Free Ray Rice

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Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawktawk » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:25 pm

OK I know this is seriously stirring the pot but here goes. Ray did something no man should do and I'm not defending it. But he took responsibility for it. By all accounts except Goodells he was honest about what happened. He entered counseling with his fiance and was publicly very contrite.His wife supports and forgives him and she really doesn't strike me as some cowering battered woman. His teammates generally still care about him and think he is basically a good person. He has a history of charitable contributions and community service as an NFL player. The case was already adjudicated by law enforcement and they felt comfortable enough with RR to allow him to enter a diversionary program although they had all the videotape. His league discipline had already been meted out. I believe the NFL had the video and only flipped their punishment when it became clear the public was going to see it.

But here is my main objection to Ray Rices high tech lynching. Ray McDonald beat his pregnant girlfriend in front of teammates 2 weeks ago and he will start this Sunday. Greg Hardy already has a conviction on his record for domestic violence and another charge pending and he will start Sunday. Now we have AP beating on his 4 yr old boy. He is deactivated but no talk of cutting him or a league indefinite suspension.

So WTF? RR is finished because of a video? What do all the grandstanding Pollyanna dunces think domestic violence looks like? To be honest it often looks a hell of a lot worse than a guy swinging one time at his wife as she lunges at him. Id love to have a camera on Goodells wall so we could see what kind of sleaze he hides in his life.Or perhaps some of these jaded billion dollar owners. It might be a lot like Sen Larry Craig who voted against anything that was pro homosexual until he got caught playing footsies with a male undercover detective in an airport restroom in Minnesota.
Not saying that's how it is, just a hunch when it comes to this anal retentive self appointed morality policeman and all these media talking heads. If nothing else this latest string of incidents proves how foolish it is for a Commissioner to try to wear all these hats at the same time.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby jshawaii22 » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:41 pm

Ray Rice's case has been adjudicated. He went to court, he admitted guilt long before the 'tape' came out , and the 'pre-trial' disposition of the case ordered him to stay clean for 1 year. That is the verdict. That is when the NFL can step in, not before.

The 49'er has not even been charged with a crime by a grand jury or the prosecutor. Do you think those are same issues at this point? Once charged or indicted, they still have a presumption of innocence until it works it way through the court.

You might also want to add the Carolina Panther's player into this, as he was found guilty, but is appealing... it's the American way. He's playing Sunday, too.

On a side note, as sad as it is, if we put every person who hit his/her spouse, kid, friend, co-worker, etc. in prison... you'd need to add 2x the prisons you have now to accommodate them. 90% never see more than a weekend or two in the local jail, if that.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby RiverDog » Sat Sep 13, 2014 7:14 am

I agree with Hawktalk on this one. The issue in this matter, at least at this point, is how the league reacted to it more so than the incident itself. The important questions are why the league couldn't have obtained the video before last week, a law enforcement official that claims they've had the video for 5 months, the light punishment that was given to Rice, and so on.

Going back and reneging on Rice's punishment is what's un American. It's called double jeopardy, and if this were a court of law, Rice would be playing in Week 3.

As far as 'feeling sorry' for Mr. Rice, I don't. His career was winding down a bit anyway and like ObS said, he's made a bundle of money. I have no respect for men that strike women, children, old men, et al, in anything other than self defense.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby c_hawkbob » Sat Sep 13, 2014 7:38 am

Zero sympathy for Ray. As for "freeing" him, from what? He ain't behind bars. He's already free to go about the rest of his life as he sees fit, just not in the NFL.

And if you're gonna whine about his rights, playing in the NFL is not a right, any more than being a rock star or a movie star is a right. You play in the NFL if you're lucky and talented enough to be a marketable commodity for the entertainment industry that is the NFL. If you do something stupid and public enough to reder yourself no longer marketable, no "rights" have been infringed upon.

