Kaepernick signs

[Anthony]

http://mmqb.si.com/2014/06/05/andrew-luck-russell-wilson-colin-kaepernick-robert-griffin-cam-newtown-running-quarterbacks-analysis/?sct=nbar_blogs_dd

Pretty good article, and even though many Seahawks fans will be up in arms, it does indeed touch on Kap's pre snap recognision, and lack of basic route combination knowledge. Hawks fans ( well some) will be upset, because it points out that many of Russell's sacks are a product of him moving, not the o-line. he wasn't rated the worst, but many will probably guess who the love fest continues to favor ( hint it isn't someone who runs much).

"Kaepernick does not read the defense before the snap. You can tell because he shows no understanding of this basic quarterbacking concept: When one receiver is covered, it often means another receiver is not. There’s no awareness of route combinations"

Here's a scary statement:
A note on Wilson: All but one of the sacks that were a blocker’s fault came against a simple four-man rush.

The scarier stat to me was that Wilson led the group in sacks that were his fault. Something that needs to be either improved on, or something people need to learn to accept ( as fans of Rothlisberger have had to learn to accept). Over a quarter of the sacks allowed weren't on that o-line, in fact, the o-line was better than all 5 QB's listed in that list.

It IS IMPORTANT to note however, that the article makes mention, that it seems as though that is what the staff wants Wilson to do though. So in essence, it is not the line, or even Wilson, but the system, coaching and scheme, they want to run ( or at least in the writers opinion, based on what he witnessed).

and here is a site saying the opposite and I will never buy anything Peter King sells

http://blogs.seattletimes.com/seahawks/ ... crambling/

For Seattle’s Russell Wilson, the breakdown looks like this:

20 for what it terms a “blown block.”

14 for good coverage in the secondary

8 for a rusher coming in untouched (so meaning the blame more on scheme or assignment than a physical error).

And one each for it describes as other pressure and “quarterback fault.”

[burrrton]

Football Outsiders was who I was meaning to refer to when I said "PFO" (not sure where I got the Pro part, but anyway).

I haven't read that article yet, but I suspect they'll explain themselves better than MMQB, which is what leads me to trust their numbers and opinions more.

[Anthony]

Football Outsiders was who I was meaning to refer to when I said "PFO" (not sure where I got the Pro part, but anyway).

I haven't read that article yet, but I suspect they'll explain themselves better than MMQB, which is what leads me to trust their numbers and opinions more.

Agreed the big thing for me is at the very top of the MMQB is the name with Peter King, Peter has been on Lucks jock since day one and has been anti Rw since day one. So I do not buy any of it, it is just another PK Luck love fest. And FYI I watched Luck get sacked and it was his fault, he ran right into it, and he did not even have to run.

[HumanCockroach]

I wasn't saying King wasn't on Luck's nut sack, just that the article was interesting. I trust my own eyes far more than any article, I KNOW I've seen Wilson run when there is no pressure, how that works into the system and coaching I have no idea, I just know what I've seen. Wilson runs when there is no pressure ( which may be a product of a timer in his head, as all QB's have one, and use it on every passing play), as long as the results continue to be good plays and decisions, and the team continues to win games, I'll never complain ( at least in a majority sense).

I won't however, pretend like he doesn't make mistakes, poor decisions, or things that aren't beneficial to the play at the time. He does, as does every QB playing the game today, or ever. As long as he mitigates those mistakes ( as he has done) I'm good.

[kalibane]

And not that I'm trying to excuse all of the Sacks Wilson was at fault for, we also need to keep in mind that some of those sacks came indirectly as a result of Wilson taking off too early because the internal clock started ticking fast because the offensive line was so bad during the first half of the season. Bad protection and the QB bailing out too quick all contribute to a negative circular result.

[Anthony]

And not that I'm trying to excuse all of the Sacks Wilson was at fault for, we also need to keep in mind that some of those sacks came indirectly as a result of Wilson taking off too early because the internal clock started ticking fast because the offensive line was so bad during the first half of the season. Bad protection and the QB bailing out too quick all contribute to a negative circular result.

Those are good points as RW has bailed on occasion to soon, or at least it looked to be to soon, without knowing the play, the routes and such it is tough to tell, he might have left what looked to be to soon, because he saw the routes break down. Tough to say, However I know the football outsiders numbers took that into account. All that said all QBs make mistakes as does Rw, but more often than not he more than make sup for it, a thing a lot of other QBs do not do.

[HumanCockroach]

Personally, I would like to see more throw aways and quick throws. It isn't a knock to admit these are areas he could work on. I do think having Harvin and Richardson is going to greatly increase his ability to do that, and be effective doing so. I love his ability to freelance, just sometimes feel he is doing so, when he really doesn't need to do it. I'm not in the least complaining about where he is at this point in his career, but I do know more quick throws directly equates to less shots on the QB.

[Anthony]

Personally, I would like to see more throw aways and quick throws. It isn't a knock to admit these are areas he could work on. I do think having Harvin and Richardson is going to greatly increase his ability to do that, and be effective doing so. I love his ability to freelance, just sometimes feel he is doing so, when he really doesn't need to do it. I'm not in the least complaining about where he is at this point in his career, but I do know more quick throws directly equates to less shots on the QB.

Agreed problem is a lot of times there are no quick routes to throw to, and if the play calls for a longer route he cannot throw it away to soon, because if he does he did not give the route time to develop. It is a fine line and with out knowing what every play call is we cannot tell. I think the answer is to always have a quick check down on every play so the has that option. Something we did not do a lot of last year till the SB.

[Futureite]

I preferred this line " It's scary to think what Kap can do when he adds a higher football IQ to his freakish athleticism."

Notice the part about needing a "higher football IQ" guess it isn't just us that see's it.[/quote]

That says it all for me. Sorry, stats notwithstanding, this guy is a flash in the pan, he will be traded in 2 years after the Niners implode next season. The Niners should make the playoffs next year barely. (No team/management chemistry). And yes, he reminds me of Romo Light(great beer, not filling), except he has faster feet. Not to mention the threat of injury as he runs out of the pocket into the arms of a 300 pound D-linesman or LB.



RIDDLE ME THIS, when was the last time you saw a low football IQ qb win the SB.
Most of them including Kaep, choked.

[/quote]

Obviously there is no changi.g of anyone's mind here. But on the way to work I was thinking about how so few people even understand what a "choke" is. The word is thrown around so.much, it has lost it's effect.

My understanding of a choke is when the internal pressure experienced by an athlete causes an abnormal decrease in his physical performance on the field. The athlete can no longer perform routine tasks he ordinarily would. The errors can be mental or physical. Examples:

Bill Buckner boots a routine ground ball in game 6 of the world series.

