HawkShack.com

"I'm just appalled at the attitude I've received on Twitter from people I thought were Golden Tate fans," Tate said Tuesday on 710 ESPN Seattle. "People are starting to show their true colors. I think the world of the 12s [Seahawks fans], but there is a large group who very quickly turned on me. It kind of bothered me because I felt like I gave everything I possibly could to the city of Seattle."

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10630 ... -laughable

I thought that may have been the case.
As I've said all along with Tate, he's redundant because of Percy Harvin.
There was just no reason for the Seahawks to offer him much since his role would have been greatly reduced with Harvin here anyway.
What this shows really is that Harvin is ready to go for us next year, and the Seahawks are really counting on him to play.
It also shows that they feel Kearse came on (as we all saw) and is also ready for a bigger role.

Can't blame Tate or any of these players who have left the team in free agency to make significantly more money for being disillusioned with knucklehead 12th man fans who are angry with players for doing so.

Actually surprised how little they offered him. 2.5 a year is as Tate said a "joke" based on his production not just in the passing game but what he brought in the return game, as well as his truly superb downfield blocking. The guy was clutch, and explosive. That said, my guess would be in that 4 to 4.5 range, I just assumed that the Detroit offer was quite a bit more, plus being an opportunity to play in a passing offense. Obviously Seattle didn't feel he was one of those "core" players.

If there are 12's trashing him, I guess you can't help band wagon fans doing it, but if there are actual 12's, they need to get a fricken grip. The man did nothing to any of them. Seattle came in with a VERY low offer, he left, not a thing wrong with that. My concern is the absolute indifference to upgrading the receiving core, I mean, a couple late round draft picks, an UDFA, one trade, and one FA signing 5 years ago, Tate leaves and they don't immediately bring in every receiver in the NFL, and don't give em' whatever they want. What gives?

They were dead last in passing, so all starting receivers from every team are better, and yet they have the gall to have defensive lineman come in.........


LOL. Relax, just a little brevity...

monkey wrote:I thought that may have been the case.
As I've said all along with Tate, he's redundant because of Percy Harvin.
There was just no reason for the Seahawks to offer him much since his role would have been greatly reduced with Harvin here anyway.
What this shows really is that Harvin is ready to go for us next year, and the Seahawks are really counting on him to play.
It also shows that they feel Kearse came on (as we all saw) and is also ready for a bigger role.

Tate was sooooooo redundant in 2013 with Harvin continuing his history of injuries....

What this really shows is that Schneider spent too much on Harvin and they are CROSSING THEIR FINGERS AND MAKING SACRIFICES TO THE GODS hoping that he is not the most overpaid and worthless player in the NFL two years in a row.

They were optimistic in 2013 and their optimism was misplaced. It cost Schneider the GM of the year award, although I know he would never trade the lombardi for 100 such awards.

Yes, the hawks had too many WRs that were too similar and they needed to lose one, but I think they chose the wrong one. I would've cut BOTH worthless injured Vikings WRs and that would have easily allowed us to keep Tate.

Tate > harvin

OK Briwas LOL! Ok...
If you want to look at it that way, fine, Harvin is a permanently damaged toy who we vastly overspent to get, and who we cannot count on for anything.
Clearly Tate is much better than Harvin...
Don't know why I haven't seen it all before...thanks for cluing me in!

First of all Tate, how long did it take for you to "Bloom"? Who stuck with you with you while you were blooming? 15 TD's 2198 yards receiving in four years?
Sure you have heart, desire and all that but your numbers don't warrant a 6 mil a year contract. I know your blocking, and kick off run backs were legit but how would you justify 6 mil a year with your stats?

Good luck in D town bud, you signed the contract with a team who's QB refuses to get mechanics coaching and in my opinion has a bad attitude. I truly feel like you did this in spite of the Hawks offer to you, and I get it. My question to you is did your agent even try to negotiate?.. Or did you get but hurt by the offer and not even go back to the table?

I know Percy's contract was mainly responsible for your departure and I know you knew this was coming.

I do think you deserve more than what the Hawks first offer was and don't blame you for moving on but don't act like a baby about it!

Thanks for years of service with the Hawks Tate, I know you will miss your team mates and I have a felling you are already regretting your decision, but hey your a rich man now so who cares right?

