Your Grade for the Front Office - So Far

[savvyman]

I give them an "A" so far. - For the following reasons:

Signed the #1 priority in Michael Bennett for probably the best deal of any free agent signing so far. Bennett was the only Ir-replacable free agent from last years team. The FO not only retained his services but got the best deal in all of free agency - so far.

Signed key Run Stopper Tony McDaniel for an excellent value.

Did not overpay for Tate or the Big Russian.

Let other teams over pay for McDonald, Schofield (that deal has been reversed btw) and that special team guy who I have already forgot his name.

Implemented our disaster recovery plan for our Offensive line by signing Tavaris Jackson.

Have not yet overpaid or given a long contract to an aging veteran near the end of their useful playing life.

I imagine that there has been no luck so far with offensive lineman because of #1 - the one's available are not good enough or #2 because the ones available want to be overpaid - or a combination of both.

[NorthHawk]

So far a C.
They haven't yet addressed the weakest link on the team - OL.
If they don't get more quality bodies along the OL in Free Agency, we will be at the mercy of the draft board with every other team selecting ahead of us.
They, not us will determine our fate.

[yoder]

I gave them and A, simply because our F.O. decisions were proven this Feb. We went from a joke to a completely restructured team/Champions in 4 years...simple as that. Obviously a lot of that was due to smart drafting and coaching...but I trust these guys. They know what they're doing.

[RiverDog]

I gave them a C, too. Kudos on the Bennett deal, he was by far the top off season priority. Don't blame them for letting Tate go, but letting Breno go without any apparent plan to replace him seems unwise. And as I stated in another thread, I don't know WTF they are doing with Hauschka.

[HumanCockroach]

I give them an "A" so far. - For the following reasons:

Signed the #1 priority in Michael Bennett for probably the best deal of any free agent signing so far. Bennett was the only Ir-replacable free agent from last years team. The FO not only retained his services but got the best deal in all of free agency - so far.

Signed key Run Stopper Tony McDaniel for an excellent value.

Did not overpay for Tate or the Big Russian.

Let other teams over pay for McDonald, Schofield (that deal has been reversed btw) and that special team guy who I have already forgot his name.

Implemented our disaster recovery plan for our Offensive line by signing Tavaris Jackson.

Have not yet overpaid or given a long contract to an aging veteran near the end of their useful playing life.

I imagine that there has been no luck so far with offensive lineman because of #1 - the one's available are not good enough or #2 because the ones available want to be overpaid - or a combination of both.

I wouldn't call a 3 year deal for 4 million dollar an "over payment" for Maragos, it's slightly over a veteran minimum contract for a solid depth player at safety and one of the best special teams guys in the NFL. Schofields contract surprised the hell out of me, however when a team is desperate to upgrade it's pass rush ( which Schofield can do, and has done prior to arriving in Seattle) and you have zero LB's worth anything currently on your roster, you are going to pay for one with upside and youth. Mcdonalds contract I certainly do not see as some huge over payment either, it is what the market is for young interior pass rushers, which IS what Mcdonald is ( or have you forgotten he had 5.5 sacks as a situational pass rusher on this team in 12 games already).

I guess what I am saying, is most contracts were "reasonable" for teams looking to catch up, and that taking a chance on a young productive player, makes a hell of a lot more sense coming from Seattle, than say Oakland, or Cleveland. A LOT of players that were "depth" here are indeed starting caliber guys for other teams, and most, while getting big raises from the miniscule amount Seattle was paying them doesn't equate to crazy over payments. I liked Mcdonald, Tate, and Maragos a lot, as well as Red and Clemmons, just because Seattle can't pay them, doesn't mean they weren't worth the contracts they received.

[Oly]

All of the guys who were re-signed were on contracts that I think are team-friendly. The fact that Bennett was one of them is huge.

Most of the guys who were signed elsewhere were signed to contracts that I think were a bit steep for the Hawks. Not necessarily steep for the quality of player, but steep for how important they'd be to this team. Several of those guys have backups in the wings or seem to be replaceable by a quality FO.

The only thing keeping me from an A is the lack of OL help, but I'm not worried. With few exceptions--like Bennett--the first contracts in FA end up being better for the player than the team. I don't mind them waiting for the value players, but they won't get an A unless they get those guys eventually.

[monkey]

We're not even into the fifth day of free agency, it's way way way...ad infinitum too early to grade.
The only way they get an A grade from me is if they significantly upgrade the O-Line, replace the guys lost with roughly equivalent talent, and extend both Earl and Sherm before the season starts.
If they want to get even a passing grade, they'd better accomplish the vast majority of that, because that is their job and in real life, they don't get graded on a curve!

So far, I'd give them a low B,just because they kept the most important free agent (Bennett) and a couple others they felt were important; but they have a LONG ways to go and a LOT of work left to do. Fortunately, there's still SO much time to do it!

