Russell Wilson

[RiverDog]

Has this been brought up yet in this thread? If true, what a shot by Gordon to Russ! I know Gordon had his fumbling issues which were a major concern, but I do wonder if Russ had anything to do with his release as well.

BREAKING: Multiple sources indicate that after last night's OT loss to the #Raiders, Former #Broncos RB Melvin Gordon loudly played several songs by Hip Hop artist 'Future' in the #Broncos Locker Room.

QB Russell Willson reportedly demanded his immediate release that same night

For those that don't know, Future is an American rapper that was engaged to Ciara and they had a kid together before she got together with Russ. I think most know who he is from when Russ played in Seattle.

What a disaster in Denver!!

Here's what one of the beat reporters from the Broncos' flagship radio station KOA, Benjamin Albright, had to say about it:

This isn't true at all, but it's funny so people will fall for it.

There was no music in the locker room. I (Albright) was there. Guys cleared out pretty quick. Russ and Melvin, who are friends dating back to college and have a locker next to each other were totally fine. Melvin was released for fumbling.

But such is life in the fishbowl. Even though this story is almost certainly false, it comes with the territory. And you're right, it's a disaster of epic proportions in Denver.

[Agent 86]

Here's what one of the beat reporters from the Broncos' flagship radio station KOA, Benjamin Albright, had to say about it:

This isn't true at all, but it's funny so people will fall for it.

There was no music in the locker room. I (Albright) was there. Guys cleared out pretty quick. Russ and Melvin, who are friends dating back to college and have a locker next to each other were totally fine. Melvin was released for fumbling.

But such is life in the fishbowl. Even though this story is almost certainly false, it comes with the territory. And you're right, it's a disaster of epic proportions in Denver.

Aah Ok, thanks River. I wondered about this one, seemed fishy to me. But it's turned into a weekly thing to pile on Russ right now in the social media world. I read yesterday some guy is doing a weekly update on Russell Wilson TD passes vs the number of bathrooms in his house. It's 12-8 in favour of the bathrooms right now.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/lists/broncos-russell-wilson-bathrooms-house-td-passes-losing-come-on

[RiverDog]

Aah Ok, thanks River. I wondered about this one, seemed fishy to me. But it's turned into a weekly thing to pile on Russ right now in the social media world. I read yesterday some guy is doing a weekly update on Russell Wilson TD passes vs the number of bathrooms in his house. It's 12-8 in favour of the bathrooms right now.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/lists/broncos-russell-wilson-bathrooms-house-td-passes-losing-come-on

Yeah, the TD passes to chitter ratio has been circulating for the past few weeks and is another example of how Russell has become the laughingstock of the league. It's been an amazing fall from grace. Most athletes experience this kind of decline in popularity when they do something illegal or immoral, not when they're actually a law-abiding, decent, and outstanding citizen. There might have been others, but the only player that I can think of that went through a similar plight was Tim Tebow.

[Old but Slow]

Russell=Tebow? Ouch, River, that's hard.

[Old but Slow]

I like this time system on here. I can post an answer a full hour before the guy I am responding to. Time travel at its best.

[RiverDog]

I like this time system on here. I can post an answer a full hour before the guy I am responding to. Time travel at its best.

Wow, I hadn't noticed that! Leave it to an old fogie to look at that kind of detail.

Although it's far a perfect comparison, I see a lot of similarities between Tebow and Russell.

[Hawktawk]

I like this time system on here. I can post an answer a full hour before the guy I am responding to. Time travel at its best.

Wow, I hadn't noticed that! Leave it to an old fogie to look at that kind of detail.

Although it's far a perfect comparison, I see a lot of similarities between Tebow and Russell.[/quote]

No to gloat but I brought up the comparison a decade ago . Said Tebow is a less accurate bigger white Russ . A guy who ran around , made plays with his feet and more than he got credit for with his arm . Beat people with his mind no matter how bad he threw the ball that day . 59 minutes of chaos and a last second win. Russ had some of those .
Russ was blessed beyond his wildest dreams to be drafted by an organization like Seattle , hand picked to start by Pete , stood behind , compensated .
Tebow was cursed to be drafted by Denver , inherited by John Elway who hated him , said negative crap after wins, couldn’t stand the adoration from the fans , he was jealous , most popular bronco qb since him .

He traded him after a trip to the divisional following a walk off OT touchdown pass over Big Ben and Pittsburgh . Elway traded him the worst possible place where the owner wanted him and the coach didn’t . And after a few years he went in the Geno file . Not good enough to start and too high profile to keep as a backup.

