Your Grade for the Front Office - So Far

[HumanCockroach]

I just can't believe that of all the FA OL not one would be a possible upgrade to an average at best Seahawks OL.

I was unaware that free agency and that the draft have come and gone. Must have been celebrating to much. Oh well that means next week is the first pre season game right? Who do the Hawks play?

[Anthony]

I just can't believe that of all the FA OL not one would be a possible upgrade to an average at best Seahawks OL.

I was unaware that free agency and that the draft have come and gone. Must have been celebrating to much. Oh well that means next week is the first pre season game right? Who do the Hawks play?

It has not but to date we have done nothing, not even invited anyone to visit and that is concerning.

[Vegaseahawk]

I may have missed a name or 2, but here are the OL signings in the FA market so far: Kevin Boothe (re-signed), Zach Strief- (re-signed), Charlie Johnson (re-signed), Guy Whimper (re-signed), Oniel Cousins, Evan Dietrich Smith, Shelly Smith, Anthony Collins, & Chris Williams have been signed. Thats 9 players. 4 of these signings are players who re-signed with their teams, which indicates that they had no plans to test the market, so that leaves only 5 who have switched teams in FA. I'm not that sharp on where these linemen stand talent wise, but I Don't see a lot of household names out there. Give the brain trust some time. I'm sure they have a plan in place to address the teams needs on the OL. My guess is that they will sign a FA or 2, & employ the next man up theory as well as replace those who get promoted via the draft. In PC & JS we trust.

[Anthony]

I may have missed a name or 2, but here are the OL signings in the FA market so far: Kevin Boothe (re-signed), Zach Strief- (re-signed), Charlie Johnson (re-signed), Guy Whimper (re-signed), Oniel Cousins, Evan Dietrich Smith, Shelly Smith, Anthony Collins, & Chris Williams have been signed. Thats 9 players. 4 of these signings are players who re-signed with their teams, which indicates that they had no plans to test the market, so that leaves only 5 who have switched teams in FA. I'm not that sharp on where these linemen stand talent wise, but I Don't see a lot of household names out there. Give the brain trust some time. I'm sure they have a plan in place to address the teams needs on the OL. My guess is that they will sign a FA or 2, & employ the next man up theory as well as replace those who get promoted via the draft. In PC & JS we trust.

Great but my point still stands it is concerning.

[HumanCockroach]

I just can't believe that of all the FA OL not one would be a possible upgrade to an average at best Seahawks OL.

I was unaware that free agency and that the draft have come and gone. Must have been celebrating to much. Oh well that means next week is the first pre season game right? Who do the Hawks play?

It has not but to date we have done nothing, not even invited anyone to visit and that is concerning.

http://www.seahawks.com/news/press/arti ... d2c056348a

Oops...

[Vegaseahawk]

I just can't believe that of all the FA OL not one would be a possible upgrade to an average at best Seahawks OL.

My thinking is that price comes into play here as well. It may be that in fact no, there's nobody available in FA to fill the need(s) at the price the Seahawks are willing to pay. Don't most of these FA linemen come with a price tag that the FO deems unfit for their purposes? Change for change's sake alone is wasted energy. After all, the idea is to improve, right? Name me some names of people out there that would be an improvement, a good fit in our system, & not overpriced. I can't think of any.

[HumanCockroach]

Cue the litany of bandaid solutions, and lamenting of either magical missed line talent, or lack of quantity of line picks....again......

[Vegaseahawk]

By the way, as for grading the FO, I give them a B- at this early stage of the game, mostly for letting Tate walk, although that's emotional attachment. I felt the same way about Burleson when he went to Detroit too. I got over that, & I'll get over this as well. From a business standpoint, I see the reasoning behind it. Truthfully, given a choice between Baldwin & Tate, I'd choose Baldwin. I see the need for a taller, bigger bodied WR, & I think they'll address that issue in the draft, rather than free agency.
They took too long to sign Haushka. But then again, it's all part of the game. Why trip over yourself scrambling to hook him up like a nerd on a date with the prom queen? That type of behavior tips your hand, & places your negotiating stance at a disadvantage, doesn't it?

[Anthony]

http://www.seahawks.com/news/press/arti ... d2c056348a

Oops...

wow that was before free agency so my point still stands

[HumanCockroach]

http://www.seahawks.com/news/press/arti ... d2c056348a

Oops...

wow that was before free agency so my point still stands

LOL, and free agency isn't over, so your "point" is moot. I would be FAR more concerned with a FO that made moves based on the worry of a few fans.