[savvyman]

For those who are mentioning the lack of upgrades to the offensive line as support for a lower grade - I mentioned in the OP that the reason why there have been no signings so far is:

#1 - the one's available are not good enough or
#2 because the ones available want to be overpaid -

or a combination of both #1 & #2.

Would you feel better and grade the FO higher if they had overpaid an inferior Offensive Lineman and signed him to a non-cap friendly contract?

[RiverDog]

For those who are mentioning the lack of upgrades to the offensive line as support for a lower grade - I mentioned in the OP that the reason why there have been no signings so far is:

#1 - the one's available are not good enough or
#2 because the ones available want to be overpaid -

or a combination of both #1 & #2.

Would you feel better and grade the FO higher if they had overpaid an inferior Offensive Lineman and signed him to a non-cap friendly contract?

You can't look at the problem from such a narrow perspective. You have to look for the root cause, which in this case is the lack of attention to the OL. It's been ignored for so long that we've painted ourselves into a corner where we can't afford to resign our starting RT, we don't have a suitable replacement on our current roster, and we don't have a lot of draft capital to acquire a player that can contribute immediately. The only two OL's we've drafted in the past 3 years higher than a 5th rounder have been busts.

The drafting of Bruce Irvin with our #15 overall, the drafting of Christine Michael, a third string running back, and the Percy Harvin trade, where we not only committed a whole bunch of money that's currently hindering our ability to be a player on the FA market, but traded away a #1 AND a #3...those are the decisions that have put us into the predicament we currently find ourselves in. We haven't been getting any mileage out of our top picks in the last 3 years. Eventually those chickens will come home to roost.

Sorry, we still get a C. We let our starting RT go without having a plan for a suitable replacement.

[briwas101]

I give them a B so far.

The reason I give them a B is because most of the moves that needed to be made this offseason were actually getting rid of players. We weren't a team that needed to add a lot of talent, instead we needed to trim the fat and get our contracts more in line with production so we can extend the guys on the team that deserve nice big contracts.

Looking at the offseason as "we lost red and clem and rice and tate" is not the right way, because if we KEPT those guys then we likely would not have the cap space next year (or cap space this year to rollover to next year) to re-sign the guys that we REALLY need.

We got rid of the guys who absolutely could not be kept at their current price, and the front office deserves nothing but praise for putting the team ahead of any single player and for not keeping people around for reasons other than ON-FIELD PRODUCTION at reasonable price.

We are a championship team now. There are no roster spots available for guys whose main contribution is making other players laugh while they crop-dust the locker room or play practical jokes. There are no spots for players just because that player was here for Pete's first year as coach. There are no spots available for guys because they help the community.

We still have the draft and teams cutting down to the final 53, so it's not like we missed our chance to add talent, but we definitely have some holes to fill and will be forced to do so, and because of that I can't give them higher than a B right now.

[Zorn76]

My early grade: B

Nothing unusual has really happened. We freed up cap space by not overpaying some guys who got big deals, as others have mentioned, and we re-signed Bennett, who I hope can produce another couple good yrs at 29.

I'm glad Breno signed elsewhere, as it forces us to move forward at the position, and I think even a rookie could match his "talent" at RT.

Lock up our FG kicker, and I'd love it if we could land Allen who, IMO, could really thrive on our D, even at 32. Guy will Kill for a SB ring after a disappointing stint in Minny, a team that he probably thought had a good shot at a title when he signed there.

The draft should be interesting. At this point, I'd like to see us select for need rather than BPA, like we did a yr ago with Michael.

[Seahawks4Ever]

I voted a "A" because they resigned M. Bennett and they are on pace to have the cap space to give E.T. and K.C. fat extensions and also have the dough to resign Wilson & Sherman next season. That was the most important goal for this off season and they are right on track. If they would have paid Tate, McDonald, and the other guys what they wanted we wouldn't have the money to pay the before mentioned foursome that we need to drive for another championship.

[HumanCockroach]

Doubt the Seahawks are in the market of 10 million a year for a situational pass rusher ( which is what Allen is on this team). We'll see how "hungry" he is for a chance at a SB, when he was traded to Minnesota and subsequentially signed his contract, they were coming off 9-7, 6-10 and 8-8 seasons, something tells me he wasn't thinking SB, but this is the biggest contract offered to a defensive lineman in history. Just sayin'.

[jshawaii22]

I gave them a "B" because they haven't signed Houschka to a new contract yet. He's worth 2 games a year right now with both his stronger leg for kickoffs and great accuracy for FG's. If we sign him, we go to a A. Lose, him, and I move to a C.

js

[monkey]

For those who are mentioning the lack of upgrades to the offensive line as support for a lower grade - I mentioned in the OP that the reason why there have been no signings so far is:

#1 - the one's available are not good enough or
#2 because the ones available want to be overpaid -

or a combination of both #1 & #2.