Tony Romo fumbles a snap he's taken 1,000 times on a routine FG to win a playoff game.

Chris Webber calls a timeout at the end of the NCAA Champ game when Mich was out of timeouts, resulting in a technical foul.

There are also team examples. A team "choking" occurs when the team is clearly better than its opponent, but arguably the magnitude of the game caused them to play poorly. Example:

8th Seed Nuggetts beat #1 seed Sonics (no dig, it's late and I am struggking for examples).

New York Jets beat Baltimore Colts.

That said, to suggest Kaepernick "choked" in the SB is asenine. He did nothing on the last drive that was out of the ordinary to his previous 9 NFL starts. Didn't fumble a ball or overthrow a wide open WR or call a timeout we didn't have, etc. He was the exact same QB he had been that entire yr. He threw for 300 yds, ran for 60+ and posted a 91 QB rating. He made 1 turnover the entire game. If any phase choked in the postseason it qas our D, which unlike most of the reg season, gave up over 30 ppg in the postseason.

I think your definition is way, way off. By this definition any QB that doesn't win any game he has an opportunity to at the end has choked. Which means all yr great NFL QBs will choke in 2014. Most probably more than once.

[Futureite]

Btw, anyone know why are the posts that I am responding to are not clearly separating my response from the OP by color? Everything looks like it's blending together in the last couple quotes that I responded to.

[mykc14]

Btw, anyone know why are the posts that I am responding to are not clearly separating my response from the OP by color? Everything looks like it's blending together in the last couple quotes that I responded to.

I don't know but that has been happening to me as well.

[burrrton]

Future, just FYI: Romo successfully getting that snap down wasn't the automatic win some of you portray it as.

There was still like a minute and a half left, and we had the best offense in the league.

[RiverDog]

Future, just FYI: Romo successfully getting that snap down wasn't the automatic win some of you portray it as.

There was still like a minute and a half left, and we had the best offense in the league.

Nor did we win the game after he fumbled that snap. It wasn't until SA ripped off a 20 yard gain on 3rd down that the game was put away. Had we not made that first down, we would have been punting from our own end zone with time for Dallas to run several plays.

Plus the important thing on that fumbled snap isn't the botched FG attempt, it was that Romo didn't make the first down. Big Play Babs caught him from behind. Had he made the first down, it would have been worse for us than had they converted on the FG.

[Anthony]

Future, just FYI: Romo successfully getting that snap down wasn't the automatic win some of you portray it as.

There was still like a minute and a half left, and we had the best offense in the league.

Nor did we win the game after he fumbled that snap. It wasn't until SA ripped off a 20 yard gain on 3rd down that the game was put away. Had we not made that first down, we would have been punting from our own end zone with time for Dallas to run several plays.

Plus the important thing on that fumbled snap isn't the botched FG attempt, it was that Romo didn't make the first down. Big Play Babs caught him from behind. Had he made the first down, it would have been worse for us than had they converted on the FG.

Yeah I remember that run by Alexander, I still have no clue how he got past the line since I saw no hole, and how smart he was to stay in bounds, even though he got hurt on the play.

[HumanCockroach]

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/20 ... hared=true

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/20 ... hared=true

[Futureite]

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/2089175-the-most-overrated-and-underrated-player-on-every-nfl-roster?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=programming?is_shared=true

Lol what a crap list. Trent Richardson and Tavon Austun are over-rated? I didn't hear too many people singing their praises last yr.

[HumanCockroach]

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/2089175-the-most-overrated-and-underrated-player-on-every-nfl-roster?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=programming?is_shared=true

Lol what a crap list. Trent Richardson and Tavon Austun are over-rated? I didn't hear too many people singing their praises last yr.

You need to look past the end of your nose to understand this is hype/cost versus actual production. Austin and Richardson COST a first round choice and produced little. Kaepernick COSTS this and provides that,etc. Since you were LOOKING for a way to discredit the production ( or lack there of ) you found some guys, to deflect that Kap was the 18th rated passer per PFF.

Not overly concerned that you will acknowledge that, just find actual production, versus hype interesting. For example, I've defended Irvin over and over and over again, and while he IS rated the 10th best OLB in the NFL last season , he was listed as the most over rated on my team, I don't need to "search" for a reason to "discredit" the claim, just because it doesn't coincide with how I feel about it, apparently, you do. That's on you, and that's fine.

[Anthony]

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/2089175-the-most-overrated-and-underrated-player-on-every-nfl-roster?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=programming?is_shared=true

Lol what a crap list. Trent Richardson and Tavon Austun are over-rated? I didn't hear too many people singing their praises last yr.

You need to look past the end of your nose to understand this is hype/cost versus actual production. Austin and Richardson COST a first round choice and produced little. Kaepernick COSTS this and provides that,etc. Since you were LOOKING for a way to discredit the production ( or lack there of ) you found some guys, to deflect that Kap was the 18th rated passer per PFF.

Not overly concerned that you will acknowledge that, just find actual production, versus hype interesting. For example, I've defended Irvin over and over and over again, and while he IS rated the 10th best OLB in the NFL last season , he was listed as the most over rated on my team, I don't need to "search" for a reason to "discredit" the claim, just because it doesn't coincide with how I feel about it, apparently, you do. That's on you, and that's fine.

Great post spot on.

[Futureite]

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/2089175-the-most-overrated-and-underrated-player-on-every-nfl-roster?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=programming?is_shared=true

Lol what a crap list. Trent Richardson and Tavon Austun are over-rated? I didn't hear too many people singing their praises last yr.

You need to look past the end of your nose to understand this is hype/cost versus actual production. Austin and Richardson COST a first round choice and produced little. Kaepernick COSTS this and provides that,etc. Since you were LOOKING for a way to discredit the production ( or lack there of ) you found some guys, to deflect that Kap was the 18th rated passer per PFF.

Not overly concerned that you will acknowledge that, just find actual production, versus hype interesting. For example, I've defended Irvin over and over and over again, and while he IS rated the 10th best OLB in the NFL last season , he was listed as the most over rated on my team, I don't need to "search" for a reason to "discredit" the claim, just because it doesn't coincide with how I feel about it, apparently, you do. That's on you, and that's fine.

Ya I don't think too many people other than you were hyping up Bruce Irvin, so add that to the list of players that shouldn't be on any list of "over-rated". In fact no one was hyping him up. And plenty of people thought the Richardson trade was ludicrous. By the end of the season the o erwhelming opinion was that it was a flat out terrible trade. The article sucked dude. Could care less how they rated Kap. No one was hyping any of these guys up by the end of the yr. Maybe they could have called it "biggest mistakes" or something similar instead of putting it in the present tense of "over-rated".