They pro actively signed someone they wanted, whether he is good or crap, doesn't matter obviously, they are indeed looking at guys, just because it doesn't fit into a couple peoples panic mode over it, doesn't mean it isn't happening.

[Anthony]

http://www.seahawks.com/news/press/arti ... d2c056348a

Oops...

wow that was before free agency so my point still stands

LOL, and free agency isn't over, so your "point" is moot. I would be FAR more concerned with a FO that made moves based on the worry of a few fans.

They pro actively signed someone they wanted, whether he is good or crap, doesn't matter obviously, they are indeed looking at guys, just because it doesn't fit into a couple peoples panic mode over it, doesn't mean it isn't happening.

My point is simple and valid, the o-line is the biggest weakness and they have done thing yet to address it and it is a concern. So far nothing you or anyone has said changes that fact. That is not to say they will not get to it, just it is a concern that we have not even brought anyone into talk.

[NorthHawk]

I've always been of the opinion that you use FA to plug holes and upgrade areas of concern with players that can help.
From some of the comments in other threads it seems our FO wants to use the draft to do so with the OL.
At least in FA you know the player you will get can play at the NFL level where there is more guessing in the Draft especially when selecting later on like we are.

[Zorn76]

If they convince Jared Allen to sign, it goes from a B+ to an A- for me.

C'mon, Jared.

It's worth any price to get a SB ring!

You'll regret retiring without a Lombardi if, in fact, that's what you do.

[RiverDog]

I came across this in USA Today:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... s/6591955/

They gave us a B-. Huh.

[c_hawkbob]

I came across this in USA Today:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... s/6591955/

They gave us a B-. Huh.

Beyond the letter grade their write up was spot on:

They managed to re-sign DL Michael Bennett, which looks like an even better move considering the veterans hemorrhaged by a once-deep D-line.

I gave them a B specifically on the strength of the Bennett re-signing. We needed to keep Michael.

Losing WR Golden Tate was a blow, but matching the Lions' offer to him would have hindered future deals for QB Russell Wilson and all-pro DBs Richard Sherman and Earl Thomas.

Exactly why often no move is sometimes the best move. We're well served to keep an eye on next year's to do list.

I'd understand the hand wringing about our O-line if their had been a stud available in free agency, but this year's crop was no better than our current roster, we're better off looking to draft day (which includes draft day trade bait, we'll have a lot of picks after compensatories are handed out).

[HumanCockroach]

[quote="NorthHawk"]I've always been of the opinion that you use FA to plug holes and upgrade areas of concern with players that can help.
From some of the comments in other threads it seems our FO wants to use the draft to do so with the OL.
At least in FA you know the player you will get can play at the NFL level where there is more guessing in the Draft especially when selecting later on like we are.[/quote]

Or that they aren't really an upgrade, that will cost the team more money than a draft pick that may be an upgrade.

[RiverDog]

I came across this in USA Today:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... s/6591955/

They gave us a B-. Huh.

Beyond the letter grade their write up was spot on:

They managed to re-sign DL Michael Bennett, which looks like an even better move considering the veterans hemorrhaged by a once-deep D-line.

I gave them a B specifically on the strength of the Bennett re-signing. We needed to keep Michael.

Losing WR Golden Tate was a blow, but matching the Lions' offer to him would have hindered future deals for QB Russell Wilson and all-pro DBs Richard Sherman and Earl Thomas.

Exactly why often no move is sometimes the best move. We're well served to keep an eye on next year's to do list.

I'd understand the hand wringing about our O-line if their had been a stud available in free agency, but this year's crop was no better than our current roster, we're better off looking to draft day (which includes draft day trade bait, we'll have a lot of picks after compensatories are handed out).

Agreed, it was spot on in their analysis. But you left out this quote, which I also felt was spot on, and probably why they downgraded the effort as some of us have:

The champs remain focused on the long view but have short-term replacements to find in the trenches and at wideout.

[HumanCockroach]

Seems they disagree with you as well RD, as they feel receiver should have resources dedicated to it as well. Weren't you the one saying they should not do that? Simply can't fleece one portion of the team to address another ( and no they have not at any point fleeced the o line, since they have arrived).