Would you feel better and grade the FO higher if they had overpaid an inferior Offensive Lineman and signed him to a non-cap friendly contract?

No, I wouldn't and yes, I agree with your assessment. That, however, doesn't make me feel better knowing that now, we'll likely have to address the problem in the draft.
Drafting for need almost always results in reaches and bad picks.

[monkey]

You have to look for the root cause, which in this case is the lack of attention to the OL. It's been ignored for so long that we've painted ourselves into a corner where we can't afford to resign our starting RT, we don't have a suitable replacement on our current roster, and we don't have a lot of draft capital to acquire a player that can contribute immediately. The only two OL's we've drafted in the past 3 years higher than a 5th rounder have been busts.

OK first of all I understand what you are saying, but the free agency period has literally just started five days ago.
There is still plenty of time.
Second, you're facts are a bit cherry picked...have you forgotten about Russell Okung? He may be often injured, but he's far from a bust, so you make the arbitrary cutoff line for your argument after that draft.
It's NOT that Pete and John haven't paid enough attention to the line, that's just not true. The problem has been that unfortunately, two BIG picks that there were really counting on as key pieces of the line, flopped badly. Moffit and Carpenter. They were counting on those two, along with Okung, being the foundation of our rock solid Offensive line...that just hasn't worked out, but that should hardly come as a surprise to us fans...on average, more than half of the players drafted by any team in any draft don't work out.
That's the draft for ya!

[RiverDog]

You have to look for the root cause, which in this case is the lack of attention to the OL. It's been ignored for so long that we've painted ourselves into a corner where we can't afford to resign our starting RT, we don't have a suitable replacement on our current roster, and we don't have a lot of draft capital to acquire a player that can contribute immediately. The only two OL's we've drafted in the past 3 years higher than a 5th rounder have been busts.

OK first of all I understand what you are saying, but the free agency period has literally just started five days ago.
There is still plenty of time.
Second, you're facts are a bit cherry picked...have you forgotten about Russell Okung? He may be often injured, but he's far from a bust, so you make the arbitrary cutoff line for your argument after that draft.
It's NOT that Pete and John haven't paid enough attention to the line, that's just not true. The problem has been that unfortunately, two BIG picks that there were really counting on as key pieces of the line, flopped badly. Moffit and Carpenter. They were counting on those two, along with Okung, being the foundation of our rock solid Offensive line...that just hasn't worked out, but that should hardly come as a surprise to us fans...on average, more than half of the players drafted by any team in any draft don't work out.
That's the draft for ya!

Russell Okung was taken with the 6th overall in 2010, and he's been injured as often as he's played. You would think that would have caused some alarm bells to go off in Renton by now and that maybe we should start looking for some quality depth, but no. Heal thyself, Russell.

Understood about FA starting 5 days ago, but nearly all the starting quality FA's are already gone, and we never so much as visited with any of them. Can't afford to, not with contracts like Percy Harvin's to pay. OL obviously wasn't seen as a priority when we traded for and signed Harvin. That's why I made my root cause comment. You have to look at the reasons why we let Breno go and why we haven't so much as looked at any FA OL's in two years. We've painted ourselves into a corner. Now we're going to have to depend on that crap shoot of a draft, without our 3rd round pick, just to keep the situation from getting any worse.

Carpenter was drafted in 2011 as an OT, and failed miserably. He was supposed to be the long term solution to our RT problem. They gave up on the experiment 3/4 through his rookie season, and he's never played the position since. That was 3 years ago, and the ONLY offensive linemen we've taken in the past two drafts has been two 7th rounders, and we haven't so much as visited with a top FA OL in the past two seasons, nor have we so much as picked up a flier on starters like Davin Joseph, released by the Bucs, or Jonathan Martin, traded by the Dolphins. I call that ignoring a problem, a 'heal thyself' approach.

Understood about the odds of draft choices not working out. But we're not even trying. We're using our draft picks on defensive players and offensive position players. Two seventh round picks in two drafts and no free agent signings of any consequence.

[Eaglehawk]

So far a C.
They haven't yet addressed the weakest link on the team - OL.
If they don't get more quality bodies along the OL in Free Agency, we will be at the mercy of the draft board with every other team selecting ahead of us.
They, not us will determine our fate.

Agree with NW, and River and will go one lower: they should get an F but because of Bennett I give them a D.


What the hell are they doing? No OL, no run stuffers and no WR's. And why the F are they waiting to sign the 4 million contract or so with H? WTF?

Of course this could change. But this is how I feel as of TODAY. I know its early. I start them off with a D, they now have no where to go but UP!!!!!

