The Rams - Not the 49er's -Will be our Toughest Division Foe

[c_hawkbob]

K. You crazy!

[HumanCockroach]

Call me crazy but I picked Cards. SF has all the pressure on them. It's SB or bust with a coach that doesn't get along with the higher ups. Key players aging. Haven't seen anything on offense that supposedly has improved. Yes it's preseason. But 3 points total thus far should worry them. New stadium pressure will only add to the fire. The fans will be out for blood if they experience any series of losses. Lots of potential for implosion. Cards have nowhere to go but up.

Rams offense just won't cut the mustard. If Bradford does finally have the year he was drafted to do, then good for them. But just don't see it happening.

If you are going with the injury/suspension/FA ravaged Cards at this point? You're crazy. Two months ago maybe not, but now? Yeah. That team lost what made it special in the matter of a month. Just don't see any way for them to stay competitive in this division. Thinking 6-10 or 7-9 type record.

[FolkCrusader]

I agree it looks rough for the Cards, but one of the beauties of football is that you never know who might step up. One thing is for certain though, you are going to need a great D to compete in this division.

[savvyman]

Glad I bumped this. A lot of comments since I ressurected this thread from the dead.

[Futureite]

It surprises me a bit that you don't think that Harbaugh would be interested in Pryor to be honest, every time time I see him play I immediately think of year one Kaepernick, I would think that Harbaugh if he is the "Quarterback whisperer" we've been lead to believe might indeed be interested in a QB with similar traits and abilities to the one that he has tied his wagon to for the forseable future and spent a second round draft pick initially to attain for pretty much nothing.

Doesn't bother me that you don't think he will be or anything, just thought that was an odd statement.

Lol except that Pryor has none of Kaep's traits. His arm strength is not NFL quality. Didn't score too high on the Wonderlic.He did not test out high in accuracy drills in the combine; Kaep did extremely well in all 3.

Why stop at Pryor HC. Why not go for the full "ba bing bang ching" drum roll and suggest we pick up Tebow. You really sold yourself short on this post .

I disagree on Cards too. They have enough weapons on O to sustain a fairly high level of play. Like Hawks and Ninrrs, they have developed a system and an identity on D too. Minter and possibly even Sopoaga could fit in well as plug and play players. They are still a good ball club.

[kalibane]

Future where do you get this stuff? Pryor's arm is not NFL quality? Quotes from scouting reports prior to the supplemental draft:

We don’t have verified measurables on Pryor but he is about the same size as Cam Newton (6-5 and 245 pounds) and may be a little better athlete. He has speed, quick feet and outstanding body control to go along with very good strength. He has outstanding arm strength and can throw a tight, catchable ball. Unlike many of the “spread” formation quarterbacks, Pryor has played a number of plays from under center. It could be as much as 30–40 percent of the Ohio State offense, so playing from under center will not be a skill that he will have to learn when he makes the jump to the NFL.

Pryor has all the arm strength necessary to make every NFL throw. Pryor also has more than enough arm strength to hit his receivers in stride 50 yards or more down the field without putting a tremendous amount of air under the football. He has also displayed the ability to connect on the 15 yard out.

There are a ton of things you could easily use to pick Pryor apart with but instead you choose to just completely make something up showing that you've never paid attention to him on the field or even bothered to read about him. Then you wonder why people give you crap. I'm really starting to wonder how much football you watch or if you just read comments from ProFootball talk.

It's especially ironic coming from a 49er fan since Pryor's arm is definitively stronger than every starting QB (not named Kaepernick) the 49ers have had going back to at least Montana (not familiar with how strong Brodie's arm was).

[HumanCockroach]

It surprises me a bit that you don't think that Harbaugh would be interested in Pryor to be honest, every time time I see him play I immediately think of year one Kaepernick, I would think that Harbaugh if he is the "Quarterback whisperer" we've been lead to believe might indeed be interested in a QB with similar traits and abilities to the one that he has tied his wagon to for the forseable future and spent a second round draft pick initially to attain for pretty much nothing.

Doesn't bother me that you don't think he will be or anything, just thought that was an odd statement.

Lol except that Pryor has none of Kaep's traits. His arm strength is not NFL quality. Didn't score too high on the Wonderlic.He did not test out high in accuracy drills in the combine; Kaep did extremely well in all 3.