Who cares about Ray now anyway? At this point, as ObS said; the story is about Roger Goodell.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby RiverDog » Sat Sep 13, 2014 7:57 am

I agree that the major issue is Goodell and the league, and that no one should feel a bit sorry for Ray Rice. The guy is a scumbag IMO, and I am not advocating that he be allowed to return so soon as is stated in the OP. What's done is done.

Nevertheless, the reneging on his punishment of Ray Rice is part of the whole screwed up mess that Goodell has brought upon himself. I would have had more respect for Goodell if he simply said "look, I screwed up on Ray's punishment, but that's water under the bridge. We won't let it happen again."

How would you feel if your employer suspended you for two weeks and after your doing nothing further to exasperate the situation, came back 5 months later and made it a year?
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby FolkCrusader » Sat Sep 13, 2014 9:13 am

I would agree with most of the comments here. Ray Rice and his wife seem to be moving on from the incident, that's their right. The public is not as forgiving about it, that's their right. Bob put it very much the same way my wife did, his behavior did not align with what most people expect from public figures. Most people that enter the entertainment industry understand the bargain.

I also agree that the story now is about Goodell. I do not believe that the NFL "missed" the tape of him striking his wife. I believe that the NFL just tried to follow what it had done in the past regarding similar situations and they grossly misjudged how the public would react if the tapes reached the mainstream. The leading factor in the public's evaluation was really the proportionality of penalties handed down from the NFL.

Part of this started with the Brandon Browner situation where the NFL tried to hand down a one year ban for a positive test for marijuana and a whole lot of bad record keeping. Did people think Brandon should be subject to no discipline? Some, but most thought the punishment just did not fit the crime. Of course the NFL backed off and reached an agreement with Brandon and his lawyers but many still felt the penalty was way overdone.

Fast forward to this season and last years hottest receiver, Josh Gordon is under fire for admittedly poor behavior. Again, the penalty comes out very heavy handed when situations that are much more egregious are being dealt with with a slap on the wrist (see Ray Rice penalty, etc.)

Personally I think the NFL is misreading the entire situation. I think their drug policy is not in alignment with what most Americans agree with and certainly does not align with what is happening in other professional sports. The light of this policy cast against other behaviors such as assault and abuse is a proportionality problem. Of course what the NFL intends to do is keep the drug policy and up the penalty of other bad behaviors. The NFL is soon going to find itself in a chasm of morality with no way out. Seriously, out of the 2000+ players and coaches in the NFL how many do you think are involved in some sort of adjudicated behavior? How many could not stand the scrutiny of outsiders picking through their personal lives? My guess is there are a whole lot more problems out there than see the light of day. And now that their discovery has become big media business more and more people will be trying to find them.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawktawk » Sat Sep 13, 2014 10:23 am

c_hawkbob wrote:Zero sympathy for Ray. As for "freeing" him, from what? He ain't behind bars. He's already free to go about the rest of his life as he sees fit, just not in the NFL.

And if you're gonna whine about his rights, playing in the NFL is not a right, any more than being a rock star or a movie star is a right. You play in the NFL if you're lucky and talented enough to be a marketable commodity for the entertainment industry that is the NFL. If you do something stupid and public enough to reder yourself no longer marketable, no "rights" have been infringed upon.

Who cares about Ray now anyway? At this point, as ObS said; the story is about Roger Goodell.


Bob the thread title was intended as an attention grabber to encourage people to give their thoughts. I think anyone with a brain understands RRs current status.I really cant disagree with much of what you said other than I think an indefinite ban on Rice is unfair BASED ON ALL THE OTHER EXAMPLES OF GOODELLS *discipline* which has been all over the map, also the fact that the case had been adjudicated by the league and the courts. Ravens fans agreed, with thousands of fans of both sexes wearing his jersey on Thursday.