Kap's contract as I understand it forces him to perform to get most of that money. That's beside the point though. There aren't too many compent NFL QBs and every team is going to pay for one that is even decent.

[HumanCockroach]

Cost vs production in Irvin's case ( ie a first round pick) and it would be erroneous to assume that after finishing third in the defensive rookie of the year after posting more sacks than any other rookie that there was "no hype" anyway.

The difference is I grasp the concept, and you don't. First round picks often carry "expectations" as do players with large contracts, as well as simple media hype. You use Austen and Richardsen as examples, BOTH were drafted highly( Richardson cost two teams a first round draft pick IF that isn't "hype" you're seriously lost) to think that there was "no hype" is silly. You might as well claim there is no hype for Manziel, or Weed on, or ANY other first round pick.

[Futureite]

Cost vs production in Irvin's case ( ie a first round pick) and it would be erroneous to assume that after finishing third in the defensive rookie of the year after posting more sacks than any other rookie that there was "no hype" anyway.

The difference is I grasp the concept, and you don't. First round picks often carry "expectations" as do players with large contracts, as well as simple media hype. You use Austen and Richardsen as examples, BOTH were drafted highly( Richardson cost two teams a first round draft pick IF that isn't "hype" you're seriously lost) to think that there was "no hype" is silly. You might as well claim there is no hype for Manziel, or Weed on, or ANY other first round pick.

Then the title if the article should have been "most overpaid players" by team. It makes no sense to write an article about overhyped players that are receiving no hype at the time of the article. Only a few made sense and ironically, one could argue that Kaep is one of them. Personally I do not feel that he fits the bill though as everyone from Trent Dilfer to Steve Young to millions of morons on NFL.com are critiquing his game. Kaep is also not overpaid. There is a good article on NFL.Com right now that breaks down where the money will come from and what the 49ers are actually on the hook for - which isn't much. They can even walk away at almost any point in the contract and move in a different direction. So personally I do not feel as though he should be on the list, but I can understand how some may feel he gets more hype than he deserves at times.

Lol honestly I was going to address Irvin but I cannot under your criterion - because I have no idea what your criterion is. It is really hard to talk with you about these things sometimes. You are making the article all about the pricetag for production, yet it's about hype. And I can't even analyze that aspect because apparently you are debating the timeframe in which the player was overhyped. Yes, if the article had been written last offseason it would make sense to cite Irvin's placing 3rd in rookie of the yr voting. Then, the author's assertion would be "no, he is not as good as the ROY voting suggests. He receives to much hype". As it stands now, no one is hyping him. He makes no sense to be on that list, even by your own interpretaion of the article's premise (he makes a rookie salary, how can he possibly be overpaid and thus on this list??).

I thought it was a lame article. The author compared Welker's stats but failed to note the time he missed due to injury or the fact that the Broncos had the highest scoring O of alltime. I am sure Welker had no hand in that. Just bad analysis on many levels.

[HumanCockroach]

It isn't my article, and I had no real problem deciphering the cost/ hype attributed was the hype after two seasons ago, versus the production from last season ( ie Irvin was hyped coming off his rookie campaign and didn't perform up to that level, as did Richardson. While players like Austen and Manziel came in with a TON of hype). You don't see it? Fine, doesn't bother me in the least.

Kap contract, can be gotten out of easily, and I HAVE made numerous comments about how smart it is. I have to ask Future, WHY is it structured like that? If Kap is everything you profess him to be, it would NOT be necessary to make it performance based. Kap has a TON of hype, and indeed carries a TON of questions, and however you want to slice it hasn't performed up to that hype. Period. ( and they D discuss Welker's injuries, it was a reason the put him where he was) .

Over rated and Under rated were the parameters of the article, NOT hype, and it's subjective which is why just a few years ago a player like Alexander could make BOTH list voted on the players.You can get all up in arms about it, all I did was provide the article, and I did so, in this thread to give some groundwork for Kap, which is he was the 18th rated passer according to PFF.

[Eaglehawk]

I don't see Kap as a leader. On or off the field. Maybe that's part of the situation. He's acting his age and not like the leader of a storied franchise.
Not a bad guy necessarily, just not a leader.

[Futureite]

I don't see Kap as a leader. On or off the field. Maybe that's part of the situation. He's acting his age and not like the leader of a storied franchise.
Not a bad guy necessarily, just not a leader.

Well, at least we know the "selfish" mantra has been shot down. I just read an ESPN article that said even if he hits all of the incentives in his contract, he will receive below market pay ($17 mil/yr). He made it a point to structure the contract to leave enough room for the 49ers to sign other players around him to remain competitive. I have been reading for quite some time that Kap would command $20 mil and RW would be the one taking the low-end contract to help the team. This is just another example of what I have held for over a yr now: your perception of both of these guys is built on image and interviews. In substance though Kap does every single thing you could possibly hope from a QB.

[Futureite]

It isn't my article, and I had no real problem deciphering the cost/ hype attributed was the hype after two seasons ago, versus the production from last season ( ie Irvin was hyped coming off his rookie campaign and didn't perform up to that level, as did Richardson. While players like Austen and Manziel came in with a TON of hype). You don't see it? Fine, doesn't bother me in the least.

Kap contract, can be gotten out of easily, and I HAVE made numerous comments about how smart it is. I have to ask Future, WHY is it structured like that? If Kap is everything you profess him to be, it would NOT be necessary to make it performance based. Kap has a TON of hype, and indeed carries a TON of questions, and however you want to slice it hasn't performed up to that hype. Period. ( and they D discuss Welker's injuries, it was a reason the put him where he was) .

Over rated and Under rated were the parameters of the article, NOT hype, and it's subjective which is why just a few years ago a player like Alexander could make BOTH list voted on the players.You can get all up in arms about it, all I did was provide the article, and I did so, in this thread to give some groundwork for Kap, which is he was the 18th rated passer according to PFF.

Lol I am not up in arms about it. I just did not think ot was a good article. Actually, better put, it was a well written article that at least attempted to back its assertions with statistics. But in substance it made no sense to me. Another example was Gresham. I believe he is highly regarded for his athleticism, but no one over-estimates the player that he is. He creates matchup problems on a team with a bunch of other outstanding skill players. That's about all I've ever read or heard about him.

