John Fox out in Denver

[c_hawkbob]

Wow.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... our-years/

[Hawk Sista]

WHOA! Clayton said this morning to look for it. I'd expect the Peyton announcement to follow.

[c_hawkbob]

Soon.

Followed by a fire sale. (I wonder ...)

[monkey]

Chalk up another team ultimately destroyed by the Seahawks. Yes, I know that it was the loss to the Colts that was the final nail in the coffin, (and man that had to hurt, for Manning to lose to his former team!) but really the coffin was built when they lost the Super Bowl, and the first nail to seal the lid shut, was hammered when they lost to us AGAIN.
I say that because, first they had to make all kinds of desperate and financially stupid moves in a last ditch effort to try again and to have a team that could compete with us...which they don't.*
Then after putting together a team that everyone thought could get back to the Superbowl and beat teams like the Seahawks, they played Seattle and got beat AGAIN! That'll take the wind out of your sails real quick.

Bottom line, the Broncos were always a paper tiger, at least when compared to legitimate teams like the Seahawks, (just like I said last year, not to toot my own horn), and when they were exposed in the Super Bowl, and then still fell short even after mortgaging the future to try to compete, they were doomed. The Colts just sealed the deal, but everyone could see the train wreck coming if you knew what to look for.

*Quick, name one time EVER when putting a team full of big name free agents has ever worked...you can't, because it never ever has. It never will either.

[RiverDog]

That one was a real surprise. I thought Fox was relatively safe. Also a bit surprised that the Bills hired Rex Ryan.

Fox's firing makes for 7 openings, right on the 6.8 average per year turnover. And the weird thing is that one of the longest tenured, Marvin Lewis, has never even won a playoff game and not even rumored to be in jeopardy of losing his job. He must have some Polaroids of Mike Brown doing a donkey or something.

[HumanCockroach]

His future in Denver crossed my mind late in the fourth quarter of that game yesterday. His teams have a habit of looking "unprepared" in the playoffs, and I wondered aloud yesterday if he had lost his chance there ( Elway has been "all in" for the last three years, and that performance couldn't have sat well with him yesterday).

That said, Fox deserves a hell of a lot of credit for his ability to adjust to what he has on hand, and the job he did there when saddled a couple seasons ago with a team lacking a QB, and adjusting mid season...

[Zorn76]

Even though he was only there 4 years, and compiled an impressive 46-18 mark during that time, I think this move is in Denver's best interest.

Time for a new think tank, and they likely have some major roster changes via FA's leaving, something that Fox himself likely wouldn't want to be a part of anyway.

The Broncos' window officially closed yesterday. Manning is likely gone, and even if he stays, I don't think they will make the playoffs next year. The defensive FA acquisition approach bombed - that one really is on Elway - and now he potentially has a full rebuilding of the roster ahead of him.

I guess the best thing about that HC gig is that none of the other teams in the division are all that great, either. KC will never go very far with Alex Smith at QB, there always seems to be something strange going on in SD, and the Raiders only bright spot is Derek Carr (which is huge) and a couple of other players.

[Uppercut]

Rumor from a pal in SF bay Area says Niners want Fox. I don't believe it but would not be a bad fit.

[c_hawkbob]

Rumor from a pal in SF bay Area says Niners want Fox. I don't believe it but would not be a bad fit.

I'd love that. I want the Niners to be a respectable opponent.

[monkey]

Fox loves to run the ball, and he's been with a team that featured a mobile QB and run first offense, with a powerful defense.
Makes almost too much sense if you ask me.

[jshawaii22]

Quick, name one time EVER when putting a team full of big name free agents has ever worked...you can't, because it never ever has. It never will either..

It's not football, but both the Miami Heat and the New York Yankees built dynasties with high price free agents and other free agents signed for a specific role (Ray Allen, for instance) so it can be done. Not sure about football, though. The Redskins and Denver are a prime example of how it fails most of the time.

js

[Hawktawk]

Its a hair fire. Couldn't happen to a nicer GM. LMAO

[kalibane]

And the weird thing is that one of the longest tenured, Marvin Lewis, has never even won a playoff game and not even rumored to be in jeopardy of losing his job. He must have some Polaroids of Mike Brown doing a donkey or something.

It's not that weird. I try to explain this every year. Mike Brown has been the Bengals Owner for 24 years. 12 years with Marvin Lewis and 12 years without here are the respective records:

With Marvin Lewis: 100-89-1
Without Marvin Lewis: 61-134

You can't look at John Fox being fired and think to yourself "How does Marvin Lewis have a job?". You know why? Because John Fox would never take the Bengals job.