Why stop at Pryor HC. Why not go for the full "ba bing bang ching" drum roll and suggest we pick up Tebow. You really sold yourself short on this post .

I disagree on Cards too. They have enough weapons on O to sustain a fairly high level of play. Like Hawks and Ninrrs, they have developed a system and an identity on D too. Minter and possibly even Sopoaga could fit in well as plug and play players. They are still a good ball club.

I don't feel bad comparing the two mobile,strong arm QB. I made the comparison a week ago, Clayton ( a dude that is PAID to analyse the NFL ) couple days after me. Since I'm blind, in my assessment ( which makes little sense, as it is fairly accurate, and it isn't like I said the two were comparable NOW for Christ's sake) I can at least take solace that MULTIPLE NFL scouts,and experts view him similiarily .

[HumanCockroach]

http://www.sbnation.com/2011/8/21/23764 ... ing-report

I was going to paste two seperate links for the two qb's but since this uses Kaepernik AS it's comparison ( kind of like I did, with the whole he reminds me of Kaepernik in.year one thing) I'll just leave this here to help you figure it out.

"Final word: A lightning rod of a prospect, Pryor's pro position remains in question even after three years at quarterback. His numbers improved markedly in 2010, but some his top games were against Ohio, Eastern Michigan and Indiana. The measuring stick for Pryor should be former Nevada quarterback Colin Kaepernick, a second-round pick this year. Both are big, angular signal callers with strong arms, athleticism and questionable mechanics. The biggest difference between the two seems to be character and work ethic. By all accounts, Pryor lacks both and has thus far gotten by on his immense natural ability.
"

[Futureite]

Future where do you get this stuff? Pryor's arm is not NFL quality? Quotes from scouting reports prior to the supplemental draft:

We don’t have verified measurables on Pryor but he is about the same size as Cam Newton (6-5 and 245 pounds) and may be a little better athlete. He has speed, quick feet and outstanding body control to go along with very good strength. He has outstanding arm strength and can throw a tight, catchable ball. Unlike many of the “spread” formation quarterbacks, Pryor has played a number of plays from under center. It could be as much as 30–40 percent of the Ohio State offense, so playing from under center will not be a skill that he will have to learn when he makes the jump to the NFL.

Pryor has all the arm strength necessary to make every NFL throw. Pryor also has more than enough arm strength to hit his receivers in stride 50 yards or more down the field without putting a tremendous amount of air under the football. He has also displayed the ability to connect on the 15 yard out.

There are a ton of things you could easily use to pick Pryor apart with but instead you choose to just completely make something up showing that you've never paid attention to him on the field or even bothered to read about him. Then you wonder why people give you crap. I'm really starting to wonder how much football you watch or if you just read comments from ProFootball talk.

Lol!! Lighten up bro. I am bout to go in my 5 mi jog. Maybe you should try it. Mornings are the best; get that metabolism going. Haha then I will be back on the blog afterwards arguing like a maniac.

Yes, I admit I screwed up with that one particular knock on Pryor. OK, I concede that. Maybe I had Vince Young in my mind when I posted it. Or maybe I just screwed up. Pryor still posted a terrible Wonderlic and was wildly innacurate in his private workouts with no one even covering his receivers. My general point was that he is not comparable to Kaep in the most important measures, eg playing QB. See the difference between you and I is that I will admit I am wrong, readily. I have not once ever seen you display any sort of humility or introspective thought here.

I guess we can say the same thing for the BJ Daniels RW comparisons. I mean they're about the same height, same athletic ability and both were "winners" in college who put up good numbers playing the same brand of football. The Seahawks were "all over him" the minute we put him on the practice squad as HC stated in reference to the Niner's potential desire to aquire Pryor, and putting two and two together it's not hard to see why he made that comment in a recent post. If your team did it for a crap semi-clone of it's own QB, the 49ers better do it too with a crap semi-clone of their starting QB. Let's just one up each other forever, on every possible point.

[kalibane]

That makes no sense Future. You live in Northern California and somehow you missed how strong the arm of the Oakland Raiders QB was and managed to confuse him with a QB that isn't in the NFL anymore? Not to mention Vince Young has an NFL caliber arm anyway. It's not as strong as Pryor's but markedly stronger than guys like Steve Young and Hass, probably on the level of Peyton, pre neck surgery.