Yes, you are right. It was "over-rated" rather than hyped. I I must have had the Manziel critique on that article in my mind, wherein the author spoke of hype. To be fair, it would be much harder to write an article that forced you to choose an over-rated player from every team as opposed to picking a handful from the entire league. But in reality some teams may have zero over-rated players, and that fact was born out by some of the author's choices IMO.

Re: Kap. Lol you know why you posted that article on this thread. Don't go CP on me now . At this point I have read every possible criticism of Kaep on every football website imagineable. He lifts to many weights, knows only one read, selfish, immature and dumb. If you believe that I was angered by the latest criticism in that article, you are mistaken. I think he got a good contract for where he is at right now, and I love what he has done thus far. I think he is going to have a huge, 4,000 yd 30+ td yr in 2014.

[Anthony]

I don't see Kap as a leader. On or off the field. Maybe that's part of the situation. He's acting his age and not like the leader of a storied franchise.
Not a bad guy necessarily, just not a leader.

Well, at least we know the "selfish" mantra has been shot down. I just read an ESPN article that said even if he hits all of the incentives in his contract, he will receive below market pay ($17 mil/yr). He made it a point to structure the contract to leave enough room for the 49ers to sign other players around him to remain competitive. I have been reading for quite some time that Kap would command $20 mil and RW would be the one taking the low-end contract to help the team. This is just another example of what I have held for over a yr now: your perception of both of these guys is built on image and interviews. In substance though Kap does every single thing you could possibly hope from a QB.

I doubt he purposely did anything, this is what the Niners offered he took it and it shows their reservations so lets stop trying to spin it like he did you a favor, form everything I read he had no choice.

Here is the reason he got what he got anything else is just media face saving

"As one source put it, Kaepernick can feel good about the deal because he has a lot more guaranteed money today than he had yesterday. But the same source also added that the 49ers are nevertheless “thrilled” with the contract, which allows them to control Kaepernick’s rights for seven years and to move on after any of the next six seasons, if they ultimately decide that Kaepernick is more like the guy who struggled at times during the 2013 regular season and less like the guy who found the gas pedal in the playoffs."


As to Rw he will sign a contract that will not cripple us too, but unlike Kap our FO has no reservations and will not insult him with this kind of deal,. or at least not one this insulting.

[NorthHawk]

I don't see Kap as a leader. On or off the field. Maybe that's part of the situation. He's acting his age and not like the leader of a storied franchise.
Not a bad guy necessarily, just not a leader.

Well, at least we know the "selfish" mantra has been shot down. I just read an ESPN article that said even if he hits all of the incentives in his contract, he will receive below market pay ($17 mil/yr). He made it a point to structure the contract to leave enough room for the 49ers to sign other players around him to remain competitive. I have been reading for quite some time that Kap would command $20 mil and RW would be the one taking the low-end contract to help the team. This is just another example of what I have held for over a yr now: your perception of both of these guys is built on image and interviews. In substance though Kap does every single thing you could possibly hope from a QB.

I doubt he purposely did anything, this is what the Niners offered he took it and it shows their reservations so lets stop trying to spin it like he did you a favor, form everything I read he had no choice.

There are always choices. It just depends on how much he perceives his value to be and how confident he can be in taking the next step in his development.
I would think there are more than a few teams that would be interested if he couldn't come to terms with SF and eventually became a FA.

[kalibane]

Well, at least we know the "selfish" mantra has been shot down. I have been reading for quite some time that Kap would command $20 mil and RW would be the one taking the low-end contract to help the team. This is just another example of what I have held for over a yr now: your perception of both of these guys is built on image and interviews. In substance though Kap does every single thing you could possibly hope from a QB.

Where exactly have you been reading these things "for quite some time"? A fringe lunatic fan blog? I haven't read anything suggesting either possibility. Matter of fact I don't think I've ever heard someone theorize that Kaepernick is selfish in this regard.

You try too hard...

[Futureite]

I don't see Kap as a leader. On or off the field. Maybe that's part of the situation. He's acting his age and not like the leader of a storied franchise.
Not a bad guy necessarily, just not a leader.

Well, at least we know the "selfish" mantra has been shot down. I just read an ESPN article that said even if he hits all of the incentives in his contract, he will receive below market pay ($17 mil/yr). He made it a point to structure the contract to leave enough room for the 49ers to sign other players around him to remain competitive. I have been reading for quite some time that Kap would command $20 mil and RW would be the one taking the low-end contract to help the team. This is just another example of what I have held for over a yr now: your perception of both of these guys is built on image and interviews. In substance though Kap does every single thing you could possibly hope from a QB.

I doubt he purposely did anything, this is what the Niners offered he took it and it shows their reservations so lets stop trying to spin it like he did you a favor, form everything I read he had no choice.

Just remember: everyone in the world said he'd get paid big, and he accepted less. Didn't hold out. Didn't play out the season to try to walk and get a big contract in 2015 elsewhere. Again, instead of bashing him, as a Hawk fan you should probably just hope RW takes the same sort of deal. Otherwise you are in serious danger of the whole "above reproach" line of reasoning you take to comparing these two QB's character blowing up in your face.

[Futureite]

Well, at least we know the "selfish" mantra has been shot down. I have been reading for quite some time that Kap would command $20 mil and RW would be the one taking the low-end contract to help the team. This is just another example of what I have held for over a yr now: your perception of both of these guys is built on image and interviews. In substance though Kap does every single thing you could possibly hope from a QB.

Where exactly have you been reading these things "for quite some time"? A fringe lunatic fan blog? I haven't read anything suggesting either possibility. Matter of fact I don't think I've ever heard someone theorize that Kaepernick is selfish in this regard.

You try too hard...

The speculation everywhere was that the floor of his contract was $18 mil/yr akin to Romo or Cutler. I am sure you know how contracts work. There is a floor and a ceiling. In the NFL they have a history of going up, not down. The speculation was on every single sports website dude, from ESPN to CBSSports.com.

Please on the selfish end. His character gets bashed up and down every way imaginable. And if he were a selfish or immature guy, the FIRST place it would show would be in his contract. If you want to test someone's character, try testing their pocket book. Money only accentuates one's character, good or bad.

[kalibane]

Future... Speculation about how much the contract would be has nothing to do with what you said. It wasn't even speculation, that's what Kaepernick was trying to get when negotiations first started.

What you said is that you've been reading for some time that Kaepernick would be trying to break the bank because he's selfish and RW would take a team friendly deal because he's Russell Wilson.

From the outset every sane person has been waiting to see how much Kaepernick would be signed for because it would be the barometer for Luck, Newton, Wilson, Dalton and possibly Griffin (I say possibly because Griffin has the injury question that none of these other guys do). It's already been accepted by every sane person that Russell Wilson's contract will be more expensive than Colin Kaepernick's contract because even before the Superbowl victory he has done more to earn it.