Elway brought in HGH poster boy and after getting beat at home in the first round by Joe Flacco as he froze they were humiliated by Seattle in Manning’s first trip , another 1 and done then their championship came with Manning so washed up Tebow would have been a better option . Hell Elway might have been .
Manning had aQBR of 38 and was 1-14 on third down . And a full blown PED scandal rocking Manning game week .

Since then ? No playoffs then a trade virus called the R3 that’s eating the program .

Maybe it’s the Tebow curse . Lol . I like it!!!!

He’d have won lots of games here in that ground and pound shut down defense era but we had the chosen one . The blessed . Seventh son of a seventh son .

Russ was very lucky compared to Tebow .

[RiverDog]

Except that you thought that Tebow was a good quarterback when nearly everyone else said that he would fizzle like he did.

There are dissimilarities, too. Tebow had horrible mechanics, a slow wind up of a release. Russell has very good mechanics, a good quick release and throws a pretty deep ball. Tebow was a tight end playing quarterback and wasn't all that elusive and gained most of his running yards by bowling over people. He didn't have the same degree of touch on his passes that Russell does, and he didn't extend plays to the same degree. Russell is a fart in the skillet.

What I was thinking of wasn't so much their football skills as I was their over exposure and ridicule. When Tebow had that one or two years where he did well, he was being interviewed every single day on NFL Network, ESPN, etc. I was working swing shift at the time, and would listen to several programs, and I couldn't get away from hearing him if I tried. And Tebow liked to talk about his religion, a subject that doesn't go over well with a good percentage of fans. A lot of people, including myself, started piling on him, calling him a guy with a backpack and a bible, white shirt and black tie preaching the faith. Had social media been as prevalent then as it is today, he would have been roasted non stop like Russell is getting it today.

Russell and Tebow both liked getting their mugs in front of a camera and their lips on a microphone, and they over did it. There's a point of diminishing returns on people's tolerance of seeing and hearing another individual. I get tired of seeing the same guy pitching the same commercial, like Joe Namath selling Medicare Advantage. Russell has exceeded that point, especially since his on field performance has been so horrible.

[c_hawkbob]

Good lord now Russ was lucky to be compared to Tebow?! What a load of crap. Russ was and is by nearly every measure a better athlete and football player than Tebow. Exponentially.

Have a friend that knew both personally, was a childhood friend of Tim Tebow (calls him Timmy), played baseball with him starting with little league in the third grade and football starting in HS and at Florida and played Minor League ball with Russ in North Carolina. He said the difference was night and day. Russ was much faster, more athletic and more focused. Timmy was stronger, that's it, his only measure of superiority.

Russ has fallen on more difficult times presently, but the truth is still the truth.

[RiverDog]

Good lord now Russ was lucky to be compared to Tebow?! What a load of crap. Russ was and is by nearly every measure a better athlete and football player than Tebow. Exponentially.

Agreed. Russell is a lot better overall athlete with much better quarterbacking skills than Tebow, which is why Tebow has 16 career NFL starts where Russell has 168. I wasn't comparing their athletic talents as much as I was their off-field behavior.

Have a friend that knew both personally, was a childhood friend of Tim Tebow (calls him Timmy), played baseball with him starting with little league in the third grade and football starting in HS and at Florida and played Minor League ball with Russ in North Carolina. He said the difference was night and day. Russ was much faster, more athletic and more focused. Timmy was stronger, that's it, his only measure of superiority.

Russ has fallen on more difficult times presently, but the truth is still the truth.

Interesting. Didn't you once comment a while back about how Tebow's long, slow wind-up delivery was due to his playing youth baseball? It made sense.

[Hawktawk]

Except that you thought that Tebow was a good quarterback when nearly everyone else said that he would fizzle like he did.

There are dissimilarities, too. Tebow had horrible mechanics, a slow wind up of a release. Russell has very good mechanics, a good quick release and throws a pretty deep ball. Tebow was a tight end playing quarterback and wasn't all that elusive and gained most of his running yards by bowling over people. He didn't have the same degree of touch on his passes that Russell does, and he didn't extend plays to the same degree. Russell is a fart in the skillet.

What I was thinking of wasn't so much their football skills as I was their over exposure and ridicule. When Tebow had that one or two years where he did well, he was being interviewed every single day on NFL Network, ESPN, etc. I was working swing shift at the time, and would listen to several programs, and I couldn't get away from hearing him if I tried. And Tebow liked to talk about his religion, a subject that doesn't go over well with a good percentage of fans. A lot of people, including myself, started piling on him, calling him a guy with a backpack and a bible, white shirt and black tie preaching the faith. Had social media been as prevalent then as it is today, he would have been roasted non stop like Russell is getting it today.