No one is debating that Pryor is the equivalent of Kapernick but the are in fact the same type of QB. Big, Mobile, Strong armed and raw coming out of college. Kaep is more intelligent and was harder working than Pryor coming out of college but the primary difference between them is Pryor never received proper coaching. Seattle is the first place he's been in his football career where he has good coaches to work with.

It would be only logical for Pryor to be a back up to Kaep because he is a poor man's Kaep and the coaching staff wouldn't have to rejigger the offense they way they will if Gabbert has to play. It probably won't happen because why would you bring in a project QB this late and expect him to pick up the offense to the point you were comfortable handing him the ball and keeping the ship afloat. But it makes complete sense if the timing isn't off.

[rottweiler]

I like the Rams a lot - especially with the recent draft upgrades.

I think that the 49er's will not be the Hawks biggest threat next year for the division title - I believe the toughest competition will come from the Rams.

What do you think?

I think you're prolly wishin' you'd never said ^ that ^.

[savvyman]

I like the Rams a lot - especially with the recent draft upgrades.

I think that the 49er's will not be the Hawks biggest threat next year for the division title - I believe the toughest competition will come from the Rams.

What do you think?

I think you're prolly wishin' you'd never said ^ that ^.

No because when I said it Bradford was projected to return as starting Quarterback.

Obviously because of recent events this weekend, I feel less optimistic on the Rams chances.

Still there are many excellent players remaining on a very young Rams team. I expect Fisher to rally his troops and prepare them to fight the other team each week - - in the same manner as how the Rams played towards the end of last season.

[Rambo2014]

Seahawks have two good backups. I am thinking one may end up with the Rams!

[HumanCockroach]

More than welcome to Pryor, couple other guys will be available as well ( ponder, McCoy etc) so there will be a former starter available to back up Hill on the market, that said, most flamed out, so I wouldn't recommend pinning to many hopes on them.

[Zorn76]

The Rams are now on the clock...

[NorthHawk]

Why would they go after Pryor when Foles and as PFT suggests Sanchez are available?

[Zorn76]

Foles? Is there another one besides the guy starting for the Eagles?

Anyhow, the options are garbage for the Rams.

Sanchez? He'd guarantee them the #1 pick next spring.

Pryor is junk, also.

Stl is sunk. I don't think they would be anything more than a 7-8 win team even with Bradford, but they're toast.

[wait_a_sec]

With the injury bug hitting Rams & Cards. And SF looking terrible (yes, I know - PRESEASON!) the division is looking like ours to lose. Just pray we don't lose any key players ourselves. Knock on wood.

How bout some Kaepernick highlights from yesterdays game against San Diego?
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights

[NorthHawk]

Foles? Is there another one besides the guy starting for the Eagles?

Anyhow, the options are garbage for the Rams.

Sanchez? He'd guarantee them the #1 pick next spring.

Pryor is junk, also.

Stl is sunk. I don't think they would be anything more than a 7-8 win team even with Bradford, but they're toast.

My apologies, I meant Cousins from Washington, not Foles as they have 2 young QBs both capable of starting.
PFT says the Rams had interest in Sanchez earlier this year, for what it's worth.

[Oly]

Without Bradford, I can't see the Rams being our toughest foe. Similar QB questions in Arizona also make me less likely to see them challenging for the division crown. Don't get me wrong, I think they each are solid teams, and ones that the Hawks better not look past, but they're not better than the 49ers, IMO.

With the Smiths questions in SF, and with the poor play of the offense that I've seen (pre-season grains of salt, of course), I don't see the 49ers as the second best team in the NFL now, which I think they were last year. I think they are still a wild card team good for 10 wins, but I think they have some serious question marks right now to challenge for the division. They'd still win most divisions in the league, though.

[depaashaas]

With the injury bug hitting Rams & Cards. And SF looking terrible (yes, I know - PRESEASON!) the division is looking like ours to lose. Just pray we don't lose any key players ourselves. Knock on wood.