And yes there are a lot of people who take issue with some of Kaepernick's behavior or demeanor. For instance I really dislike how he handles his post game press conferences after a loss. Not because of the headphones and casual attire either. I would just prefer the "leader of my team" to sit up and answer questions with authority instead of slouching, refusing to make eye contact and mumbling like a kid who just got caught doing something they knew they weren't supposed to. I'd also like to see him give at least some credit to the teams who beat him which he never does. And there are certainly people who make a bigger deal out of those things than they should. That being said the base criticism of Kaepernick usually boils down to immaturity and/or lack of humility... not selfishness. You invented that so you could try to lay the ground work for this absurd point you are going to try and make when Russell Wilson signs a contract that inevitably will be worth more than Kaepernick's.

Like I said you try to hard. You're dying for anything you can hold onto that shows Russell Wilson to not be the person that he presents himself as and Kaepernick as the genuine article who's just misunderstood.

When Wilson, Luck and Newton sign extensions for more money than Kaepernick signed for it's not because Kaepernick was being altruistic and Wilson, Luck and Newton are greedy, it's because they will have done more in three full seasons as a starting QB (4 for Newton) to earn their richer contracts than Kaepernick will have done in 23 career starts.

[Anthony]

Future... Speculation about how much the contract would be has nothing to do with what you said. It wasn't even speculation, that's what Kaepernick was trying to get when negotiations first started.

What you said is that you've been reading for some time that Kaepernick would be trying to break the bank because he's selfish and RW would take a team friendly deal because he's Russell Wilson.

From the outset every sane person has been waiting to see how much Kaepernick would be signed for because it would be the barometer for Luck, Newton, Wilson, Dalton and possibly Griffin (I say possibly because Griffin has the injury question that none of these other guys do). It's already been accepted by every sane person that Russell Wilson's contract will be more expensive than Colin Kaepernick's contract because even before the Superbowl victory he has done more to earn it.

And yes there are a lot of people who take issue with some of Kaepernick's behavior or demeanor. For instance I really dislike how he handles his post game press conferences after a loss. Not because of the headphones and casual attire either. I would just prefer the "leader of my team" to sit up and answer questions with authority instead of slouching, refusing to make eye contact and mumbling like a kid who just got caught doing something they knew they weren't supposed to. I'd also like to see him give at least some credit to the teams who beat him which he never does. And there are certainly people who make a bigger deal out of those things than they should. That being said the base criticism of Kaepernick usually boils down to immaturity and/or lack of humility... not selfishness. You invented that so you could try to lay the ground work for this absurd point you are going to try and make when Russell Wilson signs a contract that inevitably will be worth more than Kaepernick's.

Like I said you try to hard. You're dying for anything you can hold onto that shows Russell Wilson to not be the person that he presents himself as and Kaepernick as the genuine article who's just misunderstood.

When Wilson, Luck and Newton sign extensions for more money than Kaepernick signed for it's not because Kaepernick was being altruistic and Wilson, Luck and Newton are greedy, it's because they will have done more in three full seasons as a starting QB (4 for Newton) to earn their richer contracts than Kaepernick will have done in 23 career starts.

again here is why Kap took what he took

""As one source put it, Kaepernick can feel good about the deal because he has a lot more guaranteed money today than he had yesterday. But the same source also added that the 49ers are nevertheless “thrilled” with the contract, which allows them to control Kaepernick’s rights for seven years and to move on after any of the next six seasons, if they ultimately decide that Kaepernick is more like the guy who struggled at times during the 2013 regular season and less like the guy who found the gas pedal in the playoffs.""


Like I have said with Kap there are questions, there are none with RW, and his contract will not cripple us either but RW will get paid and rightfully so.

If I were you Future I would worry more about Kap pressing to make his numbers so he can get paid then anything else, If he does you guys are screwed, and while you can release him you have no real QB to take his place so you will be screwed either way. Not to mention if he does do well, but not well enough because of the Hawks this contract could be a huge issue latter on as he gets pissed others are getting paid. This could back fire huge for you guys.

From paid part of ESPN

[Futureite]

Future... Speculation about how much the contract would be has nothing to do with what you said. It wasn't even speculation, that's what Kaepernick was trying to get when negotiations first started.

What you said is that you've been reading for some time that Kaepernick would be trying to break the bank because he's selfish and RW would take a team friendly deal because he's Russell Wilson.

From the outset every sane person has been waiting to see how much Kaepernick would be signed for because it would be the barometer for Luck, Newton, Wilson, Dalton and possibly Griffin (I say possibly because Griffin has the injury question that none of these other guys do). It's already been accepted by every sane person that Russell Wilson's contract will be more expensive than Colin Kaepernick's contract because even before the Superbowl victory he has done more to earn it.

And yes there are a lot of people who take issue with some of Kaepernick's behavior or demeanor. For instance I really dislike how he handles his post game press conferences after a loss. Not because of the headphones and casual attire either. I would just prefer the "leader of my team" to sit up and answer questions with authority instead of slouching, refusing to make eye contact and mumbling like a kid who just got caught doing something they knew they weren't supposed to. I'd also like to see him give at least some credit to the teams who beat him which he never does. And there are certainly people who make a bigger deal out of those things than they should. That being said the base criticism of Kaepernick usually boils down to immaturity and/or lack of humility... not selfishness. You invented that so you could try to lay the ground work for this absurd point you are going to try and make when Russell Wilson signs a contract that inevitably will be worth more than Kaepernick's.

Like I said you try to hard. You're dying for anything you can hold onto that shows Russell Wilson to not be the person that he presents himself as and Kaepernick as the genuine article who's just misunderstood.

When Wilson, Luck and Newton sign extensions for more money than Kaepernick signed for it's not because Kaepernick was being altruistic and Wilson, Luck and Newton are greedy, it's because they will have done more in three full seasons as a starting QB (4 for Newton) to earn their richer contracts than Kaepernick will have done in 23 career starts.

Everyone under the sun expected - not speculated - but expected a minimum of $18 mil. That is a fact. It is born out through basic economics and free market demand. You are denying basic economics. Yes, people waited on the outcome of his contract as a barometer, because the SPECULATION was that he would get even more than $18 mil and in fact set a new ceiling of over $20 for young QBs similar to his skill set (Luck, Newton, Wilson).

