doesn't mean that the kid is an addict. There are a lot of papers written that Pot is not addictive at all. Maybe yes, maybe no, but if you're willing to throw away a pick and possibly take down other's with him (remember that Browner took down WTIII that second time) -- don't fool yourselves. Oh, and yes, Pot should be legal, for all of us that aren't playing in the NFL... or flying a plane, driving a big rig or a train, operating on a body or anything else that requires 100+ dedication. Pot use takes that away.

js

[RiverDog]

Sorry folks. I've lived it, seen it, dealt with it and had a couple years of DEA helicopters flying over my house at tree top level. You're all correct about the short term effects. Smoke it once or twice, maybe a couple times a month, no issue. But that's NOT how most users do it. It becomes a habit, like drinking or meth or any one drug. It is obvious? No, it's the easiest drum to hide. But if you do it regularly, good luck performing at 100%, let alone at NFL level for long.

Again, this doesn't mean that the kid is an addict. There are a lot of papers written that Pot is not addictive at all. Maybe yes, maybe no, but if you're willing to throw away a pick and possibly take down other's with him (remember that Browner took down WTIII that second time) -- don't fool yourselves. Oh, and yes, Pot should be legal, for all of us that aren't playing in the NFL... or flying a plane, driving a big rig or a train, operating on a body or anything else that requires 100+ dedication. Pot use takes that away.

js

But that's not what you implied in your original post. You suggested that he was a pot head, ie an addict.

I don't necessarily disagree with anything you said about its effects, particularily as it concerns public safety. I just don't see the harm in the occasional, non addictive recreational use of the drug. It's less destructive than alcohol and less of a cancer risk than tobacco. The only reason I'm concerned at all is the fact that the league has prohibited its players from using it. Except for the fact that it is against the law in FL, possessing a recreational amount in his car but not being under the influence is no big deal to me.

[NorthHawk]

Ray has an issue with his toe - apparently Turf Toe and there is some discussion amongst medical personnel about whether he needs surgery or not.
He just might fall to us in the 2nd, but all it takes is one other team willing to take a chance or willing to wait for a year if surgery is required.

[obiken]

The Football Issue here is not weed or the DEA, its OFFENSIVE LINEMAN, that we need more than DLineman.

[NorthHawk]

They aren't going to take exclusively OL, so if a premier talent on the Defensive side slides to us at the end of the 2nd, we would be fools to not at least consider it.
Thus the discussion.

I doubt he falls as far as us, though.

[RiverDog]

We could use another cornerback and a wide receiver, especially considering Richardson's status. There's also speculation that we'll pick up a running back. Bottom line is that there is a whole lot of ways we could go in this draft, although I agree that we'll see at least a couple of OL's.