Yeah, I get it, I can totally see how Tate was probably like "WTH" when he got the offer. He obviously was expecting somewhere north of $4M a year, so the Hawks definitely low balled him. Makes you wonder if they would have been better off just telling him they weren't going to make an offer cause they didn't want to insult him, which is how he feels.

Bo Duke didn't have enough in the pot to give Golden what he deserved.

To each and every Hawks who has left for another team, it is hard to hold any ill will towards them. They helped bring Seattle its first Lombardi, and I am forever grateful as a fan.

I hope Tate lights it up in Detroit. I absolutely appreciated the way he played the game, he was anything but soft.

Could have done without a few of those punt return catches inside the 3 yard line though....

Good luck GT81

If Seattle truly offered Golden Tate 2.5 its an insult. A very esteemed and respected poster called Tate an "unfinished Steve Smith". Unless I'm mistaken Smith got more money than that after being released with a bum knee at age 35. Tate is a strong #2/1.5 type of reciever with the intangibles of toughness, run blocking ,return game, and attitude that provides a heartbeat for a team.
I think the guy has huge upside he was just starting to achieve and it was a huge mistake by our FO not to even make him a respectable offer. Its on them, this one was a mistake. The fans need to STFU. Good luck Golden, Ill be sweating when we match up with your new team at some point......

When, not If, but when Harvin goes down with an injury again and misses boofoo games, again, then the hawks will be sorry they didn't offer Tate a serious contract and essentially let him go. Our F/O isn't perfect, they do make mistakes (Rice, Carpenter, Moffitt, Irvin, etc...) but so far they have not had to pay dearly for those mistakes. The main reason I figured Tate would be gone was he didn't do much of anything in the Super Bowl and Lockette and Kearse did and that made both Tate and Rice expendable. Now, I really hope I am wrong about Harvin (and Irvin) but I am going to ,lower my grade from "A" to "B-" because they did not really even try to resign Tate and that was an insulting offer and that isn't good for team morale and chemistry.

Tate did get lowballed. No doubt about it.
They mistook what he said obviously what a hometown discount was.

Knuckle head fans are on every team. Tate needs to ignore those folks.
Thanks for the 4 years. Hewill be around the league well after PC retires and hopefully the Hawks and he can reunite during his twilight football years.

He is a rich man now, and he deserves it.

HumanCockroach wrote:Actually surprised how little they offered him. 2.5 a year is as Tate said a "joke" based on his production not just in the passing game but what he brought in the return game, as well as his truly superb downfield blocking. The guy was clutch, and explosive. That said, my guess would be in that 4 to 4.5 range, I just assumed that the Detroit offer was quite a bit more, plus being an opportunity to play in a passing offense. Obviously Seattle didn't feel he was one of those "core" players.

If there are 12's trashing him, I guess you can't help band wagon fans doing it, but if there are actual 12's, they need to get a fricken grip. The man did nothing to any of them. Seattle came in with a VERY low offer, he left, not a thing wrong with that. My concern is the absolute indifference to upgrading the receiving core, I mean, a couple late round draft picks, an UDFA, one trade, and one FA signing 5 years ago, Tate leaves and they don't immediately bring in every receiver in the NFL, and don't give em' whatever they want. What gives?

They were dead last in passing, so all starting receivers from every team are better, and yet they have the gall to have defensive lineman come in.........


LOL. Relax, just a little brevity...

Please substantiate this number. If that was our offer I side with Tater, but I've read elsewhere (also unsubstantiated) that it was $4M per ...

Never mind, I found it: http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10630 ... -laughable

Our offer was $4.5M per for a 4 year deal, commensurate IMO with his offer to accept a "home town discount".

He's saying "I didn't mean a 40% discount" but his deal with the Loins was $31M over 5 years which is $6.2M per ... an actual 27% discount, which strikes me as slightly more reasonable.

Of course he may well be using guaranteed money (which I can't find in our offer to him) to arrive at his 40% number, but given what I have found he's coming off as a just bit disingenuous..

Well 1 million a year is substantially less than 6 million a year....