Lol I am trying to present Wilson not to be the person he presents himself to be? No. What I've stated here over and over (and over . . . And over) is that he does not do anymore to prepare or "lead" than Andrew Luck, or Kaepernick or even Alex Smith. I don't know how more direct I can state that. He just talks about it WAY more than other QBs. You are trying to turn this around, as if your ebtire fanbase has not laid claim to the assertion that RW is more mature, studies harder and has a higher degree of character than Kap. You are the one backtracking, not me. I have never made the opposite argument in Kap's favor, nor did I assert that RW does not do the things he claims to.

Since you ignored my point regarding chracter or attempted to redefine the word, I'll repear in bold what I stated: MONEY ACCENTUATES ONE'S CHARACTER, GOOD OR BAD. You can talk around that simple fact of life, but if Kap were not mature, or a selfish biceps kissing diva (I've read that many times here) the first place it would show up would be in these negotiations. He'd have either drug them out, sat out, or played out 2014 in hopes of a bigger deal in FN Tennessee or somewhere else in 2015.

And so it begins lol. The "told you, 49ers don't even trust him" mantra is born. Yes, he went from having "all the leverage" in a QB starved league to zero leverage, accepting scraps. Priceless! .

[kalibane]

You know what's funny about your counter arguments Future? You're whole position is that people are just speculating based on what they know from articles, twitter feeds etc. etc. But now you are speculating that Wilson doesn't do anymore than Luck and Kaepernick based on a complete absence of evidence. What's worse, you don't even seem to be cognizant of how specious your logic is. You are literrally profering and agrument based on nothing. Even if people are wrong about who Russell Wilson is, at least the argument in his favor is based on something.

It's like you're an attorney with a nullification argument. The evidence that does exist doesn't work in your argument's favor so you try to create the appearance that none of the evidence means anything. The irony is that you can't resist resting on pure nullification which is bad enough. You have to take it a step further with an even more specious ridiculously broad "money = characater" argument.

No one ignored your point about character or tried to redefine it. You are actually the one trying to hinge character all on the question of money which just isn't the truth no matter how well the phrase might fit on a T-Shirt. If we were to accept your argument as valid then in 2012 when Drew Brees didn't take a similar deal to the one Michael Vick took in 2011 after his career year, it's evidence that Michael Vick is of higher character than Brees is. It's an assanine point (cue the tantrum about talking down to you).

I'm also not backtracking off my position regarding Kaep and Wilson. I think the lamentations about Kaep are overblown but I also think it's pretty damn clear that Wilson is more mature than Kaep is from the way he carries himself both on and off the field. I swear you are like the little league parent that needs every kid to get a trophy. Guess what people aren't equal.

Immaturity doesn't have only certain places where it will show up. Immaturity and Greed often are present at the same time but the existance of one of those traits doesn't dictate that the other is present as well. Remember Ricky "I'll make up that money in endorsements" Williams? Oh yeah his rookie deal was super team friendly. He also decided he'd rather flake out on his team and go smoke weed for a year instead of playing football, a period of time in his life he himself attributes to immaturity. But you know according to you if he was immature he would have played hardball in negotiations and held out for as much money as he could.

Some of the most immature people I've known were also the most generous. You're trying to find causation that doesn't exist in what at best is a very tenuous correlation between two sepearate and individual traits. More to the point, I see no evidence that Kaep was being a team player. I see a guy accepting what the market made available to him with the belief that his talent will help him hit the escalators bringing the contract close to it's full value. The rub being that such belief could very well be overconfidence and/or not clearly recognizing one's own mortality/probability to be injured, something often considered a corrolary with youth and immaturity. Not my position on the matter, but the point is to show you just how thin the position you're taking is.

P.S. with all this talk about immaturity, let's be clear. I don't think Kaep is "immature" persay. I think he's acting the way a guy in his mid 20's acts and overall I don't have a problem with it. It's just Wilson seems to be of higher maturity than is typical for his age. This isn't a radical opinion or one held just by Seahawk fans. It's even an opinion that many 49er fans share. I'm not going to back off from acknowledging what's in front of my face simply because you want to complain every time someone says they think Russell Wilson is better in some regard than Kaep.

Besides what other explanation would you prefer for why Russell Wilson has been a better player (and yes he has been definitively better) than Kaepernick over the past two years?

[Anthony]

You know what's funny about your counter arguments Future? You're whole position is that people are just speculating based on what they know from articles, twitter feeds etc. etc. But now you are speculating that Wilson doesn't do anymore than Luck and Kaepernick based on a complete absence of evidence. What's worse, you don't even seem to be cognizant of how specious your logic is. You are literrally profering and agrument based on nothing. Even if people are wrong about who Russell Wilson is, at least the argument in his favor is based on something.

It's like you're an attorney with a nullification argument. The evidence that does exist doesn't work in your argument's favor so you try to create the appearance that none of the evidence means anything. The irony is that you can't resist resting on pure nullification which is bad enough. You have to take it a step further with an even more specious ridiculously broad "money = characater" argument.

No one ignored your point about character or tried to redefine it. You are actually the one trying to hinge character all on the question of money which just isn't the truth no matter how well the phrase might fit on a T-Shirt. If we were to accept your argument as valid then in 2012 when Drew Brees didn't take a similar deal to the one Michael Vick took in 2011 after his career year, it's evidence that Michael Vick is of higher character than Brees is. It's an assanine point (cue the tantrum about talking down to you).

I'm also not backtracking off my position regarding Kaep and Wilson. I think the lamentations about Kaep are overblown but I also think it's pretty damn clear that Wilson is more mature than Kaep is from the way he carries himself both on and off the field. I swear you are like the little league parent that needs every kid to get a trophy. Guess what people aren't equal.

Immaturity doesn't have only certain places where it will show up. Immaturity and Greed often are present at the same time but the existance of one of those traits doesn't dictate that the other is present as well. Remember Ricky "I'll make up that money in endorsements" Williams? Oh yeah his rookie deal was super team friendly. He also decided he'd rather flake out on his team and go smoke weed for a year instead of playing football, a period of time in his life he himself attributes to immaturity. But you know according to you if he was immature he would have played hardball in negotiations and held out for as much money as he could.

Some of the most immature people I've known were also the most generous. You're trying to find causation that doesn't exist in what at best is a very tenuous correlation between two sepearate and individual traits. More to the point, I see no evidence that Kaep was being a team player. I see a guy accepting what the market made available to him with the belief that his talent will help him hit the escalators bringing the contract close to it's full value. The rub being that such belief could very well be overconfidence and/or not clearly recognizing one's own mortality/probability to be injured, something often considered a corrolary with youth and immaturity. Not my position on the matter, but the point is to show you just how thin the position you're taking is.