[RiverDog]

Seems they disagree with you as well RD, as they feel receiver should have resources dedicated to it as well. Weren't you the one saying they should not do that? Simply can't fleece one portion of the team to address another ( and no they have not at any point fleeced the o line, since they have arrived).

Not really. I think that the concern about the WR corps is not nearly as pressing as is the OL, assuming that Percy Harvin steps up to the plate. If he doesn't, then we could be in some serious trouble at that position as we don't have a lot of depth. I've consistently said that WR's were "a dime a dozen", and rank it behind the OL as our #2 need, just as the article did.

[Zorn76]

The draft is 7 weeks away.

And the Seahawks have been known to do pretty well there.

I also believe this is the year that we buck our recent trend and actually end up with good OL prospects that will start as rookies.

There's a reason we let Breno go, and it wasn't just money. Carp's starting days, IMO, are over as well. Expect a less experienced offensive line, but a better one than last year.

It won't be hard to improve there.

[Eaglehawk]

The draft is 7 weeks away.

And the Seahawks have been known to do pretty well there.

I also believe this is the year that we buck our recent trend and actually end up with good OL prospects that will start as rookies.

There's a reason we let Breno go, and it wasn't just money. Carp's starting days, IMO, are over as well. Expect a less experienced offensive line, but a better one than last year.

It won't be hard to improve there.

I hope you are right.

[RiverDog]

The draft is 7 weeks away.

And the Seahawks have been known to do pretty well there.

I also believe this is the year that we buck our recent trend and actually end up with good OL prospects that will start as rookies.

There's a reason we let Breno go, and it wasn't just money. Carp's starting days, IMO, are over as well. Expect a less experienced offensive line, but a better one than last year.

It won't be hard to improve there.

Although we've certainly made up for it in the middle and late rounds and the jury is still out on most of those selections, we haven't exactly hit it out of the park with our top picks, at least not in the last 3 drafts. I only count two (Wilson and Wagner) out of 7 third round or higher since 2011 that have made significant contributions

If it wasn't for the fact that we are so thin on the OL, I'd predict right now that Carpenter would be one of those surprise cuts this summer, but I think he hangs on for one more year. He's still a pretty good point of attack run blocker.

[Zorn76]

The draft is 7 weeks away.

And the Seahawks have been known to do pretty well there.

I also believe this is the year that we buck our recent trend and actually end up with good OL prospects that will start as rookies.

There's a reason we let Breno go, and it wasn't just money. Carp's starting days, IMO, are over as well. Expect a less experienced offensive line, but a better one than last year.

It won't be hard to improve there.

Although we've certainly made up for it in the middle and late rounds and the jury is still out on most of those selections, we haven't exactly hit it out of the park with our top picks, at least not in the last 3 drafts. I only count two (Wilson and Wagner) out of 7 third round or higher since 2011 that have made significant contributions

If it wasn't for the fact that we are so thin on the OL, I'd predict right now that Carpenter would be one of those surprise cuts this summer, but I think he hangs on for one more year. He's still a pretty good point of attack run blocker.

Carp's a possible starter by default only. He just isn't very good, and I think there's an equal chance a rookie takes his place. IMO, the point isn't so much that we could be starting 2 rooks, it's that the guys they'd be replacing (Breno and Carp), are really no better to begin with.

We've whiffed on early round picks several times, so the concern is certainly legit. But we also don't need to hit a home run here, per say. Just need to improve enough to give RW slightly more time in the pocket, and a bit more of a hole for Marshawn to run through.

Harvin's health is also a Huge x-factor. Him playing a full season, or most of one, will go a long way in improving our SB odds this fall. Same with signing Jared Allen, which shoulda been done already, had he not got cold feet to retreat back to AZ to think about it. Even if he doesn't end up in Seattle, I still think we'll be the best overall team heading into 2014. There's nothing like winning the Super Bowl to build your confidence for the future. And our team is also wise enough to know that they can't rest on their collective laurels.

[monkey]

All I know is, after the draft, when we are all looking at at least one WR, (hopefully one of either Jordan Matthews or Martavis Bryant for that big body role, and maybe even Jared Abbrederis just because he's cool and already played a year with Wilson), and we are all looking at at least one probably two offensive linemen, one of whom is slated to star from day one, and will be a BIG upgrade at his spot (hopefully someone like Joel Bitonio who could play tackle or guard and start day one IMO), we will ALL view this offseason so much differently.