EDIT: Miller just restructured. To the extent that the hawks allowed this to happen I give them a C- now. This was a HUGE move. Miller has hands of glue and is an excellent blocker on that o line.

[Anthony]

I give them an "A" so far. - For the following reasons:

Signed the #1 priority in Michael Bennett for probably the best deal of any free agent signing so far. Bennett was the only Ir-replacable free agent from last years team. The FO not only retained his services but got the best deal in all of free agency - so far.

Signed key Run Stopper Tony McDaniel for an excellent value.

Did not overpay for Tate or the Big Russian.

Let other teams over pay for McDonald, Schofield (that deal has been reversed btw) and that special team guy who I have already forgot his name.

Implemented our disaster recovery plan for our Offensive line by signing Tavaris Jackson.

Have not yet overpaid or given a long contract to an aging veteran near the end of their useful playing life.

I imagine that there has been no luck so far with offensive lineman because of #1 - the one's available are not good enough or #2 because the ones available want to be overpaid - or a combination of both.

wow you think signing a backup QB is a disaster recovery plan for our o-line? WRONG. A recovery plan means improving the o-line they have not done that. We loose Rw there is no playoffs so what exactly are they recovering? Nothing.

[Anthony]

So far a C.
They haven't yet addressed the weakest link on the team - OL.
If they don't get more quality bodies along the OL in Free Agency, we will be at the mercy of the draft board with every other team selecting ahead of us.
They, not us will determine our fate.

Agree o-line is the biggest need and they have failed to address is again, I gave them a C as well.

[Anthony]

For those who are mentioning the lack of upgrades to the offensive line as support for a lower grade - I mentioned in the OP that the reason why there have been no signings so far is:

#1 - the one's available are not good enough or
#2 because the ones available want to be overpaid -

or a combination of both #1 & #2.

Would you feel better and grade the FO higher if they had overpaid an inferior Offensive Lineman and signed him to a non-cap friendly contract?

Would you feel better of the lack of trying meant loosing our franchise QB for the year? So far they have not even brought any in to look at. NOT GOOD AT ALL.

[Zorn76]

Miller re-signed bumps it up half a grade for me, to a B+.

Not sure what all the complaining is about, outside of Houschka, really.

We only have so much cap space to work with, and we gotta do it wisely, which Pete and John have shown great aptitude in doing since they arrived.

None of the OL that went flying off the board were the missing piece, IMO, even if they would be an improvement from what we had last year. It'll get done. Our F.O. has, clearly, earned the benefit of the doubt since 2010, so keep the faith.

[RiverDog]

Miller re-signed bumps it up half a grade for me, to a B+.

Not sure what all the complaining is about, outside of Houschka, really.

We only have so much cap space to work with, and we gotta do it wisely, which Pete and John have shown great aptitude in doing since they arrived.

None of the OL that went flying off the board were the missing piece, IMO, even if they would be an improvement from what we had last year. It'll get done. Our F.O. has, clearly, earned the benefit of the doubt since 2010, so keep the faith.

Speaking for myself, it's not just the fact that we haven't signed a FA OL, it's that we're not even trying or that we seem oblivious to the need. Not even bringing anyone in for a visit, nothing regarding interest in the two OL's Tampa released, no interest in Jonathan Martin, nothing. When you add into that equation the fact that the highest draft choice we've used on OL in the past two years was a couple of 7th rounders, my frustration boils over in a thread like this one.

[HumanCockroach]

Seriously shocked by the F vote unless it was a joke. Seattle signed the most versatile D lineman in free agency, that all by itself would place that grade above an F. They have reworked Millers contract, brought in multiple highly sought after free agents, and are the process of possibly signing a huge one. They have lost some true, but ANYONE coming into this off season thinking this stuff wasn't going to be the case is deluded. Pretending like over paying for a mediocre or average lineman, and limiting their ability to lock up core players drops that grade significantly, are also smoking some strange stuff.

Not bringing in a Saffold ( who by the way got seriously PAID, despite his mediocrity) or Veerher ( injury concerns and also GOT PAID). The facts of the matter are, that despite many grumblings on this site, they simply weren't there to be had, at least not at a REASONABLE rate. Are people really advocating the idea that 7 Million is to much for a Red or a Clemmons or a Miller, but 9 million a year for a RT is the way to go? Crazy, plain and simple. You do NOT pay right tackles, left tackle money, at least not and stay successful.

Were people thinking Okung should be released, and an upgrade could be had, or what? If not, then there wasn't a SINGLE player available at the right asking price that was an upgrade. People want upgrades, but want this guy, and that guy as well. It does NOT work that way. Just doesn't. You want Thomas? You want Wilson? You want Sherman? You want Bennett? Then you CANNOT pay a Guard 5-7 million a year, and a RT 6-8 million a year, no matter HOW good they are ( which they were decidedly not this year).