P.S. with all this talk about immaturity, let's be clear. I don't think Kaep is "immature" persay. I think he's acting the way a guy in his mid 20's acts and overall I don't have a problem with it. It's just Wilson seems to be of higher maturity than is typical for his age. This isn't a radical opinion or one held just by Seahawk fans. It's even an opinion that many 49er fans share. I'm not going to back off from acknowledging what's in front of my face simply because you want to complain every time someone says they think Russell Wilson is better in some regard than Kaep.

Besides what other explanation would you prefer for why Russell Wilson has been a better player (and yes he has been definitively better) than Kaepernick over the past two years?

great post, spot on. Of course you realize the excuses for the last question are coming.

[HumanCockroach]

It isn't my article, and I had no real problem deciphering the cost/ hype attributed was the hype after two seasons ago, versus the production from last season ( ie Irvin was hyped coming off his rookie campaign and didn't perform up to that level, as did Richardson. While players like Austen and Manziel came in with a TON of hype). You don't see it? Fine, doesn't bother me in the least.

Kap contract, can be gotten out of easily, and I HAVE made numerous comments about how smart it is. I have to ask Future, WHY is it structured like that? If Kap is everything you profess him to be, it would NOT be necessary to make it performance based. Kap has a TON of hype, and indeed carries a TON of questions, and however you want to slice it hasn't performed up to that hype. Period. ( and they D discuss Welker's injuries, it was a reason the put him where he was) .

Over rated and Under rated were the parameters of the article, NOT hype, and it's subjective which is why just a few years ago a player like Alexander could make BOTH list voted on the players.You can get all up in arms about it, all I did was provide the article, and I did so, in this thread to give some groundwork for Kap, which is he was the 18th rated passer according to PFF.

Lol I am not up in arms about it. I just did not think ot was a good article. Actually, better put, it was a well written article that at least attempted to back its assertions with statistics. But in substance it made no sense to me. Another example was Gresham. I believe he is highly regarded for his athleticism, but no one over-estimates the player that he is. He creates matchup problems on a team with a bunch of other outstanding skill players. That's about all I've ever read or heard about him.

Yes, you are right. It was "over-rated" rather than hyped. I I must have had the Manziel critique on that article in my mind, wherein the author spoke of hype. To be fair, it would be much harder to write an article that forced you to choose an over-rated player from every team as opposed to picking a handful from the entire league. But in reality some teams may have zero over-rated players, and that fact was born out by some of the author's choices IMO.

Re: Kap. Lol you know why you posted that article on this thread. Don't go CP on me now . At this point I have read every possible criticism of Kaep on every football website imagineable. He lifts to many weights, knows only one read, selfish, immature and dumb. If you believe that I was angered by the latest criticism in that article, you are mistaken. I think he got a good contract for where he is at right now, and I love what he has done thus far. I think he is going to have a huge, 4,000 yd 30+ td yr in 2014.

I posted this article on this thread because it wasn't a "bash" Kaepernick article, it was indeed a "this might be why he took the type of contract he did" information. I certainly could have started an entirely new thread based on it, but I decided against it. I wasn't flaming you, and I wasn't trashing Kap ( in fact, look back through the thread and find where I have, be my guest). It is an article that eludes to why Kap is "over rated" ie he hasn't really proven much yet, I didn't see anywhere where they said he couldn't do something, and I have to this date, NEVER once posted he didn't have the talent to become great. The difference is, where you continue to argue he is ALREADY great on so many levels, I haven't seen anything on the field that makes me believe it to be true, and his ranking, production illustrates that point pretty clearly in my mind at least.Kap has a TON of hype surrounding him, EVERYONE, and I do mean EVERYONE sees the talent, but to date, while he has indeed put that talent on display from time to time, he HASN'T to date, been consistently good, and so you have a contract that FORCES him to either do so, or cost the team, relatively peanuts.

Obviously the TEAM sees it, other FANS see it, even PUNDITS see it, why you can't I have no idea. Kap can be great, he isn't right now, and there is NO way to know if he will be later.

[Futureite]

It isn't my article, and I had no real problem deciphering the cost/ hype attributed was the hype after two seasons ago, versus the production from last season ( ie Irvin was hyped coming off his rookie campaign and didn't perform up to that level, as did Richardson. While players like Austen and Manziel came in with a TON of hype). You don't see it? Fine, doesn't bother me in the least.

Kap contract, can be gotten out of easily, and I HAVE made numerous comments about how smart it is. I have to ask Future, WHY is it structured like that? If Kap is everything you profess him to be, it would NOT be necessary to make it performance based. Kap has a TON of hype, and indeed carries a TON of questions, and however you want to slice it hasn't performed up to that hype. Period. ( and they D discuss Welker's injuries, it was a reason the put him where he was) .

Over rated and Under rated were the parameters of the article, NOT hype, and it's subjective which is why just a few years ago a player like Alexander could make BOTH list voted on the players.You can get all up in arms about it, all I did was provide the article, and I did so, in this thread to give some groundwork for Kap, which is he was the 18th rated passer according to PFF.

Lol I am not up in arms about it. I just did not think ot was a good article. Actually, better put, it was a well written article that at least attempted to back its assertions with statistics. But in substance it made no sense to me. Another example was Gresham. I believe he is highly regarded for his athleticism, but no one over-estimates the player that he is. He creates matchup problems on a team with a bunch of other outstanding skill players. That's about all I've ever read or heard about him.

Yes, you are right. It was "over-rated" rather than hyped. I I must have had the Manziel critique on that article in my mind, wherein the author spoke of hype. To be fair, it would be much harder to write an article that forced you to choose an over-rated player from every team as opposed to picking a handful from the entire league. But in reality some teams may have zero over-rated players, and that fact was born out by some of the author's choices IMO.

Re: Kap. Lol you know why you posted that article on this thread. Don't go CP on me now . At this point I have read every possible criticism of Kaep on every football website imagineable. He lifts to many weights, knows only one read, selfish, immature and dumb. If you believe that I was angered by the latest criticism in that article, you are mistaken. I think he got a good contract for where he is at right now, and I love what he has done thus far. I think he is going to have a huge, 4,000 yd 30+ td yr in 2014.