How bout some Kaepernick highlights from yesterdays game against San Diego?
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights

Yep all it is, is preseason but 9rs look just flat out horrible but if it is any indication it looks like the division will be between Hawks and cards

Great highlights, I wish I could set them as my screen saver

[NorthHawk]

Maybe Bradford isn't as good as we think and Hill will make less mistakes.
After all, they were paying Bradford a lot of money and had to justify his contract. As well he really hasn't had a chance to show his abilities over the course of a full season because of his injuries.
Maybe Hill will be better for them and play like McCown did in Chicago last year.

[HumanCockroach]

What Mccown did last season is the exception, not the rule. Also last I checked, there was no Forte, Jeffries or Marshall currently playing in St. Louis. If Bradford was worse than Hill, I doubt he would have entered the season as the in questioned starter.The odds that Hill turns into that type of player is about as solid as Clemmons doing it last year. Not a realistic hope at this point. He's an OK back up who has kicked around the league and never excelled at any of his stops, thinking he will in St. Louis based on an anomaly seems off the mark ( to me at least).

[NorthHawk]

What Mccown did last season is the exception, not the rule. Also last I checked, there was no Forte, Jeffries or Marshall currently playing in St. Louis. If Bradford was worse than Hill, I doubt he would have entered the season as the in questioned starter.The odds that Hill turns into that type of player is about as solid as Clemmons doing it last year. Not a realistic hope at this point. He's an OK back up who has kicked around the league and never excelled at any of his stops, thinking he will in St. Louis based on an anomaly seems off the mark ( to me at least).

The odds are against him, but these things do happen. They even go to Super Bowls upon occasion.
St. Louis could have a great Defense - maybe the best front 4 if not front 7 and look how well we did when Russell was taking baby steps.
As long as their Defense keeps them in the game they have a chance to do real damage to any team they face.

[Hawktawk]

I remember Shaun Hill coming into Seattle with the 9ers to face the defending NFC West champs in the 2008 season opener. He was very solid and outplayed Hasslebeck in a 9ers win. He can play. He is not as mobile as Clemmens was backing up Bradford last year. We will see.........

[Zorn76]

The Rams do have a good defense.

Problem is, they could be on the field for 35 min a game or so, if that offense can't produce. The have a good RB in Stacy but no much else in terms of legit playmakers on that side of the ball.

[FolkCrusader]

I remember Shaun Hill coming into Seattle with the 9ers to face the defending NFC West champs in the 2008 season opener. He was very solid and outplayed Hasslebeck in a 9ers win. He can play. He is not as mobile as Clemmens was backing up Bradford last year. We will see.........

Hill is 34 years old an hasn't started a game in 5 seasons. He was reasonably mobile, 5 seasons ago. What he can do now is anyone's guess but my guess is he's gonna look like a 34 yo back up that hasn't started a game in 5 seasons. If the lambs rely on Hill for the season they are throwing that beautifully built defense on to the fire. One, he'll never make it 16 games. He'll get splattered once or twice and his wife will remind him that he is making all of $1.25 million for the season. And two, I just don't think a young offense will follow him. When he did play his accuracy dropped off considerably after 10 yards. Both Britt and Quick are looking to make some noise this year. If all they are getting is splattered over the middle things are going to go south fast.

Fisher won't say it, but if they want to compete they must find a signal caller with more upside. Maybe they think they have that in one of their young guys and they plan to have Hill hold down the fort for 4-5 games while they coach the guy up. My guess is they are all hands on deck evaluating QBs that will be available in the upcoming cuts and are identifying trade possibilities as well. If he doesn't act in some significant way it will all be on his head.

[NorthHawk]

Any QB they sign will take a few weeks to understand the playbook.
They could strip it down quite a bit, but that would handcuff the Offense even more than a backup would.
It'll be interesting to see what they do.

[burrrton]

He'll get splattered once or twice and his wife will remind him that he is making all of $1.25 million for the season.

$1.25M is more than most of us will make in 2 decades of work- are you presenting that salary as rationale for quitting??

[HumanCockroach]

Any QB they sign will take a few weeks to understand the playbook.
They could strip it down quite a bit, but that would handcuff the Offense even more than a backup would.
It'll be interesting to see what they do.

Maybe, though there always seems to be a player that has had that same offensive coordinator floating around and available when things like this occur ( at least in a general sense).

[rottweiler]

I like the Rams a lot - especially with the recent draft upgrades.