I bring this up all the time but really think about this for a second and how ludicrous it is. The year is 2002, not 1965, not 1985, 2002. The Bengals have no scouting department. Not an exaggeration, not an overstatement. The Bengals did not employ a single scout. How insane is that?

This is the level of incompetence that Marvin Lewis fights against on a day by day basis. And he came in and changed the entire culture. He somehow managed to convince Mike Brown to step into the 20th century (if not completely into the 21st). No top level coach is taking this job so the chances of the Bengals actually improving their situation by firing Marvin Lewis are miniscule. That's the reason Lewis still has a job. It's why for the most part Bengals fans are okay with Lewis still having a job. And frankly it's why he should still have a job.

Marvin Lewis will likely never get close to winning a Super Bowl and he probably wouldn't win one with a better organization because his in game decisions are lacking at times but what he's done for the Bengals still manages to be one of the most underappreciated coaching jobs in the NFL.

[RiverDog]

It's not that weird.

It's not? Marvin Lewis has been the head coach for the Bengals for 12 years and has not won a single playoff game. How many NFL head coaches have coached for 10 years with the same team and never won a playoff game? How many have coached for 8 years and never won a playoff game? Or 6 years?

You can say all you want about the incompetence of Mike Brown as an owner and you will never get an argument out of me. But nevertheless, the fact that one coach has remained with his job for that amount of time with the playoff record Lewis has accumulated and not even rumored to be on the hot seat is extremely unusual to say the least.

[kalibane]

It's unusual but it's understandable considering the circumstances surrounding the organization. Elgin Baylor was the GM of the Clippers for 22 years even though his teams never won a playoff series. Who was his owner? Donald Sterling.

It just seems funny for people like you, an outsider, to say that Marvin Lewis should be fired even though by and large the fan base is at worst ambivalent about Marvin Lewis' continued employment.

See the fan base, and people like myself who live here, understand that Marvin Lewis is likely the best that it's going to get from a coaching standpoint. He's a respected guy, a good coach and has pretty good assistants and does an overall good job of running the organization. If they were to replace him they wouldn't be picking from guys like Dan Quinn, Adam Gase, Todd Bowles (all the hot younger guys)... they could never hope to land an established guy with tons of options like Rex Ryan or lure a guy like Jon Gruden out of retirement. I doubt they could get Mora to leave UCLA.

They would be picking from guys like Tony Sparanno. So as a Bengals fan what would you rather do? Keep Lewis who isn't great but has improved the talent level and performance of the franchise by leaps and bounds and hope that they upgrade Andy Dalton? Or you would rather they fire Lewis on principle and hire some retread like Tony Sparanno who has never had any success?

It's unusual because it's an unusual franchise... But it should not be surprising in the slightest. Especially after I have explained the situation every season for the last 7 years

[RiverDog]

It's unusual but it's understandable considering the circumstances surrounding the organization. Elgin Baylor was the GM of the Clippers for 22 years even though his teams never won a playoff series. Who was his owner? Donald Sterling.

It just seems funny for people like you, an outsider, to say that Marvin Lewis should be fired even though by and large the fan base is at worst ambivalent about Marvin Lewis' continued employment.

See the fan base, and people like myself who live here, understand that Marvin Lewis is likely the best that it's going to get from a coaching standpoint. He's a respected guy, a good coach and has pretty good assistants and does an overall good job of running the organization. If they were to replace him they wouldn't be picking from guys like Dan Quinn, Adam Gase, Todd Bowles (all the hot younger guys)... they could never hope to land an established guy with tons of options like Rex Ryan or lure a guy like Jon Gruden out of retirement. I doubt they could get Mora to leave UCLA.

They would be picking from guys like Tony Sparanno. So as a Bengals fan what would you rather do? Keep Lewis who isn't great but has improved the talent level and performance of the franchise by leaps and bounds and hope that they upgrade Andy Dalton? Or you would rather they fire Lewis on principle and hire some retread like Tony Sparanno who has never had any success?

It's unusual because it's an unusual franchise... But it should not be surprising in the slightest. Especially after I have explained the situation every season for the last 7 years

Just where is it that I said he should be fired? I said it was weird or unusual that he has survived for as long as he has. I could care less what another franchise does with their head coaching position.

[kalibane]

Fair enough... I may have read into your statement a little too far.

[RiverDog]

Fair enough... I may have read into your statement a little too far.

No problem, my friend. And I do remember quite well your defense of Marvin Lewis. As I recall, you once lived in the area so you perhaps have a little more insight than the rest of us.