In the day Pac Man got a year ban for making it rain in a strip club at which point a gangster shot a security guard. Rapist burgher sexually assaulted 2 women over a 2 year span and got 6 games, reduced to 4. Whats worse, raping a stranger twice or slapping your drunk fiance once in a fit of passion and alcohol fueled anger Bob? Or how about AP repeatedly whipping a 4 year old causing lacerations and welts all over his genitals and lower extremities?Donte Stallworth KILLED someone driving drunk and got to play again. Vick tortured dogs with electric prods, body slammed them, allowed them to be forcibly raped and sodomized, drowned them, starved them. Imagine if there was a camera on that!!!!!But hes suiting up Sunday.Goodell has shown he will suspend someone without any court having ruled on their guilt or innocence but as I said, Hardy and McDonald are going to play and star for their teams this weekend. At least the Vikes had the balls to do something unilaterally to the biggest star running back in the league and I applaud their courage. Id have even more respect if they released him. Hey fair is fair right?

I completely agree RR is a peripheral figure at this point and it is all about Goodell.He needs to go, its the only chance of cleaning up all these messes.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby NorthHawk » Sat Sep 13, 2014 10:30 am

FolkCrusader wrote:I would agree with most of the comments here. Ray Rice and his wife seem to be moving on from the incident, that's their right. The public is not as forgiving about it, that's their right. Bob put it very much the same way my wife did, his behavior did not align with what most people expect from public figures. Most people that enter the entertainment industry understand the bargain.

I also agree that the story now is about Goodell. I do not believe that the NFL "missed" the tape of him striking his wife. I believe that the NFL just tried to follow what it had done in the past regarding similar situations and they grossly misjudged how the public would react if the tapes reached the mainstream. The leading factor in the public's evaluation was really the proportionality of penalties handed down from the NFL.

Part of this started with the Brandon Browner situation where the NFL tried to hand down a one year ban for a positive test for marijuana and a whole lot of bad record keeping. Did people think Brandon should be subject to no discipline? Some, but most thought the punishment just did not fit the crime. Of course the NFL backed off and reached an agreement with Brandon and his lawyers but many still felt the penalty was way overdone.

Fast forward to this season and last years hottest receiver, Josh Gordon is under fire for admittedly poor behavior. Again, the penalty comes out very heavy handed when situations that are much more egregious are being dealt with with a slap on the wrist (see Ray Rice penalty, etc.)

Personally I think the NFL is misreading the entire situation. I think their drug policy is not in alignment with what most Americans agree with and certainly does not align with what is happening in other professional sports. The light of this policy cast against other behaviors such as assault and abuse is a proportionality problem. Of course what the NFL intends to do is keep the drug policy and up the penalty of other bad behaviors. The NFL is soon going to find itself in a chasm of morality with no way out. Seriously, out of the 2000+ players and coaches in the NFL how many do you think are involved in some sort of adjudicated behavior? How many could not stand the scrutiny of outsiders picking through their personal lives? My guess is there are a whole lot more problems out there than see the light of day. And now that their discovery has become big media business more and more people will be trying to find them.


Good post.
I agree with most of this. It will be interesting to see if they do indeed get too involved managing morality considering the varying types of backgrounds the players come from.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawktawk » Sat Sep 13, 2014 10:47 am

Good post.
I agree with most of this. It will be interesting to see if they do indeed get too involved managing morality considering the varying types of backgrounds the players come from.[/quote]



Ya that's a great post. Not only would many NFL players not stand up to security footage on them, much of the public would not either. Jerry Jones wouldn't for sure, I found it laughable he publicly supported the commish the other day. Birds of a feather flock together.

And one more thing, can we stop with the tired mantra"Athletes are role models". No they aren't!!!!!!!They are a bunch of millionaires who play a kids game and live in a fantasy world.Some are great role models, RW comes immediately to mind. But it isn't what they get paid to do. They get paid to kick someones ass on Sundays. And for some it seems to be hard to turn off the switch when the clock hits 00.

Parents should be role models and quit abdicating the responsibility to others.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby burrrton » Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:00 am

Parents should be role models and quit abdicating the responsibility to others.