All this fretting, this is how the have done THIS offseason, not how you feel about the lineman they picked last year, or the year before. The facts of the matter is, the ONE high draft pick is injury prone. The LOW first round pick is serviceable, the 3 rd roundpick retired ( and as an FYI, people that think 3rd round offensive picks on the line turn into solid starters and pro bowl type players are fooling themselves. The NFL network did a study on it not that long ago. Of 70 some odd offensive lineman selected in the third round there have been 11 pro bowls, 9 of those from ONE player) ridiculous that people expected Hutchinson at guard out of Moffitt, obscenely ridiculous. Carpenter ain't no Hutch, or Jones but expecting him to be is silly as well. He was drafted at the very END of the first round, in a "down" draft, and FYI there isn't really any other lineman that have panned out either drastically before, or after him either. You were moaning about addressing the need, they do, and then moan about who they picked, without at least acknowledging that ANY lineman would have more than likely been just as big of a wiff, if not worse....

[Eaglehawk]

I think your grade depends on perspective.

A lot of people are giving them higher grade out of deference of what they did last year, or respect or trust in their skills.
I took that out of the equation.

In my mind, you just look at the problems, and then you look at what they have done to fix those problems as of TODAY. And my current grade is a C-.

I could give a rip as to trust, or confidence in them. I am just looking at what they have done to date. And to me its not an A or even a B as yet. Maybe it will be, but not now.

[SalmonBB]

B+. Of course, this should probably be an A+, given that Pete Carrol and John Schneider always seem to be way ahead of everyone else on moves to attain, trade, and let-go of players.

What I like:
- Retaining Mccoy.
- Keeping Miller for lower price.
- Letting Red and Clemons go. Loved those guys, but I believe they've peaked and are on the downside, and that's when you let guys go.
- Freeing up cap space, so we can focus on getting long term contracts for the 3 guys we're gonna' need it for: Wilson, Sherman, Thomas.
- Not getting crazy in free agency, and planning to bring in fills with the draft, where the Seahawks have done great in the past.
- Maintaining focus on the draft, I believe we'll fill the holes left by those who have gone with young, hungry players. The Seahawks are staying true so far to who they are and what helped us get to where we are today: bringing in players who want to compete. We are staying young, and youth brings with it hunger. I'm glad we're not trying to "hold on to what we have" in terms of retaining players; rather, we're holding on to our philosophy, which worked these past 3 years, and which others are trying to emulate.

What I didn't like:
- Letting Golden Tate Go. I'm one of the first to call WRs these days a "dime a dozen," as they all just seem to be so talented, and it's hard to find a true break-out star. I believe that this game is really won in the trenches, and with a good QB. With that said, Golden seemed a big part of the heart of this team - I'll miss him. In addition, he hasn't peaked yet, in my opinion, and he could turn out to be one of those truly special WRs. To me, he would have been worth the price to keep him here.

GO SEAHAWKS!!! WORLD CHAMPIONS!!!

[RiverDog]

Seriously shocked by the F vote unless it was a joke. Seattle signed the most versatile D lineman in free agency, that all by itself would place that grade above an F. They have reworked Millers contract, brought in multiple highly sought after free agents, and are the process of possibly signing a huge one. They have lost some true, but ANYONE coming into this off season thinking this stuff wasn't going to be the case is deluded. Pretending like over paying for a mediocre or average lineman, and limiting their ability to lock up core players drops that grade significantly, are also smoking some strange stuff.

Not bringing in a Saffold ( who by the way got seriously PAID, despite his mediocrity) or Veerher ( injury concerns and also GOT PAID). The facts of the matter are, that despite many grumblings on this site, they simply weren't there to be had, at least not at a REASONABLE rate. Are people really advocating the idea that 7 Million is to much for a Red or a Clemmons or a Miller, but 9 million a year for a RT is the way to go? Crazy, plain and simple. You do NOT pay right tackles, left tackle money, at least not and stay successful.

Were people thinking Okung should be released, and an upgrade could be had, or what? If not, then there wasn't a SINGLE player available at the right asking price that was an upgrade. People want upgrades, but want this guy, and that guy as well. It does NOT work that way. Just doesn't. You want Thomas? You want Wilson? You want Sherman? You want Bennett? Then you CANNOT pay a Guard 5-7 million a year, and a RT 6-8 million a year, no matter HOW good they are ( which they were decidedly not this year).