I think that the 49er's will not be the Hawks biggest threat next year for the division title - I believe the toughest competition will come from the Rams.

What do you think?

I think you're prolly wishin' you'd never said ^ that ^.

No because when I said it Bradford was projected to return as starting Quarterback.

Obviously because of recent events this weekend, I feel less optimistic on the Rams chances.

Still there are many excellent players remaining on a very young Rams team. I expect Fisher to rally his troops and prepare them to fight the other team each week - - in the same manner as how the Rams played towards the end of last season.

You know me. Was just f'n witcha, bro.

I voted the Cardinals in your poll, though, myself, because they closed out the 2013 season so well, and I think they're gonna surprise some folks this year.

[HumanCockroach]

I don't see Arizona being able to win games with their defense this year, so unless that offense takes a monumental step forward, I really don't see Arizona as anything more than an eight or nine win team. Could be wrong, just don't see it, they have basically lost half of that front seven that kept them in games, and allowed them to win games where the offense was woefully outplayed......

[rottweiler]

I don't see Arizona being able to win games with their defense this year, so unless that offense takes a monumental step forward, I really don't see Arizona as anything more than an eight or nine win team. Could be wrong, just don't see it, they have basically lost half of that front seven that kept them in games, and allowed them to win games where the offense was woefully outplayed......

Prolly so, yeah, bro.

I guess I maybe just wanted to be different.

[Futureite]

That makes no sense Future. You live in Northern California and somehow you missed how strong the arm of the Oakland Raiders QB was and managed to confuse him with a QB that isn't in the NFL anymore? Not to mention Vince Young has an NFL caliber arm anyway. It's not as strong as Pryor's but markedly stronger than guys like Steve Young and Hass, probably on the level of Peyton, pre neck surgery.

No one is debating that Pryor is the equivalent of Kapernick but the are in fact the same type of QB. Big, Mobile, Strong armed and raw coming out of college. Kaep is more intelligent and was harder working than Pryor coming out of college but the primary difference between them is Pryor never received proper coaching. Seattle is the first place he's been in his football career where he has good coaches to work with.

It would be only logical for Pryor to be a back up to Kaep because he is a poor man's Kaep and the coaching staff wouldn't have to rejigger the offense they way they will if Gabbert has to play. It probably won't happen because why would you bring in a project QB this late and expect him to pick up the offense to the point you were comfortable handing him the ball and keeping the ship afloat. But it makes complete sense if the timing isn't off.

Let's cut the bullshit. HC meant it as an dig. He has a mini orgasm everytime he cuts down a Niner player or someone from my area. Kinda like an Ozarks complex. No different than if I said "Seneca Wallace is coming out of retirement. You know Carroll will be alll over that".

See, that's the problem. You don't get it. They would have to "rejigger" the offense for Pryor. The staff already showed you what they wanted by signing Gabbert and not making a play for Pryor. They want a big strong armed guy with a gun to deal from the pocket. That is in fact why they drafted Kaep and ultimately what they expect out of him.

You'd like to believe the opposite; that our O is geared for a running QB with limited skills. Geared for a guy like Pryor, or a Pat White type. Although JH has always favored an athletic QB who has multiple skills, he is not looking for a glorified option QB dude. Andrew Luck comes to mind as a JH prototype. So does Rich Gannon. Competitive, highly intelligent athletic guys that can throw on the run. This doesn't even begin to describe Pryor's skillset and your harping in the one error that I made doesn't change the substance of this disagreement even slightly.

Pryor couldn't even begin to operate our O. He still doesn't even set his feet half the time. And I don't care if he can throw a ball 110 yds in a competition. His arm is s***. His accuracy on the deep, downfield throws that Kaep is asked to make is terrible. Good luck on finding that "right coaching" to correct all that.

By your logic the Hawks may as well start Turbin. Same measureables as Lynch, right? Same thing. Just teach him.how to be really good.