Partially agree. I support putting the onus on parents to take responsibility, but I don't think there is any way to avoid kids idolizing athletes.

Further, I believe that idolatry plays a HUGE part in the outrageous salaries these guys earn now, and as such, I believe it's reasonable to expect they maintain a higher level conduct so as not to undermine that.

This, of course, is the rationale behind all the "conduct detrimental to the league" stuff that exists in CBAs, and it's why I grouse hearing athlete's hollering "I AIN'T NO IDOL!"

You may not like being considered an idol, but the expectations are pretty banal (no one is asking you to show up to church on Sundays) so if you don't like them, give up the high salary that comes along with them and go be a wife-beating asshole selling real estate.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawktawk » Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:17 am

LOL yeah OK Burrton that was pretty good....
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Futureite » Sat Sep 13, 2014 12:52 pm

At some point he may earn reinstatement by demonstrating the steps he has taken to fix his problem, but as of today he obviously has not had time to take those steps. His apology means nothing right now.

The most disturbing part to me was not the punch. It was the way he drug her out of the elevator and pushed her around like a sack of potatoes. He had no concern for her not only as his future wife, but simply as a human being. For all he knew she had a spinal injury, or head trauma, etc. He could have cared less. That response showed me without a doubt that he's done this before and would continue to had he not been caught.

And btw, Janay did next to nothing. I've heard this "she came at him" crap from some people. After being hit by Ray Lewis in practice for several yrs I am sure he could handle that tap to his face. He is definitely getting what he deserves right now. No freeing needed.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby monkey » Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:59 pm

Hawktawk, for what it's worth (this may not help your cause much) I agree with your take completely.

No one is defending his actions, no one. At the same time, I think that some context needs to be discussed here. We've had players who've literally killed people in drunk driving accidents, and shortly after getting out of jail, get caught drinking and driving AGAIN, still playing football. That's not to say that what he did is OK because it's not as bad as killing someone, I'm just offering some perspective.

Or how about this for perspective? The legal system saw the same video TMZ leaked, and let the guy go to continue with his life. Why? Because they see so much worse EVERY DAY! Again, that doesn't make it right, it's just a little perspective.

If I were an NFL player, I would be VERY upset at the way the NFL has handled this whole thing, and VERY upset at my players union's lack of handling this thing. Rice faced the NFL's version of double jeopardy when he was first suspended two games, then indefinitely for the same offense. Where's his union representation on that one?!? Especially considering the fact that a 6 game suspension is what has been AGREED ON by both sides...

This whole thing is a gross over-reaction to what was originally an under-reaction. It was badly handled from the start, but that hardly excuses the over-reaction we're seeing now.
The NFL's image would have never taken the hit it is now, had it just given him a more appropriate suspension from the beginning; but over-reacting doesn't somehow make up for the earlier incompetence, it just adds incompetence to incompetence.

Ray Rice should be given the contractually agreed upon six game suspension, and be done with the whole thing.
Last edited by monkey on Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby monkey » Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:08 pm

BTW I just have to point something out. There's a reason that you almost never hear people talk about major league baseball and players with legal troubles like this. The reason?
Major League Baseball doesn't do what the NFL does when it comes to players getting into legal trouble. MLB allows the legal system to play itself out, and otherwise, pretty much stays out of it.
For all the heat that baseball has taken from fans, for screwing up pretty nearly everything it can, at least it's been smart enough to realize that, they don't have to try to enforce morality, when their is a legal system for that.

That's why the NFL has a black eye right now, in spite of being a MUCH better league, while MLB does not.

It's my opinion that the NFL ought to stay out of disciplining players for off the field troubles like MLB does, leave that to the law.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby monkey » Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:10 pm

RiverDog wrote:I agree with Hawktalk on this one. The issue in this matter, at least at this point, is how the league reacted to it more so than the incident itself. The important questions are why the league couldn't have obtained the video before last week, a law enforcement official that claims they've had the video for 5 months, the light punishment that was given to Rice, and so on.