Russell and Tebow both liked getting their mugs in front of a camera and their lips on a microphone, and they over did it. There's a point of diminishing returns on people's tolerance of seeing and hearing another individual. I get tired of seeing the same guy pitching the same commercial, like Joe Namath selling Medicare Advantage. Russell has exceeded that point, especially since his on field performance has been so horrible.

Geno makes my point about Tebow . Tebow actually had a better start despite a gm that hated him . He inherited a 1-4 team and went 9-7 winning a wild card game over Ben and the Steelers . Got beat by New England and never had another meaningful start in his career . Successfully torpedoed by the vile john Elway . Late in his time in TC with Philly he was completing nearly 70% it hurt Tebow that he was so overtly religious and more so that his possee was so fervent it would put pressure on any coach to play him as soon as the starter stumbles one time .

But you all full of it saying he can’t play . Josh Allen came in completing 55% big moose that can run between the tackles.
Geno Smith . Eat it . There weren’t 32 better guys when Tebows career was blackballed.

[Old but Slow]

Personally I did not care for Tebow, mainly because of the religious stuff. But, I have to admit, I like the ad where he is learning to drive a stick shift.

[RiverDog]

Except that you thought that Tebow was a good quarterback when nearly everyone else said that he would fizzle like he did.

There are dissimilarities, too. Tebow had horrible mechanics, a slow wind up of a release. Russell has very good mechanics, a good quick release and throws a pretty deep ball. Tebow was a tight end playing quarterback and wasn't all that elusive and gained most of his running yards by bowling over people. He didn't have the same degree of touch on his passes that Russell does, and he didn't extend plays to the same degree. Russell is a fart in the skillet.

What I was thinking of wasn't so much their football skills as I was their over exposure and ridicule. When Tebow had that one or two years where he did well, he was being interviewed every single day on NFL Network, ESPN, etc. I was working swing shift at the time, and would listen to several programs, and I couldn't get away from hearing him if I tried. And Tebow liked to talk about his religion, a subject that doesn't go over well with a good percentage of fans. A lot of people, including myself, started piling on him, calling him a guy with a backpack and a bible, white shirt and black tie preaching the faith. Had social media been as prevalent then as it is today, he would have been roasted non stop like Russell is getting it today.

Russell and Tebow both liked getting their mugs in front of a camera and their lips on a microphone, and they over did it. There's a point of diminishing returns on people's tolerance of seeing and hearing another individual. I get tired of seeing the same guy pitching the same commercial, like Joe Namath selling Medicare Advantage. Russell has exceeded that point, especially since his on field performance has been so horrible.

Geno makes my point about Tebow . Tebow actually had a better start despite a gm that hated him . He inherited a 1-4 team and went 9-7 winning a wild card game over Ben and the Steelers . Got beat by New England and never had another meaningful start in his career . Successfully torpedoed by the vile john Elway . Late in his time in TC with Philly he was completing nearly 70% it hurt Tebow that he was so overtly religious and more so that his possee was so fervent it would put pressure on any coach to play him as soon as the starter stumbles one time .

But you all full of it saying he can’t play . Josh Allen came in completing 55% big moose that can run between the tackles.
Geno Smith . Eat it . There weren’t 32 better guys when Tebows career was blackballed.

Here we go with Geno again. The thread is about Russell and the comparison was with Tebow, not Geno.

The fact is that the Broncos traded up to get Tebow and had every motivation in the world to make it work, but he couldn't cut it, or more accurately, wasn't cut out to be a QB in the NFL. Tebow had chances with three other teams before he couldn't beat out Matt Barkley for the 3rd string QB slot and was out of the league. Tebow's career completion percentage was below 50% and his passer rating just 75.3. In two playoff games, he had a completion percentage of 40%. No one is going to play QB in the NFL with those kinds of numbers. He's one of the biggest first round busts of the past 15 years.

Cbob is exactly right. There are very few football similarities between Tebow and Russell. Tebow was a Mack truck. Wilson is a Ferrari. Tebow is bigger and stronger, Russell faster and quicker. Tebow's QB skills were wholly inadequate. Russell has very good mechanics.

As I keep saying, my comparison was intended for their off field, non-football related activities. They are alike in that they both have a strong Christian faith, are decent guys underneath, were/are media darlings that seemed to enjoy the spotlight and were/are controversial in that they had/have a certain segment of fans that had/have a strong dislike for them.