All this fretting, this is how the have done THIS offseason, not how you feel about the lineman they picked last year, or the year before. The facts of the matter is, the ONE high draft pick is injury prone. The LOW first round pick is serviceable, the 3 rd roundpick retired ( and as an FYI, people that think 3rd round offensive picks on the line turn into solid starters and pro bowl type players are fooling themselves. The NFL network did a study on it not that long ago. Of 70 some odd offensive lineman selected in the third round there have been 11 pro bowls, 9 of those from ONE player) ridiculous that people expected Hutchinson at guard out of Moffitt, obscenely ridiculous. Carpenter ain't no Hutch, or Jones but expecting him to be is silly as well. He was drafted at the very END of the first round, in a "down" draft, and FYI there isn't really any other lineman that have panned out either drastically before, or after him either. You were moaning about addressing the need, they do, and then moan about who they picked, without at least acknowledging that ANY lineman would have more than likely been just as big of a wiff, if not worse....

I'm not sure I'd call Carpenter "serviceable". I don't know what your definition of the term is, but to me, a player that is 'serviceable' is a solid starter that is not Pro Bowl quality. Currently I see Carpenter as a very marginal player that's on the verge of becoming a complete bust and probably would have by now had we paid even passing attention to the OL and been on the lookout for a viable replacement. As much as Pete preaches his 'always compete' motto, he hasn't brought in very many players to compete with Carpenter or the other offensive linemen. Carpenter reminds me a lot of Chris Spencer, another first round pick that fizzled, although under the previous management.

And don't forget, Carpenter was a complete bust if you look at the position he was initially drafted to occupy, and the fact that they thought he could ever be a tackle in this league places in doubt our brain trust's (ie Tom Cable) understanding of the attributes that need to be present in order to be successful at that position.

I'm not expecting third round draft picks to make the Pro Bowl. I do expect them to become a solid contributor on a line that has been so thin that it hasn't had anyone even close to becoming a Pro Bowl guard since Hutch left. The fact that 7th round draft picks and converted defensive linemen can come in and compete for starting jobs in their first years tells me that there's a huge vacuum at the position.

Using the logic that "no other lineman in that draft panned out" reminds me of the argument I clung to for several seasons when Aaron Curry was struggling. Would you have rather drafted Mark Sanchez? I used to say. The theory that no other lineman in that draft would have done any better doesn't make Carpenter a good use of the selection. Besides, you don't know how another player would have performed in our system.

[HumanCockroach]

And the selection of Carpenter has what exactly to do with this discussion? Sure I don't know how another lineman performs in this system, that's fair, but you can stop pretending like they would have been better as well. No one knows, that doesn't change the point, which is, most on here were clamoring for offensive lineman and GOT what they WANTED. You don't like how it turned out? To bad, I'm sure Cable and Carroll don't either, doesn't mean they weren't doing exactly what you ( meaning posters clamoring for them) wanted.

You can say Carpenter isn't "serviceable" if you would like, that's fine, obviously your definition of the term is different than mine. "Serviceable" lineman IMO are lineman that turn into players that typically become journeyman players that are better than some, and good enough to play on Sundays ( in Carpenters case most Sundays he's available) have moments of success and moments that leave you scratching your head. Typically strong in one area ( say run blocking) and weak in another ( say pass blocking). Carpenter would indeed start on other teams, no matter how much you dislike the guy. He ain't Pro Bowler, he isn't top 10 at his position, but he isn't bottom ten either. Which IMHO makes him "serviceable".

You can't measure these guys against one of the best guys to ever play the position in Hutch, just like it isn't fair to trash Okung basing it on Jones' play. You have to measure it against average player across the NFL and believe it or not, Carpenter performs on that level.

As for Moffitt, eh, you can expect solid starting offensive Lineman in the third, history proves that isn't a realistic expectation but you are welcome to whatever belief that allows you to sleep sound at night.

[Zorn76]

Miller re-signed bumps it up half a grade for me, to a B+.

Not sure what all the complaining is about, outside of Houschka, really.

We only have so much cap space to work with, and we gotta do it wisely, which Pete and John have shown great aptitude in doing since they arrived.

None of the OL that went flying off the board were the missing piece, IMO, even if they would be an improvement from what we had last year. It'll get done. Our F.O. has, clearly, earned the benefit of the doubt since 2010, so keep the faith.

Speaking for myself, it's not just the fact that we haven't signed a FA OL, it's that we're not even trying or that we seem oblivious to the need. Not even bringing anyone in for a visit, nothing regarding interest in the two OL's Tampa released, no interest in Jonathan Martin, nothing. When you add into that equation the fact that the highest draft choice we've used on OL in the past two years was a couple of 7th rounders, my frustration boils over in a thread like this one.

If FA and the draft were already over, then I could see your point more. But that isn't the case, and I'm gonna give them the benefit of the doubt that they'll get it done when it comes to the OL. The bar wasn't raised last year, so the possibility of improving the situation up front remains high.