I don't blame Tate for feeling a bit miffed, in his opinion he did everything asked of him and is worth more money.
He's right, he did do what he was asked to do, he blocked well, he stayed healthy and in great shape etc...
He was worth more money than he was offered...at least he was worth more to the LIONS.
Trouble is, he no longer fits Pete's blueprint, because he's a Harvin clone who's redundant with Harvin on the team.
Add to that the fact that this is a run first offense, which makes him a less important cog in the offense, and we all should have known that they were never going to offer him what he feels he is worth.
If 12's are nagging at him because he left, because they're butt-hurt he left, it's because they never understood his role or his real value to the team (which was mostly as a returner).
The Seahawks offered him what he was worth TO THE SEAHAWKS...it wasn't much. One might even call it insulting.
That's life, move on, get over it.

Even a 27% discount is kind of insulting. I wish Tate wouldn't paint all 12s with that brush but I completely understand. If the Hawks wouldn't go above 5 and he was getting over 6 in Detroit, he had to go.

And here's the thing. It's a 4 year deal which means he'll be in line to get one more bite at a big contract. So here is the financial reality of the situation. He could stay here for 1.7 million less per year. Or he can go to Detroit for 1.7 million more a year, get two to three times (considering Percy's presence taking touches away) the targets, never see double coverage and score an Eric Decker like contract in 4 years.

I also see it from the Seahawks perspective, and I love Golden Tate. He IMO is an ideal #2 guy but the Hawks need a big outside reciever and Tate just isn't big. Even though Tate has better ball skills and is a better blocker, the combo of Harvin and Baldwin does make him redundant. It sucks but this is what happens when you win a championship.

And again... I wish he wouldn't have thrown the 12s out there like that. He could have been offered 12 million a year by the Lions and some idiots on twitter would still have been mad at him. That's just the nature of the internet.

I don't blame him for taking the Loins offer either, I just don't buy the "insulting" part and think he's exaggerated the whole deal.

Business is business, we couldn't offer him what he wanted and he took another offer elsewhere, if he'd left it at that there would be no issue, but he's the one that made it a social media circus.

Contrast Tate's exit with that of Brandon Browner:

Today, I am proud to announce that I am a New England Patriot. I am honored
that the Patriots are making me part of their legendary organization, and am
grateful for the opportunity Mr. Kraft, Coach Belichick, Nick Caserio and
the entire team have given me. I intend to diligently work with the same
passion and dedication that I have displayed since coming into the NFL to
uphold the great traditions and qualities that are embodied by the Patriots.
I would be remiss if I didn’t thank the Seattle Seahawks for giving a CFL
player the once in-a-lifetime opportunity to return to the NFL, making a
young boy's dream come true. To Coach Pete Carroll, GM John Schneider, John
Idzik, Coach Richard, Rocky Seto, the LOB, my teammates, the training staff, the equipment guys the Seahawks organization as a whole and most importantly the 12th Man, I say thank you for everything you have done for myself and my family.
I am a truly blessed person.

BB

Now that's how to bid farewell to the 12th man!

I think what happened is the Loins offered over his market value and the Hawks below the market value.
If both were real, the difference might not have been too much, but what we see is about a 25 - 30% difference, so I don't blame him for taking the money.
It's a one play and your career is over business so they should take as much money as they can as soon as they can because that money being offered is not going to last for most of the players.

Regarding the twitter comments, if you take 1000 people at random, you are going to have a few jerks. Add in the anonymity of the Internet and that's probably multiplied. Then factor in the size of the tweeting pool and it's no wonder there are a lot of negative comments. It's too bad, but it's the way things are these days.
I suspect if he has a bad year, the Loins fans will be all over him on twitter, too.

There are people who would have bagged on Edgar freaking Martinez had he had to leave Seattle- don't take it personally, Golden.

The vast majority know it's a business both for you *and* the team. Good luck, my man.

c_hawkbob wrote:

HumanCockroach wrote:Actually surprised how little they offered him. 2.5 a year is as Tate said a "joke" based on his production not just in the passing game but what he brought in the return game, as well as his truly superb downfield blocking. The guy was clutch, and explosive. That said, my guess would be in that 4 to 4.5 range, I just assumed that the Detroit offer was quite a bit more, plus being an opportunity to play in a passing offense. Obviously Seattle didn't feel he was one of those "core" players.

