Pete Carroll on "grit" and a couple monkey observations

[monkey]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSizvISegnE

First observation, Pete talks about Earl Thomas exactly the way that any fan who really knows what ET is all about, would expect him to. ET is simply the best. He's exactly the kind of guy that Pete wants, and that Pete wants to build around. *which will lead me to another point I will get back to. For all the focus the media puts on Sherman and Wilson, (both deserving in their own rights) what they are CLEARLY missing is that it is Earl Thomas that truly makes the defense go, and is easily the most valuable player on our defense. He is utterly irreplaceable.

Second observation, Maxwell was also exactly what we all thought he was...just another nice player, not special. Until he bought in to what Pete was selling, because he "saw" Earl Thomas for who he was and started following his example. Now he's become something much closer to his true potential, and probably has even more room to grow. This is EXACTLY the type of thing Pete wants more than anything else. Byron Maxwell is exhibit A for everyone we draft or bring in as a free agent from this day onward, for how being truly "all in" can take you from a "nice" player to someone special.

Third observation, if Earl Thomas is exactly the type of player Pete values the most (and he is) and he is exactly the type of player that Pete wants to build his team around and who he will pay to keep around (again, he is, and he will get paid, as he is CLEARLY a "core" player) then so is Richard Sherman.
Think about what Sherman has done since making the switch from WR to corner in college. The guy busted his rear end off learning a new position, one which at first, he was actually pretty lousy at. He worked and worked until he managed to become good enough to be taken in the fifth round, mostly based on projections of his ceiling in the NFL.
Then, at the next level, he quickly bought in to what Pete was selling, he quickly got better and better to the point where he was sstarter quality. He challenged himself by putting his reputation on the line when he proclaimed himself to be the best corner in the NFL, long before most people thought he was...maybe even before he'd actually gotten to that point. He said what he said because he was challenging himself to accept no less than being THE BEST.
What's my point?
My point is, if Earl Thomas is a "core" player, one that Pete will no doubt want to keep because of the example he is to other players of what is possible by being "all in", then Richard Sherman CERTAINLY is as well!
What I am saying is, *(and this is the point I was alluding to in my first observation, and is tied to what I was saying about Thomas), there is no doubt in my mind based on what I heard from Pete in that interview (even though it had nothing to do with Richard Sherman), that the Seahawks front office will absolutely view re-signing Sherman as a "MUST". You cannot preach being all in, and always compete and win forever and not do everything possible to re-sign a guy who has demonstrated EXACTLY that at every turn.
It's my opinion therefore that Pete can no more let Sherman walk than he could let Matt Flynn start ahead of Russell Wilson after being clearly outperformed by Wilson. It would damage Pete's ability to sell his philosophy, because it flies in the face of his philosophy.

Final observation, we've all heard about how after Pete got fired from the Pats he went and re-invented himself, I see where they get that idea from, and I agree that he sort of did in a way, but from what I see from Pete, it's not so much re-inventing himself as he re-focused himself in what he already believed at his core about football and life in general.
THAT is why people are now buying what he's selling, even if they didn't his first time around in the NFL, because it's coming from a genuine place, it's really the heart of what he earnestly believes.

Feel free to tell me where I am wrong.

[NorthHawk]

Buy-in to any philosophy or system is a huge factor in team success.
With a ring, it should make it easier for others who join his program to make the decision to commit as proven success is the best persuader of them all.

Interesting point about Maxwell, and it has obviously worked for him. I wonder how Shead is doing. I hear a lot of good things about him.
The other guy is Simon. I hope he's over his foot injuries and has seen how much effort it takes to become a starter in not only the NFL, but the Seahawks in particular.
He has the physical qualities, but does he have the drive to be the best he can be.

[Zorn76]

Another epic post by monkey.

I get what you're saying about ET and Sherman, and RW goes without saying.

The interesting thing in all this is the timing of the upcoming contracts. First, it's Earl and Richard (end of 2014), then the following season (2015's conclusion) for RW, correct?

Naturally, our F.O. is aware of all this, and maybe they feel they already have a good handle on what each expects. The X-factor, for me, is Sherman.

I've mentioned this in other threads, and will say the same here: I could really see Sherman leaving for more money, even if it means playing for a 5-8 win team, at best. I really can. Don't want it to happen but, sorry, I just don't trust this guy nearly as much as I do ET and RW. And at the end of the day, who can blame him if he chooses to go that, er, route?

We all know it's a business, but I think for Richard especially so.

I threw out a guesstimate of his potential contract (70-75 mil / 33-35 guaranteed). Total guess here, off the top of my head. But when I see Aqib Talib get 57 mil / 26 guaranteed from the cash cap happy Broncos, I don't think my guess is all that outrageous. Now, that is for 6 yrs, not 4 or 5, so it is spread out. But for a 28 yr old player, still not a bad deal for A.T.