Point is, no offense to the threads starter, but I just don't see the point of throwing around grades for an off season that isn't even half over yet.

If we land a big body WR and a starting O-Linemen (and I'd bet just about anything we will land both) then people will say that this whole off season was a HUGE success...rightly so.
So why bother talking about it before the draft? Why bother getting all worried about whether or not we're doing enough to address our offensive needs before the draft?
It's very obvious even to someone who doesn't know much about the Seahawks that the front office knows what it is doing. This is NOT the Raiders or Browns...this is the Super Bowl Champion Seattle Seahawks front office we are talking about. They get it, they know what our needs are, far better than we do!
This years free agent crop didn't include anyone, and I mean ANYONE worth a lot of money that plays on the offensive line, and yet several fortunes were made by players who are offensive linemen. Heck, our own right tackle just got rich going to play with another team, and we all know that he's nothing to write home about...Breno sure got paid like a pro bowler though!

I'm far more interested to find out if we end up with one or two starters on the O-line from the draft. My guess is it will be just one, and that either Bowie or Bailey get the other spot, depending on who we draft obviously. I'd also guess that the big body receiver I think we will draft, will probably start the year as the #4 receiver, just so he has time to get acclimated before really unleashing him, which would make Harvin, Baldwin and Kearse the numbers one through three WR's, at least at first.

I find those far more interesting questions than whether or not our front office is too stupid to realize that the offensive line is a weak spot!

[HumanCockroach]

To be fair the OP did put.... so far..... I don't think there is any problem with the thread idea, the OP wasn't saying they were to stupid to know, and I think in fact he was complimentary of the work they were doing. It was the shift of this thread to the O-line panic, that shifted the entire focus off of the so far thing, this season. Hell, some even graded on past off seasons. Most obviously are in that B range, which IMO is fair, they can improve, or drop, which is fair in an "up to this point" kind of thread...

[monkey]

To be fair the OP did put.... so far..... I don't think there is any problem with the thread idea, the OP wasn't saying they were to stupid to know, and I think in fact he was complimentary of the work they were doing. It was the shift of this thread to the O-line panic, that shifted the entire focus off of the so far thing, this season. Hell, some even graded on past off seasons. Most obviously are in that B range, which IMO is fair, they can improve, or drop, which is fair in an "up to this point" kind of thread...

You're right, the thread just took such a silly turn, so full of panic and angst, even after winning a Super Bowl...that combined with the fact that the off season has just barely begun and I guess I misdirected my last comments a bit, towards the OP.

I guess I'm just having a hard time comprehending the level of panic I have read in here, given the fact we are coming off our first ever championship...makes no sense to me.

[HumanCockroach]

Well you're not alone in that Monkey. Most people aren't panicking, that said, I do understand their concerns, just not the amount of angst about it this early in the off season. I certainly am not concerned, at least at this point, if the don't draft or sign anyone else that can fill out the depth, I might become more concerned, just seriously doubt that all the moves are done in that regard. If this FO has shown anything, consistently since arriving, it's that they are ALWAYS looking for players no matter what position that can help them, or upgrade the team.

Seriously doubt, they choose to back up last season by resting on their laurels....

[RiverDog]

All I know is, after the draft, when we are all looking at at least one WR, (hopefully one of either Jordan Matthews or Martavis Bryant for that big body role, and maybe even Jared Abbrederis just because he's cool and already played a year with Wilson), and we are all looking at at least one probably two offensive linemen, one of whom is slated to star from day one, and will be a BIG upgrade at his spot (hopefully someone like Joel Bitonio who could play tackle or guard and start day one IMO), we will ALL view this offseason so much differently.

Point is, no offense to the threads starter, but I just don't see the point of throwing around grades for an off season that isn't even half over yet.

If we land a big body WR and a starting O-Linemen (and I'd bet just about anything we will land both) then people will say that this whole off season was a HUGE success...rightly so.
So why bother talking about it before the draft? Why bother getting all worried about whether or not we're doing enough to address our offensive needs before the draft?
It's very obvious even to someone who doesn't know much about the Seahawks that the front office knows what it is doing. This is NOT the Raiders or Browns...this is the Super Bowl Champion Seattle Seahawks front office we are talking about. They get it, they know what our needs are, far better than we do!
This years free agent crop didn't include anyone, and I mean ANYONE worth a lot of money that plays on the offensive line, and yet several fortunes were made by players who are offensive linemen. Heck, our own right tackle just got rich going to play with another team, and we all know that he's nothing to write home about...Breno sure got paid like a pro bowler though!