[RiverDog]

Personally I did not care for Tebow, mainly because of the religious stuff. But, I have to admit, I like the ad where he is learning to drive a stick shift.

That was my problem with Tebow, too. He was too 'in your face' with his constant advocacy of his religion. I half expected him to show up on my doorstep shoving a pamphlet in my face. I have very little patience with those types. I actually had one guy try to shove his literature in my face while I was jogging.

Some of his commercials are kinda funny. That's another similarity with Russell, although having seen Russ's Subway commercial, I'd give the clear advantage to Tebow in the comedy department.

[obiken]

That was my problem with Tebow, too. He was too 'in your face' with his constant advocacy of his religion. I half expected him to show up on my doorstep shoving a pamphlet in my face. I have very little patience with those types. I actually had one guy try to shove his literature in my face while I was jogging.
Some of his commercials are kinda funny. That's another similarity with Russell, although having seen Russ's Subway commercial, I'd give the clear advantage to Tebow in the comedy department.

My problem with Teebow is he was not that accurate, period. Comparing Russ to Teebow with Russ's stats the first 10 years, is a joke. Russ's fast ball was running on 3rd IF the lane was open, his out pitch was his accurate deep ball. He is refusing to run, and his out pitch has diminished, but he will still make the HOF.

[RiverDog]

My problem with Teebow is he was not that accurate, period. Comparing Russ to Teebow with Russ's stats the first 10 years, is a joke. Russ's fast ball was running on 3rd IF the lane was open, his out pitch was his accurate deep ball. He is refusing to run, and his out pitch has diminished, but he will still make the HOF.

Tebow's problem wasn't that he couldn't put the ball where it was supposed to go. His problem was that his release was so slow that it allowed defenders to close the window before he could get the ball to them. He had this long wind up where he'd drop his arm down to near his waist and the ball away from his body before he started his forward motion. It was a problem that was identified early on in his college career, and they tried to correct it, but he could never change it. I think it was C-bob that mentioned that Tebow was a pitcher in baseball during his teenage years and developed a muscle memory that prevented him from being able to adapt. Kinda like trying to break a bad golf swing.

[Hawktawk]

Tebow completed 72% in college although to the likes of Percy Harvin and Aaron Hernandez . The pros tried to “ fix him”. He was stuck in the middle throwing the ball , far less accurate but Very few turnovers and runs like a Mack truck .

They screwed him up but still willed a dead and buried broncos team to the postseason
where they knocked off the defending super bowl champs Steelers .

Elway despised him . He might not have succeeded anywhere else but he already was there with a city that loved him .

What Elway did to that kid was evil. I have despised him for decades but it went to a new level after that .

I’m glad the curse of Tebow is in effect . Far more classy then his detractors . Smarter too . One of the sharpest analysts I’ve ever listened to calling college ball .

My comment about Geno is to point out just cause nobody gives you a chance it doesn’t rmean you aren’t good enough. Tebow was . And he worked his ass off too on his stroke . By his last TC hr was near 70%
One was New England and BB doesn’t even bring guys in he knows can’t play .

He’d walk off the street and help denver right now . And be loved .

[Hawktawk]

Not sure if anyones followed benchgate back to op. Asked whether he was considering a quarterback change Hackett said “ not right now” several days later he stepped forward to the press with an emphatic vote of confidence “ Russell is our qb” . I wonder if his first response drew the ire of Russels people . God Hackett is a wimp
. Pathetic

[RiverDog]

Tebow completed 72% in college although to the likes of Percy Harvin and Aaron Hernandez . The pros tried to “ fix him”. He was stuck in the middle throwing the ball , far less accurate but Very few turnovers and runs like a Mack truck .

They screwed him up but still willed a dead and buried broncos team to the postseason
where they knocked off the defending super bowl champs Steelers .

Elway despised him . He might not have succeeded anywhere else but he already was there with a city that loved him .

What Elway did to that kid was evil. I have despised him for decades but it went to a new level after that .

I’m glad the curse of Tebow is in effect . Far more classy then his detractors . Smarter too . One of the sharpest analysts I’ve ever listened to calling college ball .

My comment about Geno is to point out just cause nobody gives you a chance it doesn’t rmean you aren’t good enough. Tebow was . And he worked his ass off too on his stroke . By his last TC hr was near 70%
One was New England and BB doesn’t even bring guys in he knows can’t play .

He’d walk off the street and help denver right now . And be loved .