If there are 12's trashing him, I guess you can't help band wagon fans doing it, but if there are actual 12's, they need to get a fricken grip. The man did nothing to any of them. Seattle came in with a VERY low offer, he left, not a thing wrong with that. My concern is the absolute indifference to upgrading the receiving core, I mean, a couple late round draft picks, an UDFA, one trade, and one FA signing 5 years ago, Tate leaves and they don't immediately bring in every receiver in the NFL, and don't give em' whatever they want. What gives?

They were dead last in passing, so all starting receivers from every team are better, and yet they have the gall to have defensive lineman come in.........


LOL. Relax, just a little brevity...

Please substantiate this number. If that was our offer I side with Tater, but I've read elsewhere (also unsubstantiated) that it was $4M per ...

Just going off of what was reported ( ie I can make in one year what the Seahawks offered, in two, ie half of what his yearly contract was) in fact in my post I surmised that 4-4.5 was what I guessed Seattle was going to offer. If they did, and he still took Detroits offer, it makes no difference to me as far as him accepting it.

I really was trying to say IF that is what they offered ( 2.5 ish) than it was an insulting offer. The 4 million per isn't IMHO, no way Seattle could know his market would go that high ( though to be fair, some of us said he would get it before last year, so perhaps they should have.)

OK, I loved Tate in Seattle these past COUPLE of years. But let's get real. I mean REAL real:

Under 900 yards and what(?) 5 or 6 TD's? That isn't #1 receiver production and it isn't worth $31 million. And Tate's first two years were pretty much a bust. And remember, Washington State doesn't have an income tax, so your $31 mil isn't going to go as far in Detroit. And to be quite honest, just how much of that $31 mil do you expect Tate will actually collect? There is just as good a chance that this ends up being a contract that he collects under half that amount.

Tate is a fantastic YAC receiver and a fine punt returner. But Baldwin and Kearse worked harder at improving their game from the outset and are cheaper. Some of the money that Tate was hoping to get went to Hauschka, who is the leading scorer on the team. And to say that Harvin and Tate have the same skill set---get real. Percy may be a delicate flower that needs to be handled with care, while Tate is a seemingly indestructible small catcher, but in the open field with a ball in their hand (sort of the description for what a receiver does) there is simply no comparison. Harvin is far and away the greater talent. We have two Tate style receivers already, Tate was redundant.

Good luck playing in Detroit. Good luck convincing Matt Stafford that he needs work as a QB (and getting him to actually, ya' know, WORK). And have fun playing the Pack twice a year. I believe they have a bone to pick with you.

I see Tate and Harvin in slightly different roles.
Tate was/is a "bread and butter" type while Harvin is the Jelly.
Meaning Tate will get the good, dependable yards and Harvin, when healthy, will get you the explosive gains. The roles are similar, but slightly different.
I wish we could have both, but with our Offense not throwing a lot relative to Detroit, I can see the attraction for Tate of going to the Loins.

There are three things that Tate does better than Harvin. Blocking, Jump Balls and staying healthy. Harvin even matches Tate's vaunted drop rate. In the first half of 2012 before getting hurt with the Vikings Harvin had 62 catches and zero drops.

Aside from those three things, Harvin does everything that Tate does and mostly does it better.

I think the biggest wild card of the similarities is Health.
Can Harvin last a full season, let alone 4 like Tate did?

c_hawkbob wrote:I don't blame him for taking the Loins offer either, I just don't buy the "insulting" part and think he's exaggerated the whole deal.

Business is business, we couldn't offer him what he wanted and he took another offer elsewhere, if he'd left it at that there would be no issue, but he's the one that made it a social media circus.

Contrast Tate's exit with that of Brandon Browner:

Today, I am proud to announce that I am a New England Patriot. I am honored
that the Patriots are making me part of their legendary organization, and am
grateful for the opportunity Mr. Kraft, Coach Belichick, Nick Caserio and
the entire team have given me. I intend to diligently work with the same
passion and dedication that I have displayed since coming into the NFL to
uphold the great traditions and qualities that are embodied by the Patriots.
I would be remiss if I didn’t thank the Seattle Seahawks for giving a CFL
player the once in-a-lifetime opportunity to return to the NFL, making a
young boy's dream come true. To Coach Pete Carroll, GM John Schneider, John
Idzik, Coach Richard, Rocky Seto, the LOB, my teammates, the training staff, the equipment guys the Seahawks organization as a whole and most importantly the 12th Man, I say thank you for everything you have done for myself and my family.
I am a truly blessed person.