The league is nuts these days, and monster deals seem to be trending again. I know Pete will do everything he can to keep the league's best CB, but he also can't control what kind of Powerball lotto money his guy could get elsewhere, making even his most prized cornerback come at a prohibitive cost.

[NorthHawk]

I can see Sherman going to the Jags and here's why (in no particular order):

More money offered with the Jags being able to clear Cap room easier.
A chance to prove he's the best CB in the league without people saying he's benefiting from an already great Defense.
He gets to teach other young players how to be their best and be part of developing a new team (He seems to like being a mentor to others).
He would experience that same feeling of accomplishment as the secondary develops.
A new challenge - and reason to get a chip on his shoulder as they are disrespected early.
Gus Bradley.
Familiarity with the system Bradley wants to play.
Florida weather.
Former Seahawks already in Jacksonville he knows.

But then again, he might stay here.
Time will tell.

[Eaglehawk]

Every player has his range. The range that PC goes much be in harmony with the market. If he goes on the lower end of the range with some incentives, and guaranteed money, then Sherman will stay. RW will command whatever Kaper is commanding and word on the street is that it might be 18-20 mill per year.
Huge payday.

I think Sherm RW and ET will stay but it's gonna cost us big time.

I actually don't disagree with anything you said Monkey. Good post.

[Steady_Hawk]

Our FO is nothing if not brilliant. If the Hawks were getting the feeling that Sherman wants some insane contract that would eventually cripple the team they would be shopping him for draft picks right now. He's worth two first rounders without batting an eye. Sherman isn't going anywhere IMO, and I think he may surprise some people with a contract that isn't the highest paid at his position.

[monkey]

Well, this would certainly be the best time to trade him, you'd get maximum return because he still has a year left, and he's still on his rookie contract, so the team trading for him wouldn't have to pay much, and would still have first crack at negotiating and extension, if they wanted to.

Thing is, if Sherman went somewhere else, he wouldn't get to holler about the LOB, or market the LOB, or make money selling shirts that mention the LOB, because there would be no more LOB.
He knows the kind of endorsement opportunities available to him here if he stays, and he also knows that, all that goes away the moment he leaves, and that will all get factored into his decision.
I'd bet just about anything he stays, maybe even just for the endorsement opportunities he has here, and nowhere else. He will more than make up for any money not earned in his contract from endorsements.

[NorthHawk]

Well, this would certainly be the best time to trade him, you'd get maximum return because he still has a year left, and he's still on his rookie contract, so the team trading for him wouldn't have to pay much, and would still have first crack at negotiating and extension, if they wanted to.

Thing is, if Sherman went somewhere else, he wouldn't get to holler about the LOB, or market the LOB, or make money selling shirts that mention the LOB, because there would be no more LOB.
He knows the kind of endorsement opportunities available to him here if he stays, and he also knows that, all that goes away the moment he leaves, and that will all get factored into his decision.
I'd bet just about anything he stays, maybe even just for the endorsement opportunities he has here, and nowhere else. He will more than make up for any money not earned in his contract from endorsements.

Good points.
I tend to think Sherman loves a challenge - maybe to the point of thriving on it. Here he has nothing left to prove to anyone.
Somewhere else, he can solidify his image of being a great CB and drag them up to be their best as he has helped in Seattle.

[Oly]

Fantastic post, monkey. My only quibbles, and the first one isn't really a quibble at all:

-If anything, I don't think you were effusive enough in your praise of ET. He's not just the most important player on the defense; for my money, he's the most valuable player in the NFL. The Hawks' D was easily the best in the league, and because I agree with you that none of that happens without ET, you can easily say that he's the difference between a good D and an all-time great D.

-I disagree with this: It's my opinion therefore that Pete can no more let Sherman walk than he could let Matt Flynn start ahead of Russell Wilson after being clearly outperformed by Wilson. It would damage Pete's ability to sell his philosophy, because it flies in the face of his philosophy. The reason is that whether or not Sherm stays will be driven more by cap realities than coaching philosophy. I think that without trying like hell to get Sherm to stay, Pete's philosophy is damaged, but if the Hawks are outbid--which is a possibility--then you can't pin that on Pete.

What will happen with Sherm is the most interesting story of this team, and I think will continue to be until he's locked up or leaves. I can see Sherm going for the best contract on the idea that it shows which team recognizes that he is the best CB. (This is why he might leave, even if the overall money is better as a LOB member, as monkey noted above me. I think that Sherm's concern about money will be more about the respect that the money indicates more than the money itself. But I'm guessing, obviously...)