Let's stop with the revisionist history. First of all, you're off on Tebow's college completion percentage by quite a bit. It was 66.4%:

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/pl ... bow-1.html

Secondly, it wasn't just the NFL that tried to "fix" him. His college coaches had identified the problem and they tried to 'fix' it, too. From an article in the spring of 2009:

Spectators of Florida’s spring practices seem to freeze when Tebow reaches back during spring practice, squinting to detect the slightest difference in an arm that’s been evaluated in biomechanics labs and lambasted by pro scouts.

Tebow’s moxie as a quarterback has been certified since he stepped on campus in 2005, but his mechanics are once again being tweaked for long-term effectiveness — and possibly a long-term NFL investment.

Tebow has downplayed any changes to his throwing motion, saying new quarterbacks coach Scot Loeffler — who has worked with Tom Brady, Brian Griese and Chad Henne at Michigan — has him focusing on footwork.

But Loeffler said he’s working to get the Gators senior at a "10 o’clock” motion, less sidearm.

Two years ago, Gators coaches took Tebow into the University of Florida’s Biomechanics and Motion Analysis Laboratory, utilizing digital cameras to configure a throwing motion that alleviated shoulder pain. Tebow used to throw like a baseball player, causing friction between his rotator cuff up front and the tissue near his scapula in his back.

The pain has subsided, but the concerns about a slow release haven’t faded in the minds of his critics. ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay said NFL scouts are "scared to death” of Tebow’s motion that in the past might have resembled a windmill.

"In the NFL, cornerbacks are going to read those and get the jumps quickly,” McShay said.

https://www.oklahoman.com/story/sports/ ... 431793007/

Tebow had a bad throwing motion from the first day he set foot on a football field and everybody and their dog knew it. He even said so in interviews, how critics complained about his throwing motion even from back in his high school days:

Tebow doesn’t seem bothered by the doubts in the least. He says he’s used to it. “I’ve heard a lot of it (his throwing motion). Kind of heard that since high school, though.

https://archive.nytimes.com/fifthdown.b ... ng-motion/

So please, stop saying that the NFL messed him up. Tebow could get away with his poor mechanics in college, but when he tried to make the jump to the next level, it became his Achilles heal.

Whether or not Elway's personal relationship with Tebow was a factor in his being traded is something that neither you nor I know anything about. But what we do know was that he had some horrible passing numbers, the worst that I can ever remember seeing out of a starting NFL QB. In his one full season as a starter, in 2011 when he started 14 games, Tebow completed just 46.4% of his passes. His two playoff games were even worse, connecting on just 40.4%. There's no NFL quarterback in any era since the leather helmets that's going to survive with those kinds of numbers. If I'm John Elway, I'd want him gone, too.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... boTi00.htm

[obiken]

Not sure if anyones followed benchgate back to op. Asked whether he was considering a quarterback change Hackett said “ not right now” several days later he stepped forward to the press with an emphatic vote of confidence “ Russell is our qb” . I wonder if his first response drew the ire of Russels people . God Hackett is a wimp
. Pathetic

Yeah Hackett is dead man walking. Russ lost his best back, his best WR and a boatload of other talent. Its not all Russ's fault, even though you despise RW. Elway was not evil on Tiny Tim, Teebow was given every chance in the league to make it, he was not an NFL QB, period.

[Aseahawkfan]

Yeah Hackett is dead man walking. Russ lost his best back, his best WR and a boatload of other talent. Its not all Russ's fault, even though you despise RW. Elway was not evil on Tiny Tim, Teebow was given every chance in the league to make it, he was not an NFL QB, period.

Yep. Lost O-line too. I want to see Russ with a better coach.

[RiverDog]

Yeah Hackett is dead man walking. Russ lost his best back, his best WR and a boatload of other talent. Its not all Russ's fault, even though you despise RW. Elway was not evil on Tiny Tim, Teebow was given every chance in the league to make it, he was not an NFL QB, period.

Yep. Lost O-line too. I want to see Russ with a better coach.

As we've discussed, it's going to be extremely difficult for the Broncos to upgrade their HC position given their lack of draft picks and Russell's contract and they won't be a preferred destination for free agents. If they fire Hackett, they'll end up with someone with similar qualifications, an offensive coordinator with no HC experience or a college HC like the Cards got with Kingsbury or the Panthers got with Rhule.

The Donkeys are screwed. I just wish they were in our division.