BB

Now that's how to bid farewell to the 12th man!

Nice post Bob and a +1.

Not sure what we offered. Articles I have read don't say much. Anyway, outside of this little experience, Tate has been a stand up guy.

If the Hawks were far off from what the Loins offered I would be a bit miffed myself to be honest. Problem is, I don't know how much the Hawks offered.

Hardly surprised Tate ended up elsewhere, and for the contract he got, who can blame him.

I guess one ring is enough.

He's not going to win any in Detroit.

He's a playmaker that took awhile to develop, but became a good WR and excellent punt returner. Best of luck to Golden as a Lion.

Zorn76 wrote:Hardly surprised Tate ended up elsewhere, and for the contract he got, who can blame him.

I guess one ring is enough.

He's not going to win any in Detroit.

He's a playmaker that took awhile to develop, but became a good WR and excellent punt returner. Best of luck to Golden as a Lion.

+1

kalibane wrote:There are three things that Tate does better than Harvin. Blocking, Jump Balls and staying healthy. Harvin even matches Tate's vaunted drop rate. In the first half of 2012 before getting hurt with the Vikings Harvin had 62 catches and zero drops.

Aside from those three things, Harvin does everything that Tate does and mostly does it better.

You can't forget about Tate's punt returns, understanding that Harvin is obviously one of the better KO returnees. But I'd rather have a good punt returner than a good KO returner, and Tate was one of the best punt returners we've had in decades IMO.

RiverDog wrote:

kalibane wrote:There are three things that Tate does better than Harvin. Blocking, Jump Balls and staying healthy. Harvin even matches Tate's vaunted drop rate. In the first half of 2012 before getting hurt with the Vikings Harvin had 62 catches and zero drops.

Aside from those three things, Harvin does everything that Tate does and mostly does it better.

You can't forget about Tate's punt returns, understanding that Harvin is obviously one of the better KO returnees. But I'd rather have a good punt returner than a good KO returner, and Tate was one of the best punt returners we've had in decades IMO.

While I understand why Pete wouldn't do this, I LOVE the idea of Harvin returning punts as well, particularly if we have a game where we've held the opposition to only one or two scores by the second half, and kickoff return opportunities are minimal.

Nah I didn't forget anything. The idea that Harvin can't return punts just because they opted to put him on kickoffs instead is kind of absurd to me. If he's not the best player in space in the entire league he's in the top 3 (better than Tate).

It's not uncommon for an otherwise every down player to only return one or the other.

Tate is gone, no sense crying over spilled milk.He's upset and so am I but its set in stone. But I also think that expecting Harvin to be an every down player, return kickoffs and punts and not break down at some point is simply whistling in the graveyard. He has played in 3 games in the last year and a half and was knocked out of one of them. It really doesn't matter, he justified the trade with a couple of huge plays that helped Seattle win a SB, something that some teams have never had and maybe never will.

The receiving corps could probably use some bolstering but then again with 3 nice tight ends in McCoy, Miller, and Willson that's a unique set of targets in the NE mold. Kearse was going ballistic towards the end of the season. Baldwin is terrific.And why is it set in stone that Lockette with his world class speed and good size cant emerge?

The wild card is Russel Wilson. He will be coaching these guys up and throwing with them and they will be better. Pretty tough to make a case against Seattle being successful when they are holding a Lombardi they won handily with a "pedestrian" group last season.

Big Blue is going to be on a roll.....

Hawktawk wrote:Tate is gone, no sense crying over spilled milk.He's upset and so am I but its set in stone. But I also think that expecting Harvin to be an every down player, return kickoffs and punts and not break down at some point is simply whistling in the graveyard. He has played in 3 games in the last year and a half and was knocked out of one of them. It really doesn't matter, he justified the trade with a couple of huge plays that helped Seattle win a SB, something that some teams have never had and maybe never will.

The receiving corps could probably use some bolstering but then again with 3 nice tight ends in McCoy, Miller, and Willson that's a unique set of targets in the NE mold. Kearse was going ballistic towards the end of the season. Baldwin is terrific.And why is it set in stone that Lockette with his world class speed and good size cant emerge?

The wild card is Russel Wilson. He will be coaching these guys up and throwing with them and they will be better. Pretty tough to make a case against Seattle being successful when they are holding a Lombardi they won handily with a "pedestrian" group last season.