Going back and reneging on Rice's punishment is what's un American. It's called double jeopardy, and if this were a court of law, Rice would be playing in Week 3.

As far as 'feeling sorry' for Mr. Rice, I don't. His career was winding down a bit anyway and like ObS said, he's made a bundle of money. I have no respect for men that strike women, children, old men, et al, in anything other than self defense.


Good post
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Futureite » Sat Sep 13, 2014 3:18 pm

monkey wrote:Hawktawk, for what it's worth (this may not help your cause much) I agree with your take completely.

No one is defending his actions, no one. At the same time, I think that some context needs to be discussed here. We've had players who've literally killed people in drunk driving accidents, and shortly after getting out of jail, get caught drinking and driving AGAIN, still playing football. That's not to say that what he did is OK because it's not as bad as killing someone, I'm just offering some perspective.

Or how about this for perspective? The legal system saw the same video TMZ leaked, and let the guy go to continue with his life. Why? Because they see so much worse EVERY DAY! Again, that doesn't make it right, it's just a little perspective.

If I were an NFL player, I would be VERY upset at the way the NFL has handled this whole thing, and VERY upset at my players union's lack of handling this thing. Rice faced the NFL's version of double jeopardy when he was first suspended two games, then indefinitely for the same offense. Where's his union representation on that one?!? Especially considering the fact that a 6 game suspension is what has been AGREED ON by both sides...

This whole thing is a gross over-reaction to what was originally an under-reaction. It was badly handled from the start, but that hardly excuses the over-reaction we're seeing now.:
The NFL's image would have never taken the hit it is now, had it just given him a more appropriate suspension from the beginning; but over-reacting doesn't somehow make up for the earlier incompetence, it just adds incompetence to incompetence.

Ray Rice should be given the contractually agreed upon six game suspension, and be done with the whole thing.


Legally yes, this is not a surprise. In terms of the NFL as a businesss? I said Aldon got whatever the NFL deemed necessary to protect its interest (or, its business). The same holds true with Ray Rice. The NFL would be doing a disservice to its stakeholders if it did not bring the hammer down on Rice after failing at its first attempt to properly discipline him. With women comprising over 40% of their fanbase, the NFL wanted to send a clear message on its position with respect to domestic violence.

I have zero sympathy for Rice, period. If you do not want this result, don't make the "mistake" of beating your girlfriend.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawk Sista » Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:54 am

Futureite wrote:At some point he may earn reinstatement by demonstrating the steps he has taken to fix his problem, but as of today he obviously has not had time to take those steps. His apology means nothing right now.

The most disturbing part to me was not the punch. It was the way he drug her out of the elevator and pushed her around like a sack of potatoes. He had no concern for her not only as his future wife, but simply as a human being. For all he knew she had a spinal injury, or head trauma, etc. He could have cared less. That response showed me without a doubt that he's done this before and would continue to had he not been caught.

And btw, Janay did next to nothing. I've heard this "she came at him" crap from some people. After being hit by Ray Lewis in practice for several yrs I am sure he could handle that tap to his face. He is definitely getting what he deserves right now. No freeing needed.



I have VERY similar reactions to the video evidence. We all knew Ray hit Janay. We were told she hit him and instigated the violence...& that it was more of a mutual fight w/ him getting the better of her in the end. What I saw, however, (& BTW, I actually discussed the contents of the video w/ our chief of police...our reactions were pretty much in lock step):
1. There was Zero hesitation from Ray - he just straight up slugged the life out of her, almost. This told us tells us he's done this before. No question about it, said the chief.
2. He made Zero attempt to help her after the blow led to knocking her out + her head hit the railing w/ extreme force. Dragging her around like a rag doll, using his foot to nudge her out of the way, paying more attention to her shoes & purse than checking to see if she was even breathing, & only attempting to move her when the doors opened & others were around was more evidence to us both that he's done this before.
3. Janay saying the situation was part on her and taking the fall is further evidence that she's been abused before. She's in the cycle of an abusive relationship and to quote our chief, "I fear for her safety."