[Hawktawk]

I’m reading all over the net the things we’ve been discussing . Ie is Russ playing his way out of the hall of fame ?( yes obviously ) Does anyone want to come fix Russ ?( probably not ) Is Hackett the problem or Russ ? Or both .(both ) we could talk injured players but river says it’s an excuse so I guess it is for king Russell too . Quarterback away buddy , remember ?

I though it was remarkable Denver Press is asking about benching Wilson but not surprising .

[RiverDog]

I’m reading all over the net the things we’ve been discussing . Ie is Russ playing his way out of the hall of fame ?( yes obviously ) Does anyone want to come fix Russ ?( probably not ) Is Hackett the problem or Russ ? Or both .(both ) we could talk injured players but river says it’s an excuse so I guess it is for king Russell too . Quarterback away buddy , remember ?

I though it was remarkable Denver Press is asking about benching Wilson but not surprising .

Yep. This is the no excuse zone!

Personally, I didn't think that Russell was a first round HOF'er before the trade. I always felt that he was going to need either a league MVP or SB MVP as his career numbers just didn't support a first ballot inductee. But this season has definitely dealt a blow to any HOF aspirations he might have. He'll be compared to other QB's that changed teams late in their careers, like Manning, Brady, even Mathew Stafford, and went on to win Super Bowls.

As far as what the root cause for the Broncos problems is, Hackett vs. Wilson, IMO it's both their fault. Hackett has cost the Broncos at least two wins just due to his game management mistakes. They've lost a slew of close games, six by a TD or less. With even a halfway competent offense, they'd be in the middle of the playoff race, but as it is, they're already out of the hunt and the butt of every joke on social media.

Hackett isn't benching Russell, nor should he. It would be a no-win situation as if he puts Rypien in and they win or even lose while putting up 20+ points, it will create a QB controversy that no one wants. No matter how good Rypien plays, they're going to have to stick with Russell for the next couple of years as they've painted themselves into a corner with that contract he signed, and they're too far out of the playoff hunt for any amount of wins to salvage the season for them. The best thing to do is to keep trotting Russell out there, give him as much support as possible, and see if he can't work out his problems.

They're on the road against a good team this week. The Ravens were upset by the Jags by one measly point last week, breaking a 4 game winning streak. They're in the thick of a divisional title race with the Bengals, and they won't let the Donkeys sneak up on them. On the opposite side of the ledger, the Broncos have lost their last 3 in a row and 7 of their last 8, a runaway train heading for a washed-out bridge and where the engineer has bailed. I see this as a big win for the Ravens and one step closer to a top 5 pick for us.

[Aseahawkfan]

As we've discussed, it's going to be extremely difficult for the Broncos to upgrade their HC position given their lack of draft picks and Russell's contract and they won't be a preferred destination for free agents. If they fire Hackett, they'll end up with someone with similar qualifications, an offensive coordinator with no HC experience or a college HC like the Cards got with Kingsbury or the Panthers got with Rhule.

The Donkeys are screwed. I just wish they were in our division.

I think Hackett is an especially bad coach myself. I think this season has born it out. I don't think it will be difficult to upgrade from Hackett. Maybe they don't get Payton, but there are coaches out there that we probably don't even know about that an owner can attract with money, a QB that at one time was one of the best in the league, and a strong defense with some quality players back next year. I wouldn't be surprised at a quicker turnaround myself.

I don't think a QB like Russell falls as hard as he has fallen unless something strange we don't know about is happening. But I can't complain. It's working out great for us. I was hoping the Broncos would crap the bed. Somehow they did. That's sports. Sometimes your team gets lucky and things work out in unexpectedly good ways. I don't think Denver craps the bed like they have if their best RB wasn't knocked out early, but he was.

Russ isn't done yet. Denver can turn this around quickly, just like we did after Mora. It's going to take some work from their GM and finding a much better coach that knows how to prepare a team and figure out what's going on with Russ and play him to his strengths.

[RiverDog]

I think Hackett is an especially bad coach myself. I think this season has born it out. I don't think it will be difficult to upgrade from Hackett. Maybe they don't get Payton, but there are coaches out there that we probably don't even know about that an owner can attract with money, a QB that at one time was one of the best in the league, and a strong defense with some quality players back next year. I wouldn't be surprised at a quicker turnaround myself.

I agree with your appraisal of Hackett. No coach should ever grant a player, no matter how good that player is, the kind of influence Hackett granted to Russell. Besides that, his team is horribly mismanaged, constantly getting called for delay of game penalties or having to take timeouts due to disorganization. He's a cluster phuck.