[NorthHawk]

Seattle wants to run the same philosophical Offense of a strong run game and a QB passing from the pocket.
The problem is up to this point our OL hasn't permitted Wilson to do so whereas the 49ers have an OL that up to this point has for the most part allowed the QB to play that way.
Pryor hasn't had that luxury in either Oakland or here with the 2nd or 3rd team Offense, so that's at least for me why I see a good comparison. As well, Pryor hasn't had the good QB coaching that either Wilson or Kaepernick have so his learning curve is pretty steep. Physically he has similar height to Kaep, can run real well like Kaep, has a gun like Kaep, but is lacking the fundamentals of playing QB or it appears the mental game at this point, but the potential is huge.
I think that's why Pete is intrigued and why some of us think Harbaugh would be too.

[kalibane]

Harbaugh fixed Kaep didn't he? You act like Kaep was a finished product coming out of college.

He played out of the Pistol in Nevada which is designed to take advantage of a QB's running ability. Kaep didn't have proper footwork when he came out of school. He didn't know how to drop back. Harbaugh spent a season and a half coaching him up. But some how you don't think he could coach Pryor who has the same skill set?

I don't care whether HC referenced Pryor as a dig (and for the record I disagree with your assessment, and think you are reaching with your hyper-sensitive ass), it's not a dig to me it's a natural comparison. Pryor is not Pat White. And if you think they are similar it shows exactly how flawed your assessment tools are.

Bottomline, comparing Pryor's skill set to Kaepernick's is not an insult. They are both unbelievable atheltic specimens. Both have every physical tool you could want in a QB. What you need to do is stop trying to read between the lines of what people are typing because you are horrible at it. I never said nor did I mean that the 49ers offense is designed to have the QB run. Neither is the Seahawks. They didn't change the package when Pryor came on to a bunch of designed runs. They had him dropping back. I wasn't suggesting that SF would be any different, but clearly Harbaugh (as you said) likes an atheltic QB. Pryor fits that mold, he's just raw. You don't want Pryor? Fine... I'm happy with that because I think if Harbaugh invested time in him he could be a very dangerous player. Gabbert, not so much.

As for your evaluation of his footwork and his deep ball accuracy being so bad that it's uncorrectable. How am I supposed to even take that seriously? You expect me to believe you have examined Pryor with enough detail to breakdown his footwork and his accuracy on specific types of throws but somehow missed the easiest thing to evaluate, arm strength? A 10 year old can tell who throws the ball harder. STOP TALKING OUT OF YOUR ASS. Then on top of that you cite Rich Gannon as a Harbaugh prototype. Rich Gannon's biggest weakness BY FAR was arm strength. Now I'm not saying that Harbaugh wouldn't like Rich Gannon but make up your mind, is arm strength important or isn't it?

You obviously haven't spent any time looking at Pryor so just stop pretending you have. You are completely typing out the side of your mouth. The sad thing is if the Seahawks had Gabbert and the 49ers had Pryor, your position would be completely reversed.

P.S. I don't object to comparing Turbin to Lynch. It's a completely flawed analogy because RB is an instinctual position and you can't really "teach" a RB when and where to make his cuts the way you can "teach" a QB footwork, proper throwing mechanics or going through progressions. But I do think Turbin and Lynch have similar skill sets. It doesn't bother me in the slightest and it doesn't diminish Lynch's value in any way just because Turbin isn't as good as Lynch.

You need to get a grip and stop looking for implied insults to your precious QB. When I want to be critical of him I will be direct about.

[HumanCockroach]

You're 100% wrong Future, I meant it as an option And have said so to more than just you, interestingly enough they have the ability to recognise the similiarities. I'm not the one that jumps into completely irrelevant topics to bash specific players, have steadfastly said the Niners are the biggest challenge for Seattle in this division, was one of the few posters that said Kap was the better QB before he got the job over Alex, called their SB appearance.

So in short, this is now the third or fourth time you have tried to claim I posted something I haven't, claimed I meant something I didn't, and I'm getting pretty F@#king tired of it. I WAS Actually attempting to give a reasoned,rationale option to yo Gabba Gabbert, and saw something that I thought would interest your COACH. Surprise, surprise when I discovered that the scouts and experts had ALREADY made the same comparison when he was drafted.

[RiverDog]

P.S. I don't object to comparing Turbin to Lynch. It's a completely flawed analogy because RB is an instinctual position and you can't really "teach" a RB when and where to make his cuts the way you can "teach" a QB footwork, proper throwing mechanics or going through progressions.