I'm far more interested to find out if we end up with one or two starters on the O-line from the draft. My guess is it will be just one, and that either Bowie or Bailey get the other spot, depending on who we draft obviously. I'd also guess that the big body receiver I think we will draft, will probably start the year as the #4 receiver, just so he has time to get acclimated before really unleashing him, which would make Harvin, Baldwin and Kearse the numbers one through three WR's, at least at first.

I find those far more interesting questions than whether or not our front office is too stupid to realize that the offensive line is a weak spot!

Intelligence or competence was never an issue, at least not with me. It's always been about a matter of priorities and opinions, nothing more. I do trust our management more so than any before it, but that doesn't stop me from expressing an opinion. I would find the game pretty damn boring if I were forced to march lock step through the Kool Aid line with everyone on everything.

I don't fault the OP at all. It was a good topic and correctly titled. Time to move on, though. We've beaten this one to death, so as Forrest Gump would say..."and that's all I got to say about that."

[Anthony]

Well you're not alone in that Monkey. Most people aren't panicking, that said, I do understand their concerns, just not the amount of angst about it this early in the off season. I certainly am not concerned, at least at this point, if the don't draft or sign anyone else that can fill out the depth, I might become more concerned, just seriously doubt that all the moves are done in that regard. If this FO has shown anything, consistently since arriving, it's that they are ALWAYS looking for players no matter what position that can help them, or upgrade the team.

Seriously doubt, they choose to back up last season by resting on their laurels....

For me the added "angst" come from people saying I should not be concerned, but no real reason for it. Or telling me we just won the SB like that means we should not improve are weakest unit on the team. I am concerned that is all, Like I have been for a couple of years now. Rw wants to be the best, hard to do that when you are behind the worst pass blocking o-line in the league. So why would be stay when a team with a better o-lien might want him? When Rws time come this is going to be one of the things that he will be looking at, and we are not doing a good job here. Not to mention if he does stay and the probably contract he will get, we are not doing a good job protecting what will be a big investment.

[Eaglehawk]

Everytime I read an article we are losing more guards to FA.
Oh well.
Still very concerned about our O line.

Our defense may be elite but our o line is pedestrian as of today. Carter WAS right? Son of a B! j/k

I am sure that when the draft is over, we will be just fine. I just hope we are IMPROVED from last season o line wise. I do not want us to be the same.

[HumanCockroach]

Well you're not alone in that Monkey. Most people aren't panicking, that said, I do understand their concerns, just not the amount of angst about it this early in the off season. I certainly am not concerned, at least at this point, if the don't draft or sign anyone else that can fill out the depth, I might become more concerned, just seriously doubt that all the moves are done in that regard. If this FO has shown anything, consistently since arriving, it's that they are ALWAYS looking for players no matter what position that can help them, or upgrade the team.

Seriously doubt, they choose to back up last season by resting on their laurels....

For me the added "angst" come from people saying I should not be concerned, but no real reason for it. Or telling me we just won the SB like that means we should not improve are weakest unit on the team. I am concerned that is all, Like I have been for a couple of years now. Rw wants to be the best, hard to do that when you are behind the worst pass blocking o-line in the league. So why would be stay when a team with a better o-lien might want him? When Rws time come this is going to be one of the things that he will be looking at, and we are not doing a good job here. Not to mention if he does stay and the probably contract he will get, we are not doing a good job protecting what will be a big investment.

Good lord, you keep professing that, it isn't true, despite what you feel about it. Miami, gave up the MOST sacks, AND QB hits, not Seattle...


http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

[NorthHawk]

My guess is we gave up less sacks is because we had a better run game and Russ is a better escape artist - not because of better pass pro.

[Zorn76]

Well, our OL did give up way too many sacks in proportion to how much (or little, rather) we threw. There were 11 teams who gave up under 40 sacks last season, so achieving that should be the Seahawks' goal, at least.

[HumanCockroach]

I know Zorn, not saying they shouldn't be striving to be the best in ALL areas, which IMHO they have, just tired of reading that statement over and over and over again.