But finding a coach that has qualifications that exceed those of Hackett, a coach along the lines of a Sean Payton or Mike McCarthy that are going to have 6-8 jobs to choose from, is going to be extremely difficult. Denver has too many drawbacks in terms of draft picks, salary constraints, and free agent attractiveness for a top tier coach to consider.

[Hawktawk]

As we've discussed, it's going to be extremely difficult for the Broncos to upgrade their HC position given their lack of draft picks and Russell's contract and they won't be a preferred destination for free agents. If they fire Hackett, they'll end up with someone with similar qualifications, an offensive coordinator with no HC experience or a college HC like the Cards got with Kingsbury or the Panthers got with Rhule.

The Donkeys are screwed. I just wish they were in our division.

I think Hackett is an especially bad coach myself. I think this season has born it out. I don't think it will be difficult to upgrade from Hackett. Maybe they don't get Payton, but there are coaches out there that we probably don't even know about that an owner can attract with money, a QB that at one time was one of the best in the league, and a strong defense with some quality players back next year. I wouldn't be surprised at a quicker turnaround myself.

I don't think a QB like Russell falls as hard as he has fallen unless something strange we don't know about is happening. But I can't complain. It's working out great for us. I was hoping the Broncos would crap the bed. Somehow they did. That's sports. Sometimes your team gets lucky and things work out in unexpectedly good ways. I don't think Denver craps the bed like they have if their best RB wasn't knocked out early, but he was.

Russ isn't done yet. Denver can turn this around quickly, just like we did after Mora. It's going to take some work from their GM and finding a much better coach that knows how to prepare a team and figure out what's going on with Russ and play him to his strengths.

I know Im the Russ "hater", theres Russ lovers and people in between . But the film dont lie.

LAST year I saw a guy lose to 3 backups, have 4 3 and outs in a row in 4 games, one followed up by a 4 and out as Nortons defense was hung out to dry game after game. These were the worst numbers in the league. Our 3rd down conversion rate was dead last as was Russell's 3rd down completion % until Penny went off.
Bonehead sacks. Popping off to coach after losing games with said boneheaded sacks. Hell his last playoff game of his career he was 11/ 29 141 yards pick 6 ,5 sacks and 10 pressures. Mostly due to Russ holding the ball too long or bailing on clean pockets running himself into sacks. Donald didn't even play much of the second half. Hell those are Tebow numbers right there!

I told you all what would happen to Hackett, called him Russel's "boy" . It was an easy prediction, a greenhorn vs the little king. Easy to see coming after watching his disrespect to Pete Carroll who he should have thanked his lucky stars for and been loyal as a dog forever, took a bullet for him after what he did for his career.
Charity is nice. That is not a cool person. If I were a head coach Id want nothing to do with that coach wrecker.I dont think anyone does which is the only reason why Hackett is still the coach.

For the lovers of Russ and his game I am making a prediction hes at best well into the downside of his career, deep on the back 9. This is an 8 win team right now with Drew Lock starting. Maybe Teddy bridgewater . The stats dont lie.
Unless he goes at least 4-2 and cleans up his #s they will have a viable alternative on the roster by TC next year in FA. A Mariota type guy. Heinike. Probably won't find a Geno but they cannot sell season tickets for a team that got flexed on SNF in week 11 no matter how much damn money they have in wilson.
Besides if there's any hope of turning Wilson around hes got to have serious pressure to lose his job. He never has. Then we will see how devoted he really is in 2022. Looks like big hat no cattle to me.
Hes never coming back anything like he was. Hes one of the worst starters in the league. He wouldnt be the first huge contract on the bench, just the biggest "worst contract in professional sports history" as its being described by sportswriters.
Love to see Sandos updated analysis of the QB situation here and in denver
To his credit Asea had begun to analyze this as a bad situation for Russ before the opener and picked a seattle win as I recall. Not too many others did.


Kudos on your OP Riv its 11 pages now I guess we weren't over Russ after all

[Hawktawk]

Widely reported over the last few days that Denver indeed made a run at Arod and R3 was plan B. Watching him in GB mite not have been much different. I think Russ made a lot of QBs money when he came in , short QBs but Hes gonna cost all these high dollar FAs money from now on.

[RiverDog]

Kudos on your OP Riv its 11 pages now I guess we weren't over Russ after all.

Widely reported over the last few days that Denver indeed made a run at Arod and R3 was plan B. Watching him in GB mite not have been much different. I think Russ made a lot of QBs money when he came in , short QBs but Hes gonna cost all these high dollar FAs money from now on.