I don't mean to horn in on this discussion or change the subject, but that line caught my eye. It is extremely difficult to "teach" a quarterback proper throwing mechanics, at least at the NFL level. Tim Tebow is a prime example, as coaches for 7 years tried to change his wind up style as they knew it wasn't going to be good enough to succeed in the NFL. By the time you are in your 20's, your body is done growing and muscle memory is pretty much developed and extremely difficult to alter. I seem to remember Mike Holmgren, himself a pretty decent QB guru, talking about the challenges of changing a quarterback's throwing motion by the time they get to the pros. It's an attribute that they must have when they are drafted.

I don't know much about coaching up footwork. I haven't heard anyone comment about it as much as I have about altering throwing mechanics.

Agreed about running style. It seems to me that it is pure instinct and difficult if not impossible to coach up.

Once again, sorry for changing the subject, but I couldn't let that one pass.

[Futureite]

P.S. I don't object to comparing Turbin to Lynch. It's a completely flawed analogy because RB is an instinctual position and you can't really "teach" a RB when and where to make his cuts the way you can "teach" a QB footwork, proper throwing mechanics or going through progressions.

I don't mean to horn in on this discussion or change the subject, but that line caught my eye. It is extremely difficult to "teach" a quarterback proper throwing mechanics, at least at the NFL level. Tim Tebow is a prime example, as coaches for 7 years tried to change his wind up style as they knew it wasn't going to be good enough to succeed in the NFL. By the time you are in your 20's, your body is done growing and muscle memory is pretty much developed and extremely difficult to alter. I seem to remember Mike Holmgren, himself a pretty decent QB guru, talking about the challenges of changing a quarterback's throwing motion by the time they get to the pros. It's an attribute that they must have when they are drafted.

I don't know much about coaching up footwork. I haven't heard anyone comment about it as much as I have about altering throwing mechanics.

Agreed about running style. It seems to me that it is pure instinct and difficult if not impossible to coach up.

Once again, sorry for changing the subject, but I couldn't let that one pass.

You can alter throwing mechanics to a point, but the degree to which it is necessary is debateable. JH's theory is allow the QB to throw in his natural motion with tweaks here and there. I've heard him discuss this. He belueves that there are many different styles of throwing, but the most important thing is whether the ball gets to the receiver accurately. Accuracy can be improved with better mechanics, but a lot of it is innate.

Pryor is not an accurate QB. His motion (IMO) and release is not good. He tested out terribly in noncontact accuracy drills. Colin tested great. In fact, look up the "sports science" testing of Colin's reaction time/accuracy. The first thing that JH did upon meeting with him was to go out and throw with him to watch his mechanics, accuracy etc. One may counter by quouting his regular season completion %, but there are obvioudly factors that effect that. Right now we are discussing basic skillset.

Colin fits JH's mold of a well rounded athlete. He was an all-state basketball player and a MLB prospect as a pitcher. Pryor on the otherhand is a track guy with amazing raw physical gifts. There are obvious differences between the two by this measure that do not need to be stated.

Put what you will into the Wonderlic, but Colin scored a 37 while multiple reports have Pryor scoring as low as 20's/teens.

These guys are similar only in the very basic dumbed down analysis. One is competitive, extremely intelligent well rounded athlete, and the other (Pryor) is a raw physical specimen that has well documented problems throwing a football to uncovered guys wearing t-shirts. They aren't very similar, at all.

Back to mechanics. In highschool I could throw a ball 65 yds. I was very accurate with a compact, whip like motion I developed ftom mimicing my idol l John Elway. My junior yr an idiot QB coach came and forced me to alter my mechanics, releasing the ball over the top with thumb rotated downward as opposed to up as I naturslly threw. Within 1 month I had lost a good 35% of the velosity on my throws, most of the accuracy, and shortly after injured a ligament in my elbow. To this day I cannot fully extend my arm when I throw anything. Bottom line, unless you are a Tebow type, mechanics get way too much attention.

[NorthHawk]

Mechanics = accuracy.
If you have bad mechanics, you will probably be inaccurate.
Footwork and weight transfer is critical - that's why most QBs have trouble throwing on the run - or are at least less accurate.
The problem of anticipation and timing is something I don't think can be learned. It seems to me it's one of those innate things that you either have or don't.