Big Blue is going to be on a roll.....

Who said that? Carter right?
That statement still sticks in my craw.

I'd rather have a good punt returner than a good KO returner

Hm. I think I'd say the opposite for me. You can kick away from punt returners pretty easily, and the majority of punts are fair-caught anyway, aren't they?

If they move the Kickoff to the 40 as is under consideration, there won't be a need for a kick returner.

It is always disappointing to me to hear fans rip players like GT. Social media gives idiots a direct shot, too. Whether or not it made fottball sense to keep him is a discussion we can have, but lots of fans take his decision to follow the money personally. He stated he would give a discount, but dang - if he can make the cheddar he can get from Detroit - go for it. He got a ring, now it's time to set himself up for the future. I would have respected either decision and recognize it was hard on him as he really really wanted to be a Hawk; just not more than he wanted 6 million dollars/year.

All that said - GT would be well served to realize that the majority of fans don't get on twitter to say thank you. He needs thicker skin or it's gonna be a long life. Unfortunately, the NFL is a "What have you done for me lately" league, and the Seattle FO did not prioritize him at 6 million a year for 5 years. He needs to realize he's got to worry about the Detroit fans now - I might be a little irritated if our new guy was still grousing about his old team's fans comments on social media. Grow up man, and move on. #dude-itstwitter #youmadeyourselflooksmall

PS - I enjoyed watching him and wish we coulda kept him. Too bad it's a business and building a bad ass defense is job #1.

Hawk Sista wrote:It is always disappointing to me to hear fans rip players like GT. Social media gives idiots a direct shot, too. Whether or not it made fottball sense to keep him is a discussion we can have, but lots of fans take his decision to follow the money personally. He stated he would give a discount, but dang - if he can make the cheddar he can get from Detroit - go for it. You have a ring, now set yourself up for the future. I would have respected wither decision and recognize it was hard on him as he wanted to be a Hawk; just not more than he wanted 6 million dollars.

All that said - GT would be well served to realize that the majority of fans don't get on twitter to say thank you. He needs thicker skin or it's gonna be a long life. Unfortunately, the NFL is a "What have you done for me lately" league, and the Seattle FO did not prioritize him at 6 million a year for 5 years. He needs to realize he's got to worry about the Detroit fans now - I might be a little irritated if our new guy was still grousing about his old team's fans comments on social media. Grow up man, and move on. #dude-itstwitter #youmadeyourselflooksmall

PS - I enjoyed watching him and wish we coulda kept him. Too bad it's a business and building a bad ass defense is job #1.

So true. If he has a bad or unproductive year in Detroit, he will probably hear a lot worse. The seeming anonymity of social media - or at least never having to go face to face to say some of the insulting things that are said does create rawer (if that's a word) expressions from posters. But that's better than having your thoughts censored.

burrrton wrote:

I'd rather have a good punt returner than a good KO returner

Hm. I think I'd say the opposite for me. You can kick away from punt returners pretty easily, and the majority of punts are fair-caught anyway, aren't they?

Because of all the traffic they operate in vs. a KO, I've always favored the sure handed, exercises good judgment punt returner over the KO counterpart because of all the potential bad things that can happen. Plus if they move KO's up to the 40 like they are talking about, a kick returner will become as obsolete as a buggy whip factory.

Besides, if your kickoff returner is getting a lot of opportunities, you're probably in a lot of trouble anyway. The opposite is true with your punt returner.

I just watched my Road to the Superbowl dvd for the first time last night and I have to say, we will miss GT's play. He is a great punt returner and made some spectacular catches in his time here. Having said that, I don't think the sky is falling but he will surely be missed.

PasadenaHawk wrote:I just watched my Road to the Superbowl dvd for the first time last night and I have to say, we will miss GT's play. He is a great punt returner and made some spectacular catches in his time here. Having said that, I don't think the sky is falling but he will surely be missed.

+1. Yeah he will be missed. Bad decision by the FO, he was a heart and soul of the Hawks type guy. And absolutely fearless, he didn't even know what alligator arms were, or fair catches for that matter. Bummer.

Besides, if your kickoff returner is getting a lot of opportunities, you're probably in a lot of trouble anyway. The opposite is true with your punt returner.

Fair point!