Domestic abuse is not just an NFL problem, it's a global problem. And judging by the lack of consequences by the legal system AND the nfl, it's clearly not a significant priority to reduce this sort of violence. I think the complete lack of any substantial consequence from the NJ legal system is a WAY BIGGER problem than the NFL's complete bungling of the situation. That said, the NFL bungled the situation. Whether or not it comes out that Roger saw the video, he should have demanded to see it... So much so that either way his credibility is impaired as is his value as the face of the bizz. Him being the judge, jury & executioner was hard to swallow before- now I think it'd be pretty freKin' impossible.

As an aside and back to the thread subject, I believe good people can fall into patterns of abuse (both parties) because of how they were raised and other variables. I sincerely hope that this increased attention to the issue helps to reduce it, not just in the NFL, but everywhere. I hope both the Rices get the help they need to heal and live an improved & violence-free life. But I'm as sure as I am that the sun will rise tomorrow, this was not the first punch he's thrown her way. No free passes. He's gotta face the consequences.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby RiverDog » Sun Sep 14, 2014 6:22 am

Futureite wrote:At some point he may earn reinstatement by demonstrating the steps he has taken to fix his problem, but as of today he obviously has not had time to take those steps. His apology means nothing right now.

The most disturbing part to me was not the punch. It was the way he drug her out of the elevator and pushed her around like a sack of potatoes. He had no concern for her not only as his future wife, but simply as a human being. For all he knew she had a spinal injury, or head trauma, etc. He could have cared less. That response showed me without a doubt that he's done this before and would continue to had he not been caught.

And btw, Janay did next to nothing. I've heard this "she came at him" crap from some people. After being hit by Ray Lewis in practice for several yrs I am sure he could handle that tap to his face. He is definitely getting what he deserves right now. No freeing needed.


What is not shown on the video, or at least not shown very clearly, is that Janay spit on Ray. I do not call that kind of behavior "next to nothing." That action by her escalated the confrontation from a verbal one into a physical one. Not only that, but at any point along the way, and keep in mind that the argument was going on before they entered the elevator, she could have called a timeout, and didn't. She stayed in his face. No way does that even begin to justify the actions Ray took in response, but to say that Janay did "next to nothing" is a complete misrepresentation of the facts.

As the saying goes, it takes two to Tango. Janay does bear some degree of responsibility, albeit a small one compared to the amount of responsibility that Ray must accept.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Futureite » Sun Sep 14, 2014 4:42 pm

Hawksista;

I agree 100% with everything you posted. And the fact that Janay and Rice are now married proves nothing to me. This cycle of abuse may be continuing on both sides at this very moment. Like most psychological problems, there is no easy solution for either party here.

And Goodell should be fired. They could hire me for god sake and I'll do a better job of investigating a personal conduct issue than Goodell supposedly did, if in fact his assertion is true.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawk Sista » Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:02 pm

I just don't see how he can effectively lead now.

Again, the best that can happen here is that this event serves as a catalyst for change.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby obiken » Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:48 pm

Rice is appealing and he should win the new CBA says 6 games for the first offense. The question become who will pick him up?
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby RiverDog » Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:39 am

obiken wrote:Rice is appealing and he should win the new CBA says 6 games for the first offense. The question become who will pick him up?


He hasn't been given a suspension that exceeds 6 games, at least not yet. He was suspended indefinitely, not for a specific period of time, so I can't see how he can appeal based on that clause in the CBA. Having said that, I do think he has a good chance of winning his case, and being allowed to play after the original two game suspension. The only way I can see him losing his appeal is if the league can prove that Rice lied to them during the investigation. That's the only reason I can think of that would justify the league going back and increasing his punishment. His suspension is a moot point, though, as the Ravens have released him and it's unlikely that any team will pick him up, at least not right away and until injuries start taking a toll on rosters.