[obiken]

I wish we could have signed Red Bryant he was a real run stopper. It wasn't going happen however. I was a not as big a Tater fan as some of you guys. He made some great catches but he dropped a lot of them. (look at the AZ game) This is for you chemistry experts(and I am NOT): will matching him with Megatron cause a boom or bust for the Lions???

obi

[RiverDog]

And the selection of Carpenter has what exactly to do with this discussion? Sure I don't know how another lineman performs in this system, that's fair, but you can stop pretending like they would have been better as well. No one knows, that doesn't change the point, which is, most on here were clamoring for offensive lineman and GOT what they WANTED. You don't like how it turned out? To bad, I'm sure Cable and Carroll don't either, doesn't mean they weren't doing exactly what you ( meaning posters clamoring for them) wanted.

You can say Carpenter isn't "serviceable" if you would like, that's fine, obviously your definition of the term is different than mine. "Serviceable" lineman IMO are lineman that turn into players that typically become journeyman players that are better than some, and good enough to play on Sundays ( in Carpenters case most Sundays he's available) have moments of success and moments that leave you scratching your head. Typically strong in one area ( say run blocking) and weak in another ( say pass blocking). Carpenter would indeed start on other teams, no matter how much you dislike the guy. He ain't Pro Bowler, he isn't top 10 at his position, but he isn't bottom ten either. Which IMHO makes him "serviceable".

You can't measure these guys against one of the best guys to ever play the position in Hutch, just like it isn't fair to trash Okung basing it on Jones' play. You have to measure it against average player across the NFL and believe it or not, Carpenter performs on that level.

As for Moffitt, eh, you can expect solid starting offensive Lineman in the third, history proves that isn't a realistic expectation but you are welcome to whatever belief that allows you to sleep sound at night.

You're the one that brought up Carp. I simply disagreed with your characterization of him being 'serviceable'. He was a complete bust as an OT and has one foot out the door as an OG.

I didn't compare anyone with Hutch. All I said was that we haven't had a Pro Bowl quality OG since Hutch, a commentary on the quality of players we've had since 2005 and how it should be relatively easy for an OG to break into our starting lineup. I didn't say a word about Walt.

Where are you coming up with this stuff I supposedly said? I expected Moffitt to be a starter for us considering the vacuum we have at OG, not a Pro Bowl player for crissakes.

[HumanCockroach]

And the selection of Carpenter has what exactly to do with this discussion? Sure I don't know how another lineman performs in this system, that's fair, but you can stop pretending like they would have been better as well. No one knows, that doesn't change the point, which is, most on here were clamoring for offensive lineman and GOT what they WANTED. You don't like how it turned out? To bad, I'm sure Cable and Carroll don't either, doesn't mean they weren't doing exactly what you ( meaning posters clamoring for them) wanted.

You can say Carpenter isn't "serviceable" if you would like, that's fine, obviously your definition of the term is different than mine. "Serviceable" lineman IMO are lineman that turn into players that typically become journeyman players that are better than some, and good enough to play on Sundays ( in Carpenters case most Sundays he's available) have moments of success and moments that leave you scratching your head. Typically strong in one area ( say run blocking) and weak in another ( say pass blocking). Carpenter would indeed start on other teams, no matter how much you dislike the guy. He ain't Pro Bowler, he isn't top 10 at his position, but he isn't bottom ten either. Which IMHO makes him "serviceable".

You can't measure these guys against one of the best guys to ever play the position in Hutch, just like it isn't fair to trash Okung basing it on Jones' play. You have to measure it against average player across the NFL and believe it or not, Carpenter performs on that level.

As for Moffitt, eh, you can expect solid starting offensive Lineman in the third, history proves that isn't a realistic expectation but you are welcome to whatever belief that allows you to sleep sound at night.

You're the one that brought up Carp. I simply disagreed with your characterization of him being 'serviceable'. He was a complete bust as an OT and has one foot out the door as an OG.

I didn't compare anyone with Hutch. All I said was that we haven't had a Pro Bowl quality OG since Hutch, a commentary on the quality of players we've had since 2005 and how it should be relatively easy for an OG to break into our starting lineup. I didn't say a word about Walt.

Where are you coming up with this stuff I supposedly said? I expected Moffitt to be a starter for us considering the vacuum we have at OG, not a Pro Bowl player for crissakes.

Moffitt and Carpenter have ZERO to do with this offseason, your grading on picks from YEARS ago. If you think Carpenter isn't a starter in the NFL, I don't know how to help you, because even lineman named Spencer and Locklear are. You either don't know what teams are running out there, or your bar is so high, that it is fantasy, either way, a grade based on two seasons ago seems a bit of a reach. You are using any and all topics to push your point of view, which is the line sucks ( which it doesn't and didn't last season) and the resigning of our kicker.