I can also see him wanting to be remembered as the best CB of his era, and even though he has the confidence to know that he can do that anywhere, he knows that being on this team with ET will give him a legacy that would be impossible elsewhere. He's clearly driven by a justified ego, but that doesn't clearly lead me to any specific prediction. It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

[monkey]

Fantastic post, monkey. My only quibbles, and the first one isn't really a quibble at all:

-If anything, I don't think you were effusive enough in your praise of ET. He's not just the most important player on the defense; for my money, he's the most valuable player in the NFL. The Hawks' D was easily the best in the league, and because I agree with you that none of that happens without ET, you can easily say that he's the difference between a good D and an all-time great D.

Well considering he is the most valuable player on the most valuable part of the team that won the Superbowl, that's not a tough sell to say he's the league's most valuable player...at least not to me. Of course, I am biased.

-I disagree with this: It's my opinion therefore that Pete can no more let Sherman walk than he could let Matt Flynn start ahead of Russell Wilson after being clearly outperformed by Wilson. It would damage Pete's ability to sell his philosophy, because it flies in the face of his philosophy. The reason is that whether or not Sherm stays will be driven more by cap realities than coaching philosophy. I think that without trying like hell to get Sherm to stay, Pete's philosophy is damaged, but if the Hawks are outbid--which is a possibility--then you can't pin that on Pete.

What will happen with Sherm is the most interesting story of this team, and I think will continue to be until he's locked up or leaves. I can see Sherm going for the best contract on the idea that it shows which team recognizes that he is the best CB. (This is why he might leave, even if the overall money is better as a LOB member, as monkey noted above me. I think that Sherm's concern about money will be more about the respect that the money indicates more than the money itself. But I'm guessing, obviously...)

I can also see him wanting to be remembered as the best CB of his era, and even though he has the confidence to know that he can do that anywhere, he knows that being on this team with ET will give him a legacy that would be impossible elsewhere. He's clearly driven by a justified ego, but that doesn't clearly lead me to any specific prediction. It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

I like the way you phrased what I underlined. Given the way you phrased that, I would agree your correction.
I also agree that it's perhaps the most interesting story on this team right now. It certainly is for me, because compelling cases can be made either way.
Personally I think he'll stay, I really do...but I can easily see why people think differently.

[THX-1138]

Great post, Monkey. I agree with everything you have said. What the hell is wrong with you?

Here is my perspective: I have been saying all along once the FA period began that Sherman would probably stay here seeing as he has spent a lot of his time and effort marketing the LOB. Just take a look at his FB and Twitter accounts. The guy is a shameless promoter and brander. He goes someplace else and all of that work is for naught. But let's just say he does take the money and runs. What happens then?

Well, the reason Sherman is so good and a real shut down corner from his side of the field is because of Earl Thomas. ET and Kam take away a half to two thirds of the field, easily. All Sherm has to do is cover what is left of his patch of the field. Unlike most of the legendary shut down corners, Sherman does not switch sides. He doesn't have to. But it does make his job a little bit easier. So if he left I don't think he would be nearly as successful. And whoever we would get, while admittedly probably not being as talented as Sherman, would more than likely develop into a very decent corner with Earl at safety and Pete coaching. Sherman's smart move would be to take the Seattle payday, since sinking into oblivion doesn't seem to be his style. Of course, nobody can predict the future. But the signs actually point to him staying. ET is the key. Sign that dude. For life.

And RW, too. Because he is just that awesome.

[monkey]

Great post, Monkey. I agree with everything you have said. What the hell is wrong with you?

Here is my perspective: I have been saying all along once the FA period began that Sherman would probably stay here seeing as he has spent a lot of his time and effort marketing the LOB. Just take a look at his FB and Twitter accounts. The guy is a shameless promoter and brander. He goes someplace else and all of that work is for naught.

http://www.fieldgulls.com/videos/2014/3/27/5555514/richard-sherman-marketing-genius
Here ya go, proof of what you are saying. I'm actually going to make a separate thread about this, so it will get seen by more people, but I thought it was fitting to put it here as well.
The more I think about him possibly leaving, the more ridiculous I find the notion.
There’s very little chance he’ll walk away from all that endorsement/clothing line money that he can only make in Seattle playing for the Seahawks.

I mean, it would have to be one helluva contract offer to get him to walk away from the market he’s carved out for himself here, to walk away from the Seahawks L.O.B. brand that he’s helped to create and popularize, and from all those endorsement dollars that Seattle area (and national) businesses will throw at him.
He’s carved out a niche for himself here where he can more than make up for whatever he doesn't get from his contract directly, through endorsements and his clothing line etc…but that is not going to work somewhere else.

His clothing line with Seahawks colors, the L.O.B. brand, the special moment that he created in the Erin Andrews interview, and with “the Tip”...it all goes away the moment he leaves for a different team, and he has to start all over again.

No contract is worth that!
The more I think about it, the more I truly believe that he’s here for life, or at least the better part of his playing career, because he’s quite literally stuck his stake in the ground here in far too many ways to just walk away.