I hear that he's considering suing the Ravens for releasing him, and I doubt that he has much of a chance of winning that one if he decides to go forward with it.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Hawktawk » Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:34 pm

Ray Rice has won his appeal and been reinstated. In issuing her decision the Judge said that Ray HAD NOT BEEN DISHONEST in reporting what had happened and as such has faced excessive jeopardy beyond the punishment that was handed down at his first hearing with Goodell.

So I guess my point is,if Ray didn't lie.....Goodell did. I dont see how he should be allowed to keep his job if that is the case.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby RiverDog » Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:55 pm

Hawktawk wrote:Ray Rice has won his appeal and been reinstated. In issuing her decision the Judge said that Ray HAD NOT BEEN DISHONEST in reporting what had happened and as such has faced excessive jeopardy beyond the punishment that was handed down at his first hearing with Goodell.

So I guess my point is,if Ray didn't lie.....Goodell did. I dont see how he should be allowed to keep his job if that is the case.


I agree with the judges decision, and I'll just quote from my last comments on the subject that I posted 2 1/2 months ago:

I do think he has a good chance of winning his case, and being allowed to play after the original two game suspension. The only way I can see him losing his appeal is if the league can prove that Rice lied to them during the investigation. That's the only reason I can think of that would justify the league going back and increasing his punishment.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby Zorn76 » Fri Nov 28, 2014 6:24 pm

Any team who picks this guy up is foolish.
But somebody will.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby HumanCockroach » Fri Nov 28, 2014 6:33 pm

Hawktawk wrote:Ray Rice has won his appeal and been reinstated. In issuing her decision the Judge said that Ray HAD NOT BEEN DISHONEST in reporting what had happened and as such has faced excessive jeopardy beyond the punishment that was handed down at his first hearing with Goodell.

So I guess my point is,if Ray didn't lie.....Goodell did. I dont see how he should be allowed to keep his job if that is the case.


Was that really ever in doubt? I know personally I never once believed Goddall wasn't lying through his teeth. As for "how can he keep his job" thing, the answer is money, and power. The owners and Goddall have it, Rice doesn't. It is no different in regular society, politics or any other situation where the priviledged have the ability to lie through their teeth, blame someone else, get caught doing so, and either get a slap on the wrist, or a tsk tsk shake of the head admonishment.

Truth is, his bosses care far more about profit, and far less about what is right and just, for a player, the fans or society. Simply put: they are greedy.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby NorthHawk » Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:12 pm

My understanding is that as Rice has now been reinstated, he can claim back pay from the Ravens which is probably in the millions. How much is left after the Lawyers are finished billing might be interesting.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby obiken » Sat Nov 29, 2014 1:56 am

He would get it all. Lawyer fees are paid for by the loser. Now that's a court, I don't know about a hearing.
Name a team that would take him this year?? Next year maybe but they don't need the public heat right now.
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Re: Free Ray Rice

Postby RiverDog » Sat Nov 29, 2014 6:50 am

NorthHawk wrote:My understanding is that as Rice has now been reinstated, he can claim back pay from the Ravens which is probably in the millions. How much is left after the Lawyers are finished billing might be interesting.


I'm not sure that the Ravens would have to pay. Once the league reneged on their 2 game suspension and made it indefinite, they couldn't have played him had they wanted to. It was the league that botched the investigation, the league that gave him a 2 game suspension, and the league that reneged on it and turned it into suspended indefinitely.

The Ravens did drop him from their roster, but there's nothing wrong with that. Teams do it all the time, and no justification is required. It's being denied the opportunity to catch on with another team that by the rule of the court, was improperly denied to him. I can't see any of this coming back on the Ravens.

The NFL as a whole will have to pick up the tab on this one, and now that he has the court decision on his side, he almost certainly will prevail when he sues them for lost wages. Losing a lawsuit for a few million won't hurt the league, but the PR damage will. It makes Goodell and the league look like a bunch of arrogant mavericks that feel they don't have to abide by any generally accepted standards of justice and fairness.
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