Sit back and THINK about that. The ONLY holes are OG and RT and until a few minutes ago FG kicker. LMAO seems to me they did a HELL of a job, I'ld say the BEST job in the NFL assembling this team. Guards can be found, RT's are more difficult, and yet I am not concerned that they will find them, because to find serviceable ones, there isn't a hell of a lot involved, and it most definitely doesn't involve panic or overpaying them.

[Eaglehawk]

We just signed our kicker. For whatever reason it took them to sign this deal, I move them from a C- to a C.


Seahawks have a C. Lets see what happens in the future.

[Seahawks4Ever]

A "C"??? Man, you are a tough grader. Tell me E.H. what would they need to have done (or not done) to deserve a higher grade?

[RiverDog]

Moffitt and Carpenter have ZERO to do with this offseason, your grading on picks from YEARS ago. If you think Carpenter isn't a starter in the NFL, I don't know how to help you, because even lineman named Spencer and Locklear are. You either don't know what teams are running out there, or your bar is so high, that it is fantasy, either way, a grade based on two seasons ago seems a bit of a reach. You are usng any and all topics to push your point of view, which is the line sucks ( which it doesn't and didn't last season) and the resigning of our kicker.

Sit back and THINK about that. The ONLY holes are OG and RT and until a few minutes ago FG kicker. LMAO seems to me they did a HELL of a job, I'ld say the BEST job in the NFL assembling this team. Guards can be found, RT's are more difficult, and yet I am not concerned that they will find them, because to find serviceable ones, there isn't a hell of a lot involved, and it most definitely doesn't involve panic or overpaying them.

According to you they have zero to do with this off season. IMO the past has a lot to do with our ability to operate in this current environment.

And just what is wrong with me pushing my POV? Is it because you don't agree with it? What's the function of this forum anyway? Is it nothing more than a place to stand up and cheer "Go Hawks"?

[NorthHawk]

We all want the Hawks to win another Super Bowl.
To do so we have to improve.
The Defense should be almost as good as last year and the ST can be as well.
The only place to really improve is the Offense.

That's what's driving my focus on the OL.

[Anthony]

A "C"??? Man, you are a tough grader. Tell me E.H. what would they need to have done (or not done) to deserve a higher grade?

Do something to fix the weakest part of the team the o-line

[RiverDog]

We all want the Hawks to win another Super Bowl.
To do so we have to improve.
The Defense should be almost as good as last year and the ST can be as well.
The only place to really improve is the Offense.

That's what's driving my focus on the OL.

Well said, Bro!

Excuse me if I want to win another SB. Is it a sin to be so passionate about my team that I speak out when I see things that I don't think advances our chances of winning another SB?

[HumanCockroach]

Moffitt and Carpenter have ZERO to do with this offseason, your grading on picks from YEARS ago. If you think Carpenter isn't a starter in the NFL, I don't know how to help you, because even lineman named Spencer and Locklear are. You either don't know what teams are running out there, or your bar is so high, that it is fantasy, either way, a grade based on two seasons ago seems a bit of a reach. You are usng any and all topics to push your point of view, which is the line sucks ( which it doesn't and didn't last season) and the resigning of our kicker.

Sit back and THINK about that. The ONLY holes are OG and RT and until a few minutes ago FG kicker. LMAO seems to me they did a HELL of a job, I'ld say the BEST job in the NFL assembling this team. Guards can be found, RT's are more difficult, and yet I am not concerned that they will find them, because to find serviceable ones, there isn't a hell of a lot involved, and it most definitely doesn't involve panic or overpaying them.

According to you they have zero to do with this off season. IMO the past has a lot to do with our ability to operate in this current environment.

And just what is wrong with me pushing my POV? Is it because you don't agree with it? What's the function of this forum anyway? Is it nothing more than a place to stand up and cheer "Go Hawks"?

My only issue is that it creeps up in just about any thread you can squeeze it into. How about just start a thread about the Line deficiencies. Then at least all the moaning can be in one place. By the way, I'm a touch sick of the thought that I don't care, or don't want the line to be improved. I've only put it in every other post I have made on the subject. At this point, the ONLY difference is, I understand the process, and realistic expectations for how to address it, as opposed to just want to sit around and whine about it.

FYI: bouncing from "I want an upgrade" to " just sign someone" thing isn't strengthening any one position. Either you want one or you want the other. No upgrades to be had with your band aid solutions, and really as a whole on the free agent market ( hence why the starting lineman you guys were so desperate to "upgrade" was signed 2 days after being aloud to walk to a big contract, I wonder why? Could it be because he was BETTER than the other players available. No, that can't be right can it? I mean he was TERRIBLE right? A cheaper better replacement was anywhere and everywhere..... oops).

I tired of this I want this or that, without acknowledging that what the posters here WANT isn't for sale. Isn't rocket science.

[NorthHawk]

I just can't believe that of all the FA OL not one would be a possible upgrade to an average at best Seahawks OL.