Yeah, Russell and the Broncos are a popular subject and will continue to be for quite some time, and rightfully so. It was/is the biggest story involving the Seahawks since we won the SB. At least we have a thread dedicated to the subject to keep posters from polluting other threads by constantly diverting the subject by bringing up Russell. In the other forum that I frequent, they've made a very strict point not to bring up Russell in their main Seahawks forum and will suspend posters that violate that edict. I expect this thread to stay active well into the offseason and could end up with 20-25 pages of comments.

As far as the ARod story, it's old news. It was widely reported that the Broncos were going after him, that ARod wasn't happy with the way things were going in Titletown, and that he was their first choice. I don't think there's too many people that wouldn't have taken Rodgers over Russell.

[Hawktawk]

3 years ago I wouldn’t have taken anyone in the league except Mahomes over Wilson . I agree with your analysis that Rodgers was a better choice . My guess is he flirted to get paid by GB. My point is neither has performed . Russell being in steep decline has kind of taken attention off the weirdo suddenly looking very ordinary for 50 million a year . If you juxtapose Russ and Rodgers against bargain basement deals like Geno and Mariota got it may cause some GMs to view the position a bit differently . Probably not but I hope it does . Denver and GB aren’t getting what they paid for . I hope Watson face plants in Cleveland . Oh well as you say it’s a great day of ball . Go Hawks !

[NorthHawk]

I thought it was common knowledge that they wanted Rodgers over Wilson.
So much so that they didn't make the trade until the Rodgers option was off the table.

[RiverDog]

I thought it was common knowledge that they wanted Rodgers over Wilson. So much so that they didn't make the trade until the Rodgers option was off the table.

Yeah, I thought so, too, and was surprised to see the story surface again. It's piling on, anything to make Russell look bad, as if he isn't doing enough of that on his own account.

[Hawktawk]

I thought it was common knowledge that they wanted Rodgers over Wilson. So much so that they didn't make the trade until the Rodgers option was off the table.

Yeah, I thought so, too, and was surprised to see the story surface again. It's piling on, anything to make Russell look bad, as if he isn't doing enough of that on his own account.[/quote]


I felt like it was more of a confirmation of rumors from prior to the trade , insiders . I don’t know how it makes Russ look any worse then it makes Rodgers or the denver front office . And don’t rule out Green Bay letting Denver determine how much they were gonna pay Rodgers .

There’s still been no confirmation from anyone official but it doesn’t take a genius to see the Wilson trade was announced hours after Rogers announcement he was staying .

As for dragging stuff up this thread is 11 pages and it’s no different in the sports media . Russel is back getting the attention he wanted but not in a good way . It’s like a train wreck looking at Denver . You have to watch .

[RiverDog]

As for dragging stuff up this thread is 11 pages and it’s no different in the sports media . Russel is back getting the attention he wanted but not in a good way . It’s like a train wreck looking at Denver . You have to watch .

I wasn't complaining about you bring this subject up. It was a story that has been circulating this week and a legitimate topic to be brought up in this thread. I was simply noting all the piling on that's taking place in the sports media. It's an old story that's being rehashed. Anything that features the harpooning of Russell gets lots of hits.

[RiverDog]

Donkeys lose! One more step towards a top 5, and top 37, pick!

[Hawktawk]

Donkeys lose! One more step towards a top 5, and top 37, pick!

Yeah and we’re down 7. Race to see who gets the best draft pick

[Aseahawkfan]

I don't even know who that guy in Denver is any more. What the hell happened to him.

[RiverDog]

I don't even know who that guy in Denver is any more. What the hell happened to him.

Same thing that happened to Pete's defense.

[RiverDog]

17-16 at the half. I don't like the feel of this game, letting an underdog hang around like this. The Rams are starting their 12th offensive line combination in as many games yet they're still running almost at will, almost 100 yards in the first half.

Nice pick by Tariq the Freak on an ill-advised, badly underthrown ball. Sets a franchise record for INT's. The next Richard Sherman maybe?

[Hawktawk]

17-16 at the half. I don't like the feel of this game, letting an underdog hang around like this. The Rams are starting their 12th offensive line combination in as many games yet they're still running almost at will, almost 100 yards in the first half.

Nice pick by Tariq the Freak on an ill-advised, badly underthrown ball. Sets a franchise record for INT's. The next Richard Sherman maybe?

Tariq is Sherman physique wise but far more athletic and explosive . He’s got HOF written all over him . Wofford doesn’t play much but most QBs have already quit throwing at him . He’s one of the best in thr league.