I posted this article on this thread because it wasn't a "bash" Kaepernick article, it was indeed a "this might be why he took the type of contract he did" information. I certainly could have started an entirely new thread based on it, but I decided against it. I wasn't flaming you, and I wasn't trashing Kap ( in fact, look back through the thread and find where I have, be my guest). It is an article that eludes to why Kap is "over rated" ie he hasn't really proven much yet, I didn't see anywhere where they said he couldn't do something, and I have to this date, NEVER once posted he didn't have the talent to become great. The difference is, where you continue to argue he is ALREADY great on so many levels, I haven't seen anything on the field that makes me believe it to be true, and his ranking, production illustrates that point pretty clearly in my mind at least.Kap has a TON of hype surrounding him, EVERYONE, and I do mean EVERYONE sees the talent, but to date, while he has indeed put that talent on display from time to time, he HASN'T to date, been consistently good, and so you have a contract that FORCES him to either do so, or cost the team, relatively peanuts.

Obviously the TEAM sees it, other FANS see it, even PUNDITS see it, why you can't I have no idea. Kap can be great, he isn't right now, and there is NO way to know if he will be later.

You make some fair points. And to be accurate, I do not believe Kaep is great. I think the argument we usually get into is over his intangibles. I believe he has the intangibles that are necessary to be great, plenty of peoplw outside of SF (and some in our fanbase) do not believe he does. One thing that is clear to me is that he could have pushed for more money from the 49ers and barring a bad/mediocore season in 2014, he certainly would have received more from another team. This league is short on talented (if not fully developed QBs) and the consensus was that he'd receivw at least $18 mil elsewhere.

Now consider this: if Kaep does do what many people do not believe he 'can' and he hits all of his performance based escalators, reports state that he will only earn $17.5 mil/yr. Even if he is a top 3 QB, he will by very definition be underpaid. And he knew that when he signed the contact. In fact, he publicly stated at the onset of these negotiations that he wanted a deal that would allow the 49ers to continue to sifn quality players. People that have not yet recognized the team player and leader that he is should begin to.

And for the record, yes, you have been fair in your analysis of Kaep overall. I did recognize it.

[RiverDog]

Everyone under the sun expected - not speculated - but expected a minimum of $18 mil. That is a fact. It is born out through basic economics and free market demand. You are denying basic economics. Yes, people waited on the outcome of his contract as a barometer, because the SPECULATION was that he would get even more than $18 mil and in fact set a new ceiling of over $20 for young QBs similar to his skill set (Luck, Newton, Wilson).

Lol I am trying to present Wilson not to be the person he presents himself to be? No. What I've stated here over and over (and over . . . And over) is that he does not do anymore to prepare or "lead" than Andrew Luck, or Kaepernick or even Alex Smith. I don't know how more direct I can state that. He just talks about it WAY more than other QBs. You are trying to turn this around, as if your ebtire fanbase has not laid claim to the assertion that RW is more mature, studies harder and has a higher degree of character than Kap. You are the one backtracking, not me. I have never made the opposite argument in Kap's favor, nor did I assert that RW does not do the things he claims to.

Since you ignored my point regarding chracter or attempted to redefine the word, I'll repear in bold what I stated: MONEY ACCENTUATES ONE'S CHARACTER, GOOD OR BAD. You can talk around that simple fact of life, but if Kap were not mature, or a selfish biceps kissing diva (I've read that many times here) the first place it would show up would be in these negotiations. He'd have either drug them out, sat out, or played out 2014 in hopes of a bigger deal in FN Tennessee or somewhere else in 2015.

And so it begins lol. The "told you, 49ers don't even trust him" mantra is born. Yes, he went from having "all the leverage" in a QB starved league to zero leverage, accepting scraps. Priceless! .

What's the difference between the words "speculated" and "expected"? They both are used to describe the anticipation of an outcome of a certain event, do they not?

How do you know that RW doesn't do anymore to prepare than does Luck, Kaepernick, or Smith? At least we have multiple reports from a variety of sources that trumpet RW's preparation habits which are characterized as extraordinary or unparalleled whereas I don't see reports using the similar superlatives outside of the standard descriptions about the preparation habits of the other three you mentioned.

[Futureite]

Everyone under the sun expected - not speculated - but expected a minimum of $18 mil. That is a fact. It is born out through basic economics and free market demand. You are denying basic economics. Yes, people waited on the outcome of his contract as a barometer, because the SPECULATION was that he would get even more than $18 mil and in fact set a new ceiling of over $20 for young QBs similar to his skill set (Luck, Newton, Wilson).

Lol I am trying to present Wilson not to be the person he presents himself to be? No. What I've stated here over and over (and over . . . And over) is that he does not do anymore to prepare or "lead" than Andrew Luck, or Kaepernick or even Alex Smith. I don't know how more direct I can state that. He just talks about it WAY more than other QBs. You are trying to turn this around, as if your ebtire fanbase has not laid claim to the assertion that RW is more mature, studies harder and has a higher degree of character than Kap. You are the one backtracking, not me. I have never made the opposite argument in Kap's favor, nor did I assert that RW does not do the things he claims to.

Since you ignored my point regarding chracter or attempted to redefine the word, I'll repear in bold what I stated: MONEY ACCENTUATES ONE'S CHARACTER, GOOD OR BAD. You can talk around that simple fact of life, but if Kap were not mature, or a selfish biceps kissing diva (I've read that many times here) the first place it would show up would be in these negotiations. He'd have either drug them out, sat out, or played out 2014 in hopes of a bigger deal in FN Tennessee or somewhere else in 2015.

And so it begins lol. The "told you, 49ers don't even trust him" mantra is born. Yes, he went from having "all the leverage" in a QB starved league to zero leverage, accepting scraps. Priceless! .

What's the difference between the words "speculated" and "expected"? They both are used to describe the anticipation of an outcome of a certain event, do they not?

How do you know that RW doesn't do anymore to prepare than does Luck, Kaepernick, or Smith? At least we have multiple reports from a variety of sources that trumpet RW's preparation habits which are characterized as extraordinary or unparalleled whereas I don't see reports using the similar superlatives outside of the standard descriptions about the preparation habits of the other three you mentioned.

Alex's preparation was always hailed as extraordinary. You must have forgotten that he learned his 6th new system in 2011 and actually took JH's playbook during the lockout and taught it to the entire 49er O in "camp Alex" with no coaches onhand. The kid graduated with honors in 2.5 yrs. He also regularly won the 49ers' offseason physical challenges. I mean, give me a break RD. Those are facts, not recounts from other people.

[Futureite]

And I missed the first question. Speculation: to formulate a theory based on conjecture without firm evidence. People were merely guessing, or "speculating" that Kaep would comnand more than $20 mil; that he would raise the pay floor for so called 2nd tier QBs. There was no prior evidence to suggest that would happen though. On the otherhand, people did "expect" him to sign for $18 min, as there were relative comparables out there already making that (Cutler, Romo).